Pragmatic Pre-Grouping - Mikkel's Workbench

[bgman]

As a query looking at the blades you bought Mikkel, can they not be honed back to a point or is the length critical?

It might be worth reading post #1456 on here

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/79025-a-guide-to-using-the-silhouette-cameo-cutter/page-59&do=findComment&comment=2440647

 

It can be done apparently but not sure for the need to.

[bgman]

Hi Mikkel,

 

A as yet an incompleted signal box ( being GW - esternised from a laser cut kit ).

 

I've made the add on porch with the Silhouette and the replacement roof complete with new slates ( produced from 10 thou plasticard). The original roof is laying on the ground to the left which I wasn't too keen on although I did slate it over using the same method as you to experiment.

It's far quicker to do this now with the cutter than previously cutting each slate / rows with a scalpel.

 

The fineness of the porch window bars also make it worth using.

 

Grahame

 

p.s. Still on going and aware of some minor bits to do.

[N15class]

It might be worth reading post #1456 on here http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/79025-a-guide-to-using-the-silhouette-cameo-cutter/page-59&do=findComment&comment=2440647

It can be done apparently but not sure for the need to.

Here in Brazil locally (by local I mean 3000+ kilometres away in Rio) bought ones will twice as much or more as in UK. Plus postage and 3 week delivery. Buying in UK and posting is fine but will take on average three and a half months to arrive. If customs do make a charge (over 50 dollars) it's 60%.

 

It takes getting used to after the average 48 hour delivery in UK.

Edited June 7, 2017 by N15class

[Mikkel]

As a query looking at the blades you bought Mikkel, can they not be honed back to a point or is the length critical?

 

Hi Pete, as bgman says it may be possible for others. For me it would be too small to see things properly, except maybe through the magnifying glass. But I can sympathize with the need to be creative when the alternative is a 3 months waiting period for new blades!

 

 

Hi Mikkel,

 

A as yet an incompleted signal box ( being GW - esternised from a laser cut kit ).

 

I've made the add on porch with the Silhouette and the replacement roof complete with new slates ( produced from 10 thou plasticard). The original roof is laying on the ground to the left which I wasn't too keen on although I did slate it over using the same method as you to experiment.

 

Ah, that looks brilliant Grahame! Apart from the window bars, I'm also impressed by the blue engineering bricks. 

 

So you prefer 10 thou plasticard rather than the vinyl? I can certainly see that for 7mm the vinyl might appear a bit too thin. 

[bgman]

Thank you Mikkel, I originally tried artists watercolour paper, which was of the correct thickness and has a useful texture.

I then re-thought the idea, partly because of the tackiness of the carrier sheet and due to the new roof being made from 1mm plasticard.

 

I wasn't confident in sticking the watercolour paper to the plasticard so back-up plan no. 1.

 

Using 10 thou plasticard is fine for me due to the cut / embossing quality in the Silhouette. I would have probably tried your vinyl method but I read the post afterwards ( by 2 days ! Thanks mate !!! ) LOL

 

The bricks, in fact all of the box, has been sprayed and brushed with " our " favourite acrylic paints, Vallejo, colour matching with their range which so far I'm happy with.

 

I will try the vinyl with my 4mm project and thank you for showing the results here.

 

 

Grahame

[Mikkel]

Thanks for sharing that Grahame   I thought the roof you had scrapped used vinyl, so was interested to hear how you compared that with the 10 thou plasticard. Can I ask the source of the laser cut kit that you have modified to produce the signal box?

[Nick Holliday]

 

 

So you prefer 10 thou plasticard rather than the vinyl? I can certainly see that for 7mm the vinyl might appear a bit too thin. 

I appreciate that exactly scaling things doesn't always achieve the hoped for result, but I do think that modellers have got rather used to the idea of overscale slates. I see from their website that Penrhyn Slates now come in three thicknesses, 5.5mm, 7.5mm and 9.5mm.  In 7mm they scale at around 0.005", 0.007" and 0.009" respectively so 10 thou plastic is actually thicker than the thickest Welsh slate, although other sources may be thicker.  I don't know what thickness the vinyl comes in, but I rather like the potential of it to achieve the almost smooth effect of a well made slate roof.

[bgman]

Thanks for sharing that Grahame I thought the roof you had scrapped used vinyl, so was interested to hear how you compared that with the 10 thou plasticard. Can I ask the source of the laser cut kit that you have modified to produce the signal box?

Good morning Mikkel,

 

No vinyl was hurt during the modelling process !

 

The reason for using 10 thou is.... because I had it in front of me !

 

I wasn't going to be pedantic about scaling the thickness ( consider some of the commercial kits and you could have a field day ! ) and I found it acceptable.

