Jack P

I did consider going P4 for a while, I think the main reason why I wouldn't consider it, is simply the mammoth cost involved (primarily) with steam outline conversions. the fact that everything needs re-wheeling which almost instantly doubles the cost of most tender locos, and in some cases you need to build a whole new chassis too. In my mind, it seems like when you're paying full price for the RTR loco and getting rid of most of it, it's just better to start off with a kit, in my opinion. I should probably stop flogging a dead horse though! My final point is simply that I think P4 is much better looking than 00, you certainly notice the difference, and (usually) coupled with the fact that the rest of the modelling is top notch makes for a far more realistic scene. I'm trying to work through a few things that are still on hold while I wait for bits to progress with the N15x.so, here's some not so realistic toy-trains for you, I ordered some replacement B4 buffers, thinking they would be the bigger size. Sadly they weren't. Instead of returning them, I had a look in the spares box for bits I could use, I settled on some of the Hornby headcode discs. They appear to be the right diameter, but seeing this front on shot i'm not sure. I also soldered up the smokebox dart and handrail, I'm now in the process of reducing down the thickness of the casting so that I can mount it on the faceplate and file the boiler to shape around it. Lots of talking, but not much doing, or any pictures, while i'm waiting for things to arrive! I did use the vice (which arrived last night) to shape the boiler round last night, thankfully no cracking. I also made a start on taking the boiler bands off, the ones on the firebox will be the most difficult, as well as the one closest to the smokebox, but I can certainly see what Dave means about the thickness of them, they are very prominent on the model and very subtle on the prototype. I was thinking about the next step for the body, which will be the fixing of the smoke deflectors, to assist in painting, these will be attached and the boiler assembly will be removable, this will help with lining too. Note to self - Call high level and get my hands on a motor/gearbox already! Edit: you can see in this photo the disadvantage of the wheel spacing of 00. Wouldn't a P4 B4 look much better?

Thank you! I would have preferred etched springs to be honest, I think these whitemetal ones protrude into the inner frame area too much and are going to get in the way when it comes to fitting pickups. I'm still unsure on what to do for frame spacers, these ones are handy having the hole in the centre for locating things. As for the cylinder assembly - I have a plan, I'm not sure that i'll be able to do a good job of explaining it though! I plan to use washers on the front axle to limit sideplay to an absolute minimum, and then on the second axle to probably halve the sideplay that's there now too. I think the rear axle will have the most play but i'll need to have a play with tolerances when the correct wheels arrive and i've got the valve gear mounting points sorted out. No doubt i'll have plenty of questions as I go. I was thinking that too. I had thought about soldering the spigots to the nameplate, but the 'Beattie' nameplate is quite small and I don't want to ruin the finish. They are on their way to me from 247 Developments, (no connection, the usual disclaimer), so i'll have a play around when they arrive. Thanks for your input so far mate, it's very much appreciated! Thanks Dave! I think I had a bit of a panic moment. It's all coming easier now! (I hope I don't crack it, it's what I was worried about!!) Not round yet, still waiting on this vice to arrive, I've also got a mate to lazer cut me some small disc's to sit on the front of the smokebox 24mm, 24.5mm and 25mm to see which one it ends up being once it's round. I'll use this disc to fit the smokebox door to once i've sanded the back off it. hopefully this will improve the front end and hopefully complete the 'face' to a better standard. I had considered removing the boiler bands. It seems like the firebox will present a bit of a challenge, but I think you're right. I'll need to make a template of where they're supposed to be before I file them off. I've heard of people using masking tape to represent them. I was going to use LMS coach lining to do the boiler bands, and then Fox for the cab sides, splashers and tender.I'll let you know how I get on! Same to you Dave, thanks for your help so far! I turned my attention to finishing off an on-going project last night, I received the 'THIRD' transfers from Fox last week, they are very good quality. Infact they make the HMRS transfers look quite shoddy, not sure if they are printed badly, or I just got a bad batch, I think i'll come back to these and replace them at a later date, but for now I'm glad that they are 'Finished' Sorry about the photos, the lighting is a little bit off!

