Wright writes.....

[Barry Ten]

I've just spent a few minutes noodling around the internet looking for remote control horses. The one that looks the most like a real horse (as opposed to My Little Pony, Unicorns etc) seems to be this one:

 

 

It seems to be about 38.5 cm high at the head. I'm not sure what scale that would equate to in terms of modelling sizes, but I guess we'd be well into the miniature engineering end of things, which would in turn mean heavy wagons that the horse might struggle with.

 

I could see some potential if it could be bulked out by covering it in teddy bear fur and so on, to represent a beefy sort of draught horse.

 

Al

[micklner]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

I don't find shunting as much fun as watching express trains roaring past. 

 

It would seem that LB had two pick-up workings a day - one Up, one Down. The train engines did the shunting (there being no yard pilot). Both the pick-ups are run in the sequence, and any shunting which takes place is down to the operators. Some shunt, others don't bother (I'm in the latter camp). All shunting stock is equipped with Sprat & Winkle couplings, which work perfectly in the main. To be fair, derailments in these movements are very rare. Indeed, derailments anywhere in the sequence are very rare indeed. In fact, I can't recall any of late (apart from yesterday's; which has been investigated and attended to - a wheelset ever so slightly wide of gauge). 

 

I don't find operating (not just shunting) 'fun'; not unless it's in the company of friends. I've said before, I prefer to use my time building things. Speaking of 'building' things, has anyone ever replicated horse-shunting? There was a horse at LB for this purpose. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[drmditch]

1 hour ago, micklner said:

I know this picture has been commented on before, possibly by me.

Do you wonder whether the hard-working railway horse knows it is pulling some kind of superior hunter/racehorse/favoured pony?

 

But perhaps it's not all that bad. At least the railway horse works regular hours and gets fed properly.

(Even if doesn't know what happens to racehorses when they can't race anymore and are not suitable for stud.)

Edited October 11, 2022 by drmditch

[drmditch]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

I don't find shunting as much fun as watching express trains roaring past. 

 

It would seem that LB had two pick-up workings a day - one Up, one Down. The train engines did the shunting (there being no yard pilot). Both the pick-ups are run in the sequence, and any shunting which takes place is down to the operators. Some shunt, others don't bother (I'm in the latter camp). All shunting stock is equipped with Sprat & Winkle couplings, which work perfectly in the main. To be fair, derailments in these movements are very rare. Indeed, derailments anywhere in the sequence are very rare indeed. In fact, I can't recall any of late (apart from yesterday's; which has been investigated and attended to - a wheelset ever so slightly wide of gauge). 

 

I don't find operating (not just shunting) 'fun'; not unless it's in the company of friends. I've said before, I prefer to use my time building things. Speaking of 'building' things, has anyone ever replicated horse-shunting? There was a horse at LB for this purpose

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

Thank you Tony.

I think it is good that people like different things.

I do like watching trains run

(long goods and heavy mineral trains - not just high-stepping big-wheeled locomotives!)

And providing linking services/trains/railcars/coaches

And shunting goods services

And, of course, making things, rolling stock and locomotives and buildings and infrastructure.

 

Of course this (in my available space which is still quite large (22'x11')) does demand compromises, especially in curvature, gradients, and couplings.

Not prototypical - though it is set in County Durham and there were heavy gradients here!

It does contain prototypical elements however, and I am scheming to add more.

 

I'm sure you wouldn't approve of my railway, but it is my railway even if it's not likely to win any awards!

 

 

[jwealleans]

2 hours ago, drmditch said:

....you wonder whether the hard-working railway horse knows it is pulling some kind of superior hunter/racehorse/favoured pony?

 

It's not.  That's a Special Cattle Van.

[drmditch]

1 hour ago, jwealleans said:

 

It's not.  That's a Special Cattle Van.

Excellent. Thank you. I should have looked it up!

 

(Owing to health limitations I'm making too many posts, and not doing enough modelling. So, finish my cup of fennel tea and back to current project.)

 

Edited October 11, 2022 by drmditch

[Clive Mortimore]

1 hour ago, jwealleans said:

 

It's not.  That's a Special Cattle Van.

