Early Risers.

[monkeysarefun]

3 hours ago, polybear said:

Listen to the Lyrics?  Bear gave up trying to do that long ago - most seem so undecipherable now that it's nigh-on impossible**  Actually knowing what the song is about seemed to become impossible after the 80's.

 

**Try many (all?) Leona Lewis songs, for example.  Nice tunes, shame about the words.....

 

 

 

 

Poor old fella!   You must miss the days gathered around the family Harpsichord singing "With a trilly rilly rilly troo loo!" and so on.

 

Maybe this is more up your furry alley. And if you can't understand the lyrics you can just watch the picture. And there is  a special treat just for you at  1 minute 40.

 

 

 

 

[PhilJ W]

3 hours ago, polybear said:

Bear here.....

 

I reckon this is about the first thing of any note that Bear has been p1ssed about since Br*xit happened:

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx29nzd1drgo

 

Moan about "saving 7 Euros?"  Well I don't recall having to pay that when I went to Malta or Portugal earlier this year anyway (unless it was buried in air fares or summink).

 

Nope - that wouldn't have particularly bothered me anyway - it's lost in the noise.

 

This bit, however REALLY does p1ss a Bear off:

 

"She was speaking as she confirmed the Entry/Exit Scheme (EES) - which will require non-EU travellers to register fingerprints and a photo instead of having their passport stamped - will start on 10 November"

 

Why?  Well whilst Bear has never been a naughty Bear sorry, been caught so have nothing to worry about, the state of the legal system is such that I'd quite like "my options to remain open" in the event that someone close to me was the victim of some unspeakable crime 😉 where a blatantly guilty party got some derisory sentence (or even walked entirely) whilst at the same time maximise my chances of getting away with it.  It also suggests that those living in EU Countries are all good, law abiding citizens......

Most definitely a Huge, Huge Rant by the way.....

 

It's one of the so called 'brexit benefits' that we were told was fake news.

[pgcroc]

@PhilJ WIt's one of the so called 'brexit benefits' that we were told was fake news.

 

I assume that the UK is reciprocating.

 

Pete

[DaveF]

6 hours ago, Ozexpatriate said:

David, When does that miner's banner date from?

 

 

Probably 50s? - I forgot to read the expnatory bit about it, but I will check next time I am there.

 

David

[Gwiwer]

13 hours ago, Ian Abel said:

the BMI "calculator" used by my clinic informs me I come out as 30 i.e. obese! 

The BMI Calculator used by my final employer failed to take account of the fact that I am a fully-qualified and paid-up member of the Cornish Pasty Appreciation Society. 
 

Placing the initials MCPAS after my name also failed to impress it. 

[Gwiwer]

Good morning. Welcome to Wetness-day. Currently not living up to its name but I’m sure that will change when I am thrown in the shower dreckly. 
 

I also have my fortnightly appointment with Our Friends in Camborne to boost supplies. In the words of our much-missed late local liquor-lover “Train don’t stop Camborne Wednesdays”. 
 

Better take the car, then. 

[DaveF]

A bright sunny but cool morning so far.

 

A bad nights sleep as I kept needing to visit the loo and didn't feel brilliant.  So I rang the surgery at 08.00 as soon as they opened and have an appointment for 10.10 this morning.  Last night I rang 111 and spoke to a nurse who suggested I saw a GP as it sounds like a slight infection.  That would fit with how I've felt recently.

 

The rest of the day depends on how long that takes and whether I need to visit the pharmacist but if possible Iwould like to get a haircut.  Whatever happens I feel I need a rest - I really must remember I am 75 not 25.

 

David

[PhilJ W]

2 hours ago, iL Dottore said:

Modern politics, well all politics throughout history really, is defined by who won the last war. Take Richard III - demonised by the Tudors (and beautifully so on their behalf by Shakespeare in his play Richard III ) by modern accounts he was a decent king who did much for poor people (such as The Court of Requests - a court to which poor people who could not afford legal representation could apply for their grievances to be heard). Had Richard III won the Battle of Bosworth, Britain’s history books would refer to his “great achievements” and to his being a “good king”.

