For those interested in old cars.

[stewartingram]

I was taught by my driving instructor, and later emphasised by the Police Driving School next to my office at Police HQ:

 

Whilst waiting at lights etc:

Keep wheels straight ahead (if bumped from the rear, you will then not be pushed into the path of oncoming traffic). This also implies that if in a right turn lane, keep both the car and front wheels straight.

Apply handbrake (resists movement if bumped from rear).

Disengage gear (if foot slips etc car cannot be driven forward by engine).

Do NOT keep foot on brake as brakelights remain on, causing driver in rear to be dazzled. Pedant point though, if last one in queue, watch mirrors, and use footbrake/brakelights briefly to indicate to approaching vehicle).

If a prolonged stop (level crossing, or known hold up) switch off engine (fuel economy and eco reasons) It really does make a difference to mpg if the stop is 30 seconds or more!

 

This applies to both manual and auto. With an auto, apply footbrake before engaging drive and releasing handbrake.

 

Stewart

Edited October 25, 2015 by stewartingram

[alastairq]

What's the correct procedure when stopped with the engine running (at traffic lights, for example) in an automatic?

• Handbrake and in Neutral, as in a manual.
• Footbrake and in Drive.
• Handbrake and in Drive.
• Footbrake and in Park.
• Handbrake and in Park.
• Something else.

I've been told Handbrake and Drive, but that seems counter-intuitive to me, as the engine will be trying to go, the handbrake will be trying to stop it, and I could envisage tears before bedtime.

If I was stopped for any length of time, in a traffic jam for example, then I'd go with handbrake, Neutral and engine off.

 

As an addition to what has been said above, [which is DSA syllabus policy, for the above reasons].....placing an auto box [or, rather, any epicyclic box, which for old vehicles might have a 'fluid flywheel' rather than a torque convertor....] in neutral helps obviate any 'overheating' of the gearbox or torque converter/fluid flywheel oil.

 

Important since the oil is part of the transmission-of-power, and not just a lubricant.

 

London Transport-of-old [when men were men, and sheep were worried?].....used to have a 'rule'...whereby drivers [of RT's with their pre-selector gearboxes]....MUST engage neutral if standing in traffic, with the engine running, for longer than 5 minutes.

 

I recall LT did a test once....the objective being, to see how long the transmission took to overheat when left in gear, engine idling......and what, if anything, might happen as a result.

 

IIRC, they placed a cine camera on the platform of a bus [RT?] , pointing down the aisle towards the little metal hump at the front.

 

Again, IIRC [it was a long time ago...]....after around 25 minutes, the wee hump erupted, there was a fleeting image of a red hot lump of metal hurtling down the aisle, then the film went all fuzzy. Apparently said lump put a hole clean through the back of the bus!

 

Put the gearbox into neutral if waiting for a while...just in case??  

 

[On a car, application of hte handbrake to hold the vehicle stationary, if in drive....might not prove enough. Remember the handbrake is the weakest part of the braking system, after the driver's foot?  On a large vehicle, now referred to as LGVs, an air handbrake might prove strong enough on its own.  I wouldn't place much faith in a car handbrake...after all, most old ones are applied by strongarm tactics alone?  Get it one notch too light, and trouble might ensue?]

 

Edjit...just remembered..getting older.....a downside to stopping & starting the engine, for traffic reasons.

 

We are all far too used to having the benefits of engines controlled by ECUs [computers] rather than driver skills......with electrical systems to boot, powered by alternators of excessive outputs. 

 

But think about the days back when we all had dynamoes under the bonnet .....and relied on judgement when starting the engine, so as not to flood the damned thing?

 

Back in the days when it took a good 15-30 minutes or more of continuous driving simply to put back into the battery, what we'd taken out churning the starter motor over on a cold morning?

 

The very last thing we needed to do was turn the engine off......for traffic reasons........especially when it wasn't quite hot enough..or indeed, had gotten itself a tad too hot... to be faced with churning the starter motor over, on a dodgy battery only part charged, with fuel that might be too much, or not enough, to fire the engine?

 

When, before the days when we could replace the dodgy points with a  modern hall sensor ignition system on our Ford pop?

 

Maybe stop-start isn't such a good idea on an old car after all?

 

Unless, of course, one's clutch pedal isn't doing much when depressed...and one then has to stop the engine at junctions, put the vehicle into 1st gear, wait for the gap, take the brakes off, turn the key, and feed the gas in to start and drive off using the starter motor, with the engine firing up to lurch away......changing gear the old man's way?

 

Stop-start technology? Nothing new there, mate!

Edited October 25, 2015 by alastairq

[Penlan]

...... But think about the days back when we all had dynamoes under the bonnet .....and relied on judgement when starting the engine, so as not to flood the damned thing?   ....When it took a good 15-30 minutes or more of continuous driving simply to put back into the battery, what we'd taken out churning the starter motor over on a cold morning?  ....

I'm still at that point, I have two 1934 Austin 7's on the road, in regular use.

