Which SECR O1 kit?

[JSpencer]

There seems to be 3 SECR O1 kits out there:

 

Golden arrow - resin kit recommended for use with a minty chassis ( the chassis is miles out for my liking so I would switch to. branchlines R1 chassis kit). I have no have close a scale representation this is (which is important) but is by far the cheapest and easiest to build.

 

Branchlines own fully etched kit. Probably the most expensive but is it accurate? How hard to build etc

 

Falcon brass - not available. Cheaper than branchlines but a lot of bending and forming needs to be done by the modeler.

 

There seems to be no white metal one.

 

Any opinions advise is welcome

[Horsetan]

Branchlines O1 is not fully etched. I've been struggling with one, on and off, for a friend for some years now. I've had to replace quite a few parts with my own fabrications. See my photo album, entitled "The Long March".

 

Whitemetal boiler/footplate/cab and tender body on etched frames. This kit was, I think, an international design collaboration between Andy Mullins (Britain) and Paul Berntsen (New Zealand). If so, it shows. Some unfathomable design quirks, such as a whitemetal footplate in two halves (one longer than the other) which you have to solder together before cutting a big hole in it to fit your motor and gearbox, severely weakening the footplate. Boiler casting is oval and does not plug at all well into the smokebox casting. Smokebox front is etched but is incorrect shape and rivet pattern for any O1 running in BR days.

 

Coupling rods are so slender that you can twist or break them if you are heavy-handed. Instructions can be hit and miss. You cannot fit the RG4 motor / gearbox without a significant redesign of the gearbox. On the good side, has many cast brass details.

 

My view is: not worth the price tag unless it undergoes significant redesign. Would be better if combined with some of the Falcon Brass etched parts, but I think Falcon are unlikely to resurrect their kit unless there is sufficient demand and, if they do, my feeling is that we won't see it reappear much before 2016. They already appear behind schedule in respect of re-releasing the rolling stock range.

[mikeandnel]

Of the three, I would recommend the Falcon Brass version, providing that you build

with a photograph in front of you. It is a good kit for using most of the parts to 'scratchbuild' the Class O1 loco.

You may have to do a little bit of 'hacking' but the end result should be result in personal satisfaction.

I have built one and finished in South Easstern Railway lined black livery, and I have a spare waiting to be built

when I can get round to it.

Michael dJS

[JSpencer]

Branchlines O1 is not fully etched. I've been struggling with one, on and off, for a friend for some years now. I've had to replace quite a few parts with my own fabrications. See my photo album, entitled "The Long March".

Whitemetal boiler/footplate/cab and tender body on etched frames. This kit was, I think, an international design collaboration between Andy Mullins (Britain) and Paul Berntsen (New Zealand). If so, it shows. Some unfathomable design quirks, such as a whitemetal footplate in two halves (one longer than the other) which you have to solder together before cutting a big hole in it to fit your motor and gearbox, severely weakening the footplate. Boiler casting is oval and does not plug at all well into the smokebox casting. Smokebox front is etched but is incorrect shape and rivet pattern for any O1 running in BR days.

Coupling rods are so slender that you can twist or break them if you are heavy-handed. Instructions can be hit and miss. You cannot fit the RG4 motor / gearbox without a significant redesign of the gearbox. On the good side, has many cast brass details.

My view is: not worth the price tag unless it undergoes significant redesign. Would be better if combined with some of the Falcon Brass etched parts, but I think Falcon are unlikely to resurrect their kit unless there is sufficient demand and, if they do, my feeling is that we won't see it reappear much before 2016. They already appear behind schedule in respect of re-releasing the rolling stock range.

Thanks for the advice, after checking the pictures and considering the price, I might not go for this one. With Falcon being not available, I just a need a review of the Golden Arrow version. If dimensionally it is accurate, I,d can add the missing details and weight. Edited January 6, 2014 by JSpencer

[JSpencer]

Of the three, I would recommend the Falcon Brass version, providing that you build

with a photograph in front of you. It is a good kit for using most of the parts to 'scratchbuild' the Class O1 loco.