 

Likewise King John, His brother (Richard I) had virtually bankrupted the country with supporting the Crusades, not forgetting that a massive ransom* was paid to get him back. The Vatican demanded that John continued to support the Crusades which he refused to do due to the parlous state of the English economy.

Other historians argue that John did not attempt to overthrow Richard, but rather did his best to improve a country ruined by Richard's excessive taxes used to fund the Crusade. It is most likely that the image of subversion was given to John by later monk chroniclers, who resented his refusal to go on the ill-fated Fourth Crusade.

 

[BSW01]

Good morning everyone 

 

A bright, sunny start to the day here in England’s northwest corner, but quite cool at just 13C! Apart from a couple of shopping trips, Waitrose and Costco, there’s not a lot in the agenda today. The reason is we’re stocking up on non perishables before I go into hospital next week, as I won’t be able to drive for a couple of weeks. So that all we need to get is fresh stuff like bread, milk, fruit and vegetables, which hopefully Vickie and Ian will do for us. 
 

Back later 

 

Brian

 

[tigerburnie]

Had the pleasure (!!!!!!) of getting stabbed the arm with a syringe full of Respiratory Syncytial Vaccine yesterday(whatever next) and was told I will most likely feel like I have got the flu afterwards.........whoopedoo.

[PhilJ W]

Morning all from Estuary-Land. Waiting in for a parcel containing an item that runs on two parallel strips of metal this morning, hopefully it will be early as I will be at a garden layout this afternoon drinking tea and eating cake and biscuits.

[BoD]

2 hours ago, Barry O said:

As it happens I once went down the pit in the village where @Two_sugarslives. I was officially 6 days too young to do so. It ensured I never went down another deep coal mine ever again (especially the 15 inch seam.. ( @roundhouse  as in thev5 quarter weatherspoons in Peterlee).

I went down Dawdon a couple of times with exactly that result for me too.  We went as a group from Uni as part of the course we were doing and got the sanitised version as in ‘no swearing lads we’ve got visitors’ over the tannoy/intercom  and only visiting the wider seams.  Those continuous cutting machines, belts and hydraulic props make it look quite an easy job.  Fortunately, being from the town, I knew a few people there and was shown what it really could be like working the narrow seams.  
 

Both my grandfathers worked ‘down the pit’. A great grandfather (along with 163 others) was killed in an explosion. My father-in-law’s job was to pull out the wooden props left behind as the seam moved forward.  Sometimes the ‘roof’ would fall straight in, mostly the void left by the removed coal would remain for sometime.  When we were down I could actually hear the roof falling in behind the working face. Scary, if you aren’t used to it. 
 

Back then tradition said the if your father worked down the pit so did you.  Fortunately my grandfather told my dad that there was no way that he was going down ‘that hole’ so he became a plumber instead.

[iL Dottore]

3 hours ago, rockershovel said:

Did the Romans really  think much about law and order? I've always doubted it. Rome seemed to me to be a violent and lawless place where the general population had few rights, if any….

I think that Rome was probably as about as violent and dangerous as any European city (all of which were pretty lawless places well into Georgian times).

 

The point I was making was that had the Roman Empire continued more or less unaltered until now (and presuming Christianity never got a foothold) then Citizens of The Roman Empire in 2024 would not have found crucifixions particularly cruel or unusual (with, of course, the occasional onlooker like PU [PolyUrso] muttering things like “crucifixion is too good for them”). Their moral compass would have pointed in a very different direction to ours, because our moral compass is the result of centuries of Christianity and enlightenment thinking.

 

I think there is a certain amount of validity in your assertion that the Romans really didn’t think much about law and order, from what I’ve read (which admittedly is not terribly extensively) the Roman forces of law and order were more concerned about threats to the state rather than threats to the individual.

