TheSignalEngineer

For clarity I'll repost what was in the original thread as linked in my post above. At Southall in the time between 17 was transferred to Leamington and the 128s came this was a sample of the duty worked by 34.

Trains from Leeds/Bradford to Morecame seemed to be anything from 3 to 11 coaches depending on the time of year, day of the week and what was attached/detached where. The minimum was CK/BSK/SK between Bradford and in the late 1950s, although I found one working formed BSK/CK/CK/BSK with an extra SK on the back on Friday only. In reality the strengthener would be whatever was to hand I suspect. Another working also had a BG for Morecambe.

Just as an aside to this, c1991 BR was in a bit of a mess with projects. Different factions within the sectorised organisation were trying to show their muscle and often proposing confliction or overlapping projects. We did a review of all unstarted projects across the whole system in terms of cost, resource requirement and timescale from development to completion. Some were tied in with essential renewals, others were combined and some rejected as just plain dumb. The code name for the review team was Crystal Ball, you can imaging a few of the nicknames that soon became attached. All projects seen as realistic were plotted on a chart which was tied in with both BR and Industry resource levels, and the level of investment we predicted would actually materialise. The Manchester IECC scheme I mentioned earlier was largely renewals driven, together with some rationalisation. Hope Valley was considered for 90mph running with 3-aspect signalling with an implementation phase of 2006-08. The main things needed on the line are the alterations at Dore and upgrading the signalling to provide more shorter sections than the present Absolute Block and IB signals. I am never sure of the value of Goods Loops unless they have an entry connection from the main line at or near to 60mph and enough length to brake to stop at the exit signal. When we did Saltley, Derby and Trent MAS in 1969/70 period a lot of loops and refuge sidings disappeared. Freight train mileage run per engine hour improved by about 40%.

There were certainly a few vestibule coaches in regular formations on the main line through Skipton in the early 1950s. The Skipton - Ilkley trains saw some non-corridor two-coach trains but I did notice one in 1958 (post 3rd class abolition) which was formed BSK/CK/SK/BSK. Another set I noticed at Skipton but on a train going in the Colne direction in 1955 was formed BTK/CK/CK/BTK. As time moved forward the number of vestibule coaches in regular weekday trains seems to have decreased but they did turn up as strengtheners. I don't see a problem with the formation you proposed, alternatively you could have a regular three or four coach set with strengthener added at one end such as TO/BTK/CK/BTK TO/BTK/CK/CK/BTK TO/BTK/CK/TK/BTK It just depends on how much first class you want to include in the regular set, 18 or 36 seats if using LMS stock.

What lines / stations are you looking at? Will be back to the railway room in 10 minutes and will look if I have anything.

If you join Robert Carroll's io group you will find a lot of carriage working notices giving formations like the ones I posted. https://brcoachingstock.groups.io

Extracts from article in the Sheffiled Star in September 2019:- A Network Rail spokesman said: “We are reviewing the original plans for the Hope Valley line and expect to put the contract out to tender in the next few weeks. “The chosen contractor, once approved by the Department for Transport, should be announced by autumn 2020. Construction is expected to start in 2022 and complete by 2023.” Network Rail added that the scheme was being reviewed to ensure it ‘meets current railway standards’ before the contract can go out to tender.

Here are some examples of the commuter workings out of Manchester Victoria in Winter 1954/55 Note the Coronation Scot articulated sets. By the 1990s the Southport train was a Pacer, four-car if you were lucky.

This was a regular formation of everyday trains on the line in the early 1950s. The Blackpool and Southport lines has so many rich commuters in those days that the stock intended for the Coronation Scot was used on their commuter trains after WW2. Going on to another area, in the early 1950s trains from Birmingham to Manchester and Liverpool splitting at Crewe had the two portions formed BTK,/TO/TO/CK/BCK. As new stock came in during the mid-1950s the TOs were relegated to lesser duties being replace by Period 3 TKs displaced from lomger distance WCML services.

