RMweb Gold Anotheran Posted November 30, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 30, 2014 And even if you were sure you knew exactly where it was, you wouldn't know exactly when it was there... 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jock67B Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Werner Heisenberg steps in to the ring with his uncertainty principle! Kind regards, Jock. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
emt_911 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Werner Heisenberg steps in to the ring with his uncertainty principle! Kind regards, Jock. Ok. I'm having to look this one up Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 1, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 1, 2014 Ok. I'm having to look this one up Duncan, There are some physical quantities that are intrinsically linked. Heisenberg identified pairings, including position and momentum, and energy and time. There will always be a built-in - nothing to do with the equipment used - uncertainty if you try to measure the 2 quantities in the pairing at the same time. So if you knew precisely how fast/the momentum of an object, you'd not have a clue where it was. And if you try to measure the energy of an object at a precise instant then the energy value you got would have an infinite spread of possible values. Heisenberg's famous Uncertainty Principle links the 2 items in the pairing through a fundamental constant "h" - Planck's Constant. This quantity turns up in ALL the key quantum equations, a bit like the irrational numbers PI and "e". Very fundamental. Sorry, I just felt the urge to write things down. Jeff 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 1, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 1, 2014 No, you won't have seen it... it's dead.... or maybe not...... Cat.png A Alan, that is a fantastic poster. I'd love a T-shirt with that printed on. The key thing about the Schrodinger Cat paradox is that we don't know what state the cat is until we open the box. The action of the observer/rescuer in opening the box collapses the possibilities and produces the single alive or dead result we see. QM sounds weird, but we judge reality by our very limited range of everyday size-scales. Commonsense isn't really the way in which reality works. I'm surprised nobody has taken the infamous "double slit" experiment and tried to guess which of 2 tunnels an approaching train would take..... Maybe we should just quit the physics and get back to 4 x 2? Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
emt_911 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Duncan, There are some physical quantities that are intrinsically linked. Heisenberg identified pairings, including position and momentum, and energy and time. There will always be a built-in - nothing to do with the equipment used - uncertainty if you try to measure the 2 quantities in the pairing at the same time. So if you knew precisely how fast/the momentum of an object, you'd not have a clue where it was. And if you try to measure the energy of an object at a precise instant then the energy value you got would have an infinite spread of possible values. Heisenberg's famous Uncertainty Principle links the 2 items in the pairing through a fundamental constant "h" - Planck's Constant. This quantity turns up in ALL the key quantum equations, a bit like the irrational numbers PI and "e". Very fundamental. Sorry, I just felt the urge to write things down. Jeff Is this the time to worry? I actually understood that 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
emt_911 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Alan, that is a fantastic poster. I'd love a T-shirt with that printed on. The key thing about the Schrodinger Cat paradox is that we don't know what state the cat is until we open the box. The action of the observer/rescuer in opening the box collapses the possibilities and produces the single alive or dead result we see. QM sounds weird, but we judge reality by our very limited range of everyday size-scales. Commonsense isn't really the way in which reality works. I'm surprised nobody has taken the infamous "double slit" experiment and tried to guess which of 2 tunnels an approaching train would take..... Maybe we should just quit the physics and get back to 4 x 2? Jeff I was going to agree until I read the last sentence Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60091 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 (edited) Hi Jeff About the cat t shirts - I know nothing about the company and definitely don't moonlight as a sales rep for them.... but here's the site. Unfortunately it's in the US. Here's a link - www.snorgtees.com Alan Edited December 1, 2014 by 60091 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
emt_911 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Hi Jeff About the cat t shirts - I know nothing about the company and definitely don't moonlight as a sales rep for them.... but here's the site. Unfortunately it's in the US. Here's a link - www.snorgtees.com Alan Quite a few that appeal to me Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Anotheran Posted December 1, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 1, 2014 I'm surprised nobody has taken the infamous "double slit" experiment and tried to guess which of 2 tunnels an approaching train would take..... Maybe we should just quit the physics and get back to 4 x 2? Surely it's not guessing which of two tunnels it would take, more of once passengers have reached central London you can work out from the way they congregate around Nelson's column the probability of them having come through Euston or St Pancras from that single source called Scotland! Quit the physics??! Oh, ok sir! I guess you don't need detailed QM to be sure that 4x2 will hold your track off the floor 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 2, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 2, 2014 (edited) Surely it's not guessing which of two tunnels it would take, more of once passengers have reached central London you can work out from the way they congregate around Nelson's column the probability of them having come through Euston or St Pancras from that single source called Scotland! Quit the physics??! Oh, ok sir! I guess you don't need detailed QM to be sure that 4x2 will hold your track off the floor I like your Nelson's column analogy. A good image to have in mind, with people representing photons or electrons. Yep, that'll do fine! If people wish to continue discussing Physics topics on here, well, go ahead. Until KL2 finally rears its head there's not much else to discuss.... though I may have another garden pic or two later (I can hear the collective groan!!) I'm impressed with the Lunester's interest and knowledge of some of my favourite topics! Jeff Edited December 2, 2014 by Physicsman Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 2, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 2, 2014 On a railway-related matter (WHAT? Shock horror!), I