[polybear]

If they go shifting the goalposts and make Bear further away from the goal I’ll be most p1ssed off…..
 

3 hours ago, Barry O said:

I believe the BMI process is being reviewed as even the NHS has realised its incorrect and based on poor data.

 

 

Edited August 21 by polybear

[rockershovel]

17 minutes ago, iL Dottore said:

I think that Rome was probably as about as violent and dangerous as any European city (all of which were pretty lawless places well into Georgian times).

 

The point I was making was that had the Roman Empire continued more or less unaltered until now (and presuming Christianity never got a foothold) then Citizens of The Roman Empire in 2024 would not have found crucifixions particularly cruel or unusual (with, of course, the occasional onlooker like PU [PolyUrso] muttering things like “crucifixion is too good for them”). Their moral compass would have pointed in a very different direction to ours, because our moral compass is the result of centuries of Christianity and enlightenment thinking.

 

I think there is a certain amount of validity in your assertion that the Romans really didn’t think much about law and order, from what I’ve read (which admittedly is not terribly extensively) the Roman forces of law and order were more concerned about threats to the state rather than threats to the individual.

I'm going to challenge that. I'd always understood that crucifixion was intended to be "cruel and unusual", that in a world where dire and awful things (eg, being dragged from your mud and wattle roundhouse in Gaul, your womenfolk sold into slavery and you ending up as a farm slave in Central Italy) could and DID happen, crucifixion was STILL just about the worst thing that could happen to a man. You could look at the crucified bodies along the Appian Way and think, "well at least THAT didn't happen, and if I keep my nose clean it won't."

 

I was taught at school that crucifixion was actually quite rare, rather like World Cup Finals; everybody knows about them but few people have been to one. 

 

The Romans were great believers in "orderint, dum metuant" (let them hate us, as long as they fear us). The great crucifixion of survivors of the Spartacus Rebellion seems to have been an almost unique event 

[iL Dottore]

3 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

It's one of the so called 'brexit benefits' that we were told was fake news.

Another “Brexit Benefit” is that I can no longer enter the UK on a Swiss ID card, but only with a Swiss passport. Which, because I travel a lot, is not a problem, as I have a  state of the art, up-to-date and a brand spanking new Swiss Passport  (for my forthcoming trip to Japan as my old one was expiring).

 

The Swiss passport is quite a good passport to have allowing me to enter most countries in the world with no undue formalities and often on a Visa waiver. I suppose this is because most countries realise that that the Swiss know exactly where each country’s elite and leadership have stashed their cash and their other ill gotten gains.

 

Knowing where “things that do not officially exist“ (like a politician’s Swiss numbered bank accounts) can be found, is an extremely useful diplomatic tool 😁

[rockershovel]

34 minutes ago, iL Dottore said:

I think that Rome was probably as about as violent and dangerous as any European city (all of which were pretty lawless places well into Georgian times).

 

The point I was making was that had the Roman Empire continued more or less unaltered until now (and presuming Christianity never got a foothold) then Citizens of The Roman Empire in 2024 would not have found crucifixions particularly cruel or unusual (with, of course, the occasional onlooker like PU [PolyUrso] muttering things like “crucifixion is too good for them”). Their moral compass would have pointed in a very different direction to ours, because our moral compass is the result of centuries of Christianity and enlightenment thinking.

 

I think there is a certain amount of validity in your assertion that the Romans really didn’t think much about law and order, from what I’ve read (which admittedly is not terribly extensively) the Roman forces of law and order were more concerned about threats to the state rather than threats to the individual.

There's a major, untold story about the rise of Christianity in the Roman world. I was taught that it was a sort of inversion of Roman life, that the Romans taught a creed of citizenship and rights - of "civis Romanus sum" and "appeal to Csesar" but couldn't make it actually work. 