You may have to do a little bit of 'hacking' but the end result should be result in personal satisfaction.

I have built one and finished in South Easstern Railway lined black livery, and I have a spare waiting to be built

when I can get round to it.

Michael dJS

That could be an option if I can find a kit easily enough with the correct tender. As for photoes I am ok there, as I took many of the sole preserved example plus have the Marx and Bradley books on former SECR locos.

 

What worries me about the Golden Arrow version is that they may have added a scale foot to fit the Hornby Jinty chassis that looks nothing like an O1s.

Edited January 6, 2014 by JSpencer

[Horsetan]

....

What worries me about the Golden Arrow version is that they may have added a scale foot to fit the Hornby Jinty chassis that looks nothing like an O1s.

Ask Chris at Golden Arrow. He'll be able to tell you where the moulding has been stretched or compressed. Wheelbase should be 7'4" x 8'2", almost dead-on for the Pannier tank chassis......

[s_ellinson]

I'm working on a Jidenco O1 which i picked up without a chassis. I'm intending to put it on a Perseverance 2251 chassis which i happened across at a decent price plus a perseverance 6ft + 6ft tender chassis. I imagine the same chassis option would work for the Golden Arrow version, and a propriatary chassis might be the way forward!

[JSpencer]

Well, after my initial post in January 2015, we finally went for the Golden Arrow kit in 2015. Time flies by fast, but with a house change and kids, I did not have much time.

 

For the chassis, there were 5 basic options open to me:

1/ Use the Hornby Jinty chassis - this is so wrong in many ways, that you end up giving an SECR O1 a SECR C class wheel base. In fact you could go for a Bachmann C class chassis, but basically it is way oversized especially when eventually parked next to a C class.

2/ Brachlines R1 chassis kit, this is perfect for size BUT the end model is light.

3/ Oxfordrail Dean Goods chassis, having waited 3 years, what is another 1 or 2? Ok, this would probably perfect for size but I see no point spending £100 plus on a new loco just for a chassis, while the Dean goods currently running on the layout is a £30 Mainline one. So I would have to wait them to come out and then for someone to off load one for cheap (that will still be more expensive than the running mainline one)!

4/ Use a mainline chassis. YES, a push along scale model.... hmm maybe not

5/ Use a J15 chassis, there are some dimensional differences but lets look closer.

 

Wheel base 16' 1, a bit longer than an O1, however measuring Hornby model, it seems to be set slightly closer than that, a plus point

Loco Wheel Dia 4'11 vs 5'2 - only 1mm less. This is OK because really I will need a slight gap to ensure the wheels do not fowl the splashers

Tender Wheel dia 3'9 vs 4'1 - 2/3rds of mm more. I can live with that

Tender wheel base 12ft vs 11ft   --- the gap between the first set of wheels on the J15 tender match those of the O1, the second pair will need to be stretched which is easy enough by cut'n'shut

 

Now the J15 chassis has the bottom of the boiler barrel. Surprise both locos have 4'4 boilers.

 

Here are some pictures:

 

 

 

 

 

We tested sitting the kit on a J15 chassis, a lot better than the jinty chassis as can be seen above. Kernow then cleared out some J15 for £65 so it is now all systems go:

Edited April 19, 2017 by JSpencer

[JSpencer]

Having brought a second cheap J15, I stripped out the chassis and set to work getting the resin loco body to fit. Much of consisted of grinding away the thick resin walls of the kit, however some grinding was also required on the J15 chassis too.

The J15 boiler sits lower than the O2, so I won,t really benefit from daylight. I still find this chassis a better choice than standard Hornby 0-6-0 chassis though.

 

One thing, the middle splasher needs to be moved forwards about 2mm. I can get the chassis to run as is, but it looks wrong.

The question is how? Do I sculpt it? Need to think about that one.

 

Here are some pics next to a visiting superior GW engine!