received a HUGE email from Jason yesterday. It was sent while he was at work, so he was clearly very busy! Importantly, he's acquired TONS of Parkside kits - many are for me. So it looks as if yours truly will be into wagon building during 2015, which is a good (and new for me) thing. Jeff 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 On a railway-related matter (WHAT? Shock horror!), I received a HUGE email from Jason yesterday. It was sent while he was at work, so he was clearly very busy! Importantly, he's acquired TONS of Parkside kits - many are for me. So it looks as if yours truly will be into wagon building during 2015, which is a good (and new for me) thing. Jeff He was telling me about them last night and I was gobsmacked, still maybe its a good sign, Plastic Kits today, Finescale Points tomorrow :no: 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 2, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 2, 2014 He was telling me about them last night and I was gobsmacked, still maybe its a good sign, Plastic Kits today, Finescale Points tomorrow :no: Kits, yes. Points, NO. I've got all the points I need and there's just too many other things to do. At the moment I feel like I'm in the deep valley well below Base Camp, staring up at the summit of a very tall mountain. It'll be a long, enjoyable climb with side-visits on the way. But not too many distractions....until KL2 is "finished". Then, maybe, some track building... Jeff 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 2, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 2, 2014 In the meantime, the garden work continues, though I'm on my last bag of cement (146 used, so far!), last 50 bricks and it's getting cold. 5C this morning - which I can cope with. But the wind chill was such that after 2 hours bricklaying and tidying up my fingers were uncomfortably numb. Here's a couple of pics. 2 of the sheds are due on Thursday - fingers crossed (when they warm up!): Jeff 11 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jock67B Posted December 4, 2014 Share Posted December 4, 2014 Early good morning Jeff, Just a quick reminder that yesterday was the day in 1621 that Galileo announced his invention of the telescope - what a device that proved to be in terms of advancing our understanding of the universe. Don't suppose he realised just how much trouble he was about to get into with theChurch! I guess you've got one at home Jeff, mine has come in very useful over the years to help children and grandchildren with understanding and homework. I've started to kindle an interest in Freddie the great grandson now, he looked at the moon a couple of evenings ago but of course at three and a half he struggled to understand where the other half had gone! Kind regards, Jock. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peach james Posted December 4, 2014 Share Posted December 4, 2014 ...It is Cheese (Caerphilly)... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBrjdQIH8uw Let Freddie know, that's where it went, someone ate the moon ! James 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 4, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 4, 2014 Of course it's cheese! That was one of the main conclusions of the Apollo missions: "The structure and consistency of the lunar surface suggests a hybrid cheddar/stilton/caerphilly arrangement. The orange soil discovered by Apollo 16 only serves to reinforce this!" Yes, the telescope is one of the things to be rediscovered when I manage to clear out - reorganise - the bunker. As for understanding where the other half of the moon went. Well, many adults don't understand what they're seeing! Jeff 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 4, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 4, 2014 Update on (potential) KL2 start. I was supposed to have my summerhouse and tool shed fitted today. The tool shed is now in place and looks the business. The installation team pointed out various "faults" on the summerhouse and recommended I get a replacement sent out. This has been organised for the 23rd December. Sorting out boxes/crates of tools for the shed can start this weekend. The bulky stuff will have to wait. So I think we can now say that any kind of start on converting the garage is going to be in early January, 2015. Unfortunate, but that's the way it goes! Jeff 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
emt_911 Posted December 4, 2014 Share Posted December 4, 2014 So which company do we complain to for delaying the start of KL2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 4, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 4, 2014 So which company do we complain to for delaying the start of KL2 Bodgit Acme PLC!! I'll still be in the garage at the weekend sorting tools out - looking forward to it! Jeff 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted December 4, 2014 Share Posted December 4, 2014 Bodgit Acme PLC!! I'll still be in the garage at the weekend sorting tools out - looking forward to it! Jeff Don't blame me Boss, I've managed to DROP the Bodgit tag now that I'm building Points. Good luck with the Bunker mate. I need you and JT down soon. hahha Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted December 4, 2014 Share Posted December 4, 2014 Hi Jeff, Looking at Andy's last post, we will all have to think of a new name for Bodgit, it certainly no longer applies! As for telescopes, I had one given to me by my late best mate's wife and I can see NOTHING out of it because I don't have the slightest idea how it works, sad really in both respects. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 4, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 4, 2014 Don't blame me Boss, I've managed to DROP the Bodgit tag now that I'm building Points. Good luck with the Bunker mate. I need you and JT down soon. hahha Evening Andy. Tomorrow will be the swansong for garden work in 2014. I've one bag of cement left, enough for a bit of mortar for bricks and some concrete. Once used, no more until 2015. That'll free me to start sorting stuff in the garage. Brother is keen to lead the way and he's a better "sorter-outer" than me. At least we can get some stuff into the tool shed. You are doing a great job with Bitton. It's good as you and the Lunesters are inspiring me/keeping my interest levels up. Jeff 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 4, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 4, 2014 Hi Jeff, Looking at Andy's last post, we will all have to think of a new name for Bodgit, it certainly no longer applies! As for telescopes, I had one given to me by my late best mate's wife and I can see NOTHING out of it because I don't have the slightest idea how it works, sad really in both respects. Mike, a poor telescope - mount, not just optics, is a nightmare that can put people off for life. A well-made telescope is a pleasure to behold. And I'm not just saying that because I'm a bloke!! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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