 

There was no real point of contact with the urban poor. It wasn't a world of mass industrial employment, the urban poor simply congregated because they had no other life. Huge numbers depended upon Imperial largesse. Christisnity taught that they were of individual value. 

 

How did this become sufficiently established to be a significant force upon the Roman plutocracy? 

[PhilJ W]

Crucifixion was reserved for 'Enemies of Rome', that puts into doubt the mantra that the Jews killed Jesus Christ.

[iL Dottore]

18 minutes ago, rockershovel said:

I'm going to challenge that. I'd always understood that crucifixion was intended to be "cruel and unusual", that in a world where dire and awful things (eg, being dragged from your mud and wattle roundhouse in Gaul, your womenfolk sold into slavery and you ending up as a farm slave in Central Italy) could and DID happen, crucifixion was STILL just about the worst thing that could happen to a man. You could look at the crucified bodies along the Appian Way and think, "well at least THAT didn't happen, and if I keep my nose clean it won't."

 

I was taught at school that crucifixion was actually quite rare, rather like World Cup Finals; everybody knows about them but few people have been to one. 

 

The Romans were great believers in "orderint, dum metuant" (let them hate us, as long as they fear us). The great crucifixion of survivors of the Spartacus Rebellion seems to have been an almost unique event 

OK, I’ll accept your challenge. Perhaps I should rephrase what I was trying to get across slightly differently. I concur that what you say about crucifixion being deliberately cruel, and certainly rather unusual, is a good assessment.
 

But the point I was trying to make is: such a punishment (like other Roman punishments such as sending someone in to the arena armed with nothing more than a pointy stick to face professional gladiators) was not considered “immoral”, “unethical” or “wrong”. Their moral compass was, well, different! (can you imagine the uproar if a British government decided that the best punishment to mete out to serial thieves would be to put them unarmed into an arena to face a bunch of professional killers [live on BBC Sports 🤣).

 

Your point about the mass crucifixions after the Spartacus uprising, very much ties into what I was saying about Roman law and order being about protecting the state not the individual. And the slave uprising, led by professional gladiators was very much a threat to the Roman state.

Edited August 21 by iL Dottore
Spelling

[PhilJ W]

Afternoon all from Estuary-Land. Still no sign of my parcel and the delivery time has been put back to 'Before 7:30 pm.' But I've got to go out shortly so I've asked for it to be left with a neighbour.

[PhilJ W]

2 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

Afternoon all from Estuary-Land. Still no sign of my parcel and the delivery time has been put back to 'Before 7:30 pm.' But I've got to go out shortly so I've asked for it to be left with a neighbour.

The above seems to have done the trick,the parcel has just been delivered.

[Erichill16]

5 hours ago, Winslow Boy said:

 

Drugs - cake

 

Isn’t that just the Dutch ‘sssshpecial ‘ re-mix  of the song?

 

Edited August 21 by Erichill16
Wording

[PupCam]

Morning (Pre-munch)

 

16 hours ago, polybear said:

I can think of worse ways to spend a day.....

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0qe8vj2yy8o

 

Excellent!

 

15 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

Indeed, Ipswich trolleybus # 44 which was displayed immaculately restored at the Clapham transport museum fifty years ago was stored there. It has been allowed to deteriorate to such an extent that scrapping it was considered. Fortunately the Ipswich Transport Museum* stepped in and it's now being restored for the second time.

*A proper transport museum, run by enthusiasts.  Well worth a visit if you're up that way.

  https://www.ipswichtransportmuseum.co.uk/ 

And only a short distance away at Leiston is the Long Shop Museum.

 https://www.longshopmuseum.co.uk/

 

Yes the Garrett  museum at Leiston is very good indeed.      We'll have to have another Suffolk holiday (we like Suffolk) and go and visit the Ipswich museum.

 

14 hours ago, monkeysarefun said:

Going by the number of longlegged blondes in little shorts who man our stop/go signs at roadworks,  plenty of Scandinavian girls still do. Traffic Management companies love hiring them because motorists probably  get less impatient if they are held up by one of them..