Thank you! I think that when the cylinders are fitted it will look alright. I did think maybe I could use some thin brass and fit it on the outside of the frame, just to cover the gap. I think the frame cut-outs are ok, I do actually think the bogie is a little bit low. I need to place another Markits order to add some 12mm 10spoke bogie wheels, I think it will be a combination of lifting the bogie a little and the right rim profile on the bogie, as well as the cylinders being added that should bring it all together. The instructions actually suggest that you build the motion and the cylinders as one sub assembly. They still screw through, although there will be a nut on the inside of the smokebox to locate them, if there is any play, I can bulk up the assembly in the middle, where it sits in the frames so there is no play, hopefully this makes sense I think due to the fragile nature of the slide bar arrangement - only the bottom slide bar extends all the way into the cylinder casting, I'll need to support this with some kind of spacer. I did run into a bit of grief when I tried to bend the motion back down so it was a little bit closer in line with the wheels, and it broke away from the main fret. I have a plan to tackle that, however worst case I can get a replacement from Langley models. I also added the WM springs (that actually came with the kit), just need to tidy them up a little I also spent most of last night soldering together the rest of the brake shoes for the brake rigging assembly. These 6 brake shoes and hangers are 18 different peices! I'll be following DLT's way of assembling the brake assembly, although I need to wait for some thicker wire to arrive before I crack on, but i'll use what I have, and some other brake shoes to practice. I also decided to remove the 'Nameplate board' on the middle splasher. They are located about halfway inboard the splasher, and are completely useless. i'm not sure how i'm going to securely fasten the nameplates now, but I think it will look much better than what was provided. It also looks like i've taken too much material off the bottom of the boiler/firebox assembly so i'll add in some more whitemetal and see how I get on with re-shaping it to sit a little nicer on the splasher. I do apologise that it all must seem very repetitive, with only small progress, but each small step is progress for me!

I figured that now that I'm really over-thinking it. I soldered some whitemetal chunks into the gap underneath and into the smoke-box front and then filed them round. I also ordered a small jewelers vice with rubber jaw covers for the purpose of squeezing the boiler round, I didn't have a vice before, and the total price was only $13nzd to my door (about £6.50), It doesn't have a huge jaw opening, only about 70mm, but i'm sure it will be fine for now. I also added the steps at the front and rear of the footplate. I think i'll also make a front plate for the smokebox from brass sheet, and then make sure the boiler confirms to that shape, probably with some judicious filing. I'll see how I get on. I mentioned that I soldered some whitemetal off-cuts to the bottom of the firebox, I filed those back so they fit the splashers better. now the boiler actually sits level. I also added some off-cuts to the cab curvature, then I filed it down and got it to the point where I was happy with the fit onto the footplate. Whitemetal solder filled any gaps left. and when the fibreglass pencil arrives I should be able to tidy up the area to make a nice square join. I also had a quick play with some copper rod to replicate the pipe along the side of the boiler, although i'm not sure if this is thick enough. There is still more to do. I basically have to remove the rear most band on the firebox off completely to move the whole boiler assembly back enough. Question, does the bogie look too low? The whole area looks a bit odd without the cylinder block, and will look much better when I've added the brake rigging and pipes from the sandboxes. I'm actually really enjoying this kit-building thing. My results aren't great, but i'm learning so much!

Thanks Georgeconna, I suppose i'm my own biggest critic! I completely agree John. A good example of an outlier would be the Hornby E2, sure there's a RTR example, but would I prefer this over building a kit? No, not at all. I would rather start with a kit and detail it to my liking. As for the N15x, I don't think i've done a good job of explaining the issue, please excuse the quality of the photos, they are just taken on my mobile. In this photo, the smokebox saddle is flat, and the firebox sides are square, (the issue is really just theoretical at this point), but there's a gap along the bottom of the boiler. I'm concerned that when I go to squeeze the smokebox round, the gap at the bottom will cause problems because the only securing point will be the seam along the top of the boiler which will be over-stressed and then just break- hopefully that makes sense? Am I over thinking this?

