Dieppe Boat Train

[saveric]

Hi All,

 

Does anyone have an idea of what locos and coaches were assigned to the Dieppe-Paris boat train in the mid-late 1980s and early 90s?  circa 1984-1992.

 

Thanks,

Richard 

[Derekl]

Assuming you mean the trains that ran from the old Dieppe ferry terminal (Dieppe Maritime), I used one of these a little prior to you period - probably 1980/81. The coaches were standard Corail, and impressive in comparison to the stock used to get to Newhaven. I can't now remember the loco, which must have been diesel, as the harbour lines were not wired, but the train stopped in the main Dieppe Town station for sufficient time to replace the diesel with an electric.

[Fat Controller]

I believe A1A-A1A 68000s from Soteville Depot, Rouen, were used. The change of traction would have been at Rouen, as Dieppe's not electrified. A friend drove these towards the end of the service; getting from the harbour to the town required both power and adhesion, he said. For the former, it was usual to turn off the ETH supply and rely on the coach batteries, whilst for the latter, there was some sort of weight-transferance system that moved some of the weight from the carrying axles to the driven ones. Both were practical for the short term, but it wasn't unknown for drivers to forget one or other for a while..

[brushman47544]

I believe A1A-A1A 68000s from Soteville Depot, Rouen, were used. The change of traction would have been at Rouen, as Dieppe's not electrified. A friend drove these towards the end of the service; getting from the harbour to the town required both power and adhesion, he said. For the former, it was usual to turn off the ETH supply and rely on the coach batteries, whilst for the latter, there was some sort of weight-transferance system that moved some of the weight from the carrying axles to the driven ones. Both were practical for the short term, but it wasn't unknown for drivers to forget one or other for a while..

 

I certainly remember 68000s, but that was way back in the late 60s, maybe early 70s... I don't think they had ETH, so by the 80s wouldn't the locos have been 67400s?

[caradoc]

I travelled on the following trains on this route:

 

13th September 1987, 0438 Dieppe Maritime-Paris St Lazare:

BB67448 to Rouen

BB16012 from Rouen

 

1st June 1988, 0438 Dieppe Maritime-Paris St Lazare:

 

BB66461 & BB66460 to Rouen (I then continued by DMU to Mezidon)

 

12th September 1988, 0438 Dieppe Maritime-Paris St Lazare:

BB66455 & BB66456 to Rouen

BB17042 from Rouen

 

14th May 1989, 0438 Dieppe Maritime-Paris St Lazare:

BB67440 through to Paris

 

All I can remember about the coaches is the quintessentially French smell in the smoking vehicles !

 

Hope this is of some use.

[saveric]

Thanks for the information.

I was wondering whether the coaching stock was Corail in those days or whether older coaches were in use. 

 

Richard

[brushman47544]

All I can remember about the coaches is the quintessentially French smell in the smoking vehicles !

You certainly can't mistake those Gauloises!

[Gordonwis]

I've been away from this forum for ages, so apologies for late contribution to this thread.

 

It is however one of my areas of expertise, for a period of 15 years between leaving home and meeting my wife! it was my favoured way of starting my inter-rail and French France vacances rover ticket based holidays - especially if heading south west. one reason for this was that a Picasso railcar was allocated to the early morning all stations Rouen - Caen train, and in the early 80s I was hairing around France at every opportunity I got as many trips in as possible prior to the end of the PIcasso railcars. The early morning Picasso form Rouen was the perfect way to head off the main boat train trail onto real SNCF very early in the mi-orning without too much hanging around and avoiding Paris. My normal plan was to take the Picasso to Mezidon, change to  Caen - Tours Turbotrain and change at St Pierre des Corps to head south - or even east to Lyon 

 

These trips were almost always southbound night crossing as a way of starting a holiday after work on a FRiday to maximise my two weeks annual leave! Coming back was usually by day via the short sea route.

 

IN the mid 1980s 66400, 67300 and 67400 were used. 16000 or 17000 electrics took over at Rouen. I agree that the use of 68000 had ceased in general by about 1980.

 

I have found the following notes from trip like those described above.

 

19/7/81:

 

67387

stock: pre-war OCEM type rivetted coaches

16040 from Rouen

 

20/8/83:

 

66460+66461

stock - mixture of DEV and USI coaches

16008 from Rouen

 

11/8/84:

 

66459+66458

stock - mixture of DEV and USI coaches

17028 from Rouen

 

May 86:

 

67481

Stock - USI except for one 1st class Corail

17012 from Rouen

 

rare return journey I saw 67409 and 67448 during the day

 

In 1988 I managed three trips in a month, with a short trip over August bak holiday , returning to work then going back out to use the rest of my inter-rail

 

August Bank Holiday 1988:

 

67383

stock - mixture  refurbished interior and non refurbished USI coaches

16033 from Rouen

 

return tue/wed 30-31 8 1988

16050 to Rouen

67454 Rouen - Dieppe

 

Outbound  again 9/9/88

67377

16019 from Rouen

 

This was the first trip where the connecting 06:00 Rouen - Caen was a Caravelle DMU as the PIcassos had finished :-(   but it did mean I could sleep for 2 hours instead !

 

 

Incidentally over this time the ships varied a lot. I have noted travelling on Versailles, Senlac and Chartres, having previously travelled on Valencay and Villandry

[Joseph_Pestell]

Showing our age now, Gordon, with Valencay and Villandry. I reckon they had the best food on any Channel crossing.

