BITTON

[Donw]

I went to agree with Jason but the computer though it funny I have changed the rating but I was not being funny.

I said earlier you were making more progress. than most of us stop berating yourself and also you probably need to accept you cannot answer every post just do one post to cover all of us who had made similar comments.  I agree with Jason. Once you get the lifting section done and can run a train round it will make a difference. However if you want to do something smaller fine. A small BLT or shunting plank could be reseted on the fiddle yard boards for now do that then come back to see if Bitton still has some interest for you.

 

If you think you need some morw operational interest I can possibly help. It took me some time to realise that Dolgelley offered more interesting working than most places but all that changed with the grouping. It needs thought as there were many places where little happened. My advice is not to be hasty. I don't expect a quick response you need time to think. It may be that building small exhibition layouts is you key interest if so I have suggestions I can make but I do not want to tell you what to do.

All the best Don

[RBE]

Right, I'm not going to be popular saying this but I do so as a friend and nobody else seems to want to say it.

 

I think that you would be making a huge mistake giving up on Bitton. Sure, it is going to take a long time, the ballasting alone will take you weeks and at times it might seem like the goalposts are moving further and further away. But...

 

You can already run trains on it in it's current state with sod all track down and the more you lay, the more play value you will get. Who is saying that you have to ballast the whole thing at once? It doesn't stop you operating if you do it bit by bit, an hour here and there and it will soon be done. Pease don't let impatience put you off.

 

You have as many sidings as Bacup has in the yard, but with the added interest of breaking trains up on the main line and working them back across the slip. When you get a bit more track down, you will also be able to run round and add more interest. With only mineral wagons and vans in short rakes, you don't have much to go with but marshalling a pickup goods and plonking different wagons in different sidings (including picking up as well as dropping off wagons) and it gets more interesting.

 

Even at this early stage, it is well on it's way to being the best layout you have produced with an interesting prototypical plan, handbuilt track, different levels of scenery, that lovely station built on a curve, etc. KL was far from finished when we saw it and both of us loved it; apart fom the fell and the viaduct it was bare boards with some ballasted track (and one siding).

 

You have bare fiddle yard boards at the moment. Why not use that as a base to build yourself a small layout on there using Peco track and play trains on it whilst doing little bits to Bitton in the meantime when you feel like it. When you are ready, simply take the new one down and press on with the fiddle yard for Bitton, with nothing lost?

 

Building Bitton, a small GWR terminus (at the front of the FY) and another small layout at once would stretch the most prolific layout builder; even thinking about it makes my mind snap.

 

I know you are a fickle old git when it comes to what you like (LM steam, GW steam, BR blue, Sectorisation, horrible modern boxes that sound like whiny hoovers), but what is to stop you running them on Bitton other than pillocks like me telling you that it's not prototypical? Don't listen to me and my views, tell me to do one, it's your layout and you should run what you like. I once set my own trousers on fire on purpose so why would you listen to me??

 

Saying that, at least think about the above. Scrap it and a few months and layouts that offer short term gratification down the line and I reckon you will wonder what the hell you got rid of this one for. Take your time, give it a go and I reckon it will be your greatest triumph. Just don't try to do the whole bloody thing in a couple of months!!!

 

If I could click agree 5 times I would. I could stand here and go arrrggghhhhhh to be honest.

 

I understand the pressure that you put on yourself all too well because to be honest the pressure of you banging layouts out left, right and center, updating your threads and the speed at which Bitton was cracking along was the reason that I got overwhelmed and utterly disappointed by the tiny amount of progress I had made on Millers Dale over the last 2 years. I just don't have the time to dedicate to keeping up with you. I had no other choice but to shelve it for a bit. That being said I am in no way ever binning the project. It will be back, it will be done and I will be proud of what I have achieved. As said above, Bitton is by far your best work and to fall back into the old quick fix, knock a small layout up in peco over a couple of weeks, method of layout building would in my opinion be nothing short of an insult to everyone on here who takes something from your work. Model railways as in any other field of life need to be grown, skills progressed, new ideas formed and ambitious things tried in order to progress you as a modeller and human being. Doing the comfort zone thing over and over may be soft and snug but its also reclusive and desensitized. I like your small layouts but I always felt that you could achieve so much more, Bitton had started to prove that true. I have another friend on here who is exactly the same way (I won't mention names!) I've been trying to prize him out of his comfort zone for years, he does move on in baby steps though so that's something he can be proud of.

