Modern Image - is the phrase outdated?

[MattWallace]

Agreed, for the term Modern Image.

It does less to replace the 'Steam Era' tag

So we ignore the steam era-releated ones and just use the last few instead of the phrase "Modern Image"

 

I left the steam ones in for reference, I really don't want to start trying to define the "Steam Era" as well...

[Titan]

I suppose it boils down to whether you regard the term 'modern image' as a name or a description. If the former, then once named modern image, always modern image, if the latter then it is only appropriate for something recent. And since there will always be someone who wants to use the 'other' meaning it is unlikely to be resolved.

[Clive Mortimore]

I suppose it boils down to whether you regard the term 'modern image' as a name or a description. If the former, then once named modern image, always modern image, if the latter then it is only appropriate for something recent. And since there will always be someone who wants to use the 'other' meaning it is unlikely to be resolved.

Hi Ian

 

Hence the need to drop it.

[Black Sheep]

Skimming to the end as I'm nearly out of lunch break, modern image to me is the 70's 80's as the full realisation of the modernisation plan had been achieved (open to discussion I know) as a modern diesel and electric British Rail

 

My categorisation is as follows:

 

Pioneer

Pre grouping,

Pre war (ww2)

Post war

Br

Transition

Tops

Regional railways / sectorisation

Privatisation

 

Given that I'm not quite 30 my timing for when things happened could be out.

[Clive Mortimore]

The Diesel and Electric era is the modern image after replacing 150 years of the old steam era. I havent seen much change on our rail system since the steam railway was demolished and replaced with bus shelters and minimal trackage. Updated bus shelters, diesel and electric continue to reign supreme. If I modelled say 1970 and decided to model today, I wouldnt need to alter the infratructure, just the trains.

 

I realise folk living alongside one of the busy newly electrified routes would see things differently, but that is merely an extention of AC. I could post photos of the North Wales route from 1971 to present day and the only change is tree growth!

Hi Larry

 

Your post is an example of the simplistic use of "Modern Image" to mean all diesel and electric modelling. My 1960s models are not modern, not even the Tri-ang Type 2 A1A-A1A.

 

Your example of the lack of change does not relate the constant change on our railways. I have lived in Chelmsford for 20+ years. In that time my local station has been rebuilt and the booking hall is larger than the old station. The signalling has been replaced by new signals, there have been track alterations, a post office unloading bay was opened and closed and the overhead wires are in the process of being upgraded. The only thing that has not changed is the GER bridge number plate on platform 2, it is still in LNER blue. 

 

Another change is that Colin no longer works in the Smith's at the station he did so for over 30years.

[Pete 75C]

Ron Ron Ron - I have absolutely no problem with you disagreeing with me, but if you're going to do it so often, do I eventually get a £10 Argos gift voucher?

Edited November 21, 2013 by Pete_S

[Joseph_Pestell]

(Lifted from Google)

 

adjective

adjective: contemporary

1. 1.

   living or occurring at the same time.

   "the event was recorded by a contemporary historian"

   • dating from the same time.

     "this series of paintings is contemporary with other works in an early style"

     synonyms: contemporaneous, concurrent, coeval, synchronous, synchronic, of the time, of the day, simultaneous; More

     coexisting, coexistent;

     rarecoetaneous

     "contemporary writing says that the city's walls were formidable"
2. 2.

   belonging to or occurring in the present.

   "the tension and complexities of our contemporary society"

   synonyms: modern, present-day, present, current, present-time, immediate, extant; More

   up to date, up to the minute, fashionable, latest, recent, ultra-modern, newfangled, modish, voguish, in vogue;

   à la mode;

   informalbang up to date, with it

   "crime and violence in contemporary society"

   antonyms: old-fashioned, out of date

   • following modern ideas in style or design.

     "contemporary ceramics by leading potters"

 

 

 

noun

noun: contemporary; plural noun: contemporaries

1. 1.

   a person or thing living or existing at the same time as another.

