Wright writes.....

[St Enodoc]

2 hours ago, Barry O said:

I thought you meant the one built by Leeds MRS when we joined in the 1970s..

 

It definitely wasn't sterile but could cause a bit of mental grief on occasion.

 

Baz

 

45 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

As I understand it, both layouts are interpretations of what the Midland's proposed West Riding lines - making Bradford a through station - would have looked like if built in full (MMRS) or in part, but rather more so than was actually built (Essery). The station still open is on the ex-LNWR line. 

 

The famous P4 layout Heckmondwike was based on the same proposed Midland line.

The Leeds MRS version of Dewsbury Midland looked like this:

 

 

As seen at the 1980 Corn Exchange exhibition.

 

As @Barry O hinted, it could be quite challenging to operate.

 

 

[St Enodoc]

54 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

 

 

 

Chee Tor.

For me, the least realistic part of Chee Tor was the change from double to single track.

[Geep7]

With some of the recent conversations in mind, I thought this thread would be the most appropriate place, so I have a question to pose to the collective minds of Wright writes, if I may Tony?

 

I am currently in the situation of only having space for small end to end layouts, and run mostly diesels and Multiple units. The quandary I have is, when fitting drivers, and a secondman, should I fit them at both ends of the locomotive / unit? I think, although please correct me if I am wrong (probably region dependent), that most multiple units would be run driver only, with no secondman required, and I would expect that the Guard would usually be in the brake / guards area of the unit.

 

As I model the late 1960's / early 1970's, it's a similar dilemma to fitting tail lamps to Diesel Multiple Units, for the BR (S) EMU's I don't need to worry, as by the time I model, the could use the rear red blinds to signify the end of the train, although I am aware that the earlier stencil fitted stock should have a tail lamp as well.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

8 minutes ago, Geep7 said:

The quandary I have is, when fitting drivers, and a secondman, should I fit them at both ends of the locomotive / unit

Amidst the various novelty items that the RTR brands are increasingly pushing into product, a very obvious absence is a directionally appropriate driver position in D+E twin cab traction. Plenty of space for a servo actuated figure to appear at the leading end. Clearly for those that need the noises, a delay after the driver going out of view when the change of ends is required will be necessary, to allow for both the door's operation, and the intervening footsteps along the platform. Some occasional randomly added effing and blinding about the weather might be a fun feature...

[Tony Wright]

44 minutes ago, St Enodoc said:

For me, the least realistic part of Chee Tor was the change from double to single track.

I believe the reason was it was originally planned as a Somerset & Dorset layout.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[t-b-g]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

But what about departing trains?

 

 

I think it's down to 'observation'.

 

Seen before but in a different context. Though no trains terminated at Little Bytham, the difference in the staining on the footbridge is noticeable. Why the difference? Because Down trains were straining against the 1 in 200 of Stoke Bank, while Up trains had it easy (shutting off steam?).

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

 

That little area has always been one of the least satisfying bits of Little Bytham for me. The rather obvious chopped off generic Peco buffer stop and the wrongly placed ground disc (which should be a GNR pattern rotating signal in the period of the model) always jarred with me. I recall being told that correct pattern Lanarkshire Models bufferstops were going to replace the Peco ones. Did it ever happen?

[Clive Mortimore]

1 hour ago, Geep7 said:

With some of the recent conversations in mind, I thought this thread would be the most appropriate place, so I have a question to pose to the collective minds of Wright writes, if I may Tony?

 

I am currently in the situation of only having space for small end to end layouts, and run mostly diesels and Multiple units. The quandary I have is, when fitting drivers, and a secondman, should I fit them at both ends of the locomotive / unit? I think, although please correct me if I am wrong (probably region dependent), that most multiple units would be run driver only, with no secondman required, and I would expect that the Guard would usually be in the brake / guards area of the unit.

 

As I model the late 1960's / early 1970's, it's a similar dilemma to fitting tail lamps to Diesel Multiple Units, for the BR (S) EMU's I don't need to worry, as by the time I model, the could use the rear red blinds to signify the end of the train, although I am aware that the earlier stencil fitted stock should have a tail lamp as well.

