S.A.C Martin Posted March 10, 2012 Author Share Posted March 10, 2012 I'm not singing anymore...dreadful first half at the Valley today, so I am told. I was on the North Norfolk Railway today taking in the beautiful Holden B12 and the sights of the sea beyond. 2-4 to Notts County. Come on Charlton, one last big push for the end of the season to seal promotion, please... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Steve Kean should audition for the part of Houdini. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Torper Posted March 10, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 10, 2012 (edited) Went to Station Park today and saw Forfar Athletic hammer local rivals Brechin City 4-1, thereby easing the Loons' relegation worries to some small extent. I fear that Brechin manager Jim Weir's days at the club are numbered. The unbelieveable part is that they (Rangers) can lose 10 points and still be second. Not too unbelievable - in the English Premiership, Manchester United, currently second, could lose 10 points and would still be second. Edited March 10, 2012 by Torper Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PhilH Posted March 11, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 11, 2012 SSShhhhhhh.......whisper it ever so quietly but it looks like Southampton are back on song.....and West ham keep doing us favours! Bit concerned about Reading though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bike2steam Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 What's the odds on the Saints, Royals, and Seagulls getting to the Premier league this year ?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Game on............................ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Swansea 1 - Man City 0 need I say more !! Joy. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Lambton58 Posted March 11, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 11, 2012 What is it about Liverpool, the Stadium of Light and bizarre goals? No beach balls this time but Campbell's shot rebounds off the post, hits the back of Reina's head & rebounds off the post again and is eventually put away by Bendtner. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining about the result, just the odd way it came about Ralph Lambton58 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 ....I'm not complaining about the result.... I am. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) Game on............................ Seems we have you worried! Must be a novelty for a united fan!! There's another 10 games yet... It could all change again! Edited March 12, 2012 by Hobby Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Claude_Dreyfus Posted March 12, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 12, 2012 I read the other day that Pompey and Glasgow Rangers are planning a friendly match to help boost the coffers! Perhaps that is an idea for a new competition....the 'Bankrupts Cup'. Entrants so far are (restricted to those teams who have had point deductions for going into administration!): Portsmouth Glasgow Rangers Port Vale Darlington Plymouth Argyle The list of entrants will no doubt grow ove the next couple of seasons... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 I read the other day that Pompey and Glasgow Rangers are planning a friendly match to help boost the coffers! Perhaps that is an idea for a new competition....the 'Bankrupts Cup'. Entrants so far are (restricted to those teams who have had point deductions for going into administration!): ..... The list of entrants will no doubt grow over the next couple of seasons... Can they afford to enter? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Yeah, the Skinto Shield, it could spend 364 days a year at the pawnbrokers....... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Seems we have you worried! Must be a novelty for a united fan!! There's another 10 games yet... It could all change again! Half a billion quid would have anyone worried, the fact that it's city rather than Chelsea/Arsenal/Newcastle/Liverpool pushing us for the title adds a little bit to it, what does make it more interesting is the number of city fans who seemed to think it was a foregone conclusion. Difference is, been there, done that, I remember standing on the Kop in April '92 watching us lose the title, didn't think it could get much worse, in fact I honestly thought I'd never see Utd win it, so 20 years later, worried, no? I do think you need to lose a title to win one though, so yeah there may be a few twists, but I still fancy our run in over yours. I don't think you'll see too much scriking going on from the red 3/4 though........... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) Your players/manager are getting very vocal all of a sudden over the past few weeks so I'd say that there is some concern there, as for winning/losing I'd agree but point out that most of our players are used to winning as well, just not the English Prem... As for money, when you've worked out what Utd, Chelsea, and the others have spend over the years to win their titles then maybe mention City's spending... But even over the past few years if you actually look at moneys in and out for players there isn't that much difference between them, one of the papers did the figures at the end of last year... Its just another myth... Edited March 12, 2012 by Hobby Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Well, a loss last year of £195 million (a record for a British club), the highest British club wage bill (which is £22 million more than their turnover) and a stadium sponsorship scam which might, or might not, get them round the UEFA's Financial Fair Play regulations, are not myths. