jwealleans Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 (edited) I know we all like this kind of thing, so here are some shots of rolling stock I wasn't sure about at Beamish yesterday. This looks to me like a G1 NER van with the outside framing boarded over? No makers plate in sight. This looks like a G2 with detail differences and in an unusual livery. On the other hand I have no idea whatsoever what these might be. Edited October 16, 2018 by jwealleans Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 Nothing similar in Tatlows or N.E record . Possibly a G2 as lots survived post war. No markings on any of the axleboxes ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted March 14, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 14, 2011 I'm not sure about the first one but the second van is LNWR. This like many other such vehicles lost their original identities whilst in military service. The two RNAD vans are ammunition vans specially built for the Royal Navy in 1913, these would have been 'internal user'. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyA Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 I am nervous about offering this information as a first post in the forum but here goes. I saw WD47877 when it was an exhibit at the Beverley Museum of Army Transport from where I took the following notes. “This van has always worked for the Army. Vans give protection from the weather and pilferage. Note the lower door which acts as a loading ramp. This box or closed van was used for the movement of small stores. Loading and unloading was facilitated by the use of the hinged bottom flap, which when lowered on to the platform, formed a bridge for the passage of sack barrows then used in freight handling. The wagon was constructed for the War Department in 1918 by Cravens Railway Carriage & Wagon Company Ltd of Sheffield. The wheels were made by Miller & Company of Edinburgh in 1917. This particular wagon arrived at the museum in February 1986 from the army depot at Bicester having been transferred from a depot at Didcot in 1956. Beyond this date the history is difficult to establish due to the renumbering of equipments that occurred in the mid 1950s.†Although I cannot confirm it from photos, I believe that the two RNAD vans are from the same museum. If so, they were described as follows. “...two very unusual small closed vans built in Rotherham in 1913 and used in Royal Naval Armaments Depot, Gosport, for the internal movement of small consignments of explosives within the Dockyard. They feature sliding, opening roof sections to allow loading by crane.†Tony 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted March 14, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 14, 2011 WD47877 is described on the Vintage Carriages Trust website as LNWR. It was usual for the military to use ex main line stock adapted for their own purposes. Here is the VCT entry. http://www.ws.vintag...fo.asp?Ref=6939 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 WD47877 is described on the Vintage Carriages Trust website as LNWR. It was usual for the military to use ex main line stock adapted for their own purposes. Here is the VCT entry. http://www.ws.vintag...fo.asp?Ref=6939 Sorry, but I believe Tony is correct. Yes it is a LNWR design, but these were built new for WD in c1917. Paul Bartlett Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyA Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 Paul, There is a photo by you of a similar van, WD47444, at Ludgershall in Vol. 16, No. 1 of the HMRS Journal. The caption refers to “the LNWR designed vans built for the WD in 1917-18â€. It also refers to further information in Vol. 14 No. 5 and Vol. 7 No. 5. However, I have not seen either of these issues so cannot comment further. Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
halfwit Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 Another photo of an Admiralty gunpowder van can be found in 'Industrial Wagons an introduction' (IRS). This one is in preservation at Shackerstone and came from the RNAD at Bedenham. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
multiprinter Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 I am nervous about offering this information as a first post in the forum but here goes. Tony An excellent informative first post. Welcome to RMweb! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyA Posted March 14, 2011 Share Posted March 14, 2011 Thanks for the encouragement. I have found my photos from Beverley and confirm that the RNAD wagons were from there. Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 Paul, There is a photo by you of a similar van, WD47444, at Ludgershall in Vol. 16, No. 1 of the HMRS Journal. The caption refers to “the LNWR designed vans built for the WD in 1917-18â€. It also refers to further information in Vol. 14 No. 5 and Vol. 7 No. 5. However, I have not seen either of these issues so cannot comment further. Tony Tony Thanks for the reminder. Vol 7 pt 5 is about LSWR banana vans sold to the WD in 1915 and bought back in 1921. Includes a nice drawing. Vol 14 in part 3 has a photograph of one of the LNWR design vans ex Gosport, followed by discussion in the letters pages in parts 4 and 5. Buffer guides and axleboxes distinguish whether diag 88 vans were originally LNWR or manufactured by Gloucester or other private companies for the WD. Paul Bartlett Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted March 16, 2011 Author Share Posted March 16, 2011 (edited) Thank you to everyone who responded. I was directed elsewhere to this document which is a Beamish stock list. That LNWR wagon looks a definite candidate for a slight bash - can you get the WD transfers anywhere? To wrap this up here are the last of my photos from the day The transship van usually lives in the goods shed, but (I assume) the Y7's in there at the moment. There was certainly a pile of coal outside as if they'd been coaling it off the goods dock. This flat has seen better days. Mrs. W was very taken with the crane as well. Edited October 16, 2018 by jwealleans 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted March 16, 2011 Share Posted March 16, 2011 Another photo of an Admiralty gunpowder van can be found in 'Industrial Wagons an introduction' (IRS). This one is in preservation at Shackerstone and came from the RNAD at Bedenham. Wasn't the RNAD at Gosport known as 'Bedenham'? I recollect that the working from Eastleigh along the remains of the Gosport branch used to be nicknamed 'The Bedenham Bomber' even into the latter days of Speedlink. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garethp8873 Posted March 27, 2011 Share Posted March 27, 2011 Another ex-RNAD Bedenham wagon that has been preserved is the B&MR Open Wagon 197 on the Severn Valley Railway. Garethp8873. DSCN5808 - B&M Open Wagon 197 by SVREnthusiast, on Flickr DSCN6852 - B&M Open Wagon 197 by SVREnthusiast, on Flickr Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