And it isn't pulling it, the chains to the harness are loose, the hand brake is on and the horse (bless him) is pulling that I am p***ed off waiting for my dinner look.

[drmditch]

17 minutes ago, Clive Mortimore said:

And it isn't pulling it, the chains to the harness are loose, the hand brake is on and the horse (bless him) is pulling that I am p***ed off waiting for my dinner look.

Perhaps it's nosebag is coming - just out of shot!

 

(And the chains and handbrake should have been obvious, but I'm not very awake today .)

Edited October 11, 2022 by drmditch

[thegreenhowards]

I went to GETS on Sunday. I thought there were some good layouts there. Allerby (modern image O gauge) was right up my street and Sydney Gardens and Bradford on Tome were great examples of roundy roundy watch the trains go by layouts which I really enjoyed. There were so many good layouts there that I ran out of time. I wasn't expecting to buy much - these magazine run shows never have many interesting traders and the one thing I wanted - some plastic putty - seemed to be unavailable.  But I did buy (Tony avert your gaze) a DCC sound chip.

 

Andy

 

 

[Tony Wright]

7 hours ago, drmditch said:

 

Thank you Tony.

I think it is good that people like different things.

I do like watching trains run

(long goods and heavy mineral trains - not just high-stepping big-wheeled locomotives!)

And providing linking services/trains/railcars/coaches

And shunting goods services

And, of course, making things, rolling stock and locomotives and buildings and infrastructure.

 

Of course this (in my available space which is still quite large (22'x11')) does demand compromises, especially in curvature, gradients, and couplings.

Not prototypical - though it is set in County Durham and there were heavy gradients here!

It does contain prototypical elements however, and I am scheming to add more.

 

I'm sure you wouldn't approve of my railway, but it is my railway even if it's not likely to win any awards!

 

 

Why would I not approve of your railway?

 

From what you've posted, it sounds exactly like the kind of model railway I'd admire; greatly. Far more so than the current 'obsession' with RTR.

 

And, winning 'awards' really means nothing in my view. I've never set out to build 'better' models than anyone else - just better than my last one! 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

Well, believe it or not, I've now got two of 'those' locos working. 

 

I had to strip out the DCC stuff to make sure they worked properly (I'll have a go, Baz, at re-instating it, but they might well need your expertise). 

 

 

 

 

The DJH Z (C7) now runs beautifully (with its DJH motor/gearbox) and proper (Markits) drivers.

 

 

Near 50 wagons, hauled at speed presented no problems. 

 

Whether the owner will be able to live with the inaccuracies is a moot point (my brief, in the main, was to make this go). 

 

 

The London Road D2 now works rather well (after much swearing!).

 

 

Six (mainly metal) Pullman cars were taken with ease (with just a bit of slipping on starting).

 

Some time ago, the merits (and the speed at which they can be made) of High-Level gearboxes were broadcast. Well, this one's assembly was dreadful; grinding and jamming under load. I think I've sorted it (with more profanity) but it's taken me ages. I wish I'd just dropped in a DJH AM10 (the cost of this is much less in real terms than the cost of my time for getting this loco to go). 

 

Do friction-fit drivers make good loads in wagons? The ones originally underneath this loco were awful. Now shod with Markits drivers, it's a really smooth rider.

 

Next on the list - a jammed-up LRM J6 with no coupling rods! 

 

 

[Mark C]

11 hours ago, micklner said:

 

The second photo is of Welwyn North station - and the horse is on the Down line of the ECML!!

 

[Tony Wright]

8 hours ago, Mark C said:

 

The second photo is of Welwyn North station - and the horse is on the Down line of the ECML!!

 

It is indeed.

 

Interesting, isn't it? That when we pass horses in the road we (should) slow down to walking pace and give them as wide a berth as possible. 

 

Judging by the exhaust on that 'Royal Claud' (coming Up from Cambridge on a 'beer train'?), it's belting along! Railway horses must have been very laid-back.............

 

Regards,

 

Tony.

