Henley-on-Thames - GWR in the 1930's

[Neal Ball]

42 minutes ago, longchap said:

Hi Neal,

 

I've had issues using Vallejo matt varnish on little people, where they refused to go dull! Someone told me a second coat would work, but unfortunately not, so I went back to my default Testors Dulcotte, which I have a sufficiency of from the sadly missed Mick Bonwick, who taught me so much very useful stuff.

 

Hopefully, all will be restored when you find your ideal varnish.

 

Bon courage mon ami.

Thanks Bill, that’s interesting. I also thought about emailing Vallejo to see what they say….

 

In the meantime, I’ve hand painted a couple of roofs with the neat varnish.

 

to be continued…

[TrevorP1]

Varnishing terrifies me! Success or ruination, rarely anything in between!

 

Re the matt. I've used Humbrol acrylic aerosol on figures and the occasional wagon. It always comes out very matt but occasionally it has damaged the odd transfer or acquired a 'bloom'. The damage to transfers can be overcome by first gently covering with Clear (I've only ever used the Humbrol version for this). The bloom is probably my impatience and using it when the air is too damp. Not a disaster on a wagon but nightmare on a coach!

 

Somewhere I read of someone's success with Army Painter products but I'm blowed if I can remember where...

[ChrisN]

My understanding is that matt varnish is a nightmare.  It can go off with time, although I think Neal's varnish is new.  Needs stirring quite well.  I had an issue with Humbrol matt sray varnish where one side of my figures was fine, the other side had a bloom.  I tried to do it late in an autumn day when it had gone damp.  I checked out what the wargamers said, and the advice was to respray.  Their advice was to shake the can for a good five minutes, or as I interpreted, until my arm fell off, so that it was mixed and warm.  It worked and the bloom disappeared.

 

I usually try and finish with satin, but this can be variable and needs lots of mixing.

 

Sorry, no experience with air brushes and varnish though.

[Ben Alder]

12 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

 

 

Maybe that’s the answer - stick to one side 😎

 

More of a pressing issue is the gloss like finish 🙁

 

One side only is all I ever do - don't even paint the other....never seen, so no point and it gives you more time to make even more stock!

 

Getting a matt spray finish is tricky and several of my go to favourites have been playing up recently, but Winsor and Newton do one that gives a flat finish. Avoid spraying in on a humid day as this can affect the results. They also do a satin varnish which might be better for coaches, which were better looked after than wagon stock.

[Neal Ball]

5 hours ago, Ben Alder said:

 

One side only is all I ever do - don't even paint the other....never seen, so no point and it gives you more time to make even more stock!

 

Getting a matt spray finish is tricky and several of my go to favourites have been playing up recently, but Winsor and Newton do one that gives a flat finish. Avoid spraying in on a humid day as this can affect the results. They also do a satin varnish which might be better for coaches, which were better looked after than wagon stock.

Thanks for that Ben.

 

I think I have been quite careful regarding the weather when I spray. Generally we have quite a dry atmosphere in this part of Spain…. The humidity increases during July and August, so that’s something I will need to remember.

 

Thanks again.

[Neal Ball]

Yesterday afternoon, I decanted some neat varnish (shaken vigorously) and hand painted a couple of roofs.

 

Initially I started with this bus, where the difference from the roof to the sides is apparent.

 

And also the roof of the H44

 

 

But I don’t really want to hand paint the sides. The finish I have achieved with the spray gun is terrific…. I won’t be able to hand paint to the same standard….

 

I’m inclined to have another go with the bus. If I mess it up, it doesn’t matter as much.

 

(in the meantime, I have emailed Vallejo)

 

To be continued.

Edited May 4, 2022 by Neal Ball

[Neal Ball]

The shape of things to come!

 

 

I have had these roof boards for a while, they are from Sankey Scenics, who made up a Regatta Special set for me.

 

I’m sure folks on the Slough service would love a Restaurant carriage as part of the service!  Rule 1 clearly applies! 
 

I think I need to order some general Regatta roof boards.

 

The Centenary carriages will have roof boards for the Radley College (Regatta) special.

