Whacky Signs.

[The Johnster]

24 minutes ago, MartinRS said:

When the sign was changed to Welsh did the locals celebrate with a bottle of Felinfoel?

Welsh Brewers more likely in the Gent Valleys; Feeling Foul is more a Llanelli thing. 

[Steamport Southport]

Llanelly!

 

 

Edited February 7 by Steamport Southport

[Hroth]

54 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

Llanelly!

 

 

 

Its the men off the telly!

 

(Don't know why I said that, but it feels good)

[Michael Hodgson]

Rhymes with Kidwelly  🙃

[The Johnster]

🎵Oh I….

 

’ad a cousin Rupert

he played outside-half for Newport

in the game against Llanelli

someone kicked him in the belli

 

did you ever saw, did you…🎵

Edited February 8 by The Johnster

[DavidB-AU]

19 hours ago, The Johnster said:

This earworm of which you speak, does it go:-

 

diddly dum diddly dum

                                      diddly dum diddly dum

diddly dum diddly dum

                                      diddlydum diddly dum

wooooooooooooo

                                oooooooooooo

diddly dum diddly dum

wooooooooooooo

                                 oooooooooooo…

        

 

Right, you asked for it.

 

What does the fox say?

[Hroth]

21 hours ago, DavidB-AU said:

 

Right, you asked for it.

 

What does the fox say?

 

Generally, they bark, whine, growl, and howl.

When they're feeling their oats, they scream.

 

Good, eh?

 

Paul Gambaccini doesn't like them screaming...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68244820

 

Edited February 8 by Hroth
Extra!

[Welchester]

8 hours ago, The Johnster said:

’ad a cousin Rupert

he played outside-half for Newport

 

i'd forgotten that Newport rhymes with Rupert, but then it's over thirty years since I left mummersher and I've forgotten how to talk tidy.

 

[F-UnitMad]

6 hours ago, Welchester said:

 

i'd forgotten that Newport rhymes with Rupert, ....

 

That must heavily depend on your accent. They don't rhyme when I say them.

[The Johnster]

Gwent accent; Newport is spoken 'Newput', and Rupert is 'Ruput', perfect rhyme.  Roundabout is 'Rowndabut'

 

The tune is from the folk song 'Cosher Bailey', very much rooted in northern Gwent, which ridicules the infamous Blaenafon ironmaster Crawshay Bailey.  He was the archetypical Industrial Revolution evil boss, and aware enough of his workers' opinion of him to build the last fortified house in the UK in case he needed to defend himself against uprisings, which he sometimes did...  Even the Crawshays of Merthyr, related to him, though he was a bit extreme.  Not a nice man, perhaps the inspiration for 'captalism red in tooth and claw'.

 

🎶 'Cosher Bailey 'ad an engine

and 'is engine wouldn go

so 'e pulled it with a string

all the way to Nantyglo

did you ever saw

did you ever saw

did you ever saw

such a funny thing before'🎵

 

 

 

 

 

[Hroth]

40 minutes ago, The Johnster said:

Gwent accent; Newport is spoken 'Newput', and Rupert is 'Ruput', perfect rhyme.  Roundabout is 'Rowndabut'

 

The tune is from the folk song 'Cosher Bailey', very much rooted in northern Gwent, which ridicules the infamous Blaenafon ironmaster Crawshay Bailey.  He was the archetypical Industrial Revolution evil boss, and aware enough of his workers' opinion of him to build the last fortified house in the UK in case he needed to defend himself against uprisings, which he sometimes did...  Even the Crawshays of Merthyr, related to him, though he was a bit extreme.  Not a nice man, perhaps the inspiration for 'captalism red in tooth and claw'.

 

🎶 'Cosher Bailey 'ad an engine

and 'is engine wouldn go

so 'e pulled it with a string

all the way to Nantyglo

did you ever saw

did you ever saw

did you ever saw

such a funny thing before'🎵

 

 

 

 

 

 

I've never actually heard it, but I remember it being mentioned in Robert Graves "Goodbye to All That".

I think that Mr Graves didn't really understand what it was about...

 

 

[The Johnster]

It's one of those songs that have been bowdlerised into so many versions over nearly two centuries (and of course it may have existed in some unrecorded form before that, and 'Cosher Bailey' is itself not the original) that it is difficult to objectively isolate a definitive version. nor should one try IMHO, the thing is a living organism developing over time; verses concerning rugby such as the Newput/Rewput example have been added over the years, and 'oh I have a brother Mike and 'e rides a motor bike' can hardly be original.  My mum remembers this from her Valleys childhood in the 1920s.  The tune and 'did you ever saw' chorus are common to all, and it has spread throughout South Wales from it's Gwent Top homeland; there is even a 'St Fagan's Pullman' version which I wish I could remember all of.  Samples include:-

 

'As we pass by Canton shed

we see two Castles standing dead'

 

'As we pass by Leckwith Junction

the injector will not function

so I prime it with some water

and it then does what it oughter'

 

'Oh and then we get to Creigau

where I thought I saw a tiger

but I must have been mistaken

oh, whatever have I taken?'

