HSE jobsworths

[DavidH]

I still got texts from a Claims Management Company asking why I hadn't tried to claim upto £3000 for injuries.

 

Did the texts mention that accident specifically? Periodically I get texts asking why I haven't tried to claim up to - and I think it's also £3000, which is why I ask - for "injuries". Touch wood, I haven't even been involved in a car accident, so this makes me wonder if these are random texts and they just got lucky with you!

[Chameleon]

I get the odd text like that on my works mobile. Apparently the phone company sells corporate numbers to the vulture lawyer/fishing companies for a tidy profit. Presumably they cant do thus for private numbers.

 

Also the whole Elf n safety ethos has been overtaken by jobsworths thinking "how might we get sued? This could cost us MONEY!" this is why we end up with so many stupid rules, mostly originating from the US (feeding frenzy for lawyers) where councils are companies are really just trying to save money. The flip side if course, is people who will sue at the drop of a hat, especially if said hat lands on their foot, urged on by VultureLawyers 4U. So both can be as bad as each other.

The feeling seems to be that everyone is worried over accidents, even if they are cused by the I dividual, as you can be sued for ALPOWING the stupid to hurt themselves.

 

You can't win.

[Guest Max Stafford]

<< Speed Updates >

 

I've often suspected from the thinking exhibited by large swathes of management that they are under the influence of some substance...

 

Redgate, I agree entirely with your comments. Things that should be focussed primarily on improving safety and quality of working environments are being subverted into a tool of oppression in many cases.

 

On so many levels, the West is now morphing into a perverted caricature of the old East.

 

To think my old man, God rest his soul, gave up two years of his youth to protect his country on active service overseas from this kind of abomination. In a way I'm relieved he's not around to see what's going on now, hiding in plain sight of the masses!

 

Dave.

[Rugd1022]

As far as high vis clothing in a rail environment is concerned it has led to a sense of false security among some people and my training mantra for many years has been that the main thing a high-vis vest does is help the Driver of a train see you before his train hits you - with the potential advantage that he might have time to sound a warning.

 

 

This is becoming more of a problem these days Mike, more so when I encounter large groups of P/Way or S&T staff lineside, despite having plenty of lookouts there are still a few in each group who leave it till the last minute to move to a position of safety.

 

On the other hand, I came upon two S&T chaps near Heyford last night who must have thought that 'the other guy' had acknowledged my warning horn so neither of them moved aside until the near enough last minute. To be fair to them both though, that particular area (south of Heyford station on the Up road climbing Tackley Bank) is very remote and damn near pitch black at 2am, save for my headlights and their tiny helmet lamps, and stepping down off the shoulder of the ballast can be a very tricky move when all you can see in front of you is blackness. A habit I've picked up, particularly when driving at night is to look out for Network Rail vans parked up in the cess with nobody onboard, a sure sign there are men about lineside somewhere nearby.

 

A certain amount of complacency is definitely creeping in I'm afraid.

 

[The Stationmaster]

This is becoming more of a problem these days Mike, more so when I encounter large groups of P/Way or S&T staff lineside, despite having plenty of lookouts there are still a few in each group who leave it till the last minute to move to a position of safety.

 

On the other hand, I came upon two S&T chaps near Heyford last night who must have thought that 'the other guy' had acknowledged my warning horn so neither of them moved aside until the near enough last minute. To be fair to them both though, that particular area (south of Heyford station on the Up road climbing Tackley Bank) is very remote and damn near pitch black at 2am, save for my headlights and their tiny helmet lamps, and stepping down off the shoulder of the ballast can be a very tricky move when all you can see in front of you is blackness. A habit I've picked up, particularly when driving at night is to look out for Network Rail vans parked up in the cess with nobody onboard, a sure sign there are men about lineside somewhere nearby.

 

A certain amount of complacency is definitely creeping in I'm afraid.

 

 

I think - from what I occasionally see and from what I hear from a contact 'in official circles' - that you are spot on with those observation Nidge. Alas the whole 'safety culture' on NR seems to have become very system oriented with far less emphasis on personal responsibility for one's own safety and as a result of it getting over-complicated a lot of the folk at the sharp end of carrying out on-track tasks have the impression that they are surrounded by some sort of force field; with the worst ones thinking the whole business is nothing to do with them anyway because 'someone' is looking after their safety.

 

It's quite interesting writing safety Rules and procedures for independent railways - where many of the risks are no different although train speeds are obviously much lower - to find the extent to which the RSSB Rule Book can be simplified and made far more understandable for everyone instead of a few 'experts' and form-fillers. Would that NR could get hold of that idea but somehow I can't see it happening soon.

[Guest Max Stafford]

" Alas the whole 'safety culture' on NR seems to have become very system oriented with far less emphasis on personal responsibility for one's own safety and as a result of it getting over-complicated a lot of the folk at the sharp end of carrying out on-track tasks have the impression that they are surrounded by some sort of force field; with the worst ones thinking the whole business is nothing to do with them anyway because 'someone' is looking after their safety."