[Neal Ball]

The shape of things to come part 2:

 

(work in progress)

 

 

Of course there will be other carriages added to make up the Radley College Regatta special.

 

[Neal Ball]

Interesting reply to my email from Vallejo.

 

Thank you for your interest in our products and we are sorry for the inconveniences that this issue may cause.

I assume that you first applied a gloss varnish to be able to apply the decals and that their support wasn’t visible, is it?

Sometimes the issue you exposed happen when the matt varnish is too much diluted, could it be your case?

If not, please we kindly request you to send us the batch numbers printed on the label beside the description.  This code starts with a letter and is followed by numbers, for example: K-02-05.  Once we have this information, we can send the reference to our chemistry department to test the batch to ensure highest quality.  As soon as the quality test is finished, we will respond to your issue with the resolution and take the required steps.

 

I wonder if in my haste to get the “consistency of milk” I diluted it down too much. It’s a lovely sunny day here today…. I will try another mix on the bus!

 

I have now read on the Vallejo website a precise 3 parts varnish to 1 part thinners.

[longchap]

7 minutes ago, Neal Ball said:

Interesting reply to my email from Vallejo.

 

Thank you for your interest in our products and we are sorry for the inconveniences that this issue may cause.

I assume that you first applied a gloss varnish to be able to apply the decals and that their support wasn’t visible, is it?

Sometimes the issue you exposed happen when the matt varnish is too much diluted, could it be your case?

If not, please we kindly request you to send us the batch numbers printed on the label beside the description.  This code starts with a letter and is followed by numbers, for example: K-02-05.  Once we have this information, we can send the reference to our chemistry department to test the batch to ensure highest quality.  As soon as the quality test is finished, we will respond to your issue with the resolution and take the required steps.

 

I wonder if in my haste to get the “consistency of milk” I diluted it down too much. It’s a lovely sunny day here today…. I will try another mix on the bus!

 

I have now read on the Vallejo website a precise 3 parts varnish to 1 part thinners.

It's reassuring to see that Vallejo are taking your problems seriously Neal and offering advice and further research with the batch numbers. Good luck with the respray using a precisely measured dilution today and we await further, hopefully, duller news to come.

 

A glorious day here in the Loire, which I fully intend to take full advantage of.

 

Best,

 

Bill

Edited May 6, 2022 by longchap

[Neal Ball]

Rapido have posted this video on their Facebook page: 

 

 

The sound file is very good, but I don’t think adding smoke is for me. Interesting that it’s only burning water, not oil.

 

Obviously Rapido will be using a 48xx to showcase their Titfield set… but presumably not doing the loco that goes with it…. Something else GWR coming soon @rapidoandy? A new GWR Collett designed Autocoach perhaps…. 

[Harlequin]

The technology used here is ultrasonic vapourisation using a piezoelectric transducer. It's a really neat way for making "smoke and steam" for model steam locos because it's solid-state and can be instantly turned on and off electronically.

 

But it's a shame the exhaust hangs around and falls to the ground after the initial puff.

 

Edited May 6, 2022 by Harlequin

[longchap]

10 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

The technology used here is ultrasonic vapourisation using a piezoelectric transducer. It's a really neat way for making "smoke and steam" for model steam locos because it's solid-state and can be instantly turned on and off electronically.

 

But it's a shame the exhaust hangs around and falls to the ground after the initial puff.

 

I like the  sound of this technology and the smoke and steam hopefully would dissipate more realistically with the model moving over the track. Looking forward to learning more and thank you both for your posts.

 

Bill

[Neal Ball]

29 minutes ago, longchap said:

It's reassuring to see that Vallejo are taking your problems seriously Neal and offering advice and further research with the batch numbers. Good luck with the respray using a precisely measured dilution today and we await further, hopefully, duller news to come.

 

A glorious day here in the Loire, which I fully intend to take full advantage of.

 

Best,

 

Bill

Thanks Bill, it’s already 20 degrees in the shade on our front terrace 🌞

 

Thinking about the dilution, that must be the issue…. My E153 which had not previously been sprayed gloss, has a very Matt look to it…. Whereas those carriages sprayed Gloss, just increased the gloss.