My original post put the blame on the former Transport Secretary rather than NR. We seem to forget that however much the Tory politicos like to tell us differently that NR is a nationalised industry and they are ultimately responsible for its performance.

This is an example of a Manchester - Blackpool set from 1951. Seating split roughly half and half compartments for those who wanted to read the newspaper and opens for the bridge club or domino school.

57' coaches built for use as Dining Saloons had 2+1 seating, 7 bays of six seats per coach and were classed as RTO. There were some 60' coaches built as D1722 RFO which were declassified to thirds. Coaches for general use had 2+2 seating, 7 bays of 8 seats except for the D1915 as made by Replica which had 7 1/2 bays giving 60 seats. Although used to give higher capacity than 3-a-side compartment stock there were many to be found in mixed rakes on normal services especially longer distance commutes.

My take is much as Paul. The essential signals at the red arrows. The top two are at the clearance point when the lines start to converge. At 4mm scale that would be at 45mm track centres plus any allowance needed for side and end throw. The green arrow is an optional signal to make full use of the available platform length on the line where the 47 is standing. It would be 25mm back from the rail joint between the two sets of points. There are some instances similar to this at Birmingham New Street and I put one in at Euston when the old parcels platforms were signalled for passenger use.

Good question. None of my books show the answer but the predecessor to the P3 version (D1697?) has 9' bogies on the Jenkinson drawing I have.

There are several pictures of the WR tests on this page http://www.traintesting.com/test_car_4.htm. They include D1500 on Dainton, Falcon, Lion and a Western

In 1961/1962 the WR ran trials on various Type 4 locos. Following trials with a Peak banking on Lickey for Type 4 diesel-hauled trains up to 12 coaches and some fitted freight was abolished from 12th March 1962. Reported in the May 1962 issue of Modern Railways, 'Falcon' reached 100mph on the level with 273 tons trailing and 75mph with 600 tons. On the South Devon banks it took 550 tons unaided with restarts on the steepest curved sections against 360 tons for a King. On Lickey it restarted 638 tons from a stand northbound at Vigo during each of six runs on 6/7 February. The train pictured on Lickey included the Swindon Dynamometer car followed by what looks like a ferry van then 18 assorted bogie coaches. Reported elsewhere it also took a mineral train of over 500 tons unaided. The report stated that the WR was going to repeat the trials with a 'Western' for comparison. More info here. http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_feature_424.php 'Lion' was reported sighted on Lickey in June. It repeated the 'Falcon' tests on Lickey and Dainton in August 1962. http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_feature_425.php

That about matches my impression. Only major work in recent times was Stalybridge remodelling.

Born in Shaftmoor Lane, Acocks Green I understand, about half a mile from where Mrs SE was born. He went to the primary school later attended by my children for their first two years. He attended Moseley Grammar School with Bev Bevan of The Move and ELO.

Or that boring Breakfast programme. I time myself by the items that are on. Oh, they've just started talking about the NHS or obesity or similar, must be 0811 or thereabouts. It's a wonder they're not still using Frank Bough's cardigan. Just need a slot to keep Carol on for the weather.

I remember a documentary about a gentleman from the Black Country who had a then-record Pools win. It was shown with translation subtitles

For 49 years next week, since 1st February 1971.

An unfortunate side-effect of the Twit-Face generation. We had the same issue when we had a weekend hideaway some years ago. We were both in pressurised jobs and that house didn't have a phone or TV. There was a visit from the 'enforcers' one time when we had a midweek break. I sohwed them all round the house and we weren't troubled again.

Using under-age children has long been a tactic for catching out shopkeepers for alcohol, tobacco, etc. As the person being used is under 18 does the Council employee running the sting have to be in possession of a full disclosure certificate from the DBS?

That was a standard BR test for diesels in the early 1960s. Stop at Vigo IB Signal and restart 20 coaches without assistance.

A lot of traditional folk songs would probably get 'snowflaked' now. A prime example is Bonny Black Hare.