Wright writes.....

[Tony Wright]

10 hours ago, PupCam said:

Evening,

 

Firstly, belated birthday wishes to Tony.   What do they say?   It's only a number and there are plenty of those left to use!

 

I need want a few O Gauge BR vans and wagons for as yet non-existent small layout.     I'd been looking at the usual RTR suspects but having been suitably indoctrinated by WW I decided to build them.     Sometime back I built the first of the 16T mineral wagons and I've recently finished (minus a few finishing touches e.g. wheels & buffers) the first van seen here.     There's little difference in the cost between the RTR offerings and the kit built versions and I thoroughly enjoyed the build, which entertained me for a significant number of hours.    Whilst doing so I realised how much better Value For Money the DIY versions are.   You get all those hours of amusement and entertainment and then you end up with something to keep and actually use.      

 

It's my first time using Humbrol weathering washes and powders which seemed to work quite well albeit there's a bit too much residual sheen for my liking.   How does Humbrol matt varnish work these days?  Is it any good or does it go all white and blotchy?    I never used to have much success with it years ago.  I'm trying to decide if it's worth risking it and giving it a coat.

 

Alan

 

Good morning Alan,

 

My experience with Humbrol matt varnish in the past has been the same as yours - cloudy and blotchy! Other Humbrol paints of the time (years ago) were fine, especially the railway colours - BR green, particularly. More recent experiences have not been so good - has it been made safe enough to drink now? 

 

Anyway, have you tried a product called 'Dull-Coat' (or Dul-Kote if the English is mangled in the trade name)? Made by Testor (or Testa, or..........), it gives an excellent matt finish via the airbrush. 

 

I made this............

 

 

O Gauge Parkside 12T van, and painted it in gloss car acrylic rattle can. It then went to Geoff Haynes for weathering/toning down, and he would have used the Dull Coat. I don't know if it can be brush-painted on. 

 

Regarding the above, although the individual numerals are correct, I have no idea if they're in the right order. They came in a line on the transfer sheet (waterslide), then, on application, they just floated apart in every direction! I just poked them around, and I doubt if it's the same number both sides..............

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[grahame]

Here's another samey pic of my under construction N/2mm rendition of London Bridge, but I'm still in quite a bit of pain and slowly recovering from the operation which is restricting modelling, although I can just about hold the camera to take a snap or two. Hopefully it demonstrates that railways in Britain didn't end in 1968 and that there's still plenty of interest to model.

 

[NHY 581]

Morning, 

 

I now avoid Testor's Dullcote after a rather unfortunate experience. I used the Dullcote as I had run out of my usual Humbrol Acrylic Matt varnish, which I use in aerosol form to seal weathering powders. The Dull cote was too concentrated and came out "very wet". This caused the weathering powders to effectively disappear. 

 

Yes Humbrol varnish can bloom but if the can is warmed in a bowl of warm water and well shaken, It's fine but only if used in thin coats. 

 

These have all been weathered using weathering powders, sealed with Humbrol Matt varnish. 

 

Oxford 1/76th Land Rover

 

 

 

Hornby 20T Brake Van

 

Hornby Toad E

 

Hornby waiting room and 3D GER Van body

 

As you can see, it results in a nice matt finish. Just needs a bit of preparation prior to use. 

 

 

Rob

 

 

Edited Wednesday at 07:58 by NHY 581

[jwealleans]

Hasn't Dullcote been withdrawn permanently, or have they managed to reformulate it?   I always found it excellent, but never use it over powders because as has been said, it makes them disappear.   It's surface is matt enough that decent weathering powders (MIG, AK) stick to it well enough  to not need sealing.

[NHY 581]

13 minutes ago, jwealleans said:

Hasn't Dullcote been withdrawn permanently, or have they managed to reformulate it?   I always found it excellent, but never use it over powders because as has been said, it makes them disappear.   It's surface is matt enough that decent weathering powders (MIG, AK) stick to it well enough  to not need sealing.

 

Interesting regarding the Dullcote but I'd always advocate sealing over powders if stock is handled on a regular basis, as mine is when I take the layout to an  exhibition. 

 

Rob. 

 

 

[31A]

35 minutes ago, jwealleans said:

Hasn't Dullcote been withdrawn permanently, or have they managed to reformulate it?  