 

and much more in similar vein...

[Dagworth]

2 hours ago, The Johnster said:

Gwent accent; Newport is spoken 'Newput', and Rupert is 'Ruput', perfect rhyme.  Roundabout is 'Rowndabut'

 

The tune is from the folk song 'Cosher Bailey', very much rooted in northern Gwent, which ridicules the infamous Blaenafon ironmaster Crawshay Bailey.  He was the archetypical Industrial Revolution evil boss, and aware enough of his workers' opinion of him to build the last fortified house in the UK in case he needed to defend himself against uprisings, which he sometimes did...  Even the Crawshays of Merthyr, related to him, though he was a bit extreme.  Not a nice man, perhaps the inspiration for 'captalism red in tooth and claw'.

 

🎶 'Cosher Bailey 'ad an engine

and 'is engine wouldn go

so 'e pulled it with a string

all the way to Nantyglo

did you ever saw

did you ever saw

did you ever saw

such a funny thing before'🎵

 

 

 

 

 

"Now on a hill in Brecon is Crawshay's ruined house
It blackens out the green of the valley
And on his battered grave is the epitaph they gave
It stands there, God forgive him!
Forgive him! Forgive him!
And all who rot in hell with him"

 

 

 

Andi

Edited February 8 by Dagworth

[Andy Kirkham]

2 hours ago, Hroth said:

 

I've never actually heard it, but I remember it being mentioned in Robert Graves "Goodbye to All That".

I think that Mr Graves didn't really understand what it was about...

 

 

Also quoted in a novel by Anthony Burgess. I think it was Any Old Iron.

[The Johnster]

I suspect the grave mentioned is that of the Cyfarthfa Ironmaster Richard Crawshay.  He was not quite cut from the same cloth as Cosher, who gave himself droit de seignneur on his workers' wives and daughters in exchange for employment and was more than happy to have anyone causing him problems quietly done away with and disposed of in the waste tip.  Richard Crawshay's house was Cyfarthfa Castle, more a luxury mansion than an actually defendable building, which is actually in Glamorgan by a few yards, the border being Cefn Coed bridge over the Taf Fawr on the Brecon Road just to the north of Cyfarthfa Castle's main entrance.  The workers' institute has a clock tower visible from the Castle, but has no clock on that side because they refused to give him the time of day...

 

There was a slum area owned by him and rented to the workers called 'China', roughly where the bus station is now.  It was situated between a churchyard and the river, and because there was no drainage, which as landowner he was responsible for providing, in heavy rain the churchyard would flood and the residents of China lived quite literally in the slurry of their own dead.  It was, as were other areas of the town, a breeding ground for Cholera and consumption was ever-present.  He threw a party at Cyfarthfa in 1829 which was reported as costing him £2,000, more than a million now, which would easily have provided proper drainage and sewerage systems for the entire town. 

 

Merthyr was by a considerable margin the largest town in Wales at that time, and growing rapidly, but had no mayor, council, constitution, by-laws, ordinances, or representation (the MP was either one of the Masters or in the Masters' pockets, and working men did not own property so could not vote anyway).  The ironmasters ran it in their own interests, not just the Crawshays but Lord Plymouth at Penydarren, Josiah Guest at Dowlais, and others.  Guest was a Quaker and something of a modifying influence on Crawshay's worst excesses, but by and large Crawshay, having the biggest ironworks and owning the most land, got his way.  There was no hospital, law and order were kept by the Masters' bully-boys, the Masters printed their own money to pay their workers, and of course it was only redeemable in their own shops.  These were always ready to hand out credit, resulting in half the workforce being in debt to the Masters; every aspect of their lives was controlled by these people.

 

Not surprising there were riots.

Edited February 9 by The Johnster

[Nick C]

6 hours ago, The Johnster said:

Merthyr was by a considerable margin the largest town in Wales at that time, and growing rapidly, but had no mayor, council, constitution, by-laws, ordinances, or representation (the MP was either one of the Masters or in the Masters' pockets, and working men did not own property so could not vote anyway).  The ironmasters ran it in their own interests, not just the Crawshays but Lord Plymouth at Penydarren, Josiah Guest at Dowlais, and others.  Guest was a Quaker and something of a modifying influence on Crawshay's worst excesses, but by and large Crawshay, having the biggest ironworks and owning the most land, got his way.  There was no hospital, law and order were kept by the Masters' bully-boys, the Masters printed their own money to pay their workers, and of course it was only redeemable in their own shops.  These were always ready to hand out credit, resulting in half the workforce being in debt to the Masters; every aspect of their lives was controlled by these people.

Basically slavery in all but name...

