Bachmann Warflats

[John Isherwood]

51 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

I have recently purchased an example of this model with a Cromwell tank. One question, should these wagons have jacks fitted to the underneath of the buffer beams? 

 

Yes, and they are supplied for the purchaser to fit - along with couplings, side chains and vac. pipes.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Edited September 29, 2019 by cctransuk

[markw]

On 08/09/2019 at 14:28, Phil Bullock said:

Possible source of post war vehicles for warflats and warwells...

 

https://www.butlersprintedmodels.co.uk/20mm/post-ww2-c22/british/wheeled.html

 

Phil

I ordered a Ferret and BV202 to see what they were like, quite pleased with how they turned out.

[Phil Bullock]

Cheers Mark yet to order but will be doing shortly. Would glazing be easy? 

[markw]

51 minutes ago, Phil Bullock said:

Cheers Mark yet to order but will be doing shortly. Would glazing be easy? 

Phil, No there is no cavity behind the windows, the whole body is a solid lump.

[exet1095]

12 hours ago, markw said:

I ordered a Ferret and BV202 to see what they were like, quite pleased with how they turned out.

That looks really good. Just one thing; the machine gun on the Ferret (it’s the original Browning .30) is always dismounted when the vehicle is unattended, especially for transport. It would be signed out of the armoury by the commander, along with his personal weapon (SMG) before deploying. If moving by rail to an exercise area, the weapons are mostly likely to have been centralised and transported under escort.

 

Paul

[JSpencer]

My Pair arrived. Here are some pics comparing the Cromwells to Hobby Master, Altaya/Ixomodels and Revell versions (all 1/72nd). The Bachmann tank has about 8 pieces in total (which is) far short (in the number used) compared to the other 3 makes. Price wise about equal to Altaya, about the same as Revell by the time you buy glue paint etc (and build the kit) and about half that of Hobby Master. Basically the Bachmann model lacks separate details of the other makes, no inner road wheels, the lamps and their guard irons as moulded like slots etc. A good starting point to detail from but for £15, you could start with Airfix kit (at 1/76th) and get a better all round model for the same (paint glue etc) though you would need to build it. 

Another pic compares with Oxfords Sherman III, the Oxford is cheaper, has more fitted details and is diecast (vs all plastic), though Bachmann did pick out the road wheel tyres in Black while Oxford did not. 

 

The Warflats are fortunately far better and looks good with both makes of Warwells. Having the weight and paint standard found in the Hattons version (Oxfords being 2/3rds the price of both, is lighter but has the securing chains in place). My only gripe on the Bachmann Warflat is that there are no instructions for fitting the detailing parts.

 

Enjoy the pics:

 

 

Edited October 7, 2019 by JSpencer
to correct the sense of short statement

[John Isherwood]

 

The Oxford Diecast Landrovers duly arrived, and were treated to a coat of Testors Dullcote to better replicate a military finish.

 

Here they are, posed on the WARFLAT but awaiting securing.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Edited October 6, 2019 by cctransuk

[PaulRhB]

On ‎01‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 15:40, JSpencer said:

The Bachmann tank has about 8 pieces in total and is far short compared to the other 3 makes.

Well it is 1/76 vs 1/72 so should be  

 

 

On ‎01‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 15:40, JSpencer said:

 

Basically the Bachmann model lacks separate details of the other makes, no inner road wheels, the lamps and their guard irons as moulded like slots etc. A good starting point to detail from but for £15, you could start with Airfix kit (at 1/76th) and get a better all round model for the same (paint glue etc) though you would need to build it. 

 

 

I agree one option is the Airfix kit as it's the same scale as the Bachmann Cromwell but I'd suggest the Milicast Battlefield range as worth a look as it offers far more variety in tanks in the correct 1/76th scale http://www.milicast.com/shop/home.php?cat=66

 

[truffy]

3 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

Well it is 1/76 vs 1/72 so should be  

 

 

 

I agree one option is the Airfix kit as it's the same scale as the Bachmann Cromwell but I'd suggest the Milicast Battlefield range as worth a look as it offers far more variety in tanks in the correct 1/76th scale http://www.milicast.com/shop/home.php?cat=66

 

The Airfix kit is 1:76

[PaulRhB]

6 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

 the Airfix kit as it's the same scale as the Bachmann Cromwell

 

2 hours ago, truffy said:

The Airfix kit is 1:76

That’s what I said  they’re both 1/76 

 

the other models in the comparison photo above of Cromwell’s were 1/72 so Bachman’s model should be shorter and narrower. 