   "he was a contemporary of Darwin"

   synonyms: peer, fellow; More

In amongst that lot (adjective 2) there is a synonym "bang up to date"....... I think that describes some of my modelling.

 

However, since originally starting this discussion, I have started to dislike the c-word as it has multiple uses, just like "modern image". From now on, I'm modelling the "recent" scene and will qualify it with 2007-present day and progress the 2007, as time marches on...........

 

 

Cheers,

Mick

 

I recognise, as does Google, that current usage uses "contemporary" to mean "modern/recent/current". But it does not mean that if you go back to its Latin origins.

[Clive Mortimore]

Warley has indicated which layouts are "Modern Image" with a helpful MI next to the layout name.

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/74710-warley-national-2013/

 

Why have they felt the need to do so?

 

They are all model railways.

 

Please stop this need to differentiate non steam modellers from those who model steam.

Please stop calling diesel or electric models "Modern Image" many are not modern.

[Talltim]

Warley has indicated which layouts are "Modern Image" with a helpful MI next to the layout name.

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/74710-warley-national-2013/

While North Haston seems to roam the North American continent, it's always been 'Modern image' so far. Has Chris Gilbert been buying steam?

[Xerces Fobe2]

The era formally known as Modern Image!

 

Steam a Engines working at Falmouth Docks In the 1980's - modern image?

 

The more you think about the term the less relevant it seems

 

XF

[Clive Mortimore]

Modern Image is just a term, one that a lot of people seem to get the jist of, so whats wrong with it?.....D&E sounds far too much like somewhere you take poorly trains to be mended to me

Hi Mickey

 

Sorry but why should all diesel or electric modellers be labelled "Modern Image". I get form other modellers, "Your a Modern Image modeller, how do you put a chip in this? " As they thrust their grandson's muti-coloured DMU that I don't even know what it is called, under my nose. Or because I model diesels have the P taken out of me by those who buy RTR steam locos.....I use to scratch build diesels until the manufacturers joined me in making cock-ups.

 

If we need specifics why not say "Cornwall in the 90s" or something similar that actually is specific???

Now this is what I have been trying to get across to people. How simple is it to say "I model Midland Railway in the Peak district, about 1910" or "I model GNR in Yorkshire, during early LNER days" or "I model Highland main line in the 1970s". It is all model railways.

Edited November 21, 2013 by Clive Mortimore

[Titan]

Indeed - I say I model 'BR blue', which is simpler than saying 'modern image', more accurate, and everyone knows what I am talking about. I was even reluctant to call it 'modern image' 25 years ago when sectorisation had taken firm hold, let alone now!

[PhilJ W]

The term 'modern image' was coined about 50 years ago when it was relevant, is it relevant any more? 

[grahame]

Warley has indicated which layouts are "Modern Image" with a helpful MI next to the layout name.

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/74710-warley-national-2013/

 

Why have they felt the need to do so?

 

They are all model railways.

 

Please stop this need to differentiate non steam modellers from those who model steam.

Please stop calling diesel or electric models "Modern Image" many are not modern.

 

Yep, I do agree.

 

In fact to me the 'MI' indicator tells me very little and really only serves as a rather insidious warning that this layout has no steam trains whereas those without the 'MI' tag are still likely to include a diesel or electric train or two as they were around before steam effectively ended. Consequently I see it as a divisive term and certainly not helpful or meaningful

 

G.

[ThaneofFife]

Classic Traction? and

Post Classic Traction?

Could they work for people?  Im not fussed but its fun seeing all the replies and suggestions.....although

referring to the term MI as "devisive" (see post 144) is certainly not an approach i've heard before.

 

thing is as its always a moveable feast in 15-20 years youll need to come up with a category that goes beyond post classic - have fun going in circles again!

Edited November 22, 2013 by ThaneofFife

[Dagworth]

Thane, your avatar is classic traction 

 

Andi

[EddieB]

In these days of privatisation and fragmentation of railway companies, perhaps the term "post-modern image" may not be inappropriate.