Ah, the joys of modern traffic in an old car in the far west of Cornwall.

PS - I also have a 1999 Rav4 automatic - my first auto, I much prefer a manual box, especially when towing a trailer.

... and I do put it in neutral when at lights etc.,

[keefr2]

I'm still at that point, I have two 1934 Austin 7's on the road, in regular use.

Ah, the joys of modern traffic in an old car in the far west of Cornwall.

Bu doesn't it make you feel good as a local, holding up the grockels with their caravans?!

[Guest]

For some reason eBay keep telling me about Ford Escorts.

Here's a boggo Mk2 1.1 going for really quite a lot of money. I hope it stays factory standard but somehow I doubt it.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181909474412

[keefr2]

I hope it stays factory standard but somehow I doubt it.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181909474412

 

It wouldn't if I could afford it....!!

[PhilJ W]

For some reason eBay keep telling me about Ford Escorts.

Here's a boggo Mk2 1.1 going for really quite a lot of money. I hope it stays factory standard but somehow I doubt it.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181909474412

Start price 99p, some people have more money than sense.

[keefr2]

It's cheap if the shell is as good as claimed. A full Group 4 spec rally Escort is now worth well over £50K. If you want one built professionally then you need a budget of 6 figures as a minimum. A good engine will be about £25000...

[Horsetan]

It's cheap if the shell is as good as claimed. A full Group 4 spec rally Escort is now worth well over £50K. If you want one built professionally then you need a budget of 6 figures as a minimum. A good engine will be about £25000...

Basically, it's all megabucks now. Mk.2s are no longer for the home enthusiast.

[Guest]

Basically, it's all megabucks now. Mk.2s are no longer for the home enthusiast.

I once looked at a nice tidy '79 Escort but couldn't come up with the required £495

[keefr2]

Basically, it's all megabucks now. Mk.2s are no longer for the home enthusiast.

Absolutely. It's why we now have a Mini instead of an Escort, it can still be relatively 'cheap'...(but a competitive historic Mini race car will now cost well over £60K....)

[BG John]

Minis were too small for me even as a passenger, so no substitute for an Escort!

[keefr2]

I once looked at a nice tidy '79 Escort but couldn't come up with the required £495

About 15 years ago I looked at a lovely, genuine MK2 Escort Mexico that the dealer wanted £1700 for. I decided I'd had so many Escorts in my yoof that I'd get something else. I paid £300 more & bought a Porsche 924. Hated the thing more or less from the day I bought it, kept it a year & a half then sold it for less than £500...!! I hate to think what the Mexico would be worth now....

 

Whata mistaka to maka...!!

[keefr2]

Minis were too small for me even as a passenger, so no substitute for an Escort!

 

There's a lot more space when you rip out the back seats & just have a pair of bucket seats in the front! The door bars on the roll cage do make getting in & out a tad more difficult though!

[BG John]

In my mid 20s I realised I could afford a new Porsche 924, but I bought a house instead!

 

Or rather, I had the cash to buy a Porsche 924!

Edited October 25, 2015 by BG John

[BG John]

There's a lot more space when you rip out the back seats & just have a pair of bucket seats in the front! The door bars on the roll cage do make getting in & out a tad more difficult though!

But no good for carrying dogs and various assorted stuff!

[MJI]

As an addition to what has been said above, [which is DSA syllabus policy, for the above reasons].....placing an auto box [or, rather, any epicyclic box, which for old vehicles might have a 'fluid flywheel' rather than a torque convertor....] in neutral helps obviate any 'overheating' of the gearbox or torque converter/fluid flywheel oil.

 

Important since the oil is part of the transmission-of-power, and not just a lubricant.

 

London Transport-of-old [when men were men, and sheep were worried?].....used to have a 'rule'...whereby drivers [of RT's with their pre-selector gearboxes]....MUST engage neutral if standing in traffic, with the engine running, for longer than 5 minutes.

 

I recall LT did a test once....the objective being, to see how long the transmission took to overheat when left in gear, engine idling......and what, if anything, might happen as a result.

 

IIRC, they placed a cine camera on the platform of a bus [RT?] , pointing down the aisle towards the little metal hump at the front.

 

Again, IIRC [it was a long time ago...]....after around 25 minutes, the wee hump erupted, there was a fleeting image of a red hot lump of metal hurtling down the aisle, then the film went all fuzzy. Apparently said lump put a hole clean through the back of the bus!

 

Put the gearbox into neutral if waiting for a while...just in case??  

 

[On a car, application of hte handbrake to hold the vehicle stationary, if in drive....might not prove enough. Remember the handbrake is the weakest part of the braking system, after the driver's foot?  On a large vehicle, now referred to as LGVs, an air handbrake might prove strong enough on its own.  I wouldn't place much faith in a car handbrake...after all, most old ones are applied by strongarm tactics alone?  Get it one notch too light, and trouble might ensue?]

 

Edjit...just remembered..getting older.....a downside to stopping & starting the engine, for traffic reasons.

