chaz Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 Nice work Chris. Would a rivet - punch - tool have deformed the corrugated sheets? ATVB CME Maybe, but I'm with Chris. It's worth the extra work to use Peco track pins: they look the part and additionally have the merit of fixing parts together. Chaz 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
81A Oldoak Posted July 17, 2015 Author Share Posted July 17, 2015 Yesterday, I finished inserting the bolt-heads into the walls of the Cwm Bach Colliery Motive Power Depot. The structure has been strengthened by them. Today, I attached a false roof and built a ventilation clerestory(?) atop the ridge. They will be clad with simulated corrugated iron sheet and drilled and "bolted" like the walls. You may have noticed the warped sheet towards the rear of the shed. This was caused when I spilt half a bottle of Mek-Pak onto to my cutting board and flooded a pile of sheets waiting to be attached to the framework. Some of the sheets dissolved, but several survived albeit warped. Thrift dicated that I should try to save as many as possible and I think the serendipitous appearance of neglect works rather well. With a bit of effort the shed might even be ready for painting on Sunday, but I don't believe in deadlines for hobbies so we shall see. Chris 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium corneliuslundie Posted July 18, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 18, 2015 I think the bent sheet adds to the look. You couldn't have achieved it if you had tried intentionally. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
81A Oldoak Posted July 18, 2015 Author Share Posted July 18, 2015 I think the bent sheet adds to the look. You couldn't have achieved it if you had tried intentionally. I should have stayed stumm. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 (edited) I don't know as I don't own a rivet punching tool. That said, I had to push in the side walls to stop them flexing out of line, always a problem with engine sheds because they don't usually have a base to give rigidity. The holes in the end walls and gables were drilled with a hand-held Dremel drill and I will probably have to use it when the time comes for the roof. Maybe, but I'm with Chris. It's worth the extra work to use Peco track pins: they look the part and additionally have the merit of fixing parts together. Chaz Hi Fella's, Nice work, very nice work, both, thanks for the hints and tips. I agree, Chris model engine sheds can be flimsy for the reasons that you mention, especially in 7mm or 16mm, luckily both of ours are resin, which helps. When I made up a corrugated roof for an old US style 'Speeder' hut (Wickham trolley to you and me), I had nothing else to hand except some thickish aluminium foil sheet so I scribed the corrugated lines in and then used a rivet tool to add the 'bolts'. As my layout plans changed I have put the - now Anglicised - model to one side. The roof remains unpainted, so needs a coat of primer to see if my efforts were successful (I was aiming for very worn and bent, thus ancient, tin, atop of a roof that was beyond repair but needed repairing 1960's stylee as opposed to the near perfection of GWR corrugate). I have some of the Metalsmith? corrugated sheets (from Steve at FMR - many thanks!) and these whilst pricey are very nice and I hope to add them to the roof of yet another Pt Way hut - the issue is, will I ever be able to match up Slaters' plastic version with the 'Metalsmith' version, as Metalsmith is up for sale and the corrugated sheet hasnt been produced for quite some time. Your wonky sheet really works IMHO. I was wondering, was there a difference in corrugated sheet fixing bolts in the eg. 1960's than in more recent times? Kindest, CME Edited July 18, 2015 by CME and Bottlewasher Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
81A Oldoak Posted July 20, 2015 Author Share Posted July 20, 2015 All 248 Peco track pins have been installed in Cwm Bach Colliery's engine shed. Barge-boards and soffits are also in position. Remaining construction tasks are the installation of the cosmetic roller-shutter door, gutters and down-pipes. I spent a few minutes driving my Ixion Fowler in and out of the shed; sad, I know. 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Budgie Posted July 21, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 21, 2015 I spent a few minutes driving my Ixion Fowler in and out of the shed; sad, I know. Not necessarily sad; you were just testing that it all works properly, as it should. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted July 21, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 21, 2015 I think back in the 60s it was galvanised nails with a lead washer to fix corrugated sheets. When I re-did the garage roof in 2013 the sheets could be ordered to length (mine are 6.1m) the fixing are some hex headed self cutting with a plastic rubber washer just driven with a bit to fit in the power driver Times change! Excellent work Chris the fowler looks quite at home! Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
raymw Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 (edited) Not come across the lead washers, but plenty of 'spring head' galvanised nails in old stuff to wooden beams (http://www.toolstation.com/shop/p15415). For steel, it was often a U bolt (or may be called a 'J' bolt) -to grip under the angle, with a rubber? moulding around the nut, or a domed washer. Edited July 21, 2015 by raymw Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
N15class Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 Corrugated sheets were held in place with spring heads through the ridges, into timber grounds. Modern building sheets are fixed in the valleys with self driving screws, They will even go through RSJ's. J bolts tend only to be used on rooves as on the verticals they sag. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
81A Oldoak Posted July 22, 2015 Author Share Posted July 22, 2015 I love the RMWeb. Where else in the world would you find a discussion about the history and merits of different fastenings for corrugated iron? If you're really interested in the subject then you must read the paper at http://www.arct.cam.ac.uk/Downloads/ichs/vol-3-3097-3116-thompson.pdf It ranks with one of my under-graduate dissertations written at the University of York in 1979 with the snappy title: "A Study of the Social Impact of Sliding Scale Wage Agreements in the South Wales Coalfield 1875-1915." 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simond Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 "Design & Performance of Fuel-Injected Two-Stroke Engines" 1983 - Cranfield Institute of Technology I do have a copy, but I haven't read it for more than thirty years. I imagine it might be somewhat soporific. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barnaby Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 Nice one Chris. Having a read of that paper I was struck by the curve [dip] in one of the roofs and was reminded of me being fascinated by the process of rolling the corrugated sheets multiple times to achieve the desired curvature. I was a child in Western Australia at the time living out in the bush where corrugated tin was GOD. Going to a" tin dunny" now that was an experience, beat the seat with a stick to rid the spiders, vermin and other insects and melt from the radiated heat off the tin sides. Also being inside while someone beat the outside wasn't a fun experience either. Then there were the steam lorries at the Fremantle docks, the factories that ran all the machines from one power source via belts, and the rail yard we'd jump a freight train for a lift back out of town ........... memories. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgood Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 (edited) Type of fastener depends on frame. If timber then spring head nail, but if purlins (the horizontal side rails to which sheets attach) were of steel - typically angle iron - then hook bolts were used. Hook bolts have been in use for a long time - probably from 1920s? Hook bolt diameter would be 1/4" for very small structures - anything like an engine shed would certainly use 5/16" dia. with square nuts. Hook bolts before the age of plastic washers (maybe 1970s?) would use a shaped galvanised washer approx 1 1/2" square, some were curved so the washer edge sat perpendicular to the corrugations, some were curved to sit at 45 degrees. I can't tell whether the loco shed at Cwym Bach is deemed to have timber or angle iron purlins, but typically a colliery shed of the 40s onwards would I think be all steel construction. Sheet width varied enormously, but the bog standard was an 8/3 sheet, being 8 complete corrugations at 3" pitch. The wider 10/3 sheet was popular for large buildings allowing much faster cladding, and was very common from before WW2.. The actual coverage of the sheets (the distance between sheet edges that you see from the outside) depends upon whether the sheets are overlapped by one or two corrugations. 10/3 sheets with a double overlap give 24" actual coverage, according to my copy of the construction drawings for a WW2 T2 aircraft hangar. The overlap depends on need for economy or durability of structure. Fasteners would be placed at the overlap of sheets and spaced in between to suit budget and durability of construction. Typically sheets with a 24" coverage would have one fastener at each overlap (I.e. one fastener holds the end of both sheets) with one or two spaced along the purlin in between the overlap joints. Many variations existed, so if possible best to go by photographic evidence of actual buildings. Edited July 22, 2015 by Osgood Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted July 22, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 22, 2015 The nails and lead washers sounds like a very rural thing just using the materials available probably more for Pigscotts Hen coop and sheds than proper buildings. For an HTEC I did a project on model railway controllers using IC circuits I didn't bother copying it all as you normally got it back not that one though probably the only interesting one of the class. Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgood Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 Re. Post 983 - I think I need to get out more....... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
81A Oldoak Posted July 22, 2015 Author Share Posted July 22, 2015 The now familiar view of the Cwm Bach Colliery motive power depot, though with all of those Peco pins in position I think it could pass for Spotty Dog's kennel. This evening I qjuickly added the cosmetic roller-shutter door. Rainwater goods will go on tomorrow and then it's off to the paint shop. Fowler diesel "KITCHENER" lurks inside. 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
81A Oldoak Posted July 25, 2015 Author Share Posted July 25, 2015 I have fitted the rainwater goods and painted the Cwm Bach Colliery engine shed. I spotted that one of the Peco pins was missing in the close-up photo, but I'm inclined to leave the hole empty to represent a little bit of neglect. The final job will be the weathering, a job I always enjoy. The next structure will be a coal stage to sit in between the shed and the water tower. I considering the later coal stage at Ashburton as the prototype. It was built from concrete blocks and is very simple. 18 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaz Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 Very nice indeed, I imagine that in due course you will put some weeds and crud along the bottom of the brickwork, maybe even some windblown rubbish, to visually anchor the building to the ground? My rubbish was admired today at the New Milton show. Chaz 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
81A Oldoak Posted July 26, 2015 Author Share Posted July 26, 2015 Very nice indeed, I imagine that in due course you will put some weeds and crud along the bottom of the brickwork, maybe even some windblown rubbish, to visually anchor the building to the ground? My rubbish was admired today at the New Milton show. Chaz There is much groundwork to do. I want to bring the ground in the area up to sleeper level with lots of muck from coal, ash, oil, water, oil drums, broken pallets, weeds and the usual detritus and impedimenta to be found around a steam age loco depot. Before that I must build the coal stage. Hopefuly, the area will eventually look as rubbish as Dock Green. :-) Chris 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
81A Oldoak Posted July 27, 2015 Author Share Posted July 27, 2015 Today I have been weathering the Cwm Bach Colliery loco shed. Simple tecchnques were used. Phase one was an all-over wash with very diluted Humbrol matt black. I left it to dry for a few hours and popped over to Chaz Harrison to fiddle about with the DCC settings on one of my locos (we were a bit stumped as the loco would not start chuffing until Notch 4, but we think that is a SWD design feature). Then back home for a spot of mid-day nose-bag before collecting the father-in-law from the day-care centre. After that, back out to the work-shop to apply detail rusting with enamel paint around the rivets, bolts or whatever we eventually decided the fastenings to be. The stains on the brickwork are also enamel paint, this time dry-brushed. Finally, Mig weathering powders were used for the smoke staining and other rust effects. It'll do for the time being. I'm rather pleased with the effect of the warped sheet. 19 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alant Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Looking good Chris, the weathering has brought it to life. Alan. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Young Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 That really does look the part. The sheet of wriggly tin you had the problems with has come out looking very effective. Cheers, Andrew Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
railwayrod Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Great work Chris. I love your signals and can understand your idea of "plug in" versions. The loco shed looks superb and when bedded in will certainly look the part. Rod Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaz Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 (edited) That shed is excellent. I clicked the "Craftsmanship/Clever" button but that scarcely seems adequate. Terrific stuff! I might just say that knowing when to stop is an important skill maybe just some signs of damp in the bottom of the brickwork? Chaz Edited July 29, 2015 by chaz Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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