I think though, you must remember that in many cases a kitbuild is the only option. As an example, I said on Tony Wrights thread, I'm certainly not planning on ever building a Schools Class from a kit, and, honestly, why would I? The Hornby offering isn't 100% perfect, but it's a really good model, and it would be much better use of time, money and effort to add details to that than to build a whole kit (in my opinion anyway), I can certainly see the merits of building a kit though, and especially if you model in EM or P4. However in the case of the A2 and the N15x - yes, they do leave a lot to be desired, (Hi Nu-Cast, why no one piece boiler?), but the other options are either 1. to buy a finished one, or 2. there is no other option! In reality, it's much cheaper to do it yourself. Plus I think it's worth saying that I personally was in the same boat as you, and then I actually did try building a kit, and it's all very fun. The main thing is just how much satisfaction you get from doing something yourself, and mastering new skills. I think my biggest win so far is soldering whitemetal, I was absolutely dreading it, but It's probably easier than brass! I also want to add, building this N15x has given me a new appreciation for the cost of RTR items. I could probably model half of the SR's allocation of P classes, and then half of one for the (estimated) finished cost of this kit.

Looks like you're making good progress! Excuse my ignorance - but what's the prototype? A little bit of progress tonight - excuse the poor video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpOIWFMzRyc test fit of the machined crossheads, making sure they run ok, chassis is still free rolling with the connecting rod added. Now the only issue is that with the valve gear bent up the way that it is, it's too wide, I'm not sure if that's because I've bent it incorrectly, or because the etched bend line is wrong. I'll have another look at it tomorrow and see what needs to be done to get it in line. If the bend is right and it's still too wide, i'll cut it down the middle and solder it closer. Worst case, I've been in contact with langley models, and when the next run of etches is put through i'll be purchasing a replacement valve gear set from their Baltic Tank, which to my eye looks a better representation than the nu-cast version anyway. Then I need to get my head around how to attach the return crank, which has a rearwards 'lean' as opposed to the more common frontwards 'lean' (what's the word i'm looking for? Bias?), and the rest of the motion. I think before I get into that I need to fit a motor and gearbox and get the rest of the chassis sorted.

Ah, sorry, i'll clarify. The boiler is a 2 piece design, in order to get the firebox sides straight you need to join the top seam of the boiler, but not the bottom seam - it leaves a gap at the smokebox end. It seems like the best way to explain it is simply that i'll need to fillet in some whitemetal to fill the gap. The thing I'm worried about though, is when I go to use a vice to shape it round, will tit hold up okay? I suppose I can just give it a go and see! I appreciate your comments, The kit certainly doesn't make anything easy, the footplate is in 4 parts. I've ordered some brass sheet, because I know that there are parts that just won't do the job, plus it will be useful for adding detail. In addition to that, I've just gone and ordered the wrong size replacement drivers - joy! What a way to cut my teeth kitbuilding! I soldered the footplate together, and then added some scrap WM to the fronts of the footplate I then sanded this down and added the front bufferbeam - not in shot. I will be cleaning up that casting line too. Another shot of it not finished, but posed. I assembled the cab, which honestly, leaves a lot to be desired, it lines up with the footplate badly, I am seriously considering scratchbuilding a replacement, I could probably get away with new side overlays, or maybe seeing if I can find a cheap donor LN body and pinching the cab from that. I also soldered some excess WM to the undersides of the firebox so that there wasn't a gap on either side of the splashers. I need to sand these additions down now so the boiler sits flush. I also bent the valve gear up. I have some fantastic machined crossheads from Markits to replace the whitemetal ones that came with the kit, so I just need to make sure these will fit up when it comes time to assemble the cylinders and motion. Next steps are to finish the brake rigging, and add the chassis springs. I also managed to get my hands on some of this! Happy day.