 

I will attack the poor old bus!

 

But in the meantime I have ordered locally a replacement Vallejo varnish and thinners - the exact ones in their on-line instructions.

 

4 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

The technology used here is ultrasonic vapourisation using a piezoelectric transducer. It's a really neat way for making "smoke and steam" for model steam locos because it's solid-state and can be instantly turned on and off electronically.

 

But it's a shame the exhaust hangs around and falls to the ground after the initial puff.

 

Presumably it would waft along better if the train was running.

 

I like the soundfile and I like the idea of sound in the 48xx. Although I have always thought it would be better to squeeze a larger speaker into the adjacent autocoach.

 

Food for thought - although it’s not on my radar at the moment, I need to bring my current carriage up to spec, it’s paint job is being superseded by my spraying efforts! (It was done by hand ages ago and it shows!)

 

[Neal Ball]

Just now, longchap said:

I like the  sound of this technology and the smoke and steam hopefully would dissipate more realistically with the model moving over the track. Looking forward to learning more and thank you both for your posts.

 

Bill

Thanks Bill. Yes I am sure it would be better if the loco was running. But I don’t think smoke is for me….

[Harlequin]

12 minutes ago, Neal Ball said:

I like the soundfile and I like the idea of sound in the 48xx. Although I have always thought it would be better to squeeze a larger speaker into the adjacent autocoach.

 

YouChoos fitted one of the new MS decoders into a DJM 14xx, crucially with useful stay-alive, for @Andy Keane's Helston.

But it's a very fiddly upgrade!

https://www.youchoos.co.uk/Index-Resource.php?L1=Guides&Item=OODJM14XX-MS

 

[Andy Keane]

47 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

YouChoos fitted one of the new MS decoders into a DJM 14xx, crucially with useful stay-alive, for @Andy Keane's Helston.

But it's a very fiddly upgrade!

https://www.youchoos.co.uk/Index-Resource.php?L1=Guides&Item=OODJM14XX-MS

 

Indeed it was not a simple upgrade as I also wanted a headlamp. But it is now not a bad little runner.

[Nick Gough]

21 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

The shape of things to come!

 

 

I have had these roof boards for a while, they are from Sankey Scenics, who made up a Regatta Special set for me.

 

I’m sure folks on the Slough service would love a Restaurant carriage as part of the service!  Rule 1 clearly applies! 
 

I think I need to order some general Regatta roof boards.

 

The Centenary carriages will have roof boards for the Radley College (Regatta) special.

 

What a civilised way to travel!

[Nick Gough]

21 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

The shape of things to come part 2:

 

(work in progress)

 

 

Of course there will be other carriages added to make up the Radley College Regatta special.

 

 

According to my 1937 Through Coach Working book the 'Centenary' stock was employed on 'The Limited' Monday to Saturday. However, the Sunday equivalent services were composed of 70' stock.

[Harlequin]

52 minutes ago, Andy Keane said:

Indeed it was not a simple upgrade as I also wanted a headlamp. But it is now not a bad little runner.

Lamp? Oh yes, I see. Amazing! (Should be a red bodied lamp for your period, of course...)

 

This all inspired me to have a look at my 14xx again because the sound has always been a bit weedy and I realised I can easily improve it by fitting a bigger speaker. Looking at it afresh it's a really beautiful model. Mine has run quite well in the past but today, not so well... Motion full of cat hairs... ☹️

 

[Neal Ball]

2 hours ago, Harlequin said:

YouChoos fitted one of the new MS decoders into a DJM 14xx, crucially with useful stay-alive, for @Andy Keane's Helston.

But it's a very fiddly upgrade!

https://www.youchoos.co.uk/Index-Resource.php?L1=Guides&Item=OODJM14XX-MS

 

Thanks for that Phil, I hadn’t seen the new decoder tried out. Last time I looked it was still the MX.

 

I like the comment “not for the faint hearted”. 
 

Although it would be tight, I reckon you could get a decent installation into the autocoach…. Including pick ups on the carriage.