[steve1]

59 minutes ago, Nick C said:

Basically slavery in all but name...

 

And there are bosses/companies still who would introduce it again like a shot, given half a chance.

 

steve

[Ozexpatriate]

19 hours ago, steve1 said:

And there are bosses/companies still who would introduce it again like a shot, given half a chance.

Foxconn.

 

Manufacturer of Apple equipment in China.

[Hroth]

A fact you have to accept/ignore if you're an Apple user.

 

[Krusty]

1 hour ago, Hroth said:

A fact you have to accept/ignore if you're an Apple user.

 

Also if you use a Kindle, Nintendo console, Playstation, or Xbox. And some Dell computers. Plus plenty of others. They've also moved into electric cars. They're the largest electronic manufacturer on the planet and it's quite hard to be certain you're avoiding them.

[billbedford]

3 hours ago, Hroth said:

A fact you have to accept/ignore if you're an Apple user.

 

 

Or if you accept MSM propaganda without question. 

[62613]

On 09/02/2024 at 02:47, The Johnster said:

I suspect the grave mentioned is that of the Cyfarthfa Ironmaster Richard Crawshay.  He was not quite cut from the same cloth as Cosher, who gave himself droit de seignneur on his workers' wives and daughters in exchange for employment and was more than happy to have anyone causing him problems quietly done away with and disposed of in the waste tip.  Richard Crawshay's house was Cyfarthfa Castle, more a luxury mansion than an actually defendable building, which is actually in Glamorgan by a few yards, the border being Cefn Coed bridge over the Taf Fawr on the Brecon Road just to the north of Cyfarthfa Castle's main entrance.  The workers' institute has a clock tower visible from the Castle, but has no clock on that side because they refused to give him the time of day...

 

There was a slum area owned by him and rented to the workers called 'China', roughly where the bus station is now.  It was situated between a churchyard and the river, and because there was no drainage, which as landowner he was responsible for providing, in heavy rain the churchyard would flood and the residents of China lived quite literally in the slurry of their own dead.  It was, as were other areas of the town, a breeding ground for Cholera and consumption was ever-present.  He threw a party at Cyfarthfa in 1829 which was reported as costing him £2,000, more than a million now, which would easily have provided proper drainage and sewerage systems for the entire town. 

 

Merthyr was by a considerable margin the largest town in Wales at that time, and growing rapidly, but had no mayor, council, constitution, by-laws, ordinances, or representation (the MP was either one of the Masters or in the Masters' pockets, and working men did not own property so could not vote anyway).  The ironmasters ran it in their own interests, not just the Crawshays but Lord Plymouth at Penydarren, Josiah Guest at Dowlais, and others.  Guest was a Quaker and something of a modifying influence on Crawshay's worst excesses, but by and large Crawshay, having the biggest ironworks and owning the most land, got his way.  There was no hospital, law and order were kept by the Masters' bully-boys, the Masters printed their own money to pay their workers, and of course it was only redeemable in their own shops.  These were always ready to hand out credit, resulting in half the workforce being in debt to the Masters; every aspect of their lives was controlled by these people.

 

Not surprising there were riots.

Years ago, I read a book called The Fire People by Alexander Cordell, about those working for Crawshay and Guest, and ending, IIRC with the hanging of the leader of an uprising; and another by him which ended with the Newport Rising.

[Dagworth]

36 minutes ago, 62613 said:

Years ago, I read a book called The Fire People by Alexander Cordell, about those working for Crawshay and Guest, and ending, IIRC with the hanging of the leader of an uprising; and another by him which ended with the Newport Rising.

The Rape Of the Fair Country set.

 

Andi

[The Johnster]

'The Fire People' features several real life characters, including the ironmasters of course, but Dic Penderyn, the worker's leader hanged for stabbing a soldier, Private Donald Black, was also a real person, as was Black.  The trial was pretty much a foregone conclusion, Penderyn was a dead man before he entered the dock, despite the soldier making a signed statement that the man who stabbed him was not Dic Penderyn; this statement was ignored by Cardiff Assize Court at the trial.  Evidence against Penderyn was taken from a Merthyr barber who had a score to settle with the accused; he apparently confessed to lying on his death-bed many years later in America.  Huge crowds turned out from all over South Wales for the hanging, in support of Penderyn, who is regarded as a working class hero in the area to this day.

 

For matters concerning Cosher Bailey, 'Rape of the Fair Country', set in Blaenafon and Nantyglo and also by Alexander Cordell, is more the thing.  The 'Rape' series charts the story of several generations of the ficticious working-class Mortimer family, and the later books are tbh not as good or as well-researched as the earlier ones.  'The Fire People' is a standalone story set against the backdrop of the Merthyr uprising, during which the red flag of Socialism was first raised (on Hirwaun Common, a sheet soaked in the blood of a slaughtered sheep).

 

Bara neu Waed!

Edited February 10 by The Johnster

[kevinlms]