[truffy]

9 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

 

That’s what I said  they’re both 1/76 

 

the other models in the comparison photo above of Cromwell’s were 1/72 so Bachman’s model should be shorter and narrower. 

The way you worded it made it sound like only the Millicast range was the correct scale. 

[PaulRhB]

Ok if the bottom quote is read in isolation but it was directly below the first in the same post where I said the Bachmann one is 1/76.  

Anyhoo, I too was a little surprised they didn’t paint the tank but I wasn’t upset at the lack of extra detail as it’s a nice moulding and going to be robust in stock boxes. I’ve already used milicast for post war and WW2 AFV’s and they are a nice fast route to a wider selection of prototypes so you can swap around loads. 

I’ll repaint mine, masking the markings although I may cover the larger ID star over. Then I’ll get some other vehicles for the later BR period and add magnets to hold them on. 

[markw]

1 hour ago, PaulRhB said:

Ok if the bottom quote is read in isolation but it was directly below the first in the same post where I said the Bachmann one is 1/76.  

Anyhoo, I too was a little surprised they didn’t paint the tank but I wasn’t upset at the lack of extra detail as it’s a nice moulding and going to be robust in stock boxes. I’ve already used milicast for post war and WW2 AFV’s and they are a nice fast route to a wider selection of prototypes so you can swap around loads. 

I’ll repaint mine, masking the markings although I may cover the larger ID star over. Then I’ll get some other vehicles for the later BR period and add magnets to hold them on. 

The tanks are painted, but it is just a single very thin coat, painting a couple of coats on the inside of the track guards will prevent the light shine through, The tracks can be snapped off easily to do this and then re-glued.

[PhilJ W]

I did read somewhere (Britmodeller?) that the Airfix Cromwell was about a scale foot too long though all the other dimentions are correct for 1/76 scale.

[gwrrob]

On 24/09/2019 at 07:47, JSpencer said:

 

For transport and when not in use, it was common to seal the muzzle of a gun with a 'tampion'. This was to protect the weapon .

 

Any ideas on how military modellers represent this feature please.

[Coach bogie]

There has just been a movie on 'Talking pictures', I assume filmed at Longmoor due to the J94 with obvious fake BR" on the side. Yard scenes shot at Feltham.

 

There are two warflats in the train one of which had a Bedford CA van and a caravan on the back. Prototype for everything!

 

https://www.reelstreets.com/films/weekend-with-lulu-a/

 

see picture 13 and 17.

 

Mike Wiltshire

Edited October 18, 2019 by Coach bogie
spag

[JSpencer]

3 hours ago, gwrrob said:

 

Any ideas on how military modellers represent this feature please.

 

Military modelers normally show tanks in battle mode. But the want too, I guess a small bit of plastic rod with a paint end will do.

[PhilJ W]

The idea was to stop water from entering the gun barrel. I have seen pictures of tanks about the time of D-Day with what appears to be a canvas bag tied over the end of the barrel. 

[gwrrob]

Following a link supplied by @Trains&armour there is a resin [hessian] camo set available to cover a Cromwell.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Redog-1-72-Hessian-camouflage-modelling-kit-for-British-Cromwell-Mk-IV-tank/292858761041?hash=item442fbe0f51:g:u68AAOSwX85cxQR7

 

 

[James Fitzjames]

On 19/10/2019 at 08:51, gwrrob said:

Following a link supplied by @Trains&armour there is a resin [hessian] camo set available to cover a Cromwell.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Redog-1-72-Hessian-camouflage-modelling-kit-for-British-Cromwell-Mk-IV-tank/292858761041?hash=item442fbe0f51:g:u68AAOSwX85cxQR7

 

 

AFAIK hessian camo would only be applied once over the water: a response to having a big square turret sticking up above Normandy hedgerows. Same with the 'Normandy Cowl' over the exhausts on the Bachmann model. Must say I'm pretty disappointed: Warflat itself is a nice model, but the tank is pretty dreadful for the price

Edited November 14, 2019 by James Fitzjames
Havering

[Trains&armour]

On 01/10/2019 at 16:40, JSpencer said:

Basically the Bachmann model lacks separate details of the other makes, no inner road wheels, the lamps and their guard irons as moulded like slots etc. A good starting point to detail from but for £15, you could start with Airfix kit (at 1/76th) and get a better all round model for the same (paint glue etc) though you would need to build it. 