 

As for Bitton, get it finished, but know that it doesn't have to be done tomorrow, enjoy the process not the finish line, breaking the end tape is such a short part of a very long race, why place such a high value on that fleeting moment in time? The people on here are not expecting miracles and if they are then its tough luck on them not you. The hobby is just that, a fun thing to enjoy at your leisure. There is absolutely no reason or need to rush it. Its not an exhibition layout being made to a deadline. Enjoy the process, enjoy building it, enjoy laying the track and enjoy ballasting it! Your fun part, the scenics, will soon come along, it's all part of the process. It doesn't need to be a slog. If you need a break take one, I am, if you need to keep modelling but can't face Bitton right now do a diarama or build a set piece to go on the layout later. Repaint a loco or something. There's lots you can do without binning off  the best work that you've done to date.

 

Just get better, don't stress and enjoy it, whatever it turns out to be!

Edited February 12, 2015 by RBE

[georgeT]

Morning Mate,

 

Welcome back to the web, l hope you are feeling a lot better, now you have had a lot of comments and all valid in my mind, but at the end of the day it is up to you to decide where you go from here, being as you have put so much work into 'Bitton' to scrap it at this stage would be a complete waste of your time (and others)?

 

My advice would be to KEEP 'Bitton' on the back burner and stop working so hard on it, and have a break, as it is getting you down at the moment and seems endless, l know you also love the modern stuff, so build yourself a little depot / yard plank to run your diesels on, which you could exhibit at a later date, as l know you really enjoy the shows, then do a bit of work on 'Bitton' little and often as they say, with the ballasting why not just try to do a yard at a time a day? then before you know it you would have it done, so you could then have the best of both worlds....with the room you have you could have a nice big roundy-round with the planned fiddle yard and have space in the centre for your modern exhibition plank ??

 

Just my opinion, for what its worth    

 

George...

[Andrew P]

Morning Gang, Once again thanks for all your support and more importantly all your input, I didn't want to hear comments from a lot of you saying KEEP BITTON GOING, but you know, at the end of the day your right. I will be having a small break from Bitton.

 

I will be building a small Layout that I can sit and enjoy, it will NOT be going back to Peco Track though, as I have enjoyed the Point building so much, and I will come back fresh and raring to go, but a lot more slowly.

 

Bitton was originally planned as the last great project, but as many of you pointed out, IT COULD NEVER BE, as I love planning and building Layouts.

 

I had a long chat with Marcus, (Marcus37 / Kyle of Loch William) last night, now for those who don't know Marcus, he is a Train Driver, and he said that there are still many Yards like Bitton on Secondary routes that still get used today. At one location there is even a Goods Shed like the one on Bitton that has been used to service Locos over the last couple of years, so I have many options.

 

One thought I have had overnight is to do a Cav; Well Bitton closed as was Millersdale, but Cav is doing Millersdale in the 80's, so as my main memories of early train interest was mid to late 77, I could do Bitton in the 70's & 80's (sorry Cav for being a copy cat). If that's the route I decide to take, then the Signals will be replaced with Colour Lights and the Signal Box may be boarded up as control would be from Bath Box. One siding of the Coal Yard would still be in use with Engineers dumping wagons in the other siding, and the Shed would be used by Van Traffic to a Local industry as a private siding, as Bartholomew's had in Chichester with a constant supply of Cargo Wagons. I could then justify my Blue and Railfreight Sound fitted Stock that I like so much. 

 

The Station would still be in use but by Class 158 / 150 / 153 etc.

 

I'm out with another Doctors appointment for Mum this morning, and then picking up a 5ft x 18 inch board later, all will be revealed in due course once its under way, and the points are built.

 

Bitton is not dead, its just sleeping.

 

Thanks.

[JZ]

I know exactly how you feel. My last two projects, Somercombe and Tolmouth, both failed when I lost focus, mainly through trying to fit a quart into a pint pot. Yes, I am aware that having close to 20' x 10' is more than most can give to a layout, but however much space you have, it is never enough. And also, it is a large undertaking for one person, which in itself can lead to 'burn out'. With Gurney Slade, I am back to enjoying the build again. Also it has some operational variety, shunting the small yard and also banking up to the summit. It also helps being able to almost see the real location from where I sit. I have deliberately not finished the wiring so I don't play trains, so this gives me some incentive to get on with the scenery. However, there are some days when I really don't feel like modelling, so I just leave it, sometime for a week or more. I do hope you return to Bitton, but only when you want to, otherwise it will become a chore and lose it's appeal. Beside, I am hoping you can move your time frame back to include the early 1960s so we could run some through traffic.

[Allegheny1600]

Hi Andy, dear boy,

I don't care what era you do with Bitton, just make sure that you look after yourself and your family first & foremost!

.

Model railways, however much we love them - are merely a hobby, a distraction from harsh realities, an escape from dreary life, whatever and yes, they add warmth & friendship when shared via a forum, show or club but they are NOT worth losing any sleep over (even though I've done it, Aaargh!).