 

We are all far too used to having the benefits of engines controlled by ECUs [computers] rather than driver skills......with electrical systems to boot, powered by alternators of excessive outputs. 

 

But think about the days back when we all had dynamoes under the bonnet .....and relied on judgement when starting the engine, so as not to flood the damned thing?

 

Back in the days when it took a good 15-30 minutes or more of continuous driving simply to put back into the battery, what we'd taken out churning the starter motor over on a cold morning?

 

The very last thing we needed to do was turn the engine off......for traffic reasons........especially when it wasn't quite hot enough..or indeed, had gotten itself a tad too hot... to be faced with churning the starter motor over, on a dodgy battery only part charged, with fuel that might be too much, or not enough, to fire the engine?

 

When, before the days when we could replace the dodgy points with a  modern hall sensor ignition system on our Ford pop?

 

Maybe stop-start isn't such a good idea on an old car after all?

 

Unless, of course, one's clutch pedal isn't doing much when depressed...and one then has to stop the engine at junctions, put the vehicle into 1st gear, wait for the gap, take the brakes off, turn the key, and feed the gas in to start and drive off using the starter motor, with the engine firing up to lurch away......changing gear the old man's way?

 

Stop-start technology? Nothing new there, mate!

 

If I did stop start the cars gearbox plays up and only has 3rd, I had to struggle a mile with the engine running to get enough charge in to be able to clear the gearbox ECU

 

[MJI]

For some reason eBay keep telling me about Ford Escorts.

Here's a boggo Mk2 1.1 going for really quite a lot of money. I hope it stays factory standard but somehow I doubt it.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181909474412

 

Wil most likely be a 1600 or 2000 by the end of next year

It wouldn't if I could afford it....!!

 

Same here, a nice 2.0 Pinto

[MJI]

About 15 years ago I looked at a lovely, genuine MK2 Escort Mexico that the dealer wanted £1700 for. I decided I'd had so many Escorts in my yoof that I'd get something else. I paid £300 more & bought a Porsche 924. Hated the thing more or less from the day I bought it, kept it a year & a half then sold it for less than £500...!! I hate to think what the Mexico would be worth now....

 

Whata mistaka to maka...!!

 

They were so slow, I out dragged one once who pulled out in front of me with nothing more than a Chrysler Sunbeam hatch back.

 

[Horsetan]

I once looked at a nice tidy '79 Escort but couldn't come up with the required £495

Once upon a time, I'd have liked a DS21 or DS23, but I missed that particular boat a long time ago. Hence the CX is more realistic.

 

And yes, I do like unconventional old cars. That's why I had a VW K70L followed by the Ro80. The 635CSi was relatively conventional, though.

Edited October 26, 2015 by Horsetan

[Catweasel]

CX. Now that was a beautiful car.Picked up one from Paris that was a development mule. Citroen had fitted it with the engine from an SM! Went like stink. Sold it 9 months later for double what I paid for it.

[peanuts]

About 15 years ago I looked at a lovely, genuine MK2 Escort Mexico that the dealer wanted £1700 for. I decided I'd had so many Escorts in my yoof that I'd get something else. I paid £300 more & bought a Porsche 924. Hated the thing more or less from the day I bought it, kept it a year & a half then sold it for less than £500...!! I hate to think what the Mexico would be worth now....

 

Whata mistaka to maka...!!

if you could keep the light fingered brigade away from it know of two mk2 escorts being stolen in recent months localy one involved moving other vehicles worth a lot more to get at it shells and parts are now worth a premium especially the type49 shells they are like gold dust

[keefr2]

if you could keep the light fingered brigade away from it know of two mk2 escorts being stolen in recent months localy one involved moving other vehicles worth a lot more to get at it shells and parts are now worth a premium especially the type49 shells they are like gold dust

 

If you visit the Old Skool Ford forum, you'll see there's a heck of a lot of all types of retro Fords getting nicked. And, as they increase in value the same is starting to happen to Minis. There's often at least one mentioned in each new issue of Mini Magazine....

[Horsetan]

CX. Now that was a beautiful car.Picked up one from Paris that was a development mule. Citroen had fitted it with the engine from an SM! Went like stink. Sold it 9 months later for double what I paid for it.

Unusual, because Citroën tended to scrap their test mules once their purpose had been completed. If that car still survives, it will be worth something, a bit like the surviving GS Birotors.

 

I thought it wasn't physically possible to squeeze the SM's V6 into the CX engine bay?

[Penlan]

But doesn't it make you feel good as a local, holding up the grockels with their caravans?!

They still have there bog bog standard low compression heads on (4.9:1), but still roll along at a steady 45+ mph ... 

I did a solo drive from John O'Groats to Lands End in one of them in 22 hours a couple of years ago.

However, in the narrow lanes of west Cornwall. even I'm surprised at some of the narrow bits I get through, and that car behind? it wouldn't be the first time some 'lack of attention' driver has thought "If that car can get through, so can I", scrunch.