 

You can rebuild the Bachmann Cromwell:

 

(Still, the Airfix  model is better. Rebuilding was a lot of fun though...)

[gwrrob]

A bump for this thread for a video from Sam's Trains 

 

 

I was hoping Bachmann would do another run of these to give another running number but I don't think the first batch has sold out. I agree with his view of the Cromwell tank and would rather the model came without it. Interesting price comparison with the Hatton's/Accurascale warwell.

[barkingdigger]

Hi all,

 

A post elsewhere led me to this thread, and having read it I feel compelled to set the story straight.  First, there was never any plan to scan real tanks at Bovington!  Some years ago (around 2014 IIRC) I was contacted by Tracy Layton at Armourfast.  She had some blokes from Bachmann UK in her office and they were talking about getting a Cromwell tank for the Warflat they were developing.  At that time Armourfast had a 1:72 Cromwell in their wargaming range, pantographed down from the 1:35 Tamiya kit back in the days before affordable CAD/CAM.  Bachmann were interested in it, but did not want it in 1:72 - they wanted it scaled down to 1:76 because their audience would raise havoc over the roughly 1mm length difference!  Of course you cannot simply scale down the steel tooling, so a new tool would need to be cut.  I do CAD modelling, so I was brought in to do the CAD work for Armourfast to get cut into new steel tooling in a Chinese workshop.  The design brief was the same basic parts breakdown and detail level as the rather simplified Armourfast kit (for rough handling by kids and others who "play" with trains rather than modelling them), but with the magnet holders added to the bottom, and optional parts for both the gun tank and CS version.  That tied my hands over the fine details!  I measured the Tamiya kit and looked at scale drawings to create the CAD model that would be CNC'd into new tooling - I even modelled the sprue runs.  They were keen to have something that could be WW2 or Korea, a MkIV or a MkVw with the extra hull armour, but there are so many differences even at that scale that they would have needed two different sets of tooling, so a standard MkIV with type D hull was agreed on...

 

The CAD went to China, and then the problems began.  It took ages to get anything from the Chinese workshop and relations between Armourfast and Bachmann broke down.  In the end the whole thing was supposedly dropped by Bachmann, but they managed to get the tanks moulded eventually.  Sadly Armoufast was a casualty of the Covid economic crash.

 

I am disappointed that Bachmann did not paint the plastic.  But I did provide them with several sets of markings for different times/units and for gun vs CS versions.  I haven't bothered to see what combos they have decided to offer.  One thing I am surprised about is how the tank adds so much to the price - I'd have expected it to cost Bachmann maybe a few quid each including assembly over a decent production run.  From what I've seen the quality of assembly and clean-up leaves something to be desired, and a skilled modeller would do well to strip and repaint it, replacing the headlight-guard "lumps" with wire along the way..  The cowl can be removed, along with the sand shields and fender-ends that were often placed on top to fit the loading gauge width.  (With the Oxford Sherman, why is there a .50cal on the turret?  These would be stowed for transport, especially when there was the factory-issue OVM box on the rear...)

 

I hope this helps!

[markw]

15 hours ago, barkingdigger said:

Hi all,

 

A post elsewhere led me to this thread, and having read it I feel compelled to set the story straight.  First, there was never any plan to scan real tanks at Bovington!  Some years ago (around 2014 IIRC) I was contacted by Tracy Layton at Armourfast.  She had some blokes from Bachmann UK in her office and they were talking about getting a Cromwell tank for the Warflat they were developing.  At that time Armourfast had a 1:72 Cromwell in their wargaming range, pantographed down from the 1:35 Tamiya kit back in the days before affordable CAD/CAM.  Bachmann were interested in it, but did not want it in 1:72 - they wanted it scaled down to 1:76 because their audience would raise havoc over the roughly 1mm length difference! 

 

I am disappointed that Bachmann did not paint the plastic.

But the difference in length is not 1mm, it is over 4.6mm. The over 2mm extra width is more of a problem when the wagon width is correctly scaled.

 

Bachmann did paint the plastic, but it was a very thin coat and the plastic was quite translucent.

[barkingdigger]

Ah, in the pics it looked unpainted - they really needed a second coat!  Yeah, the thing is they wanted "cheap and fast" so looked at the Armourfast offering that they could have super cheap since the tool already existed, but the scale issue meant starting from scratch.  Oh well...