 

 

 

[relaxinghobby]

Here's a possible solutions; If you have a piercing or jewellers saw ( a sort of miniature hack saw with a very fine blade which leaves a very fine cut ) you can cut around the splasher from the hole under the boiler without cutting all the way through the footplate. Then re-fix the splasher in the new position with super glue.

[JSpencer]

Thanks, I think I will try that because it really looks wrong.

[Bluebell Model Railway]

I built mine a number of years ago, interesting to see some different chassis being used, although for me I was on a tight budget, so it was make do, and improve. So mine has just had a small make over, and an upgrade on some chassis bits as I saw another O1 being made so borrowed some ideas to improve mine.
 

 

[JSpencer]

I built mine a number of years ago, interesting to see some different chassis being used, although for me I was on a tight budget, so it was make do, and improve. So mine has just had a small make over, and an upgrade on some chassis bits as I saw another O1 being made so borrowed some ideas to improve mine.

 

 

Yours in very nice indeed, did you do the lining yourself with bow pens or lining transfers? Edited April 29, 2017 by JSpencer

[Bluebell Model Railway]

Some are HMRS, some are homemade transfers which are mainly the patterns on the tender, cab and splashers.

[JSpencer]

Ok, about time for an update I suppose.

 

Now, first thing research the prototype. The golden arrows resin body, gives you a resin body and same of the larger parts in resin. But all other minor details are not supplied.

So out with the photos and the list is quite long. To complex matters, SECR patten parts are somewhat rare out there. I could find SECR lamp irons though LSWR and LBSCR exist, photos showed they were not the same. Clack valves were another headache and buffers which are very particular for the SECR, non existent.

 

As luck would have it, I had two spares from a Jendico H class kit. And my choice of prototype 31065 (bluebell engine in BR days), for some odd reason did not have SECR buffers in the early 50s (she does now). I am modelling her when she worked on the former east kent railway. Here is a pick from an East kent railway book (informative read) and you will see she has bigger than normal buffers.

 

 

 

 

Funny enough I had some bigger than normal buffers in the spares bin with tapered shanks. The backs of the shanks were round rather than square. But nothing a file could not sort out.

 

 

Moving to the front, for lamp irons, I made my own from staples. You can also see the sandboxes and sand pipes just under the running plate behind the buffer beam. Golden arrow provide resin versions to go above the running plate next to the smoke box saddle but my loco had the other style and these has to be scratch built.

 

 

The less detailed side: the real pain was adding clack valves. Mark it's SR ones modified to suit. Splashers have been cut out and moved to better positions .

 

 

 

The more detailed side, the right hand side has more minor piping and the steam reverser,

 

 

Finally the cab. The resin kit is plain here, so I scratch built some leavers from thin plastic stripe,

 

 

Next to finalise fitting to the chassis and then it will be onto the tender.

[Horsetan]

.... Jendico.....

 

Now that's a spelling I'd not seen before. I have also seen "Jedinco".

 

The mention of the "H" class is entirely appropriate since the O1s carried the same boilers as the "H".

[JSpencer]

The loco body has progressed more and received its first coat of paint. Attention has now switched to the tender.

 

Golden arrow provide thin resin slots for wheel axles, but keeper plate etc is left to the end user to scratch build. Their instructions suggest adding weight to the tender and then attach it to the loco somehow so that weight is applied on the rear end. Mind you it was also designed around the Hornby 0-6-0 railroad SSPP chassis. I will say that all of this I was not keen on personally, and I decided to use tender parts from the J15.

 

First up, cut off the resin axle slots and cut out the tender chassis from the Hornby J15:

Before:

 

After:

 

Now the result chassis assembly of the J15 needs some modification. On the O1 tender, the axles are evenly spaced. On the J15, the middle axle is offset to the rear. So what followed next was moving it. The middle chassis and keeper plates are 2 parts. The keeper plate being held on by 4 screws and a clip, so this means we can cut it into sections to facilitate moving the second axle forwards. By luck, swapping the tender pickups from one side to the other means the centre wheel still picks up. Overall the O1 will have loco and tender pickups which is a better arrangement than Bachmann's C1! I left the DCC ready stuff too.