 

A Canadian friend brought me a can over last year.  Apparently it can be sold there but not here!

[Captain Kernow]

9 minutes ago, 31A said:

 

A Canadian friend brought me a can over last year.  Apparently it can be sold there but not here!

I believe that there is a new formula for Dullcote that is sold in Europe, which is not quite so matt a finish as the original cans.

 

[John Isherwood]

2 hours ago, 31A said:

 

A Canadian friend brought me a can over last year.  Apparently it can be sold there but not here!

 

Tut, tut !

 

I thought you weren't supposed to put aerosols in flight luggage?

 

John Isherwood.

[St Enodoc]

10 minutes ago, John Isherwood said:

 

Tut, tut !

 

I thought you weren't supposed to put aerosols in flight luggage?

 

John Isherwood.

Here are the rules as they apply to Australia. I suspect that other jurisdictions' rules are similar.

 

https://www.homeaffairs.gov.au/about-us/what-we-do/travelsecure/security-screening-at-airports/what-you-can-and-can’t-bring

[PMP]

14 minutes ago, St Enodoc said:

Here are the rules as they apply to Australia. I suspect that other jurisdictions' rules are similar.

 

https://www.homeaffairs.gov.au/about-us/what-we-do/travelsecure/security-screening-at-airports/what-you-can-and-can’t-bring

Normal aerosols ( smellies etc), are allowed in sensible quantities. Not always in hand luggage though. You can assume within the allowances listed that paint will be banned under solvents and flammable liquids, including hold luggage, they are in the EU.

[Geep7]

Sadly anything that seems to work well, eg. Dullcote, Testors paint, etc. usually contain the more nasty chemicals that are banned or frowned upon in the EU (and hence the UK). Dullcote, as mentioned, was reformulated a few years back for the EU market, but sadly doesn't work quite as well as before.....

[31A]

1 hour ago, John Isherwood said:

 

Tut, tut !

 

I thought you weren't supposed to put aerosols in flight luggage?

 

John Isherwood.

 

I didn't ask!

[kevinlms]

A former workmate, told me that he once sent fireworks that he'd made himself, to his sister in the middle of Australia! He didn't believe me, when I told him that they would have probably locked him up if Australia Post had known.

His sister told him that the fireworks went off very well.

[1471SirFrederickBanbury]

1 hour ago, Geep7 said:

Sadly anything that seems to work well, eg. Dullcote, Testors paint, etc. usually contain the more nasty chemicals that are banned or frowned upon in the EU (and hence the UK). Dullcote, as mentioned, was reformulated a few years back for the EU market, but sadly doesn't work quite as well as before.....

which is why it is imperative for me to buy old paint (almost all Humbrol) and add the necessary amount of lovely chemicals back if they're dried out slightly.  This leaves me with enamels that stick to both metal and plastic better than any easily attainable primer ever could, so I never end up using primer nowadays.  My Varney Super Mikado is a great example, as I wanted to get some paint over the brass, and feeling lazy, just hand brushed Humbrol black (I got it a while back, slightly thick, so I thinned it out with drying linseed oil, the top liquid from some humbrol tins that needed thickening, and acetone/butyl acetate) direct to the brass boiler.  I did it in two coats, with the first being baked on (convection oven at 250 F for 2 hours, and 350 F for 3), and I know now that its almost impossible to scrape the paint off!  After that experience,  I think that big tin of Humbrol gloss black will be my primer if I ever need it, as I'd have to spray (with a good spray gun) old high build cellulose lacquer primer or a good urethane (maybe not, as the enamel is far more durable than the paint on most any cars I've seen!) to get anything near the rejuvenated Humbrol.

[grahame]

I use a lot of Humbrol matt varnish aerosol, especially on my buildings and kit built rolling stock, with good results. It works well if you follow two main rules.

 

Don't spray in a humid atmosphere otherwise it can catch and trap airborne water droplets causing blooming. Secondly, only spray over thoughourly dry paint. Give it an extra day or two if unsure, especially for oil based paint, as the acrylic varnish can react. And dust on thin coats (although that is presumably teaching . . . . )

 

 

 

Edited Wednesday at 14:16 by grahame

[lezz01]

I use Ronson lighter fluid to thin Humbrol enamels for brush painting and white spirit for airbrushing. I mix paint with a nail polish shaker for small tinlets and I tape larger tins and rattle cans to the blade of a Bosch multi tool and give it a wazz with that. I add a couple of steel balls to tins to help with the mixing. Do not add them to glass jars as it's a very bad idea, don't ask me how I know. 🥴 You can use glass beads to add to glass jars. So far I haven't had any disasters with the glass beads.