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Your players/manager are getting very vocal all of a sudden over the past few weeks so I'd say that there is some concern there, as for winning/losing I'd agree but point out that most of our players are used to winning as well, just not the English Prem... As for money, when you've worked out what Utd, Chelsea, and the others have spend over the years to win their titles then maybe mention City's spending... But even over the past few years if you actually look at moneys in and out for players there isn't that much difference between them, one of the papers did the figures at the end of last year... Its just another myth... No it's not a myth, the difference between City and United is that we are not and never have been a rich mans plaything, the simple fact is your sucess (!) is soley thanks to the largesse of your Arab benefactors, without that you would just be a middle of the table club. I have no problem with that but lets not cloud the issue with absolute rubbish, Uniteds net spend is mimimal compared to City and any money spent has been generated by the club itself and not an oil rich state in the middle east. If you really want I'll provide you the figures, believe me it'll show you're wrong. If City do go on to win it it will be deserved, as the winner is undoubtedly the 'best' team over the season, but to suggest that our players/management/fans/tea lady are getting vocal all of a sudden is a complete joke, all that's happening now is a slight ramping of pressure on City, by all means you mob can try the mind games but I really don't think you've much chance of winning that one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted March 13, 2012 Share Posted March 13, 2012 (edited) Sorry, m8, but its not a myth regarding spending, when the paper published it I was discussing it with one of your fellow supporters and one from Spurs, we were all surprised to the figures but they don't lie, just all our spending has been over the past three seasons rather than over the past ten. Looking at the top clubs once they get up there the spending, whilst still very high compared to the rest, tends to level off (though still at a high level!) I wish I'd kept a copy of it now! I agree with you about where the money comes from, though where the Glaziers fit in to your plaything bit I'm not sure! Lets face it the whole of football is a rich mans playground and has been for donkey's years, its just now things could be said to be getting out of hand... Rather like F1... ;-) We'll have to agree to differ with the sudden increase of comments from the Utd staff, though! Mind games from us? That's a bit rich... No, we'll leave that to the expert over your way, and just hope that our lot don't take the bait!! We should be 4 points behind you by the time we play Chelsea, though, so it will be an interesting game... Must remember to wind up the Wolves fans at work to get their lot do do an upset (fat chance!!)... Edited March 13, 2012 by Hobby Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted March 13, 2012 Author Share Posted March 13, 2012 No it's not a myth, the difference between City and United is that we are not and never have been a rich mans plaything, the simple fact is your sucess (!) is soley thanks to the largesse of your Arab benefactors, without that you would just be a middle of the table club. I have no problem with that but lets not cloud the issue with absolute rubbish, Uniteds net spend is mimimal compared to City and any money spent has been generated by the club itself and not an oil rich state in the middle east. If you really want I'll provide you the figures, believe me it'll show you're wrong. Didn't they - without money - go from League 1 to Premier League? Undoubtedly a big achievement when they had very little to work with prior to being bought out. If City do go on to win it it will be deserved, as the winner is undoubtedly the 'best' team over the season, but to suggest that our players/management/fans/tea lady are getting vocal all of a sudden is a complete joke, all that's happening now is a slight ramping of pressure on City, by all means you mob can try the mind games but I really don't think you've much chance of winning that one. It has been no different this year to any year, whether it's Wenger/Mourinho/Ferguson/Moyes/Ancelloti/AVB/Mancini. Managers play the talking mind games all the time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bike2steam Posted March 13, 2012 Share Posted March 13, 2012 (edited) . Must remember to wind up the Wolves fans at work to get their lot do do an upset (fat chance!!)... You gotta be kidding, with no money to get a decent manager, a meddling board of directors, a defence as useless as a chocolate teapot, and a one way ticket to oblivion for a once proud club which yearns for the good old days of about the same time when Bert Trautmann played for Man City. Edited March 13, 2012 by bike2steam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted March 13, 2012 Share Posted March 13, 2012 (edited) Sorry, m8, but its not a myth regarding spending, when the paper published it I was discussing it with one of your fellow supporters and one from Spurs, we were all surprised to the figures but they don't lie, just all our spending has been over the past three seasons rather than over the past ten. Looking at the top clubs once they get up there the spending, whilst still very high compared to the rest, tends to level off (though still at a high level!) I wish I'd kept a copy of it now! I agree with you about where the money comes from, though where the Glaziers fit in to your plaything bit I'm not sure! Lets face it the whole of football is a rich mans playground and has been for donkey's years, its just now things could be said to be getting out of hand... Rather like F1... ;-) We'll have to agree to differ with the sudden increase of comments from the Utd staff, though! Mind games from us? That's a bit rich... No, we'll leave that to the expert over your way, and just hope that our lot don't take the bait!! We should be 4 points behind you by the time we play Chelsea, though, so it will be an interesting game... Must remember to wind up the Wolves fans at work to get their lot do do an upset (fat chance!!)