 

Moving the centre axle holding prongs forwards. Cut off with a dremel saw disc. Glued on with polystyrene cement.

 

Choosing the cutting points for the keeper plate. Basically we cut into 3 sections. The fore and aft sections retaining 2 screw holes as these will cover the forward and aft axles that have not moved. The middle section moves forwards.

 

 

After cutting, this part will be glued in last:

 

 

Now assembled. First refit the pickups, then wheels (ensure pickups touch the wheels), then fore keeper plate, then aft keeper plate (2 screws each) and finally glue the middle keeper section in:

 

 

 

Next will be fitting up the tender.

[JSpencer]

More pics of putting the tender together and detailing.

 

There 3 basic parts, upper tender body, lower tender body and converted J15 chassis. As the resin kit is light, a steel weight is added to the upper body. The lower body has had groves bored out with a dremel to allow the wheels to turn freely (and seat the chassis at the correct height).

 

 

Placing the tender chassis on the rails next to Hornby's H class to ensure buffers are at the right height.

 

 

 

With body in place (but not yet glued, hence some daylight - this is because I need to paint behind the suspension springs before gluing it)

 

 

Most additional detailing is on the end. Lamp irons made from staples, foot steps from plastic U Chanel's. Gaurd irons taken from the J15 tender. Golden Arrow provides 2 holes for a hand rail on the tender rear but, the prototype in question does not have one.

 

 

Nose to nose, O1 loco (starting to get a coat of paint) with the H.

 

 

Loco matched with tender

 

.

Edited March 7, 2018 by JSpencer

[JSpencer]

Ok the first coats of paint have started to go on. One thing I noticed was that I had not included a plac for the number on the smokebox door!

 

The Hornby H class is useful here, given me exactly the dimensions I need and a quick searching the plastic strip bin found an ideal strip.

 

 

[JSpencer]

Ok more progress the paint and numbers have gone on.

 

 

 

Just crew and coal to go then assembly.

[JSpencer]

And she is finished!

 

 

 

However the original J15 drawbar sets the loco and tender very close. Probably ok on 4ft radius but not on my 22,24 and 26 inch curves.

 

 

So I scratch built another from brass strip; In these pictures we compare her with other former SECR locos in BR black. The Golden Arrow instructions recommend a Hornby Jinty chassis, but the wheel base on this is the same as larger C class shown here. The J15 chasis gives a better wheel base although boiler bottom is  pitched a bit low. Hmmm SER O class perhaps?

 

 

 

 

Being resin the loco is lighter than the C and J15. I,ve added a brass lump behind the smokebox door and whitemetal figures. Even then she is clearly lighter but had no issues taking a set of Birdcages around.

One advantage over the C is the all wheel pick up on the tender retained from the J15. A very smooth runner.

 

 

 

 

Next projects are the GT3 and Fell. But next SECR loco is the J class.

 

Toodle pip!

Edited April 10, 2018 by JSpencer

[Jack P]

Wow, that looks fantastic. You've done an excellent job. not a wheel out of place up against those RTR models.

[JSpencer]

I'm looking at backdating the O1 kit into an O with a Stirling cab I've got lying about; hopefully I manage a decent enough job of it, yours looks stunning!

Thanks for the kind comments. I,m not sure how easy they would be given the boiler is pitched a lot lower, unless it is one which Wainwright deepened the firebox.

 

Might be easier to build entirely from scratch.

Edited April 11, 2018 by JSpencer

[Compound2632]

Just leafing through this - is it known if the defects Horsetan mentioned WRT the Branchlines kit, also apply to the Branchlines O? (Suspecting they do, as there are presumably key components such as footplate common to both kits.)

[Blandford1969]

I don't know about the O but certainly the O1 has 2 bits of whitemetal for the footplate and the only really sensible option is to replace it with a scratchbuilt replacement. I wonder if Horsetan ever finished his?