Hi Chris

 

I face the same dilemma as I too have a terminus station and run DMUs. A tail lamp at both ends ...no,  and a driver at both ends...no. No drivers and tail lamps....no.

I do run DMUs in multiple, I can have four 2 car units coupled together forming one train. That would be eight drivers, one looking where he was going, one admiring where the train has been and six staring at each other in the middle cabs.

 

I could make the tail lamps removable once the train is ready to leave and put another one on what had been the front and now the back. With my dexterity I can see myself imitating the Italian porter at Bedford Midland Road I mentioned a few days ago when he used his new found English words to encourage an ill fitting lamp to go on the iron.

 

At the moment ,as the layout and stock are far from complete, no drivers and no tail lamps doesn't look too bad.

[Michael Edge]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

I didn't put those hills in.

Nor did I but we had to put something on as a screen, the layout goes offstage here.

[Michael Edge]

2 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

For me, the least realistic part of Chee Tor was the change from double to single track.

I agree, the idea of the Midland building a single track main line was most unlikely.

[Compound2632]

31 minutes ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Hi Chris

 

I face the same dilemma as I too have a terminus station and run DMUs. A tail lamp at both ends ...no,  and a driver at both ends...no. No drivers and tail lamps....no.

I do run DMUs in multiple, I can have four 2 car units coupled together forming one train. That would be eight drivers, one looking where he was going, one admiring where the train has been and six staring at each other in the middle cabs.

 

I imagine some mechanism akin to the famous Triang giraffe..

 

[gingerangles]

How about this idea from Airplane?

 

 

Inflatable drivers?

 

Don't call me Shirley.

 

[CF MRC]

1 hour ago, Michael Edge said:

I agree, the idea of the Midland building a single track main line was most unlikely.

I believe that there was a track laid parallel to the single track in the hidden bit so that it could have been doubled in the future if that was required. The change from single to double track forced a regulating of traffic, otherwise it would have probably become just a (more intensive) procession of trains in either direction.  
 

As with Chitern Green & Luton Hoo, Chee Tor had a fairly short exhibition life. I recollect that it was pretty heavy to shift (but who am I to talk…). 
 

Tim
 

[Dunsignalling]

7 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

On the other hand, I do think we need to be aware of projecting our own experience of the contemporary world back onto earlier periods. Every one of us here grew up in a post-war world of neglect and decay - myself in the 70s, which some might say was as grim as it got. We've seen the rise of rubbish with our disposable consumer economy, and, with the general rise in expectation of standard of living, a collapse in the low wage economy that could afford to keep things tidy.

 

There's a big difference though, between "clean and tidy" vs a portrayal so pristine that nothing on it can ever have done an ounce of work or spent more than half a day out of doors.

 

That sort of thing is fine for individual models, but becomes entirely unconvincing when extrapolated to an entire layout.

 

Even on the opening day of the Liverpool and Manchester, much of the infrastructure had been out in the weather for up to a year.

 

The other side of the coin, of course is "work stained" vs "decrepit", and that can be overdone, too.

 

John

[Northmoor]

1 hour ago, gingerangles said:

How about this idea from Airplane?

 

 

Inflatable drivers?

 

Don't call me Shirley.

 

Just so long as you don't have an "Elaine" topping him up when he starts to deflate......

[Tony Wright]

2 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

 

There's a big difference though, between "clean and tidy" vs a portrayal so pristine that nothing on it can ever have done an ounce of work or spent more than half a day out of doors.

 

That sort of thing is fine for individual models, but becomes entirely unconvincing when extrapolated to an entire layout.

 

Even on the opening day of the Liverpool and Manchester, much of the infrastructure had been out in the weather for up to a year.

 

The other side of the coin, of course is "work stained" vs "decrepit", and that can be overdone, too.

 

John

Good evening John,

 

I think the 'problem' here is that some folk will not tolerate any kind of weathering/distressing on their models, particularly locos/stock. They prefer to live in a miniature 'perfect world' (which they can do, if they wish) where nothing is besmirched, but it's wholly unrealistic in my view. 