desbrine Posted October 22, 2021 Share Posted October 22, 2021 For the record, the two small RNAD vans from Gosport Nos 9 and 18 are now in North East Scotland. No 18 is at Maud Railway Museum and No 9 is at Peterhead Prison Museum. The connection is the ownership of the Admirlty which had a railway from the harbour and prison to a quarry at Stirlinghill. see friendsofmaud.org.uk Des 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold phil_sutters Posted October 22, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 22, 2021 1 hour ago, desbrine said: For the record, the two small RNAD vans from Gosport Nos 9 and 18 are now in North East Scotland. No 18 is at Maud Railway Museum and No 9 is at Peterhead Prison Museum. The connection is the ownership of the Admirlty which had a railway from the harbour and prison to a quarry at Stirlinghill. see friendsofmaud.org.uk Des To see more about the Peterhead Prison Railway and the restoration of some of its rolling stock, you can go to http://www.ipernity.com/doc/312383/album/959146 . ipernity is an independent photo-sharing site, owned by its members. There are a number of railway groups, with some excellent photographers in them. The member sharing these albums works for Stangate Restoration and Replicas and documents the work they do photographically. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold phil_sutters Posted October 22, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 22, 2021 On the subject of railway rolling stock in naval establishments these are snaps of ones seen in Portsmouth and Chatham Historic Dockyards within the past 20 years. There is quite a range of eras represented. Chatham had some useable track but the Portsmouth stock was parked on a short stretch of inset track, when these photos were taken. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted October 24, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 24, 2021 That outside-framed van painted black, No. 566, looks rather interesting. It has some features in common with LCDR and H&B covered goods wagons of the 1880s but others that are clearly not. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted October 24, 2021 Share Posted October 24, 2021 Considering its location, an LCDR influence is understandable ! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted October 24, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 24, 2021 I did the sensible thing and looked it up in the Railway Heritage Wagon Register: http://www.ws.rhrp.org.uk/ws/WagonInfo.asp?Ref=7111 Built by Charles Roberts in 1896, as far as I can make out for the Dockyard directly, rather than it being a second-hand vehicle. The Admiralty must have been splashing out on wagons in that year, as Montague's Gloucester book has photos of a couple dated March 1896: a covered goods wagon of similar dimensions, but with more Midland-style framing either side of the doors, with diagonals in a V, but rather more LCDR / H&B doors, with a horizontal mid-way up; also a 3-plank dropside wagon. The livery of these is quite attractive: grey with black ironwork and ROYAL DOCKYARD CHATHAM in full, white shaded black. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted October 24, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 24, 2021 ... although the Royal Dockyard website says the 8 ton covered goods wagon has Stapleford axleboxes, dated 1896. https://thedockyard.co.uk/explore/railway/ 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 The Military were quite happy to swap 'boxes and other bits between vehicles under overhaul ........ as were the Railways - though the latter's spares were far more likely to be from the same source as the originals. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted October 25, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 25, 2021 27 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said: The Military were quite happy to swap 'boxes and other bits between vehicles under overhaul ........ as were the Railways - though the latter's spares were far more likely to be from the same source as the originals. A set of Stapleford axleboxes might have been swapped in for a set of Chas Roberts. Though having looked at photos of both sides of the wagon I see no sign of a Chas Roberts builders plate so I'm wondering on what the RHWR identification rests. Are Royal Dockyard vehicles covered in John Arkell's book? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 John only includes a couple of Glo'ster-built dropside wagons in his book - also built 1896 ! ( Shame this question didn't crop up last week - I could have quizzed him further on Thursday.) 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted October 25, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 25, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Wickham Green too said: ( Shame this question didn't crop up last week - I could have quizzed him further on Thursday.) He has been seen on here but I can't remember his nom-de-web. I imagine one of his Gloucester drop-sides is the same photo as the one in Montague - No. 7? Edited October 25, 2021 by Compound2632 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now