... Didn't they - without money - go from League 1 to Premier League? Undoubtedly a big achievement when they had very little to work with prior to being bought out. It has been no different this year to any year, whether it's Wenger/Mourinho/Ferguson/Moyes/Ancelloti/AVB/Mancini. Managers play the talking mind games all the time. Lets clear these few things up shall we. Transfer spends Shall we set off with approx the last few years Citys net transfer spend per year 2006-2011 £85,674,000 Uniteds £10,320,000 Yep that's close........ok, so the fact that Citys recent spending skews the figures, so we'll go back to when the Thai embezzeler was in charge Citys net transfer spend per year 2003-2011 £53,049,375 Uniteds £10,912,500 Well it's getting closer but that's still some difference in my book, a mere £43 miliion now.....Tell you what let's do it over the last 20 plus years since the premier league started in 1992 Citys net transfer spend per year 1992-2011 £24,156,350 Uniteds £ 8,865,500 Get closer, but still a big difference in my book, that's not far off 3 times in my book.......... Figures taken from here http://www.transferl...92-to-2011.html other sites showing similar are also available should you like me to link them up.....,... Ok lets take City gong from League one to the Premiership with no money, now I'm going off memory here but City have been relegated a couple of times in the premiership era and once going down to League 1, I would have thought during those relegations that Premiership parachute payments would have been in force, softening the financial blow, and as I'm often told City are a massive club so surely the numbers through the turnstiles would afford some form of financial clout to help them up, off the top of my head haven't Fulham, Norwich, Swansea, Blackpool, QPR, Stoke(?) amongst others had a stint in league one and then gone up, look at Norwich now, so hardly a huge unknown achievement, it's a bloody good effort but hardly a one off. As to City having very little to work with, they are a big city club, an easy comparison would be with Everton, a traditional big support in a football city with a history and tradition of their own, it's a bit laughable to say they had nothing to work with and got promotion on 2/6, because they didn't nor should they have been in that position. Edited March 13, 2012 by Red Devil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) Not sure about parachute payments back when we went down to league 1 (Div3?!), though you are right about the support, gates of 20+ thousand in that league was a welcome novelty for the other teams that year and the financial clout got them back up! Looking back over City's purchases over the past 10 years how many of them are actually still around from the pre Mancini era... Very few. I think the difference between Utd and City regarding spending shows how good Ferguson has been in the transfer market, he buys, and, in the main, they stay, ours tend to be in one year and out the next, hopefully now that may change, looking at the Jan 2012 window it seems it may. We wasted an awful lot of money, a lot of which we never got back... Ever thought what will happen when Ferguson goes, RD? I tend to think he's the reason for your success and will be a hard act to follow... Edited March 14, 2012 by Hobby Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted March 14, 2012 Author Share Posted March 14, 2012 Red Devil, I am reading those stats with amusment. You are stating the average per year gross spend from 1992-2011. Of course if you conveniently put it back twenty years to 1992, City will have spent more on average per year, because their overall spending has rocketed in the last three to four years compared to United. If you removed the last three to four years spending the story would be completely reversed! Up until 2007 Manchester United's spending would have been far higher than Manchester City's, year on year. Twisting the figures in the way you do above does not represent the whole truth. I will say this, however: it shows to a great extent, if you put the 1992-2011 figures against number of trophies won, how very, very canny and clever Ferguson is in the transfer market compared to every other football club, without a shadow of a doubt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) Red Devil, I am reading those stats with amusment. You are stating the average per year gross spend from 1992-2011. Of course if you conveniently put it back twenty years to 1992, City will have spent more on average per year, because their overall spending has rocketed in the last three to four years compared to United. If you removed the last three to four years spending the story would be completely reversed! Up until 2007 Manchester United's spending would have been far higher than Manchester City's, year on year. Twisting the figures in the way you do above does not represent the whole truth. I will say this, however: it shows to a great extent, if you put the 1992-2011 figures against number of trophies won, how very, very canny and clever Ferguson is in the transfer market compared to every other football club, without a shadow of a doubt. Not absolutey the case, City like many other clubs have spent big in the past, Steve Daley etc, the point I'm trying to get across is the big bad United haven't spent huge sums and poor little city very little, many clubs spent averagely dependant on the market up till I'd say the money bags Chelsea era began, take a look at how much Liverpool have spent in the period 1992-2011 and what they won in comparison. Yes Uniteds transfer budget and spend was greater than Citys, but that was because we had more fans through the turnstiles, greater sucess, better marketing etc etc. The fact was stated the United and Citys transfer dealings were close, doesn't matter how you add the figures up, they're not, yes I grant you the average may be somewhat skewed but can you provide me figures to show the City and United spent similar ammounts? I have seen figures for the pre premiership era and City spent big then, 80s perhaps before your time, check out the prices paid for Steve Daley, Mckenzie, Robinson etc, 1979 £1,437,500 (a British record at the time) compare that with Bryan Robson 1981 £1,500,000 (a new British record) . The fact is City have spent a huge ammount, money that is not generated by the club itself but by it's benefactor, I have no problem with that, but don't tell me that the spend is similar, it is not, I don't care when it was spent, the fact remains that it was spent, or did Mr H put a caveat on his post that what we've spent in the last four years doesn't count as it's not really there? I'll wager you that City's and United's spend pre 92 is not that disparate, yes United will probably be greater but not hugely so, that is assuming you want to take it back to the very start? Edited March 14, 2012 by Red Devil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dseagull Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Meanwhile, back in the world of real football.... A point at home to Oakwood on Saturday will be enough for promotion. Any Rmwebbers fancy being there to see it will get a free cuppa (If you tell me you are coming, anyway!) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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