I came home to a few surprises last night, one of which was whitemetal solder. Which meant after must frustration I ended up with this - not super happy with it, the biggest issue is the 'face' the boiler is oval, and the odd design of the kit means that in order to get the firebox sides straight, there needs to be a gap along the bottom of the boiler, which means I can't solder it all up and gently press it round, does anyone have any suggestions for this? I'm a little stumped. Starting to look like a Lord Nelson an N15x now! Posed up with the boiler, footplate/frame front and cylinder block all screwed into place, I apologise for the tape. But i'm trying to align the footplate sides as best I can to try and line up the front bufferbeam. I think I need to assemble the cab next to make sure it lines up correctly on the footplate and then lines up okay with the boiler/firebox. I've come to realise that a lot of the castings are undersized, the front bracket that supports the smokebox saddle is the main offender here, although as I was advised for the top of the boiler, dabbing blobs of solder on and then filing down does a good job of filling any gaps. I did wonder though, should I be using a specific flux, or will regular flux do ok? It still sizzled, but the solder didn't seem to 'flow' like it does on brass, it was fluid on the parts that did have solder though. I was also very pleased that there was no melted whitemetal, turning the iron right down yielded very happy results, liquid solder every time, and full intact castings!

Hey Dave, may I just ask what thickness of brass you used for the replacement smoke deflector and how you managed the beading? Thanks mate!

Mick, Sorry if it's been asked before, but what transfers do you use for your lining?

Still no WM Solder, so nothing is fixed together, but here are some photos of my efforts tonight. And with a few extras courtesy of some blu-tack Most of my efforts have been around dry fitting, making sure that all the bits fit together nicely. I'm running into a bit of an issue with the front part of the footplate, where it meets up with the bufferbeam doesn't match. The left side is too short, and the right side is too long. It's only just occurred to me now, but I might fillet in some whitemetal at the cab end, I think that will be easiest. There will still be lots of tidying up around the front end as there are so many joins. Once the boiler has been soldered together I'll clean up the castings and try my best to get it more round than oval. Ideally I want to be able to fit a flywheel inside so there's still lots of sanding back and tidying up to do. I also had a play around with ideas for the draincocks - I saw the idea in one of DLT's posts, although after studying the prototype photos a little closer, there's other details that need adding. What I imagine is the actuating lever is the main part, but i'll focus on those details later. Finally I tidied up the bogie, the donor King Arthur bogie wheels are the right size (12mm as opposed to the kit providing 14mm) but the rim profile isn't quite right, so they will do for now, but will need to be addressed before the model is finished. I also cut up some PCB (remembering to chamfer the edges to avoid shorts!) so I can fit pickups to the bogie, and did my best to clean up the casting a bit. I'm also still not sure how i'm going to join loco/tender, I did think maybe through the drag beam hole, but i'm not so sure now. I also need to think about the pipework under the cab - I think i'll need to order some brass rod... I'll add it to the list!

Thanks guys, I didn't have any brass sheet to hand, and because the hole opening was a sort of 'half etch' I didn't have the right size rod either, but I did have some spare bits of brass wire, so I just did my best, and the solder filled the gap nicely around the wire and it looks fine all tidied up. I'm lucky that the holes are way out because it would be a pain trying to drill another hole over the existing hole. Here's some interesting B&W footage of the Southern in the 1940's - if it links correctly it should be as N15x 2329 'Stephenson' passes the camera in wartime black guise https://youtu.be/3sIUtu-s51Q?t=473

Jeez, now that's good value! I was hoping that I would be able to use the shoes from this fret for the K class, I think that I should be able to use a mash up of parts to get correct looking versions for that though - I think there's a general fret that would suit the N15x better. So no worries there! I need to fill the holes that are already in the chassis for the brake hangers and drill new ones. I was thinking solder, but i'm not sure, is there another way of filling holes in brass? Once the fully insulated wheels arrive, I'll start on the motion - the Motion that comes with this kit is a little Disproportionate (I think) so i'm trying to see if Langley models will do just the valve gear from their Baltic Tank. I've already sorted crossheads from Markits. Once I've sorted that, it'll be on to pick-ups and motor/gearbox fitting. Still waiting on this blasted whitemetal solder!

