Hornby Merchant Navy announced (formerly Facebook leak)

[Combe Martin]

Hornby's 35028 will have an early BR logo. 1st MNs rebuilt were in 1956 but some time between 1957-59  Clan Line obtained a late BR logo (the only 'un-rebuilt' MN to do so). During it's early BR logo spell 35028 ran on the Eastern section of BRS, whereas the vast majority of MNs ran on the Western section of BRS. The only rebuilt MN to appear on the Eastern section was 35015 for a brief period in 1958-59.

 

 

Clan Line did run on the Eastern Section until the middle of 1959, and it's the easiest of modelling jobs to change the tender logo.

[Dunsignalling]

Clan Line did run on the Eastern Section until the middle of 1959, and it's the easiest of modelling jobs to change the tender logo.

And remove the fairings ahead of the cylinders, which BR did c1952 c1953.

 

John

Edited December 1, 2015 by Dunsignalling

[Forester]

Apologies if this all sounds a bit pedantic but a few points re running 'un-rebuilt' 35028 alongside 'rebuilt' MNs.

 

Hornby's 35028 will have an early BR logo. 1st MNs rebuilt were in 1956 but some time between 1957-59  Clan Line obtained a late BR logo (the only 'un-rebuilt' MN to do so). During it's early BR logo spell 35028 ran on the Eastern section of BRS, whereas the vast majority of MNs ran on the Western section of BRS. The only rebuilt MN to appear on the Eastern section was 35015 for a brief period in 1958-59.

 

Regardless of all of this, there's always 'Rule 1'.

 

PRTRAINMAN

 

Fair point.

But I'm a Golden Arrow fan so my 35028 Clan Line will end up on the Eastern Section suitably adorned sharing the duty with my exquisite rebuilt and renamed 35015 Rotterdam Lloyd.

 

Now all I need is for Hornby to do the decent thing and produce the correct Pullmans for their 2016 Golden Arrow Last Steam pack ...........

[RFS]

Dunsignalling, on 01 Dec 2015 - 10:11, said:

And remove the fairings ahead of the cylinders, which BR did c1952.

 

John

 

According to A J Fry's "Bulleid Power - the Merchant Navy Class" 35028 was repainted from blue into Brunswick Green in June 1953, and fitted with boiler 1120 which had re-sited safety valves at 250lb pressure.  If the fairings ahead of the cylinders had been removed by this time, then Hornby's model is incorrect, in that it never ran in Brunswick Green with the fairings still in place.

Edited December 1, 2015 by RFS

[Combe Martin]

But I'm a Golden Arrow fan so my 35028 Clan Line will end up on the Eastern Section suitably adorned sharing the duty with my exquisite rebuilt and renamed 35015 Rotterdam Lloyd.

 

As I recall (I was there as a kid on the bridge at Orpington) Golden Arrow duties were shared between the above 2 and Channel Packet and the Brits William Shakespeare and Iron Duke.

 

If Channel Packet was on it all the kids used to moan !  

[Forester]

As I recall (I was there as a kid on the bridge at Orpington) Golden Arrow duties were shared between the above 2 and Channel Packet and the Brits William Shakespeare and Iron Duke.

 

 

Now I also have a false memory of Channel Packet on the Golden Arrow ............

 

It's probably because of all the publicity photos, prints, jigsaws of the inaugural run which were around at the time.

 

In fact Channel Packet never pulled the Golden Arrow again in all its regalia after the first couple of weeks re-introduction. It went back to Eastleigh and on to Exmouth Junction to work for many years!

It lost the side sheeting arrow clips when it gained the large deflectors and these were never re-fitted when it found its way back to Stewarts Lane in 1957. Consequently it was used on the Night Ferry, often in very poor condition, and it never reprised its glossy finish GA heyday.

[ed 66 plant]

Clan Line did run on the Eastern Section until the middle of 1959, and it's the easiest of modelling jobs to change the tender logo.

My records (not my memory) tell me that 35028 received the second logo 7-11-59 and repainted BR green/front casing removed-12-6-53.

35023 never received the BR blue livery . It came out in malachite and was repainted BR green 22-3-52.Its front casing was removed 5-53.