 

In your position matey, I'd be inclined to close the shed up and put it to the back of my mind until the milder weather appears again.

 

Walk the dog, build some buildings or wagon kits on a tray on your lap while watching the box(!) or even take a holiday away from everything.

It's entirely normal for mojo to disappear entirely leaving you wondering what the heck you were thinking of but after a while it comes back, slowly but surely.

 

Above all get sleep and rest, switch that brain off and unfocus for a while. And don't worry about us lot!

All the very best mate,

John.

[Jock67B]

Morning Andy,

That post cheers me up a lot - glad that you are taking that route and I look forward to seeing evidence of the results as and when you are ready! Good advice somewhere above to post less often with more content when you feel up to it - you are in charge don't forget!

Good to have you back mate but do PLEASE take care, and no more 'porkies' about taking things easy!!! You did have me very worried there as a build up of pressure like that is the last thing a stroke victim needs!

Kind regards,

Jock.

[KeithHC]

Well done Andy take care and chill out. At the end of the day its your railway do what you want just to please yourself. I do not even have a layout but have been planning the one I want. But have a mind to build a smaller layout to try out things!! I have to admit I do get a lot of inspiration from your current layout and look forward to your next one as well. For my small layout I am thinking of a yard similar to Bridgwater. A yard that is still in regular use. The stock required 2 x Class 20, 31, 37, 47, 57 and 2 x 66 just a couple of Nuclear flask wagons and maybe a couple of engineers wagons.

 

Keith, Dursley

[Andrew P]

Afternoon Jules, John, Jock, and Keith, Thanks for all you input guys, and its good to hear of other project like yours Keith. Also I see from KL that Jock is making a start so good luck with that mate.

 

As for closing the Shed John, well I'm afraid that's a no no my friend, and if you send anything up from the S & D with a Kettle on the front Jules. then it will be Warmley (get it Warmley, just up the Line from Bitton) welcomed.

Edited February 12, 2015 by Andrew P

[Marcus 37]

Hi Andy

It was nice to have a chat last night. It's good to talk sometimes, so please feel free to call anytime you like. like wise I'll call you.

Now you've got that Yeoman 59 it would be perfectly feasible to have either a loading or unloading pad at Bitton for train loads of stone. Just need the relevant Machinery. Grab for unloading or Shovel for loading. I do this at a couple of locations. Small Heath Caledonion yard we discharge and Shrewsbury we load with stone brought in from the nearby Quarry. With Bitton being in the vicinity of the nearby Medips this traffic could be perfectly feasible. As for your passenger services don't forget the Wales & West Bristol to Weymouth trains.

I used to do these frequently as they were 37 Hauled. On their route to Weymouth they used to stop at all sorts of outlying shacks.

They were normally formed of 4 Mk 2s. Two painted Maroon and two painted blue. The good thing as well they frequently dropped no heat loco's as well as the normal 37/4. Even some of the 37/4 celebrities appeared as well such as 37403 in green.

I've included a few pictures below mate.

37403 Westbury

37403 Bristol

37407 Bristol

37430 Castle Cary

 

Hope that provides a bit of inspiration. If you decide to go down the stone route. (Good replacement for the sixties coal traffic) then any prototypical information you want, photos, method of work etc let me know as I'll be glad to oblige..

You take care mate.

Speak to you soon.

Cheers

Marcus.

[Andrew P]

Hi Andy

It was nice to have a chat last night. It's good to talk sometimes, so please feel free to call anytime you like. like wise I'll call you.

Now you've got that Yeoman 59 it would be perfectly feasible to have either a loading or unloading pad at Bitton for train loads of stone. Just need the relevant Machinery. Grab for unloading or Shovel for loading. I do this at a couple of locations. Small Heath Caledonion yard we discharge and Shrewsbury we load with stone brought in from the nearby Quarry. With Bitton being in the vicinity of the nearby Medips this traffic could be perfectly feasible. As for your passenger services don't forget the Wales & West Bristol to Weymouth trains.

I used to do these frequently as they were 37 Hauled. On their route to Weymouth they used to stop at all sorts of outlying shacks.

They were normally formed of 4 Mk 2s. Two painted Maroon and two painted blue. The good thing as well they frequently dropped no heat loco's as well as the normal 37/4. Even some of the 37/4 celebrities appeared as well such as 37403 in green.

I've included a few pictures below mate.

image.jpg

37403 Westbury

image.jpg

37403 Bristol

image.jpg

37407 Bristol

image.jpg

37430 Castle Cary

 

Hope that provides a bit of inspiration. If you decide to go down the stone route. (Good replacement for the sixties coal traffic) then any prototypical information you want, photos, method of work etc let me know as I'll be glad to oblige..

You take care mate.