 

Their British counterpart was Falaise which was built in about 1948 and very dated.

[Devonbelle]

Fascinating! Early in my BR career I did a trip (September 88). It was a BB 67 and corail stock from the harbour. I was captivated by the Art Deco style station.

 

When we came back to Dieppe station to connect with the ship, a week later we used a service train (2 car Caravelle) to the main town station, then walked to the harbour station as one of my pals knew a bar good for Bierce du Gard. I remember a 67 coming in to the harbour station with USI 'verts' behind it and kicked myself for not doing the boat train.

 

Funny - the Caravelle journey stuck in my mind - it called at some halts and I recollect young couples joining, all dressed up for a Saturday evening out in Dieppe!

 

Paul S

[Gordonwis]

 I remember a 67 coming in to the harbour station with USI 'verts' behind it and kicked myself for not doing the boat train.

 

Paul S

 

 

Like this you mean!

 

Note that 67372 was not a boat train. I had come in behind 372 on an autorail replacement set of USI stock in advance of the boat train.

 

In those days SNCF cross country timetables were still pathetic, and I  had to set off from Argentan in Normandy - only about 120 miles miles as the crow flies from Dieppe - at 5am in the morning to get the evening Dieppe - Newhaven ferry, so I had all day to get to Dieppe!

 

 

 

 

 

Who remembers this ship?

[Joseph_Pestell]

I don't recall that one at all. Looks very similar (i.e. sister ship) to the St Eloi which plied Dover-Dunkerque and was optimised for lorries and trains rather than passengers. I don't think there was ever a lorry only service on Newhaven-Dieppe so I guess that she is standing in for one of the regular boats during re-fit.

 

I can't make out the name of the second ship. Looks of similar design to Hengist/Horsa/Vortigern. Perhaps a transfer from the Irish routes?

 

Edited to include info from Google:

 

Marine Evangeline, a former Norwegian built Canadian flagged vessel called Duke of Yorkshire, registered for one year in the early 90s to Opale Ferries, presumably a Sealink sub--contractor.

 

And re-edited:

Just looked up St Eloi which was quite different and constructed in Italy. So which ship am I thinking of which was so similar to Marine Evangeline?

[Gordonwis]

 

I can't make out the name of the second ship. Looks of similar design to Hengist/Horsa/Vortigern. Perhaps a transfer from the Irish routes?

 

Edited to include info from Google:

 

Marine Evangeline, a former Norwegian built Canadian flagged vessel called Duke of Yorkshire, registered for one year in the early 90s to Opale Ferries, presumably a Sealink sub--contractor.

 

 

Not sure the google reference is correct. This was May 1986, not the 1990s.

 

To this day, I remember that on that day one thing I was specifically drawn to was the previous Canadian registry, which is why I took a picture of it!

 

You can see Yarmouth N.S. in relief letters underneath.

 

The passenger ferry is Chartres, Joe.

 

 

 

 

[Fat Controller]

 Opale Ferries were a short-lived freight operator who ran a freight service from Folkestone to Boulogne from June 1992 to July 4th 1993 (when they went bankrupt). The very same day, operations were taken over by Meridian Ferries, who lasted until March 15th 1995, when they also went bankrupt..

This is to a link for a site that mainly deals with Dover ferries:- http://www.doverferryphotosforums.co.uk/mv-duke-of-yorkshire/

It would appear the vessel worked on Dieppe- Newhaven services several times, between working Irish Sea services and also services in Canada. Judging by the regestration and name changes, they might as well have put these on panels held on with Velcro..

[Devonbelle]

Cracking shots Gordon, thank you for sharing. What aroused my interest in Dieppe as a rail served port was a commercial postcard my family received from a BR friend of my Dads, in the 1970s with a blue and white diesel (memory tells me it was a 67/0) on a rake of all green coaches as it tiptoed on the single line section with road traffic either side. Paul

 

Ps if I find I will scan and post

[brushman47544]

The 80s is past my time (!) because I stopped having family summer holidays in France by around 1974. My aunt and uncle had a house in the country near Gueures (about half an hour from Dieppe) and the garden overlooked the railway from Dieppe towards Luneray and St Valery-en-Caux (now closed and lifted). We used to watch the daily freight train pass and on one occasion I was offered (but declined!) a cab ride in what I suspect was a 63000.

 

Most ferry crossings were by car to/from Dieppe and one year the Falaise had found itself on a Valency/Villandry turn and so foot passenger numbers were being restricted even if you had a ticket. To get on the ferry, a porter helped us through a gap in the fence to get onto the Maritime platform and join the ferry with the boat train passengers, who were allowed on without restriction. A really awful ferry, the Falaise.

 

On a few occasions though, we took the boat train to Paris, but at that time all I remember is green coaches and 68000 diesels on what would have been an early afternoon departure from Dieppe to Paris. I don't recall if there was more than one boat train, but I know on some occasions we took the direct route and others we went via Rouen. On the UK side, we used to take the boat train from Victoria and in the earlier years (mid 60s) I remember loco hauled stock (i.e. before EMUs were used) and have always wondered if we were hauled by a Class 70 since they were regulars for a period.

 

Sadly I've not been back to Dieppe since...