 

Another reason might be a perception that weathering things immediately devalues them in the event of their having to be resold. 

 

As is well known, all my loco stud is weathered (lightly if it's been professionally-painted; more so if it's my painting), as is all my rolling stock - particularly freight stock.

 

Regards,

 

Tony.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

2 hours ago, gingerangles said:

Inflatable drivers?

Good idea, the pneumatic inflator in my home blood pressure monitor has been running for years on a pair of AAA batteries, a cinch for track supply. Rather than inflate a driver, just needs to lift the driver representation into view. 

[John Tomlinson]

On 28/08/2024 at 08:05, Izzy said:

Kodachrome has an inherently strong magenta cast. I was told by my late father-in-law who worked for Kodak at the time it first arrived and tested it before general release that it was down to it’s unique chemistry, normal slide films being of course E-6, which it isn’t. This is at times quite noticeable in the slower ISO’s, 25 & 64, and more muted in the 200. I’m sure it could be reproduced either in camera in some cases, or in post processing in such as Photoshop. 
 

Bob

 

I've just been catching up with several days of this thread, hence the somewhat delayed post now.

 

I found the magenta cast in K64 seemed to vary with processing, sometimes it seemed more noticeable than others. My earliest Kodachromes from the mid 70's show little or no such cast, but  there seemed to be a trend of it becoming more noticeable as time went by. I also found Kodak's processing quality deteriorated into the 1990's,  not only in colour cast but also care, films were more and more likely to come back with scratches. As this was long before digi, there was of course no real method of repair. I did run a couple of rolls of K200 when it came out, but it seemed to have a terribly brown tinge.

 

As a result I moved on to Fuji Provia around 1995, which not only gave a bit more speed, ISO 100 v's 64, but had a strong but not too strong colour palette. I tried Velvia once but it really was too saturated for my taste! Provia seems to scan quite easily, as do my old Ektachromes from the 70's, but I've struggled a bit to get a decent green out of K64. It might just be my ignorance, and I've taken to giving extra saturation to yellows in Photoshop, which helps a bit.

 

I suspect that, as in so many things, the conclusion to my dying day will be "getting better, but still scope for improvement"!

 

John.

[APOLLO]

7 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

As I understand it, both layouts are interpretations of what the Midland's proposed West Riding lines - making Bradford a through station - would have looked like if built in full (MMRS) or in part, but rather more so than was actually built (Essery). The station still open is on the ex-LNWR line. 

 

The famous P4 layout Heckmondwike was based on the same proposed Midland line.

 

Apologies, I meant to say that the layouts, to me,  show typical West Riding railways "atmosphere" of the era and are excellently modelled.

 

Today such atmosphere around our railways (West Riding you name it) is, for me, has mostly gone for ever.

Does anyone see atmosphere in today's railways ? I see a little in a few locations / lines. (Settle & Carlisle etc).

 

Main problem is rampant vegetation, everywhere, brushing against the trains also on many lines.

 

Brit15

[Tony Wright]

At last; more done on the Nu-Cast K Class..............

 

 

This has languished for the last fortnight while I conducted reviews, took photographs and shot videos. 

 

It shouldn't take long to complete now.

 

 

[Tony Wright]

Just a note on my experience of colour slides in the '60s.........

 

 

Student poverty in the early-mid'60s dictated the use of a 'free film' service called Gratispool - big mistake. Much of it turned 'golden' after a few years - this is one which didn't deteriorate too much, but many were rendered useless. 

 

By 1967, and working (prior to teacher training), I used Kodachrome 64.

 

 

 

Though that always seemed to have a blue cast.

 

This is April '67, when SIR NIGEL GRESLEY first ran in preservation, leaving Crewe, and breaking records climbing Shap! 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 31 by Tony Wright
can't spell Gresley!

[Tony Wright]

A little note on weathering..................

 

 

A Southern tender at Barry Docks in October 1966 (the day of the Aberfan disaster!). 

