RMweb Gold Buhar Posted May 11, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 11, 2015 45160 was one of the batch built with right-hand-drive for service in Turkey. It runs today in British guise as LMS 8274. They led a very hard life, as is evident from 45161's very bent footplate. TCDD didn't spend much money on cosmetics! Local modifications would be the Prussian P8-style smokebox door with 4 "dog" handles on the door ring, the cowcatcher and the three headlamps, arranged German-style "Dreilicht-Spitzensignal". The cow-catcher (ineklik?) appears to have been there from the start, the headlight was fitted to some but not all. There are two cylindrical tanks on the other running plate and some had a tank on the right. Whether this was as well or as an alternative, I have no idea. Westinghouse pump on t'other side. The smokeboxes were standard, the rebuilt one with the dogs on 45161 appeared later in life. There was a TCDD versionof the 8F produced by Hornby for it's Istanbul distributor not that long ago. I haven't been over to the shop for a few years so I've not seen it in the flesh. It was 4mm, whereas Turkish modellers work to 3.5mm. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 The cow-catcher (ineklik?) appears to have been there from the start, the headlight was fitted to some but not all. There are two cylindrical tanks on the other running plate and some had a tank on the right. Whether this was as well or as an alternative, I have no idea. Westinghouse pump on t'other side. The smokeboxes were standard, the rebuilt one with the dogs on 45161 appeared later in life. .... That's why I said "local modifications". TCDD did give them the large Prussian-type headlamps, though. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spet0114 Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 Its a specific loco that I know next to nothing about beyond an article in the railway mag of nov'91 that tells me its 45160 owned by the Churchill Locomotive co. So any info on what modifications where in Turkey would be welcome. Here's a pic (not mine) showing her at Swanage, shortly after arrival from Turkey. This is probably as good an indication as you'll get of her final condition when in service there. From Swanage, she was moved (to Poole?) for the long overhaul to begin. However, I seem to remember an open day at Swanage where she was 'in steam' but not running, circa 1989. Cheers Adrian https://www.flickr.com/photos/dextra_group_transport/7709991282/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 The 8Fs that went to the Middle East also had a larger top feed (water treatment?). Also found on some of the ones that returned to the UK. The now preserved 48773 had one until they replaced the boiler with a standard one at some point in the 1960s. These locomotives ended up with the diagonal yellow cabside stripe as they were out of gauge for the 25KV electrified lines. Don't forget some were LNER liveried and others worked on the SR and GWR during the 1940s, and the Western Region had an allocation. One was painted LMS crimson in preservation. It looked pretty good TBH, a bit like a Jubilee at a glance. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 The 8Fs that went to the Middle East also had a larger top feed (water treatment?). Also found on some of the ones that returned to the UK. The now preserved 48773 had one.... That was the "WD" top feed. I think 48774 and 48775 (the other two returnees to go into BR service) also had one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 two photos of my Lima western one in the company of GBL scot presently being re lined and numbered. The Lima loco is posted in anticipation that the GBL one will of that heritage. My loco has had the brassmasters kit windows...the roof cowling was extended not by the recommended method of layers of plasticard but rather a segment added over the doors. It awaits the door rails being recessed....a round tuit job......the Lima motor replaced by one bought from deisel trains of Northern Ireland...very similar to the model torque version....western experts will note did not alter brake gear or fit the marvellous roof grilles that come with the kit....lastly a so and so to glaze the front windows....but all in all I feel it lifts it beyond its origins...wipers and hoses to be added...probably at the same time as handrails... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 and lastly couldn't resist one of the scot...oversize cab beading removed. Under size numbers replaced...motion toned down...just boiler lining to be completed then a Matt varnish...very slight weathering....then one day a motorised chassis....is it me..probably but isn't the chimney on this better than the latter Hornby version...of those replaced with the brassmasters ones... 