 

The laser cut signal box comes from http://lcut.co.uk/index.php?page=pages/main&title=Main who I found quite by accident and have an interesting range of kits in both 4 & 7 mm scales. I saw the SBox and thought I would use it as the basis for what you see in my post here. LCut are extremely quick at getting the product to you too, ordered from them at 14.00 on a weekday and here 09.20 the next day by Royal Mail. Usual disclaimer, satisfied customer.

 

I would have liked to see the brickwork in Flemish bond as opposed to the Stretcher bond which I seem to think all of the kits are due to being of a generic nature ( I could be wrong on that point ) but at the price point they're worth using I think.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Grahame

Edited June 8, 2017 by bgman

[Rob Pulham]

Thanks Chris, Mike and Snooper.

 

Yes the cutter does open up a new world, and as we've discussed earlier it doesn't lead to laziness but on the contrary spurs you on.

 

 

Not every morning at the moment I'm afraid, Chris, but at least regularly. i've also been working on the backscene and a wagon with a twist - will try to take some photos soon.

 

 

I got my Cameo from Amazon, but others will know better about good UK deals and what the most recent versions are.

 

In case you've missed it, Mike's info on blades etc is very useful, it can be found in Jason's excellent index here: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/79025-a-guide-to-using-the-silhouette-cameo-cutter/?p=1238643

 

I personally found it good to start off with the standard Silhouette blade while getting the feel for cutting depth etc. The blades do wear down fairly quickly though - which can be hard to see unless you take a photo:

 

DSCN3035.jpg

 

This becomes costly, so like many others I've started using the CB09 bladeholder and blades which are cheaper. Note that there are variants of the CB09 even if they have the same name, I got the one that seems to work without need for modification, bought from this ebay seller (in China, where I normally never buy from, but it came through with no trouble): http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1x-CB09-Graphtec-Blade-Holder-5-Blades-for-Vinyl-Plotter-Cutter-30-45-60-Mix-/191623289638?hash=item2c9da35b26:g:GqQAAOSwpdpVWq~O

 

Other than that, it might be worth getting two cutting mats while you're at it if you are going for the Cameo - partly to allow printing longer sheets as per my illustration above, and partly because there's a fair chance you'll cut into the mat more often than you want to. Which in my experience is not that much of a problem in the short term, but as the marks in the mat increase over time it does probably affect the "smoothness" of the cut.

 

Hi Mikkel,

 

I am really surprised at your blade wear. I have been using the same blade for about 18 months and although I have bought a new heavy duty blade the old one is still going strong.

[Mikkel]

Thanks for the info gents.

 

Nick, I can't find any indication on the packaging or on the web as to how thick the vinyl is, but to me it seems about right for 4mm slates. 

 

Grahame, I thought it might be from LCUT, your build is a very good advertisement for modifying their kits, I think.

 

Hi Mikkel,

 

I am really surprised at your blade wear. I have been using the same blade for about 18 months and although I have bought a new heavy duty blade the old one is still going strong.

 

That's impressive Rob. Of course it depends on how much we cut, but in my case it could be two things: (i) I could probably be more careful when it comes to setting the right depth of the blade, (ii) when I first started experimenting with the cutter I tried it out on various materials that were too thick. Of course everyone had told me I couldn't cut that deep, but I had to try, didn't I    

Edited June 8, 2017 by Mikkel

[57xx]

Wow, that stable block has come out fantastic. I really need to pull my finger out and order myself a Cameo. 

[Re6/6]

Exquisite work there Mikkel. Quite remarkable.

[Guius]

Stable block looks 'spot on' Mikkel, I can almost smell the horse pee! (quiet a nice smell in my book BTW). Some of the larger stables had two wheeled, one horse tumbrel type muck carts to carry away the manure for disposal about its yard, this might have included local foundries strangely enough. 

 

Best

Guy

[DonB]

Horse manure is used in the molds in Brass Foundries, particularly those casting large bells. I saw the (huge) molds for the Malta Memorial Bell ready to be poured at the John Taylor & Co's Bell Foundry In Loughborough. I have to say the smell was quite distinctive!

 https://www.timesofmalta.com/articles/view/20120630/environment/Siege-Bell-memorial.426560

[Guius]

Horse manure is used in the molds in Brass Foundries, particularly those casting large bells. I saw the (huge) molds for the Malta Memorial Bell ready to be poured at the John Taylor & Co's Bell Foundry In Loughborough. I have to say the smell was quite distinctive!

 https://www.timesofmalta.com/articles/view/20120630/environment/Siege-Bell-memorial.426560

Yes Don, not just bell foundries though, cores (the empty space represented by an independent 'plug' of sand) have many applications in founding and horse muck was used to 'bind' the green sand together for resilience against the stresses of pouring. Horse muck was valuable enough for  independent cartage contractors to pay for the privilege of removing the stuff for resale to foundries. So as the old saying goes 'Where  there's muck there's brass'.