Speak to you soon.

Cheers

Marcus.

Cheers Marcus, some good stuff there, I will leave the yard as Coal for now, and make a final decision later on that one.

[Andrew P]

Well this afternoon I've made a small start on the outer embankment at the Warmley end,

 

Now I just knew I'd find a use for those 4 inch nails,

 

 

that and the left over Celotex from the Shed insulation and its looking quite good so far.

 

 

[westerhamstation]

Hi Andy, what happened to taking it easy, All the best Adrian

[Killybegs]

I guess you've nailed that then!

[Andrew P]

Whilst I was doing the embankment I heard the sound of Brush Class 47 coming through, I had to get out of the way to let it past. Then unexpectedly the points changed on the Down Trailing Point and Slip and the 47 with a VDA and VGA started to revers into the Loop, and then it pushed the wagons into the Old Goods Shed for unloading by the Masons Warehouse Staff. the Cargo Wagon was yesterdays shipment and will be collected later I hope.

 

 

 

 

Plus some Engineers wagons were dumped by the 33 earlier today.

 

Edited February 12, 2015 by Andrew P

[Anotheran]

Looking good Andy, but please take it slowly.

 

I'm sure that nail next to the signal box will interfere with the trains, and your drill looks as if it's strapped to the embankment, so may reduce its range of operation. 

 

On a much more serious note. Looking at those shots you really don't have to worry about ballast quickly. The grey paint gives a good visual base for the track. So you can ballast just a foot or so every now and again between more interesting scenic work, like the embankments and buildings etc. In real life the ballast is put on top of the ground, not the ground next to the ballast, so doing other things in between isn't making anything appear wrong.

 

I really liked Jason's point of taking your time. Play around with a few moves, think about what bit of track is needed for the next move to be experimented on, and lay that bit. Then if you fancy a photo, look at what small sections of scenery are needed to make up the one picture. Bit by bit, section by section. But you don't need to show us every step if that just makes things more difficult. Keep us in suspense and surprise us whenever you feel you want to.

 

And don't listen to all those hard drivers who keep shouting for grass

[tender]

Good to see you back on the job Andy. Like everyone says, take it easy.

Ray.

[JZ]

Don't know if this helps, but I have taken to using a hot glue gun to stick my Kingspan down.

[emt_911]

Evening Andy

 

I'm sure that I read somewhere that you were having a small break from Bitton (Post 4678)

 

Nice work though and the story works as well.

 

But, please take it easy.

[PeterBB]

Don't know if this helps, but I have taken to using a hot glue gun to stick my Kingspan down.

Bodgit loves glue guns ... they stick things together very quickly so he doesn't have to hold them too long.  Like everyone the one problem occurs when the glue hits fingers - ouchhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

 

Peter

[ChrisN]

Andy,

I have only just caught up, mainly because I am away two days a week and have no internet and so I catch up on threads that have a lot in them slowly- t leaves more time for modelling.  You really need to be careful as you have started again not to get sucked into what was happening before and trying to get everything done yesterday.  It might be an idea to leave the ballasting until you feel confident that it will give you enough shunting enjoyment.  If not think about adding one or two more sidings.  Also if you make the boarded up signal box in the scenery but not stuck down you can then you can swop it out for a working one and run steam.

 

Finally, remember, this is a hobby.  Something to be enjoyed, and if posting on the web puts you under pressure then do not post your layouts.  Limit the number of sites you visit, there is just not enough time in the day to view them all.

 

All, the best Andy.  (Do not feel you have to reply.)

[Sasquatch]

Hi Andy,

 

Sometimes we all need a break my friend.

 

Chris has a good point about being able to swap things about in order to create a different era. It can be done with working signals too!

 

Ballasting. With the right tools can be done rather quickly.  I'm a bit busy at the present but when I get a short free period I'll do a video.

 

Take things easy mate, regards Shaun. 

[georgeT]

Hello Mate,

 

Glad to see you are doing something you enjoy, and that it the scenery, little by little you will feel better when you see some green stuff appear, it will start to transform it, and hopefully your mojo will return too....

 

George

[JZ]

  Like everyone the one problem occurs when the glue hits fingers - ouchhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

 

Peter

Yes. Gave myself a couple of nasty burns. I fit my point motors using hot glue. Using maybe a little too much with one in the goods yard, my determination to hold it in place until the glue had set, meant I didn't remove the drips from my fingers quickly enough. . Anyway, the fingers healed within a couple of weeks, where as the point motor would have taken as much as five minutes to remove and refit.

[westerner]

As for ballasting, not my favourite job either,, On the DVD with the March BRM Phil Parker demonstrates a couple of new products to glue ballast down. As a few have said take it nice and slow now you have started again, after all it's not a race.