Hope this is helpful--I am following the Hornby M.N news/updates very closely and hope to convert 35028 to 35030 for the period 1955-58.

In this way it can happily co-exist with my rebuilt 35018 on the Bournemouth run-especially on the Bournemouth Belle.

Edited December 2, 2015 by ed 66 plant

[Dunsignalling]

According to A J Fry's "Bulleid Power - the Merchant Navy Class" 35028 was repainted from blue into Brunswick Green in June 1953, and fitted with boiler 1120 which had re-sited safety valves at 250lb pressure.  If the fairings ahead of the cylinders had been removed by this time, then Hornby's model is incorrect, in that it never ran in Brunswick Green with the fairings still in place.

They are still there in a photo dated 26th March 1953 (on page 85 of The Power of the Merchant Navies (OPC 2007) but they had been removed from some class members earlier, hence my use of "c1952" rather than "1952" in post 431 (now amended to "c1953").

 

Unfortunately, the caption of the photo immediately below it stating it to be in Brunswick green and showing their absence, omits the date!

 

Plate 76 in "The Power of the Bulleid Pacifics" (OPC 1983, revised 2001) dated 7th April 1954 shows the gap where they used to be, setting a time span of just over 12 months during which they were removed.

 

There is an obvious temptation to infer that removal coincided with repainting into Brunswick green but the loco seems to have been a regular on the much-photographed Golden Arrow during that period so there should be plenty of dated pictures to help narrow it down.

 

John

 

Edit: the post by ed 66 plant, above, indicates that it was OK to be tempted in this case

Edited December 1, 2015 by Dunsignalling

[RFS]

Dunsignalling, on 01 Dec 2015 - 18:10, said:Dunsignalling, on 01 Dec 2015 - 18:10, said:

They are still there in a photo dated 26th March 1953 (on page 85 of The Power of the Merchant Navies (OPC 2007) but they had been removed from some class members earlier, hence my use of "c1952" rather than "1952" in post 431 (now amended to "c1953").

 

Unfortunately, the caption of the photo immediately below it stating it to be in Brunswick green and showing their absence, omits the date!

 

 

I have that book too and only noticed this picture some time after I posted.  As the photographer is Brian Morrison, the date is almost certainly correct.

 

The picture brings back memories for me since, as a 14-year old trainspotter on a rare outing to Tonbridge in the summer of 1959, I saw 35028 for the first time - the only MN not underlined in my ABC.  Still unrebuilt but not for much longer!

 

On page 90 of the same book there's a picture of 35030 under overhaul at Eastleigh on 17 May 1953.  It's already been repainted but doesn't have the fairings any more.  As 35028 went into the works the following month, I would assume that, if it still had the fairings, they would have also been removed as part of its overhaul.  All of which adds up to Hornby's model currently being wrong if they produce it in green with fairings.

Edited December 1, 2015 by RFS

[RFS]

ed 66 plant, on 01 Dec 2015 - 18:09, said:

My records (not my memory) tell me that 35028 received the second logo 7-11-59 and repainted BR green/front casing removed-12-6-53.

 

 

35028 was unique in having the final BR crest on its tender whilst still in original condition and with an un-modified tender.  Locomotives Illustrated 99 on page 25 has a colour picture of the engine in this condition at Folkestone Junction in October 1958. By 7-11-59 it had already been rebuilt.

Edited December 1, 2015 by RFS

[Dunsignalling]

I have that book too and only noticed this picture some time after I posted.  As the photographer is Brian Morrison, the date is almost certainly correct.

 

The picture brings back memories for me since, as a 14-year old trainspotter on a rare outing to Tonbridge in the summer of 1959, I saw 35028 for the first time - the only MN not underlined in my ABC.  Still unrebuilt but not for much longer!

 

On page 90 of the same book there's a picture of 35030 under overhaul at Eastleigh on 17 May 1953.  It's already been repainted but doesn't have the fairings any more.  As 35028 went into the works the following month, I would assume that, if it still had the fairings, they would have also been removed as part of its overhaul.  All of which adds up to Hornby's model currently being wrong if they produce it in green with fairings.