 

It really does puzzle me this mindset, Mike. Under normal circumstances I wouldn't be permitted on or near the line without the presence at least of a MOM, but even with this, I'm still constantly listening, looking up, back and whatever along with looking out for the nearest position of safety!

 

Perhaps I just have an enhanced sense of vulnerability, but I really can't comprehend how somebody could think any other way in a dangerous environment. It's not only for myself, but I wouldn't want a driver having my demise on his conscience or my colleagues having the task of scraping me up afterwards - not to mention all the paperwork!

 

Dave.

[The Stationmaster]

" Alas the whole 'safety culture' on NR seems to have become very system oriented with far less emphasis on personal responsibility for one's own safety and as a result of it getting over-complicated a lot of the folk at the sharp end of carrying out on-track tasks have the impression that they are surrounded by some sort of force field; with the worst ones thinking the whole business is nothing to do with them anyway because 'someone' is looking after their safety."

 

It really does puzzle me this mindset, Mike. Under normal circumstances I wouldn't be permitted on or near the line without the presence at least of a MOM, but even with this, I'm still constantly listening, looking up, back and whatever along with looking out for the nearest position of safety!

 

Perhaps I just have an enhanced sense of vulnerability, but I really can't comprehend how somebody could think any other way in a dangerous environment. It's not only for myself, but I wouldn't want a driver having my demise on his conscience or my colleagues having the task of scraping me up afterwards - not to mention all the paperwork!

 

Dave.

 

I suspect the difference Dave is that you have a 'railway mindset' and grew up in circumstances where it was natural to acquire that mindset and exercise it; I spent more years than I sometimes care to remember in various lineside situations and think in exactly the same way plus - I hope - retaining a very healthy respect for the stuff moving on rails. But there are, I regret to reassure you, plenty of instances where contractors in particular have none of that attitude and some of the more recent employed staff are possibly in the same mindset judging by some of the things I hear from a variety of sources.

[leopardml2341]

With Hi-Viz clothing getting everywhere, soon the only noticeable ones will be those in normal clothing.

 

A sort of dark area in a huge pool of dayglow !

[Baby Deltic]

Then there is the straight out stupidity cases. In Australia there has been some cases where people have been sacked instantly for 'Planking'. It includes some in major supermarket chains & subsideries, where they have been photographed on top of shelving units & the like. Also big mining companies where the employees are on very large contracts.

At least one manager was sacked for instead of discouraging planking, merely took photos of the others. Some were just on the lunch room table, but rightly so, the rule has to be consistently applied.

 

Kevin Martin

 

 

This 'planking' buisness is an old fad anyway. In Victorian times, makers of felt hats were famous for it, and even had a 'planking kettle'.

[62613]

I've been at sea since 1974 and I've never seen an open front switchboard, I thought they were illegal even then. I have to admit we still don't normally wear safety hats in the engine room unless we have people working overhead [generally in drydock]. I've banged my head more often wearing one than not, they make you just a little taller so you hit the pipes you normally miss! [i've always worn safety shoes, hearing protection and proper boiler suits though. ]

 

Jeremy

 

Well, in November 1974 I flew out to Japan to join m.v.'British Gull' at some place near Kobe. She was built in 1959, and still exhibited engine room arrangements that were going out of fashion 10 years before; exhaust piston Harland & Wolff engine (gorgeous!) two scotch marine boilers fed by a Weir's up and down feed pump ( which you had to keep a close eye on!) ring main cargo system, with reciprocating pumps, and two 5-cylinder Ruston diesel gennys, which supplied electricity at 110V d.c via an open front switchboard. She survived, in Brunei Bay until at least 1980.

[coachmann]

... still got texts from a Claims Management Company asking why I hadn't tried to claim upto £3000 for injuries.

I got a phonecall from an Indian only this morning asking if I had had a road accident in the past three years. When I replied no, it sounded like he said..."It must be someone in your family because we get information from the National Justice System.........".

[The Stationmaster]

I got a phonecall from an Indian only this morning asking if I had had a road accident in the past three years. When I replied no, it sounded like he said..."It must be someone in your family because we get information from the National Justice System.........".

 

That sounds like the bloke who rang me recently - and came up with my father's name when asked for details. Seems the 'National Justice System' works very slowly or also includes cemetery records. (I can have quite a bit of fun with these idiots by asking for the full name as my father lived at this address and both my son and I are here now so I always ask for a name and the dumbos invariably pick the wrong one, just about the only bright spot in their moronic persistence in ringing my 'phone number).

[chris p bacon]

Well, in November 1974 I flew out to Japan to join m.v.'British Gull' at some place near Kobe. She was built in 1959, and still exhibited engine room arrangements that were going out of fashion 10 years before; exhaust piston Harland & Wolff engine (gorgeous!) two scotch marine boilers fed by a Weir's up and down feed pump ( which you had to keep a close eye on!) ring main cargo system, with reciprocating pumps, and two 5-cylinder Ruston diesel gennys, which supplied electricity at 110V d.c via an open front switchboard. She survived, in Brunei Bay until at least 1980.