Regards Lez.     

[Captain Kernow]

16 minutes ago, lezz01 said:

I use Ronson lighter fluid to thin Humbrol enamels for brush painting and white spirit for airbrushing.

Interested to know what the difference between the two fluids is?

I've always used Ronsonol to thin enamels for both brushing and airbrushing (the latter based on the recommendation of Martyn Welch).

Thanks.

 

[Tony Wright]

Slightly tongue in cheek, I admit, but I'm amazed I'm still healthy and alive in my late 70s. Given the deadly substances I've used down the decades, I must be very lucky. 

 

One thing I found is that they all worked very well. Floquil paints (now banned, I assume?), carbon tetrachloride (Thawpit - brilliant at cleaning armatures), methyl ethyl ketone (organic peroxide) and cobalt for hardening polyester resin, and original Nitromors for dismantling epoxy-built metal kits. Not only that, but endless bottles of EAMES phosphoric acid 40 flux for soldering (how strong was that?), plus miles of solder containing many dangerous (heavy) metals! 

 

Maybe I'm too cynical, but modern equivalents don't seem to work as well. Granted, they must be safer, but, as an example, current Nitromors leaves paint/adhesive virtually untouched. Maybe the original was deadly - just reading the label caused blindness!

 

As for my working for over a year in a commercial photographic darkroom inhaling fumes from warm developer and hypo, what damage has that done?

[lezz01]

53 minutes ago, Captain Kernow said:

Interested to know what the difference between the two fluids is?

I've always used Ronsonol to thin enamels for both brushing and airbrushing (the latter based on the recommendation of Martyn Welch).

Thanks.

 

Yeh I don't think there is a difference Ronsonol is just what they call it now days. I've just had a look and it is called that now. I use it for the same reason plus it was also recommended in the instructions of the Bob Moore lining pen. Truth is any lighter fluid will do the job. Way back in the day it was a form of petrol but now it's alcohol based and those sorts of fluids tend to have ol on the end of the word.

Regards Lez.  

[lezz01]

You can buy phosphoric acid 1Ltr at a time from the bay of E that's in the high 90%s . I buy it like that and add water to bring it down to 50%ish. Same with Butanone that come's in 500ml bottles at 70+% and I let that down with water as well. 

It costs very little that way compared to the silly little bottles from model shops.

Regards Lez.

[46444]

1 hour ago, Captain Kernow said:

Interested to know what the difference between the two fluids is?

I've always used Ronsonol to thin enamels for both brushing and airbrushing (the latter based on the recommendation of Martyn Welch).

Thanks.

 

 

I remember Martyn Welch telling me the same thing.

 

It was when he had his shop Blue Peter, in Wilton Street, Plymouth which was quite an inspiration for a student back in the early 90's.

 

Cheers,

 

Mark 

[MarkC]

13 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Slightly tongue in cheek, I admit, but I'm amazed I'm still healthy and alive in my late 70s. Given the deadly substances I've used down the decades, I must be very lucky. 

 

One thing I found is that they all worked very well. Floquil paints (now banned, I assume?), carbon tetrachloride (Thawpit - brilliant at cleaning armatures), methyl ethyl ketone (organic peroxide) and cobalt for hardening polyester resin, and original Nitromors for dismantling epoxy-built metal kits. Not only that, but endless bottles of EAMES phosphoric acid 40 flux for soldering (how strong was that?), plus miles of solder containing many dangerous (heavy) metals! 

 

Maybe I'm too cynical, but modern equivalents don't seem to work as well. Granted, they must be safer, but, as an example, current Nitromors leaves paint/adhesive virtually untouched. Maybe the original was deadly - just reading the label caused blindness!

 

As for my working for over a year in a commercial photographic darkroom inhaling fumes from warm developer and hypo, what damage has that done?