[Dragonboy]

I was at GETS on Sunday as I usually am and while there were undoubtedly some fine layouts on display on the ground floor I yearn for a good pre grouping layout where shunting takes place rather than the block train roundy roundy layouts that are beginning to dominate with their toothpaste box liveries and where the same train appears 4 times in 3 minutes.

 

As with many things in life these days I know I’m probably well out of step with the masses here.

 

Because the lift was out of action I was unable to get to see the layouts on the balcony’s this year due to mobility issues which make stairs too much of a challenge now so there may well be some gems I was unable to get to which would have been more to my taste.

 

As commented above the lack of suppliers for the odds and sods we all need is becoming a worrying trend. Only last week I was checking if one supplier was attending on his web site and on his home page there was an announcement that he is no longer taking a stand to shows. In reality my £4 purchase from his stand had to be beefed up to his £10 minimum mail order amount by adding something else which I don’t particularly need at the moment and with postage the item I wanted  cost £13.50 - almost the same as GETS admission.  
 

From the traders perspective, and as a supplier of small sundries it’s totally understandable to discontinue shows as he’s clearly been able to keep his business flowing through Covid so for him the incentive is no longer there.

 

I think that while shows are thankfully back, the shows we’ve been accustomed to as modellers have probably gone forever.

[Tony Wright]

27 minutes ago, Dragonboy said:

I was at GETS on Sunday as I usually am and while there were undoubtedly some fine layouts on display on the ground floor I yearn for a good pre grouping layout where shunting takes place rather than the block train roundy roundy layouts that are beginning to dominate with their toothpaste box liveries and where the same train appears 4 times in 3 minutes.

 

As with many things in life these days I know I’m probably well out of step with the masses here.

 

Because the lift was out of action I was unable to get to see the layouts on the balcony’s this year due to mobility issues which make stairs too much of a challenge now so there may well be some gems I was unable to get to which would have been more to my taste.

 

As commented above the lack of suppliers for the odds and sods we all need is becoming a worrying trend. Only last week I was checking if one supplier was attending on his web site and on his home page there was an announcement that he is no longer taking a stand to shows. In reality my £4 purchase from his stand had to be beefed up to his £10 minimum mail order amount by adding something else which I don’t particularly need at the moment and with postage the item I wanted  cost £13.50 - almost the same as GETS admission.  
 

From the traders perspective, and as a supplier of small sundries it’s totally understandable to discontinue shows as he’s clearly been able to keep his business flowing through Covid so for him the incentive is no longer there.

 

I think that while shows are thankfully back, the shows we’ve been accustomed to as modellers have probably gone forever.

Good morning,

 

I think many shows might well have gone forever, or are heading that way. 

 

My observations in more recent times suggest attendees are dropping off to the point where holding shows becomes non-viable. Couple that with the disappearance of 'specialist' traders at such events, and the proliferation of 'box-shifters' to take their places, and, to me, it's a recipe for doom for many exhibitions. 

 

It could be that the 'salvation' for exhibitions are the smaller, 'home-spun' events (Nottingham for one, next month), where costs are strictly-limited (no overnight accommodation needed) and the exhibits are local. That then leaves a few 'larger' shows, often sponsored.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Mark C]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

It is indeed.

 

Interesting, isn't it? That when we pass horses in the road we (should) slow down to walking pace and give them as wide a berth as possible. 

 

Judging by the exhaust on that 'Royal Claud' (coming Up from Cambridge on a 'beer train'?), it's belting along! Railway horses must have been very laid-back.............

 

Regards,

 

Tony.

 

Indeed - literally, taking it all in its' stride...

 

Regards

Mark

 

(Mark C (with a space))

[t-b-g]

12 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Well, believe it or not, I've now got two of 'those' locos working. 

 

I had to strip out the DCC stuff to make sure they worked properly (I'll have a go, Baz, at re-instating it, but they might well need your expertise). 

 

 

 

 

The DJH Z (C7) now runs beautifully (with its DJH motor/gearbox) and proper (Markits) drivers.

 

 

Near 50 wagons, hauled at speed presented no problems. 

 

Whether the owner will be able to live with the inaccuracies is a moot point (my brief, in the main, was to make this go). 