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonhall Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 My identified pictures are 45161 which is recorded as having worked Irmak-Cankiri north-east of Ankara. It seems this was a common area for the 45151 class. I have a few other photos of locos in traffic but none are identified as 41560. I suspect the modifications were standard at first, but locos will have had more local adaptations as the years went on. If you want what I've got, please PM your e-mail addy. Thanks thats a very kind offer, but what I really want is photos of the loco at Hamworthy during rebuild, because I'm really interested in the background of photos that might show what the rear of some of the cement terminal buildings look like. Thanks, Jon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 Here's a pic (not mine) showing her at Swanage, shortly after arrival from Turkey. This is probably as good an indication as you'll get of her final condition when in service there. From Swanage, she was moved (to Poole?) for the long overhaul to begin. However, I seem to remember an open day at Swanage where she was 'in steam' but not running, circa 1989. Cheers Adrian https://www.flickr.com/photos/dextra_group_transport/7709991282/ Lurking to the left of that photo....is that a Network South East liveried Wickham Trolley? (One for Bachmann? Eventually! ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiffy2 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Morning all. A few questions for the team: Does anyone know what paint code would do for LPTB red on a 57xx? I'd prefer Tamiya or Humbrol acrylic, if possible. Does anyone want the shunter truck from the 57xx? Does anyone have a source for the large tender numbers for locos in SECR grey? Answers on a postcard, please. On the issue of paint, I bought some Tamiya yesterday at Hobbycraft, who as you may know can be a bit idiosyncratic about labelling. The paint was 'Flat Blue Thinners' which made no sense (but they don't stock Humbrol railway colours any more). It is thin - you'd have real trouble brushing it, and it worked OK in the airbrush, although slightly better when thinned with Humbrol thinners. Which everyone says don't worh with Tamiya paint. So perhaps this is some new formulation. Does anyone know anything about it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted May 12, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) Its a bit risky mixing different manufacturers acrylics as unlike enamels that have similar formulations acrylic formulations can vary. It seems in this case that Humbrol and Tamiya are compatible but whatever you do don't mix Tamiya and Revell acrylics. Many acrylics uses water as a medium, Tamiya use alcohol but paint manufacturers often change their formulas for acrylics so before mixing do a test on a bit of scrap. The different formulas can also behave differently in an airbrush so check for any warnings from the airbrush makers (I prefer a hairy stick myself.) Edited May 12, 2015 by PhilJ W 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinnylinny Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Morning all. A few questions for the team: Does anyone know what paint code would do for LPTB red on a 57xx? I'd prefer Tamiya or Humbrol acrylic, if possible. Does anyone want the shunter truck from the 57xx? Does anyone have a source for the large tender numbers for locos in SECR grey? Answers on a postcard, please. On the issue of paint, I bought some Tamiya yesterday at Hobbycraft, who as you may know can be a bit idiosyncratic about labelling. The paint was 'Flat Blue Thinners' which made no sense (but they don't stock Humbrol railway colours any more). It is thin - you'd have real trouble brushing it, and it worked OK in the airbrush, although slightly better when thinned with Humbrol thinners. Which everyone says don't worh with Tamiya paint. So perhaps this is some new formulation. Does anyone know anything about it? My Bachmann London Transport 57xx appears to be a shade that is almost exactly BR maroon (when held up against a Bachmann Mk1). It's maybe a shade lighter, but if you're going to do any weathering at all I suspect it'd be unnoticeable. I'm going to assume it's a more realistic colour than the old Hornby one in pillar-box red! SECR grey tender numbers are available in 4mm from Fox: http://fox-transfers.co.uk/transfers/secr-locos-1915-1922(although they also do a 2-pack of the sheet for a slight saving if you're renumbering several locos) along with bufferbeam numbers and SECR markings. As for the shunter's truck, I'd be interested. To be honest the loco put me off buying that magazine as I've enough panniers not to want to have to detail one! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiffy2 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 For that gracious reply the shunter truck is yours - PM me your address and I'll get it off to you when I figure out how to pack it! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) I couldn't find much on the LT colour, beyond a photo and the information, that it's called 'Midcared' ('Newspeak' for 'Midland Carriage Red' ??). The photo would seem to confirm this. From memory, they were so scruffy, that it wouldn't matter all that much. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metropolitan_Railway_A_Class#/media/File:Metropolitan_Railway_steam_locomotive_number_23.jpg Edited May 12, 2015 by Il Grifone 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smiffy2 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 So we're thinking that Metropolitan red and LPTB red were the same? Which would make life easy, because Precision Paints offer that shade, I think. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted May 12, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 12, 2015 The colour pictures I have seen of London Transport steam locomotives, the panniers in particular, they are usually covered with a layer of grime and oil. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf27 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) Finally got a big parcel today containing issues 23,23,25,26 and 28. No Rocket though!CheersShane Edited May 12, 2015 by Wolf27 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 So we're thinking that Metropolitan red and LPTB red were the same? Which would make life easy, because Precision Paints offer that shade, I think. It would be convenient, but unfortunately not. The underground passenger stock was painted bright red like the buses, though I wouldn't like to say it was exactly the same shade. locomotives were painted a dark red, very similar, if not identical, to Midland/LMS/BR crimson/maroon. Bus colours are covered quite extensively here: http://www.rmoof.co....Routemaster.htm I have repainted a Dinky 29c bus in immediate post war LT livery, using Vallejo Carmine Red 70.926, which claims to be RAL3002. It appears spot on to my eye/memory. Their Red 70.956 (RAL 3004 FS30160) seems not far removed from the above crimson/maroon colour. Examples here (which all seem to be different!) including several panniers. https://www.google.c...iw=1372&bih=783 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Metr0Land Posted May 12, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 12, 2015 Underground red was a darker shade than the buses until some time in the 60's when someone realised there were savings to be had by buying bus red in larger volume. Sorry I can't trace a date at the mo'. For the panniers I used Testors/Polly Scale Lehigh Valley Cornell red which actually looks more like red oxide (see post #2) until you varnish it and then it comes up a treat. http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/48281-weathered-lt-panniers/ 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Howe Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Examples here (which all seem to be different!) including several panniers. https://www.google.c...iw=1372&bih=783 ... and also this beastie. Issue 42 offering from GBL? https://danielhertz.files.wordpress.com/2014/11/dms1515-2-london-transport-bus-tube-train.jpg Cheers Phil 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted May 12, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 12, 2015 Underground red was a darker shade than the buses until some time in the 60's when someone realised there were savings to be had by buying bus red in larger volume. Sorry I can't trace a date at the mo'. For the panniers I used Testors/Polly Scale Lehigh Valley Cornell red which actually looks more like red oxide (see post #2) until you varnish it and then it comes up a treat. http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/48281-weathered-lt-panniers/ The only Underground stock painted 'bus' red was the 1938 stock reinstated in the 90's to cover stock shortages. The rest of the Underground stock was unpainted and bus red was all that was available. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonhall Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 ... and also this beastie. Issue 42 offering from GBL? https://danielhertz.files.wordpress.com/2014/11/dms1515-2-london-transport-bus-tube-train.jpg Cheers Phil Been there, done that... http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/83730-supercar-travelcard-promotional-bustubetrain/ jon 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonhall Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 So we're thinking that Metropolitan red and LPTB red were the same? Which would make life easy, because Precision Paints offer that shade, I think. I've painted my Sarah Siddons in Precision Met red and its a pretty good match with the Bachman LT panniers - I would think that's OK. Jon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrel Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 The 8f has arrived very nice it is too. Some bits have not been glued on straight but should be easy to fix. The cab doors are really well done and look fantastic. Time to get the transfers out and make a BR one then weathering. These locos always look filthy in photos so I think I will go to town on it. 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 That's potentially cheap feedstock for anyone not wanting to wait for the Bachmann Stanier Mogul. Use this 8F body and cylinder mouldings on a Bachmann Crab mechanism as a route to a DIY version. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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