It wouldn't be the first time Hornby included these in a loco incorrectly.

 

Two light pacific models in late condition with cut-down tenders have been produced so fitted, 'Weymouth' and 'Blandford Forum'.

 

Fortunately, they came off quite easily from both of mine.

 

John

[Forester]

 

Two light pacific models in late condition with cut-down tenders have been produced so fitted, 'Weymouth' and 'Blandford Forum'.

 

Fortunately, they came off quite easily from both of mine.

 

John

 

Indeed, mine both fell off in transit saving me the bother .... 

[RFS]

Dunsignalling, on 01 Dec 2015 - 20:33, said:

It wouldn't be the first time Hornby included these in a loco incorrectly.

 

Two light pacific models in late condition with cut-down tenders have been produced so fitted, 'Weymouth' and 'Blandford Forum'.

 

Fortunately, they came off quite easily from both of mine.

 

John

 

Let's hope Graham Muz can advise them accordingly!

[Graham_Muz]

Hornby are tooling for pretty much all the variations across all three series of Merchant Navy.  The illustration currently being used for the Series Three version is a 3D render from the cad that includes all details and hence does not at this stage fully represent the final version of the model.

 

The design team are aware of the dates when the fairings (casings) were removed from both 35028 (which was indeed at the time of repainting from blue into green) and also 35023 which ran in green with the fairings for approximately 15 months.

[Combe Martin]

Now I also have a false memory of Channel Packet on the Golden Arrow ............

 

It's probably because of all the publicity photos, prints, jigsaws of the inaugural run which were around at the time.

 

In fact Channel Packet never pulled the Golden Arrow again in all its regalia after the first couple of weeks re-introduction. It went back to Eastleigh and on to Exmouth Junction to work for many years!

It lost the side sheeting arrow clips when it gained the large deflectors and these were never re-fitted when it found its way back to Stewarts Lane in 1957. Consequently it was used on the Night Ferry, often in very poor condition, and it never reprised its glossy finish GA heyday.

 

That's interesting, and I'm not disputing what your saying.  The period I'm referring to is summer 1957 onwards until the end of steam on the eastern section.  Being the summer holidays there used to be a huge crowd of kids on Orpington bridge just waiting for the famous Golden Arrow to come through on the slow line (having come off the Victoria line at Petts Wood Junction).  I certainly remember the moans when the loco was Channel Packet though, so I presume it must have been on a preceding or following service.

[toboldlygo]

Hornby are tooling for pretty much all the variations across all three series of Merchant Navy.  The illustration currently being used for the Series Three version is a 3D render from the cad that includes all details and hence does not at this stage fully represent the final version of the model.

 

The design team are aware of the dates when the fairings (casings) were removed from both 35028 (which was indeed at the time of repainting from blue into green) and also 35023 which ran in green with the fairings for approximately 15 months.

 

Graham a few of questions.

 

Will the tooling for the deflectors allow the inclusion of the mounting battens for the Devon Belle sideboards were appropriate?

 

Also will the mounting points on the side sheet for the Golden Arrow, be part of the tooling (again were appropriate)?

 

I know this is probably a long shot - will the tooling be able to cater for Bibby Line's modifications for the Locomotive Exchanges (smoke deflectors & Flaman speed recorder)?

[Graham_Muz]

Graham a few of questions.

 

Will the tooling for the deflectors allow the inclusion of the mounting battens for the Devon Belle sideboards were appropriate?

 

Also will the mounting points on the side sheet for the Golden Arrow, be part of the tooling (again were appropriate)?

 

I know this is probably a long shot - will the tooling be able to cater for Bibby Line's modifications for the Locomotive Exchanges (smoke deflectors & Flaman speed recorder)?

 

Details such as the DB batons and GA mounting points are pushing things a little too far, and whilst the tooling is aimed to cover all 30 locomotives at some stage in their Air Smoothed life there is a limit, unsurprisingly, mainly due to costs as to just what  individual loco modifications can be incorporated (think also the front cowls and casings on 21C8 at one stage)  

 

[Forester]

That's interesting, and I'm not disputing what your saying.  The period I'm referring to is summer 1957 onwards until the end of steam on the eastern section.  Being the summer holidays there used to be a huge crowd of kids on Orpington bridge just waiting for the famous Golden Arrow to come through on the slow line (having come off the Victoria line at Petts Wood Junction).  I certainly remember the moans when the loco was Channel Packet though, so I presume it must have been on a preceding or following service.