 

 

The London Road D2 now works rather well (after much swearing!).

 

 

Six (mainly metal) Pullman cars were taken with ease (with just a bit of slipping on starting).

 

Some time ago, the merits (and the speed at which they can be made) of High-Level gearboxes were broadcast. Well, this one's assembly was dreadful; grinding and jamming under load. I think I've sorted it (with more profanity) but it's taken me ages. I wish I'd just dropped in a DJH AM10 (the cost of this is much less in real terms than the cost of my time for getting this loco to go). 

 

Do friction-fit drivers make good loads in wagons? The ones originally underneath this loco were awful. Now shod with Markits drivers, it's a really smooth rider.

 

Next on the list - a jammed-up LRM J6 with no coupling rods! 

 

 

 

The people who struggle with High Level Gearboxes are probably the same people who build locos badly.

 

The skills needed to build a gearbox are not as advanced as the ones you need to build a loco kit.

 

I wonder what exactly people find difficult about them. Is bending an etch at 90 degrees or putting bearings in holes really that difficult?

 

In the last few weeks I have fitted 4 High Level gearboxes to locos, all in cases where the DJH ones wouldn't fit (even if I wanted to pay that much for them). Each one is silky smooth and superb, especially with the new generation of coreless motors that Chris Gibbons now supplies.

 

The 30mm long coreless motor with a 120:1 reduction gearbox is a real beast!

 

Plus I can say that I made them up myself, which is a big part of the hobby for me.

[31A]

3 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

It is indeed.

 

Interesting, isn't it? That when we pass horses in the road we (should) slow down to walking pace and give them as wide a berth as possible. 

 

Judging by the exhaust on that 'Royal Claud' (coming Up from Cambridge on a 'beer train'?), it's belting along! Railway horses must have been very laid-back.............

 

Regards,

 

Tony.

 

I have read some discussion of that photo recently, it might have been in the LNER Society magazine, which came to the conclusion that it was probably posed and the loco's exhaust has been added artificially (can hardly say 'photoshopped' in connection with a 1930s photo, but that kind of thing....).

[polybear]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

It could be that the 'salvation' for exhibitions are the smaller, 'home-spun' events (Nottingham for one, next month), where costs are strictly-limited (no overnight accommodation needed) and the exhibits are local. That then leaves a few 'larger' shows, often sponsored.

 

 

The smaller, specialist suppliers appear to be disappearing (or have already) from the larger,  sponsored shows; I recall Dave Ellis (when he ran SEF) saying that he wouldn't be attending Ally Pally anymore simply because the costs of doing so made it a box-shifting exercise, with very little profit (if any) to show for it.

I usually attend the Model Engineering Exhibition at the same location - it's been "going downhill" for some time now, with less and less exhibitors attending.  Why?  Well as an example I overheard one seller of s/h tools saying that the (not very large) stand rent for the 3 days was the best part of a grand - and that's before fuel, accommodation, food etc. is added; he needs to sell an awful lot of s/h tools before he even breaks even.  The result of the reduced number of traders is (no surprises) less visitors - so the stand rents go up next year; at Ally Pally they've just started charging for car parking (£16 IIRC) which drives even more visitors away.  A vicious circle, sadly.

[jrg1]

Sad to learn of Iain Rice's passing.  I first read his articles in Model Railways during the seventies, and then collected his modelling books.

His drawings and descriptions were inspirational, and encouraged me to have a go.

As I type this, I am converting a Hornby J52 to P4 with a Mainly Trains chassis and detailing kit-all designed and complete with instructions and exploded drawings by Iain.

[Tony Wright]

1 hour ago, t-b-g said:

 

The people who struggle with High Level Gearboxes are probably the same people who build locos badly.

 

The skills needed to build a gearbox are not as advanced as the ones you need to build a loco kit.

 

I wonder what exactly people find difficult about them. Is bending an etch at 90 degrees or putting bearings in holes really that difficult?