 

I remember Father in those pristine white boiler suits, attached pic does not have an open switchboard but I did wonder if the ventilation cover ever took someones head off, I'm sure this is a T2 possibly Red Bank or Smoky Hill.

 

I also remember walking around Nagasaki Shipyard in the mid 70's without a problem and without hi vis (but with hard hat & boots) but you had safe walking routes, I was 14/15 years old

. As well as B Gull, everything being built in Nagasaki at that time (B Ranger, reliance, resource, resolution etc)went to Brunei Bay as well for lay up, I think some were there for about 6-7 years.

[kevinlms]

I got a phonecall from an Indian only this morning asking if I had had a road accident in the past three years. When I replied no, it sounded like he said..."It must be someone in your family because we get information from the National Justice System.........".

 

So, they're moving away from the 'your computer has been detected as having a virus' type call then?

 

Kevin Martin

[kevinlms]

Unfortunately not quite so harmless for this stupid boy.

 

Or this one in Australia.

 

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/national/planking-death-man-plunges-from-balcony-20110515-1entn.html

 

7th floor fall.

 

 

Kevin Martin

[Horsetan]

Or this one in Australia.

 

http://www.brisbanet...0515-1entn.html

 

7th floor fall.

 

I'm surprised that this is having a bit of a resurgence. "Planking" was originally something of a craze a couple of years ago here, when it was prosaically called "The Lying Down Game". There were photos of people lying face down across ticket barriers on the London Underground, for example.

 

Still, the Aussie eejit could still be said to be lying down.....six foot under.

[John_Hughes]

The Daily Mail had this gem yesterday. I presume there must be more to it than they say - there always is - but do have a smile anyway!

[Xerces Fobe2]

The Daily Mail had this gem yesterday. I presume there must be more to it than they say - there always is - but do have a smile anyway!

 

HSE buzz words - banned, you can't, not allowed, it might , it is possible that all negative :nono: - sorry I can't say that

 

Xerces Fobe

[coachmann]

Funny thing is we have had all this before under a different guise......Trades Unions rules....you cant do that......... you cant do this...... demarcation lines........ .if you touch that there will be a walk out....... .work to rule...... .the lads wont be happy..... .them & us..... .union meeting..... down tools...... strike.....

[John M Upton]

Wrong colour bog roll in the toilet EVERYBODY OUT!!!

 

For me, H&S writ mad was at Arundel Station the other day when I arrived with my London bound train to see a group of about thirty six to seven year olds in a school party all in railway style orange hi-vis vests.

 

I was almost tempted to ask them to see their PTS licences, either that or Network Rail are recruiting track workers awfully young these days... Thing is when I was at Primary School way back in the early 1980's I would have loved to have had a hi-vis vest as part of my uniform but would have insisted to my headmaster that he have a BR double arrow printed on the back, he probably would have agreed too!!

[Fat Controller]

Wrong colour bog roll in the toilet EVERYBODY OUT!!!

 

For me, H&S writ mad was at Arundel Station the other day when I arrived with my London bound train to see a group of about thirty six to seven year olds in a school party all in railway style orange hi-vis vests.

 

I was almost tempted to ask them to see their PTS licences, either that or Network Rail are recruiting track workers awfully young these days... Thing is when I was at Primary School way back in the early 1980's I would have loved to have had a hi-vis vest as part of my uniform but would have insisted to my headmaster that he have a BR double arrow printed on the back, he probably would have agreed too!!

Nothing to do with them travelling by train- simply makes it easier to find. They have 'walking bus' groups around here who all wear them when walking to school. Though it looks a bit bizarre, I'd rather that than the approach used by some local cyclists, who think that lights and a hi-vi are wimpish- I've had one or two close calls when driving home after nights during autumn/winter.

[shortliner]

Yesterday in Inverness, we saw 3 teachers/TAs with about a dozen 3-4 year old kindergarten kiddies toddling along the pavement in Hi-Vis hooded waterproof suits - my wife remarked that it must have been fun getting them dressed for their route-march in the rain

[petethemole]

I found out a few weeks ago that although the kids in these situations are fine in plain yellow (or whatever) hi-vis, the teachers/ helpers /parents escorting them are legally "working on the highway" and should wear highways grade hi-vis with reflective stripes. Now that may seem like overkill, which I think was the context of the article I saw, but think for a moment; how far away can you see a non-reflective high-vis at dusk or night=time, compared with reflective? I know which I'd rather have.

Pete

[DavidH]

Now, that all strikes me as very sensible. I'd far rather be visible doing a job like that than potentially invisible and solely relying on drivers' alertness. Not all safety measures are uncalled-for.