[Oldddudders]

My vague recollection is that BR launched an (expensive) initiative in the 1950s called the Modernisation Plan. I am not sure when this term ceased to be in vogue, but can say with absolute certainty that when I was working in Rules & Signalling in 1967, the next door section was called Works & Modernisation. Then, one day, a memo came round advising us that in future that section would simply be called Works. The immediate conclusion among colleagues was that "We've stopped modernising!"

[coachmann]

The term 'modern image' was coined about 50 years ago when it was relevant, is it relevant any more? 

The only term I've heard used for the current scene is 'Boring'. I suppose its simple and to the point.

[22xx]

All terms have their day. ISTR an architectural style called "moderne", popular between the wars. Art Nouveau is now anything but. Modern Image to me is Cyril Freezer talking about new station buildings and infrastructure on WCML as the overhead wires moved south. As such it has a very clear time-frame - early '60s. Leave it there.

 

Exactly so. Look at Modernism - a Victorian idea, replaced by Postmodernism, which itself is now on the way out. And of course there was nothing more Modern in the 19th century than steam railways!

 

Growing up in the 70s, I always thought that 'Modern Image' meant BR corporate image, but I now get the feeling that in some ways that was an anachronism even then. Yes, there was continuing modernisation with the HST, etc, but it was a different world from the time of the Modernisation Plan in the 50s.

 

40 years on, Modern Image is a vague term at best. And what is the 'image' bit for anyway? (Isn't 'Modern' enough?) It all seems a bit superfluous.

 

Time + Place is all you need.

[22xx]

With respect, Welly's suggestion fails to take into account overlapping, which was always taking place on Britains railways.

 

Not just one kind of overlapping, either. Locomotive liveries overlapped between 'periods', but it doesn't stop there. Those changes happened at different times and in different ways to livery changes on, say, coaching stock. And then there's the changes in wagons, signals, track, stations, buildings, staff clothing, etc, etc. There were, of course, many changes in how those things were designed and used. And that's without mentioning changes in the rest of the country through which the railway runs!

 

The notion of 'periods' seems a bit arbitrary when you get down to the detail. Even if we concentrate on one narrow category, say locomotives (which seems to be a favourite), do we measure time by changes in liveries? Or in rebuilds? Or in the introduction of new kinds of safety equipment and other fittings? And so on ...

 

What one person sees as an important change is hardly noticed by others. But all of these changes matter, because they're all part of the overall picture. The best common denominators are time and place.

Edited November 22, 2013 by 22xx

[Lady_Ava_Hay]

What happened to the term 'loosely based on ..............(add general location) in the ..............(add decade/year/period). These are model layouts we are discussing, not faithful replicas.

 

Then of course we go back to the time honoured statement that 'it is my layout and i will run whatever I -------- like!'.

 

Nothing to stop a large BUT between the two though!

[Pete 75C]

The only term I've heard used for the current scene is 'Boring'. I suppose its simple and to the point.

 

I couldn't make my mind up between "Agree" and "Disagree" so had to mark it "Funny" instead.

Mind you, I'm definitely leaning towards "Agree" for the large amount of imported plastic-wrapped vinyl cr*p blighting the contemporary scene.*

 

*I was going to say "modern image" but half of you would have had a coronary...

Edited November 22, 2013 by Pete_S

[22xx]

What happened to the term 'loosely based on ..............(add general location) in the ..............(add decade/year/period). These are model layouts we are discussing, not faithful replicas.

 

 

That's implicit, isn't it? Even the most prototypical layout is really only loosely based on the actual reality. Some aspects will be spot on, others will be good, others ok,  others a bit iffy, and some just wrong. All about the suspension of disbelief!

[newbryford]

The only term I've heard used for the current scene is 'Boring'.

 

Been there, done that discussion many times before.................

 

 

Mick