I was even luckier though - the guy I got it off gave me a tin of Humbrol 'Malachite' for 'nowt! Thank you, it'll be finished over the weekend. I pose another question to my readers - I took delivery of the mainly trains SR brake shoe etch (now owned by Wizard models). I have two contenders for the brake shoes on the N15x, The left hand one is for a terrier, but the curve is right and I think the shoe itself isn't, the right hand one is for an E4/5/6 and a little bit more stout, but it doesn't curve at the top and so won't fit between the wheels but still be anywhere near close enough to the wheel to be believable. They are both LBSC designs, so I think my best bet may be to use the shoe part from the E4/5/6 and the hanger from the Terrier. I've included a picture of the side profile, showing that in reality neither is correct. Open to suggestions - I might look at non SR brake shoes and see if any will fit the bill!

Picked up a Maunsell Van C for approx £5 - it was in BR Blue The roof needs another coat. and then transfers. This is the first thing i've painted entirely with enamels. I also realised that the spare front 8F pony truck I had was the perfect size for the K class, and looked much better than the one that came with the kit, Hopefully more updates soon!

It came with a fully compensated chassis if I remember correctly? The work you did on the body was excellent, it was no small task, dubious use of the word 'only' I think the work you did on the body is the reason it's such a nice model! I especially like the actuator detail on the left hand side of the boiler - well worth the effort!

That Q is amazing, Dave did a really fantastic job. Probably one of my favourite builds of his. I'm guilty of having read that part of his thread multiple times - an excellent addition to your collection!

I just want to point out that this year is flying by us, and it will probably be midway through 2019 before we know it. That means that for them to reach the 2020 production date we should probably be seeing physical samples in the next 6-8 months surely. Unless there are massive delays, (Bachmann H2 WHERE ARE YOU?!), I would think progress should be quite quick.

Thanks Dave! I think i just need more practice, it's certainly better than the schools tender, using water is key You're not the only person to tell me that. Might just take a while to refine the skill. I've not used Fox lining transfers yet, but I might give them go.

Gosh, lining really takes a while. I'm still not happy with it either. I should probably learn to use a bow pen.. I added the rear lamp irons, Still need to add the Vac hose. Even after doing my best to bring this up to date, it still shows its age. Not finished by any means. The buffer beam needs another coat of paint and the buffers need painting, there's a few other paint touch-ups. I'll be finishing off the rear of the tender later tonight.

Adam, I am in awe, that is one seriously excellent piece of modelling! Forgive me if it's been asked before, who's screw-link couplings have you used?

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Seems like I constantly have new things on the go I found a use for the whitemetal lump that was supposed to be vacuum tanks, that came with the N15x, much better than the Bachmann representation. I know the Hornby LN is due for release soon(ish), but I thought I would have a go at updating this tender. The reason I didn't cut out the second coal area was that after doing the first, destroying most of the details and having to rebuild them, I didn't fancy it, also the molded coal isn't too bad, it's not too high so some coal over the top will disguise it nicely. I've detailed a few little bits so far, and added sprung buffers, I need to add the lamp irons before I prime and paint. Should be interesting lining it out, lots of complex curves! This is going to be a 'Neverwas' of sorts, because what I plan to model did run but not during 1947. I wonder who will be able to guess what it is..

Kernow has been excellent to deal with every time I've ordered something from there. The staff are very prompt communicators and and very friendly. I'm not sure what else carried it, i'm sure there will be something though. from my communication with Fox, it was easy to produce these, as they are effectively the same as the Maunsell 'THIRD' but in sunshine style. It might be worth messaging them again to ask. I found them to be very responsive!