It's been going on for a long time. I'd only been C/E for a couple of years, back in 1992, and had just had a very long overnight standby going up the Schelde to Antwerp, followed by 3 hours taking fuel on board before the cargo operations could start.. I'd only been asleep for about 30 minutes, having been up for about 28 hours, when my phone started ringing. It was the 3rd Mate. "Chief, there's a chap here that wants to see you. Says it's important". Meh. OK, boiler suit back on, wander down to the cargo office.

 

"Hello Chief", says this visitor. "I'm the local rep for (one of the big players in the supply of chemicals & gases to the marine industry). I was just passing, and thought I'd call in to see how you were getting on with our new, environmentally friendly degreaser". I was NOT impressed. He got told, in no uncertain terms, that his product might smell nice, but it was totally useless for cleaning, and I wanted a supply of the old, effective product that we used to get. Also, to get the h*ll off my ship & don't come back.

 

After a couple of minutes, I thought that he might make a complaint about me, so I wandered down to the jetty & phoned the office in Edinburgh. (No roaming mobile phones back then). I told my Superintendent what had happened & waited for the rollicking. Well, says the Super, I wouldn't have done that. You wouldn't? Says I. Nope, says my boss, I'd have physically thrown him off at the least, if not thumped the swine. Forget about it - I've got your back.

 

Turned out that the 3rd Mate had tried to find out what was so important, but this geezer had been VERY insistent on me being called...

 

I got some proper degreaser supplied, next port 😎

 

Mark

[Captain Kernow]

1 hour ago, 46444 said:

 

I remember Martyn Welch telling me the same thing.

 

It was when he had his shop Blue Peter, in Wilton Street, Plymouth which was quite an inspiration for a student back in the early 90's.

 

Cheers,

 

Mark 

Indeed. Visiting his shop was the cause of some unusually long lunch breaks...

[1471SirFrederickBanbury]

3 hours ago, lezz01 said:

I use Ronson lighter fluid to thin Humbrol enamels for brush painting and white spirit for airbrushing. I mix paint with a nail polish shaker for small tinlets and I tape larger tins and rattle cans to the blade of a Bosch multi tool and give it a wazz with that. I add a couple of steel balls to tins to help with the mixing. Do not add them to glass jars as it's a very bad idea, don't ask me how I know. 🥴 You can use glass beads to add to glass jars. So far I haven't had any disasters with the glass beads.

Regards Lez.     

I decided a long time ago to just take a steel wire coat hanger and turn it into a bunch of stirring rods.  I almost never have to use them under power, but if its a tinlet I've never opened, then the bent up side gets used.

[Bernard Lamb]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

Slightly tongue in cheek, I admit, but I'm amazed I'm still healthy and alive in my late 70s. Given the deadly substances I've used down the decades, I must be very lucky. 

 

One thing I found is that they all worked very well. Floquil paints (now banned, I assume?), carbon tetrachloride (Thawpit - brilliant at cleaning armatures), methyl ethyl ketone (organic peroxide) and cobalt for hardening polyester resin, and original Nitromors for dismantling epoxy-built metal kits. Not only that, but endless bottles of EAMES phosphoric acid 40 flux for soldering (how strong was that?), plus miles of solder containing many dangerous (heavy) metals! 

 

Maybe I'm too cynical, but modern equivalents don't seem to work as well. Granted, they must be safer, but, as an example, current Nitromors leaves paint/adhesive virtually untouched. Maybe the original was deadly - just reading the label caused blindness!

 

As for my working for over a year in a commercial photographic darkroom inhaling fumes from warm developer and hypo, what damage has that done?

Good evening Tony,

I view things from the angle of a kid growing up exposed to all sorts of things and gaining a degree of immunity to the bad effects because of that exposure. I used to take paint brushes into work to get them cleaned and I would also use the degreasing agent for cleaning white metal models. All now banned. I once was in charge of the trophies from a national cycling organization. When trying to get one trophy engraved I was informed that it was not possible as the original was produced with cyanide etching.It took a very complicated, to me, computer program to solve the problem. The chap who had done the engraving lived into his late 80s and smoked like a chimney. I think I must have spent rather more time than you in a photographic darkroom.

Things have certainly improved since Victorian times. Have we become too soft? Yes as I see it. Don't start me off on sanitized sport or outdoor activities.😀

Bernard