 

1 hour ago, Andy Keane said:

Indeed it was not a simple upgrade as I also wanted a headlamp. But it is now not a bad little runner.

I also like the idea of a headlamp… even better if it had a Red/ white lamp at both ends of the train 😎

 

31 minutes ago, Nick Gough said:

 

What a civilised way to travel!

Very civilised indeed…. Rule 1 applied 😎

 

26 minutes ago, Nick Gough said:

 

According to my 1937 Through Coach Working book the 'Centenary' stock was employed on 'The Limited' Monday to Saturday. However, the Sunday equivalent services were composed of 70' stock.

Thanks Nick. Rule 1 again…. My Regatta day of course is a Saturday in July, when due to the importance of the Radley race (I’m sure I read the one of the school Governors is also a Director on the GWR 😎) the GWR opted to provide that days London based set for the Regatta. 🤣🤣

 

20 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

Lamp? Oh yes, I see. Amazing! (Should be a red bodied lamp for your period, of course...)

 

This all inspired me to have a look at my 14xx again because the sound has always been a bit weedy and I realised I can easily improve it by fitting a bigger speaker. Looking at it afresh it's a really beautiful model. Mine has run quite well in the past but today, not so well... Motion full of cat hairs... ☹️

 

It is a nice model and mine is “ok” I seem to recall…. But would definitely be better permanently attached to the autocoach with extra pickups added.

 

I need to investigate stripping the paint off the carriage first and then upgrading it.

[Neal Ball]

In other news, my poor bus has been sprayed again….

 

It was very fiddly mixing the paint 3:1

 

To be continued!

[Andy Keane]

20 minutes ago, Neal Ball said:

Thanks for that Phil, I hadn’t seen the new decoder tried out. Last time I looked it was still the MX.

 

I like the comment “not for the faint hearted”. 
 

Although it would be tight, I reckon you could get a decent installation into the autocoach…. Including pick ups on the carriage.

 

I also like the idea of a headlamp… even better if it had a Red/ white lamp at both ends of the train 😎

 

Very civilised indeed…. Rule 1 applied 😎

 

Thanks Nick. Rule 1 again…. My Regatta day of course is a Saturday in July, when due to the importance of the Radley race (I’m sure I read the one of the school Governors is also a Director on the GWR 😎) the GWR opted to provide that days London based set for the Regatta. 🤣🤣

 

It is a nice model and mine is “ok” I seem to recall…. But would definitely be better permanently attached to the autocoach with extra pickups added.

 

I need to investigate stripping the paint off the carriage first and then upgrading it.

Adding pickups I find makes a huge improvement. I use 0.3mm dia phosphor bronze wire running directly on the tops of tyres in pairs, using the contact on one wheel to tension that on the next. My 45xx is using eight of its 10 wheels for pickup, with wires on four in addition to the axle based pickups originally fitted to five. Plus a stay alive and all works very sweetly. not so much scope on the 14xx but if you are fixing the autocoach on for keeps it would surely help. I may do that myself, especially if I could source a really nice coach.

Andy

[Neal Ball]

23 minutes ago, Andy Keane said:

Adding pickups I find makes a huge improvement. I use 0.3mm dia phosphor bronze wire running directly on the tops of tyres in pairs, using the contact on one wheel to tension that on the next. My 45xx is using eight of its 10 wheels for pickup, with wires on four in addition to the axle based pickups originally fitted to five. Plus a stay alive and all works very sweetly. not so much scope on the 14xx but if you are fixing the autocoach on for keeps it would surely help. I may do that myself, especially if I could source a really nice coach.

Andy

Mine will be my original Airfix carriage…. All wheel pick up will make a huge difference.

[Neal Ball]

Matt success!

 

It certainly was fiddly to get the mix right…. But it looks as if I now have a Matt finish that I can replicate with my carriages. Before spraying, the bus had the full “wet look” appearance 🤣

 

I don’t think I have spent so much time working on a bus! It now needs proper transfers, instead of the stickers and then glazing, painted seats and people…. It’s a long way down the list !