Controller/motor conflicts - has anyone a definitive list?

[john new]

As a hobby returner in my late 50s I'm confused by the comments read in magazines etc about some controllers and some motors being incompatible mixes. This is compounded by the fact that unusually I'm also a convert back to two-rail after running my old HD 3-rail layout on the exhibition circuit for about 10 years through the 1990s before taking the break from building/running anything. It was easy when all you needed to do was get an H&M controller and it was Ok with the then standard open frame motors.

 

Firstly the query I have relates solely to analogue DC.

 

Currently my main controller is a 4-way Gaugemaster Series Q and I have some other Gaugemaster's in storage. I have a variety of N gauge locos for conversion to 09. However I have no idea if the Gaugemasters I own are/aren't feedback types and until I take the bodies off no idea either whether any of the motors are/aren't coreless and with the last lot of 4mm 2-rail Bachmann locos I bought there was very little way of telling anyway what the motor was as it is pretty much hidden in the chassis block. Also Ringfields were all the rage for a while and now seem to get a generally bad press. All very confusing.

 

So is there a website anywhere that acts as guide for electronics newbies as to what works with what and even more importantly what wrecks what - for example is it a myth that a RELCO will blow a motor, and if yes they do is it only Portescap's? (NB I no longer use a RELCO but have in the past)

 

Several earlier threads in this section cover parts of the topic but none are a comprehensive guide to the current state of the hobby with regard to mixing and matching controllers and modern motors.

[cupoftea]

Yep - this does get confusing and I cannot really offer any advice as such.

 

I am using a Morely Vesta N gauge controller on a small shunting OO gauge layout and have not experienced any problems either with locos or the controller getting hot as yet. My locos are Hornby 0-4-0 chassis based so only have a cheap can motor. Long term I will be going DCC at some point and so do not want to get another DC controller as an interim measure.

 

From what i can gather from my very limited understanding it is the wave form that matters with the more sophisticated motors.

 

It would be great to have a definitive list to refer to.

[edcayton]

This isn't by any means comprehensive, but I was talking to Dapol Dave at the RMWeb members day about the forthcoming class 22. I let slip that my H & M Duet must be 40 years old and he said that I must not use it with their products. My most recent loco is my Heljan class 15 and it runs beautifly. I have avoided dcc fitted stuff although the concensus seems to be that they work OK on dc.

 

Ed

[Gordon H]

This isn't by any means comprehensive, but I was talking to Dapol Dave at the RMWeb members day about the forthcoming class 22. I let slip that my H & M Duet must be 40 years old and he said that I must not use it with their products.

Was any reason given for this?

[hollywoodfoundry]

Generally speaking, very few off-the-shelf or RTR models available these days use coreless motors, so you are pretty safe in that regard. However older style controllers that simply used wire-wound reheostats for control are not good for most of today's models. And it is not that they will damage the models, simply that they were designed for motors that consumed around 1 to 2 amps, whereas modern motors are often less that half an ampere. Consequently, the older style controllers start with quite high voltage and the models jump unrealistically into motion.

 

Oddly though, I cannot see any reason why Dapol Dave would issue such a sharp caution as that, because whether he uses coreless motors or not in his models, a H&M Duet is not going to do any damage to the models.

 

The simple answer is that an older controller may no longer be the best tool for the job, but it should not do any harm to modern locomotives.

[corax67]

To distinguish between feedback & non-feedback Gaugemaster controllers the company designed them with different colour faceplates. The beige fronted units are non-feedback whilst the maroon (or black) fronted units are feedback types.

 

As Geoff says, whilst old controllers may not be the best tool they are still a useable tool - although I am a DCC user I often work on DC loco's for people and use a 10 year old Gaugemaster handheld for this purpose which has never caused a problem on old, new, N, OO or other items. I do always check for Portescap motors before adding power but have found these tend only to reside in kit-builds.

 

As far as ringfields are concerned, the negative comments are usually centred around perfermance - or lack of - rather than any tendancies to react badly to certain controllers.

 

 

I cannot comment on the Relco unit as I have never used one & on DCC I never will since they are not compatible.

[john new]

To distinguish between feedback & non-feedback Gaugemaster controllers the company designed them with different colour faceplates. The beige fronted units are non-feedback whilst the maroon (or black) fronted units are feedback types

 

Interesting observations all. Thanks for the tip about beige front Gaugemaster's Karl; all mine are beige front so that is one big query resolved.