 

In the last few weeks I have fitted 4 High Level gearboxes to locos, all in cases where the DJH ones wouldn't fit (even if I wanted to pay that much for them). Each one is silky smooth and superb, especially with the new generation of coreless motors that Chris Gibbons now supplies.

 

The 30mm long coreless motor with a 120:1 reduction gearbox is a real beast!

 

Plus I can say that I made them up myself, which is a big part of the hobby for me.

Good afternoon Tony,

 

You saw the D2 at Wigan (though I hadn't got it going then).

 

You're right about it being better to make things, but by my having to fiddle with and fix the High-Level gearbox in question, the end result to the customer (in terms of the price of my time) will probably be not far off the cost of a DJH motor/gearbox combination. I know the latter will automatically work superbly, but I still remain suspicious about the High-Level 'box, or rather the way it was made initially. It's a flexible one (by that I mean, it can be configured at different angles to fit inside the body). It made grinding noises under test (not in the frames), but I've anchored it in now and (I hope) it's OK. Time will tell. 

 

I've made High-Level gearboxes, and have had no trouble (though I've not been able to make them in ten minutes). That said, this is at least the fourth one I've had pass through my hands which has been noisy and stiff. Clearly, though beautifully-designed and easy to put together, they are beyond many to make properly. In no way am I being critical of Chris Gibbons' products; indeed, I thoroughly recommend them, but they can be put together badly. How? I have no idea! 

 

Which rather brings us back to the start of this discussion............... It would seem to me that the majority of kit-built locos which have passed through my hands (and it's now near 200 in the last three or so years) do not work properly, whether 'professionally-made' or not. I don't include those made by the late Paul Bromige in this assessment.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited October 12, 2022 by Tony Wright
to add something

[Barry Ten]

We were with a layout at a show in the south over the weekend. There were some very nice models in attendance, but little to nothing in what you'd call finescale trade support. At one point we needed some 0.5mm brass wire or similar to add an extra loop to a coupling, but none was available, even from Eileen's Emporium. Fortunately the layout next to us was from the Cardiff 4mm group and they had some wire to spare.

 

I gather the show was well-attended nonetheless.

[polybear]

Insofar as High Level Gearboxes are concerned, a video of a build exists on Youtube which may prove useful; it'd be interesting to learn of any opinions on the content from the Great and the Good inhabiting Wright Writes:

 

 

[jrg1]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

Good afternoon Tony,

 

You saw the D2 at Wigan (though I hadn't got it going then).

 

You're right about it being better to make things, but by my having to fiddle with and fix the High-Level gearbox in question, the end result to the customer (in terms of the price of my time) will probably be not far off the cost of a DJH motor/gearbox combination. I know the latter will automatically work superbly, but I still remain suspicious about the High-Level 'box, or rather the way it was made initially. It's a flexible one (by that I mean, it can be configured at different angles to fit inside the body). It made grinding noises under test (not in the frames), but I've anchored it in now and (I hope) it's OK. Time will tell. 

 

I've made High-Level gearboxes, and have had no trouble (though I've not been able to make them in ten minutes). That said, this is at least the fourth one I've had pass through my hands which has been noisy and stiff. Clearly, though beautifully-designed and easy to put together, they are beyond many to make properly. In no way am I being critical of Chris Gibbons' products; indeed, I thoroughly recommend them, but they can be put together badly. How? I have no idea! 

 

Which rather brings us back to the start of this discussion............... It would seem to me that the majority of kit-built locos which have passed through my hands (and it's now near 200 in the last three or so years) do not work properly, whether 'professionally-made' or not. I don't include those made by the late Paul Bromige in this assessment.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

A major mistake assembling gearboxes is to enlarge holes by drilling them-almost guaranteed to stuff up the alignment.  This is usually the reason for grinding/noise/stiffness in a gearbox.

Holes should be broached or reamed to ensure all components line up correctly.  

[Bucoops]

18 minutes ago, polybear said:

Insofar as High Level Gearboxes are concerned, a video of a build exists on Youtube which may prove useful; it'd be interesting to learn of any opinions on the content from the Great and the Good inhabiting Wright Writes:

 

 

 

What does @grob1234 make of it I wonder? 😈