Northpoint Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 A question which I feel is more appropriate here than in the DCC section as it is specific to this model. Β I have the SP version from the first production run with (I believe) the MRC sound system. Β I have great trouble getting it to work properly, even the basic making it move and sound come out of the speakers! Β In the instructions, it says press any function key twice which I have done but it still does not respond. Β Can anybody provide any advice? Has anybody experienced the same problems? Β I have e-mailed Athearn but to no avail... Β Thanks in advance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_long Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 Don't know if Athearn will give you much of a reply Nick. They've put Tsunami's in their latest MP15ACs and they are good well atleast the one I have is. Best runner I've got. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Gwinnett Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 What DCC system are you using Nick? The MRC decoders are notoriously unreliable, especially with (I believe) Lenz equipment. I never tried them with my Lokmaus (Lenz in all but name) but didn't have problems with the Dynamis. Still, I've sold all my MRC equipped locos on - the Tsunami equipped ones are much better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northpoint Posted June 25, 2011 Author Share Posted June 25, 2011 Guess what, Jon - Lenz!!!!!!!!!!! Β So, is there no hope? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prof Klyzlr Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Guess what, Jon - Lenz!!!!!!!!!!! Β So, is there no hope? Β Β Dear Nick, Β There is rarely _No_ hope, just a letting go of the problem before it's fully chased down... Β Do you have access to _any_ other DCC systems in your area? Even a single length of flextrack and some other manf's DCC rig should give you a go/no-go test. (if the loco works as intended, then the loco is not _all_ bad, just "picky" or "finicky") Β Taken even more basically, does it run as expected on a regular analog DC throttle? (If Yes, there is still _some_ hope,...) Β Assuming we discover that it works OK on "something other than lenz", what to do? Β Option 1- replace the Lenz system with "something else" (I understand this is a big change/decision, I'm just looking at all of the logical options...) Β Option 2- replace the decoder in the loco with "something else" (replacing the MRC decoder with a Tsunami 828048TSU-AT1000 EMD 645 (Non-Turbocharged) may be a do-able thing, esp if all we need to swap is the decoder, and can simply re-wire into the existing speaker installation) Β Option 3- sell the MP15AC, and replace with something "more appropriate" Β Happy Modelling, Aim to Improve, Prof Klyzlr Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northpoint Posted June 26, 2011 Author Share Posted June 26, 2011 Thanks, Prof. I'll investigate the DCC options possibly at the members day in Stafford this coming Saturday. I'm sure there will be somebody there with a different system. I wasn't aware that this decoder had a particular dislike to Lenz - I had heard that it was not very good at all, no matter what the system. Β However, the replacement decoder option is a possibility, cheaper than replacing the whole system. I certainly can't afford that! The Lenz system doesn't give me any problems with any of my other locos, US, UK or European. Β As for selling the loco - would anybody want to buy it given its reputation? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_long Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Nick, I've got a full roco multimaus and a dynamis system if you want try them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prof Klyzlr Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 As for selling the loco - would anybody want to buy it given its reputation? Β Β Dear Nick, Β For those of us who aren't DCC users, it may well find a new home... Β Hope you can find a suitable DCC rig or replacement decoder! Β Happy Modelling, Aim to Improve, Prof Klyzlr Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Williams Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Nick, I have an NCE Powercab and a small portable 3ft. programming track set-up. Hope to be at Stafford. Could easily bring it along if of any use. Β Regards Β Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northpoint Posted June 26, 2011 Author Share Posted June 26, 2011 Nick, I have an NCE Powercab and a small portable 3ft. programming track set-up. Hope to be at Stafford. Could easily bring it along if of any use. Β Regards Β Steve Β Steve - that would be good. Look forward to giving it a try on a different system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Williams Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Steve - that would be good. Look forward to giving it a try on a different system. Β Right you are. Β Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Nick, our group had the same issues with MRC sound fitted loco's - our solution was to replace the decoders unfortunately (and to not buy anything else with MRC on it!) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northpoint Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 I had a reply from Athearn - they asked if I was using DCC or DC - I'd already told them in the first e-mail - DOH!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Accurascale Fran Posted June 27, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 27, 2011 My MRC fitted FP45 worked fine on a lenz system but hates the Hornby Elite, so cross that off your testing list too. It's also the loudest sound loco I've ever heard. I am in 2 minds about replacing it with a tsunami. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northpoint Posted June 30, 2011 Author Share Posted June 30, 2011 Athearn sent another e-mail asking if it works on DC. I have tested it and, yes, it does... Β They're now suggesting a DC reset, so watch this space... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigZ Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 My idea of an MRC/Athearn sound decoder 'reset' involves a ball peen hammer and a blacksmith's anvil...and a Tsunami or QSI replacement! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prof Klyzlr Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 My idea of an MRC/Athearn sound decoder 'reset' involves a ball peen hammer and a blacksmith's anvil...and a Tsunami or QSI replacement! Β Dear Craig, Β As in my "Real Life" workday... Β "...troubleshooting does not mean taking a shotgun to the piece of equipment that's not operating as expected..." Β Happy Modelling, Aim to Improve, Prof Klyzlr Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northpoint Posted July 1, 2011 Author Share Posted July 1, 2011 My idea of an MRC/Athearn sound decoder 'reset' involves a ball peen hammer and a blacksmith's anvil...and a Tsunami or QSI replacement! Β We're coming close to that, Craig - probably the latter, not the former! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northpoint Posted July 1, 2011 Author Share Posted July 1, 2011 We're making some progress. I have done the DC reset as advised by Athearn and we now have a situation where it sits on the track under DCC power and the sound is fine, the functions (horn, bell, etc) work, but... Β ....it won't bl**dy well move! Β So, is it really progress...? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Williams Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 I reckon it's just attention seeking Nick. B) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prof Klyzlr Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 We're making some progress. I have done the DC reset as advised by Athearn and we now have a situation where it sits on the track under DCC power and the sound is fine, the functions (horn, bell, etc) work, but... Β ....it won't bl**dy well move! Β So, is it really progress...? Β Β Dear Nick, Β Given that you started with _no_ response from the loco, I'd say yes it is "progress". Β What this imporvement tells you is - the decoder's INPUT stage is OK - it can detect a command on a given address - it can read the Funtion and speed commands to that address - and it can respond to them audibly (the audio circuit side appears OK, as does _much_ of the control side) Β The bit that's missing is the commention between the "commands that tell it to move", (those same commands also tell the decoder what "engine sound" to play, so if you can "rev the engine" using the throttle, then the decoder is _recieving_ and _acting_upon_ those commands), Β and the actual "throttle circuit' bit that creates the voltage/"signal" which is fed to the motor. Β There are _some_ fault conditions which can create just this set of symtoms (everything works except drive to the motor/wheels) Β In no particular order of preference Β - Function/CV set which dis-ables motor drive, such as "display mode" or "shutdown/startup" sequence on BLI locos. (could be known firmware bug, could be simple CV setting. Now that you can actually talk to the decoder via DCC, suggest perform a "factory reset") Β - physical wiring connection between decoder and motor open-circuit (seems unlikely, as, without removing the decoder, it still works on DC. Under DC control, the signal still has to pass thru the decoder, using the same Decoder--> motor feeds in question) Β - bad motor (again, seems unlikely based on successful analog DC test) Β - blown/open-circuit "motor drive"/"output stage" circuitry within the decoder itself (possible, but not really user-tracable except in cases of extreme subject knowledge and electronic skills. "open-circuit" can be caused by a decoder manufacturing fault or QA failure, but hard to empirically pin-down. If every other option eliminated, this could be the culprit. Return to base for repair). Β Good Hunting! Β Happy Modelling, Aim to Improve, Prof Klyzlr Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northpoint Posted July 2, 2011 Author Share Posted July 2, 2011 Nick, I have an NCE Powercab and a small portable 3ft. programming track set-up. Hope to be at Stafford. Could easily bring it along if of any use. Β Regards Β Steve Β Steve did bring his test track to the members day today but we didn't use it - guess why? - the loco performed perfectly on my Tremore layout! Β I haven't had a chance to run it since I got home, so, fingers crossed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Grant 4472 Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 I got an undec Athearn MP15-AC with sound a couple of years ago at the NCAM swapmeet in Harrogate. The MRC sound decoder worked fine for half an hour, then packed up altogether, after the loco had been idling on the track for a few minutes. Β No amount of resetting and pressing function keys would fix it, so I stripped it out and replaced it with a Tsunami. I didn't bother trying to send it back for repair/replacement, cos they would have just sent another MRC decoder, and 'me no lykie' MRC Β Works fine now, although the electrical pickups and wheels have to be kept meticulously clean to avoid stuttering. The Atlas MP15 is an altogether better switching beast, despite the speaker sounding a bit crap. Β Jon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northpoint Posted July 4, 2011 Author Share Posted July 4, 2011 I agree with you, Jon about the Atlas one being better - I have several! But I particularly wanted the AC version hence my purchase. Β I have now tried it on my home layout, and it finally works! One thing I have noticed is a very long delay in starting, so whether thta was always there and I just didn't give it ling enough! Β However, I might well fit it with another decoder - I wonder if the Atlas MP15DC QSI decoder will fit?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 No amount of resetting and pressing function keys would fix it, so I stripped it out and replaced it with a Tsunami. I didn't bother trying to send it back for repair/replacement, cos they would have just sent another MRC decoder, and 'me no lykie' MRC Β Β We did try that route (with a Challenger IIRC) and it came back saying it was tested (presumably on an MRC system!) but they could find no fault - it still didn't work on Lenz though... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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