 

Guy

[Mikkel]

Thanks very much gents for the kind comments and info.

 

Very interesting to hear about the "muck carts" for the manure. Sounds like an obvious addition to the scene. Most of the standard GWR stable block designs had a manure pit at one end of the building. The one at Park Royal can be seen here on the left, although I may have to move it to the other end to fit on the layout.

 

 

 

On the subject of ventilator slats, the technique for making these can be also used for other types of ventilator slats. Compare these which I used on the stable block...

 

 

...with these below which I tried out to see what else is possible:

 

 

The difference is that on the former the hinges for each slat is at the bottom, while on the latter they are at the top (if that makes any sense!). The former are 5 thou and the latter are 10 thou by the way. I also tried making the hinges in the middle of each slat, but they broke too easily (might work for larger slats/scales though).

Edited June 11, 2017 by Mikkel

[John lewsey]

Your modelling is quite frankly superb Mikkel

Regards

John

[Mikkel]

Thanks John, very kind of you to say so. I had better post this though, before it all looks too smooth   Just a few of the failures and rejects...

 

 

[Dave John]

Just an idea, a bit of strip glued on at the edge before bending the louvres inwards  ? Also, looking at contemporary louvres I'd bend them to the inside, rather than the outside. Thats based on some restoration work a couple of years back. Ok it was a 1862 building, but the method originally was two side runners with cuts at 45 deg.   The slats were then made up as a panel and fixed behind the faceplate. 

[Mikkel]

Hi Dave, I did try the glue trick but it didn't really seem to make any difference. The main reason for the ones that fail I suspect is that the cutter simply isn't enough of a precision tool to get it exactly right every time when it comes to the small margins I'm working with here. Or small imperfections in the cutting mat, or similar. In the end I managed to get down to about 1 in 4 rejects, so not too bad when I only needed 6 roof vents in total.

 

For the roof vents on the stable block, I bent the louvres/slats towards the inside as you say. The example with the slats bent outwards was a result of playing around with alternative options, but maybe there was no prototype for that in the steam era.

[Stubby47]

Wouldn't louvres bent inwards also let in rain ?

[Siberian Snooper]

All the Louvres on machinery space and engine intakes aboard the ships I have worked upon have all had the slats opening outwards, to reduce the chances of water intake, there was also a second screen inside to stop any ingress of water on any engine intakes.

[Edwardian]

 

Time for an update. I'm still inching forward with the Park Royal stable block. It now has a roof and four walls.

 

 

 

The rear wall was very plain on the prototype, as per most GWR stable blocks (windows were sometimes retro-fitted). The desktop on my workbench is sagging, maybe I should treat myself to a new one!

 

 

 

In principle, the rear wall was too long to cut in one piece on my Silhouette Portrait cutting mat. But I found I could simply stick the embossed brick sheet across two mats, as seen above.  So for the cost of a new mat you can extend the scope of the Portrait.

 

 

 

The roof slates were cut from vinyl, a tip I got from Lee’s blog.

 

 

 

Once cut, the vinyl strips can easily be pulled off the backing and are not ass fragile as paper or card strips which allows repositioning. The photo shows my test piece, hence the irregularities. I forgot to make the end slates double size – but that’s my fault, the technique itself is the best I’ve tried yet. Thanks Lee!

 

 

 

I am now working on the roof ventilation.  After some head-scratching I’ve ended up with this approach. I first cut 5 thou Evergreen sheet as above.

 

 

 

This is then folded and glued, and when dry the slats (is that the word?) are gently teased to an angle with a scalpel.

 

 

 

Strictly speaking there should be 9 rather than 8 slats on the “long” side, but I couldn’t fit the last one. 

 

 

 

It took some trial and error to get the design right, and even there are rejects as the slats sometimes break. But when it works it only takes a few minutes to assemble a roof vent, and they have a fairly uniform look. Next steps are to finish the roof vents, and add ridge tiles and flashing. Apart from a new workbench, I think I also need a new cutting mat. I'm approaching 50 but I still haven’t learnt to colour inside the lines!

 

Excellent work, as usual.  Good to see such a substantial stable block, which I expect will justify much equine activity and impedimenta.

 

PS: Do you know how many stalls and how arranged?

 

I would guess a single row along the rear wall with an apron along the front running left and right of the single, more or less centrally placed, door, with the right-hand door a tack room or more likely hay store.

 

I tend to assume boxes at about 12' x 12', but I don't know whether working railway horses were expected to make do with less.

 

I assume that you will run a gully along the front for drainage, and I suspect that the too square apertures at the base of the wall would lead into them.

Edited June 13, 2017 by Edwardian

[bgman]

I wonder if Horsetan would know ?

[MikeOxon]

...........   Just a few of the failures and rejects...

 

So few!!!   I'm sure if we all posted our mistakes and failures, it would bring this website to a grinding halt