 

Possibly the moans were triggered by the fact that Channel Packet looked such a mess at that time, often uncleaned, with cutdown tender, and small BR early crest, compared to younger sister and stablemate Clan Line, newly overhauled with late crest matching the outline of the nameplates, original air-smoothed tender and polished 'til your eyes hurt. I remember the shock when first I saw CP in this condition rather than as it was commonly pictured in gloss malachite.

 

Perhaps a cue for a new thread elsewhere on disappointing first cops!

[ed 66 plant]

Possibly the moans were triggered by the fact that Channel Packet looked such a mess at that time, often uncleaned, with cutdown tender, and small BR early crest, compared to younger sister and stablemate Clan Line, newly overhauled with late crest matching the outline of the nameplates, original air-smoothed tender and polished 'til your eyes hurt. I remember the shock when first I saw CP in this condition rather than as it was commonly pictured in gloss malachite.

 

Perhaps a cue for a new thread elsewhere on disappointing first cops!

Gentlemen--my 2 pennoth is not directly related to the above post--I have just had confirmation from  Hattons that all 4 identified M.Navy models have been cancelled by Hornby--no reason given.

My order with them for R3436 is now a thing of the past.

Has anyone else been made aware of this?

A disappointed Ed Plant

Edited December 9, 2015 by ed 66 plant

[Hilux5972]

Gentlemen--my 2 pennoth is not directly related to the above post--I have just had confirmation from Hattons that all 4 identified M.Navy models have been cancelled by Hornby--no reason given.

My order with them for R3436 is now a thing of the past.

Has anyone else been made aware of this?

A disappointed Ed Plant

They are still on the Hornby site. And they are still available for preorder on Hattons site as well. Not sure where your email came from but I don't see it being legitimate.

[Black 5 Bear]

I had exactly the same e-mail, this was followed by another inviting me to purchase any of the four versions offered by Hornby. Confused or what ???

[Fenman]

Gentlemen--my 2 pennoth is not directly related to the above post--I have just had confirmation from  Hattons that all 4 identified M.Navy models have been cancelled by Hornby--no reason given.

My order with them for R3436 is now a thing of the past.

Has anyone else been made aware of this?

A disappointed Ed Plant

 

Coincidentally I have just come from the Hattons site which happily took an order for Channel Packet, and has sent me an email confirmation.

 

Very mysterious.

 

Paul

[Andy Y]

Gentlemen--my 2 pennoth is not directly related to the above post--I have just had confirmation from  Hattons that all 4 identified M.Navy models have been cancelled by Hornby--no reason given.

My order with them for R3436 is now a thing of the past.

Has anyone else been made aware of this?

A disappointed Ed Plant

 

The original products on Hatton's website were placeholders as Hornby hadn't announced the names and liveries at that point. Hatton's are contacting anyone who has pre-ordered to establish which of the announced liveries they actually want.

 

Therefore neither Hornby or Hatton's have actually cancelled anything.

[ed 66 plant]

The original products on Hatton's website were placeholders as Hornby hadn't announced the names and liveries at that point. Hatton's are contacting anyone who has pre-ordered to establish which of the announced liveries they actually want.

 

Therefore neither Hornby or Hatton's have actually cancelled anything.

Andy----I immediately queried the cancellation of my order for R3436 via the Hattons chat line.

Apparently in a very considered way they came back to confirm that this was the case and that they were very sorry.

As for placeholders; Hattons had identified all 4 variants on their website--presumably as per information relayed from Hornby.

There was no doubt as to which one I had ordered and wanted----R3436.--the details covered,livery crest as well as name/number

Something rather unprofessional is going on.

Edited December 9, 2015 by ed 66 plant

[Hilux5972]

When they were first announced earlier in the year, way before the 2016 range announcement, Hattons put a placeholder product on the website, this is most likely what Andy was referring to.