 

 

[richard i]

Quiz question

As your k class is about to get chimney and dome, so the Atlantic I brought earlier in the month has reached that stage. 
I am having a doubting moment. Do you fit them with evostik or two part epoxy? 
many thanks

richard 

[john new]

8 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Hi Chris

 

I face the same dilemma as I too have a terminus station and run DMUs. A tail lamp at both ends ...no,  and a driver at both ends...no. No drivers and tail lamps....no.

I do run DMUs in multiple, I can have four 2 car units coupled together forming one train. That would be eight drivers, one looking where he was going, one admiring where the train has been and six staring at each other in the middle cabs.

 

I could make the tail lamps removable once the train is ready to leave and put another one on what had been the front and now the back. With my dexterity I can see myself imitating the Italian porter at Bedford Midland Road I mentioned a few days ago when he used his new found English words to encourage an ill fitting lamp to go on the iron.

 

At the moment ,as the layout and stock are far from complete, no drivers and no tail lamps doesn't look too bad.

I think everyone has a “thing” they aren’t comfortable with when looking at someone else’s model and try to avoid on their own. For some it is drivers and lights/lamps and the absence of incorrectness of same, for me generally it is over illumination, no shadows, and everything too clean that I find kills the realism. Even too clean has the converse, ballast all over sprayed even out of station throat areas so no contrast whatsoever between sleepers and ballast, something in the real world there generally is. 
 

Those stunning models of Midland locos shown above are fantastic showcase modelling and far in excess of the r-t-r Hornby 4-4-0s BUT I think it can be argued that for a running model to authentically fit into a scene a decently weathered example showing some oil and smut stains would more authentically fit the scene.

 

At the moment I am only an observer/critic my own layouts and my early weathering attempts are nowhere near the top quality required so perhaps unfair to mention the above; the reason I have is knowing where my intended goal lies. I am advancing but still way, way behind modellers like Gordon & Maggie Gravett who’s layouts have got it right.

[robertcwp]

9 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Hi Chris

 

I face the same dilemma as I too have a terminus station and run DMUs. A tail lamp at both ends ...no,  and a driver at both ends...no. No drivers and tail lamps....no.

I do run DMUs in multiple, I can have four 2 car units coupled together forming one train. That would be eight drivers, one looking where he was going, one admiring where the train has been and six staring at each other in the middle cabs.

 

I could make the tail lamps removable once the train is ready to leave and put another one on what had been the front and now the back. With my dexterity I can see myself imitating the Italian porter at Bedford Midland Road I mentioned a few days ago when he used his new found English words to encourage an ill fitting lamp to go on the iron.

 

At the moment ,as the layout and stock are far from complete, no drivers and no tail lamps doesn't look too bad.

I take the same view with my units. No tail lamps or drivers as they go back and forth and can be seen stabled in sidings, where drivers and passengers would look very odd.

[Willie Whizz]

11 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

But what about departing trains?

 

 

I think it's down to 'observation'.

 

Seen before but in a different context. Though no trains terminated at Little Bytham, the difference in the staining on the footbridge is noticeable. Why the difference? Because Down trains were straining against the 1 in 200 of Stoke Bank, while Up trains had it easy (shutting off steam?).

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

Back in the late 80s, when it was still possible, I was one of a small group that had permission to walk through the long tunnel from the sites of Carrington Station to Nottingham Victoria, emerging

into the “Big Hole” at the north of the latter. 
 

Half way along, we paused and turned

our torches up to the blue brick-arch roof (the sides being cut from the ‘raw’ sandstone). We were puzzled to see two clean lines in between the soot-encrusted brick - one about twice the width of the other. 
 

We scratched our heads for a couple of minutes before the penny dropped - the line was on a gradient out of the City; the northbound trains had needed full power, effectively “steam cleaning” the down line’s roof; the southbound ones didn’t. So you’d almost certainly get the same effect on a bridge or tunnel mouth on a gradient, but with smoke. 
 

(A hundred yards further on, in the very darkest depths, we found a Tesco trolley, but that’s another story …).