 

Now that's what I call true Systems Thinking aka "The Wider Picture" (although probably not PC)👏   

 

In the UK we just get badly signed, badly positioned, unreliable automatic lights or a bunch of Hairy Arxxxd Herberts in dirty Hi-Vis controlling traffic.

 

7 hours ago, polybear said:

Conversely, the new scrotes running the Big House manage to come up with this:

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/czdpvz5684qo

 

"Plans for a register of foreign lobbyists aimed at protecting the UK's national security have been delayed.

The scheme would compel those working for a foreign power or body to declare their lobbying activities - failure to do so could be punishable by up to two years in prison."

 

Bear gone....

 

I seem to remember some forms that Bear, I and others on here may have completed in the past asked asked questions such as "Are you a terrorist?" & "Are you a criminal?".     I suppose the question "Are you a spy?" is of the same ilk.   It's a good job all those spies, crims & terriosts are all law abiding citizens (think about it ... ) when completing official forms and registering!

 

7 hours ago, polybear said:

Has iD never heard "The Teddy Bear's Picnic" then?

 

Ah yes, but the Teddy Bears had come out of the furniture store 😉 and then gone down the woods ......  (so iD's covered that)

 

5 hours ago, Barry O said:

I believe the BMI process is being reviewed as even the NHS has realised its incorrect and based on poor data.

 

Whenever I'm in a hospital I can't help noticing that many of the staff are "more than amply covered" and yet I am apparently obese.  Pots & very large kettles ....

 

ION

 

I was a real ER this morning.  Up at 5:30, out of the house at 6:30 and in the admissions queue at the local hospital by 7:00 even though opening time was 7:30.    There were 5 people already there and there must have been 20-25 by opening time.    I was bracing myself for a long wait but fortunately I was one of the first called and an appointment with Mr Swann & Mr Morton was all done and dusted before 10:00.    All seems good and grateful thanks to the team that "did their stuff" on my behalf, if only the anesthesia wouldn't wear off! 🤣

 

I feel a quiet afternoon playing with Arduino code for the Super Spiffing Wireless DCC++ controller or maybe a snooze is on the cards.    I need to tidy the controller up and maybe unleash some more of the potential functionality before JJP the engine driver turns up again.    I was very impressed with the precision with which he controlled the box that runs on parallel strips of metal with oodles of inertia yesterday.

 

Oh yes, I saw this sad news earlier.   I had hours of fun with my traction engine as a boy.

 

 

 

Right, munch time.

 

TTFN

 

 

Edited August 21 by PupCam
Add the Mamod news

[TheQ]

Afternoon Awl,

Another poor night's lack of sleep, 

I was told we were shopping, so we did, not till after we discovered the fuel can had split...

 

On the way between Potter Heigham and Heigham Furlgate, on the former site of a stopping place for unmentionables, two cars had stopped, it appears from the damage one had clipped the other. Plod was there, blue flashing lights. But I don't think the accident was serious enough for ambulances.

 

I got half a dozen books, nothing on unmentionables, because that cabinet was blocked by a huge pile of books, they'd just had a delivery..

2/3 a deltic spent on food, some of which is slowly cooking to produce a ragu...

 

Then to an orange shed, I needed more icing powder, for Slartibartfast to use.

 

I've now reached the knackered stage, an eyelid inspection is required.

 

 

[monkeysarefun]

32 minutes ago, PupCam said:

Now that's what I call true Systems Thinking aka "The Wider Picture" (although probably not PC)👏   

 

In the UK we just get badly signed, badly positioned, unreliable automatic lights or a bunch of Hairy Arxxxd Herberts in dirty Hi-Vis controlling traffic.

 

Australia, its heaven on a stick!

 

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/male-drivers-respond-better-to-women-the-changing-face-of-australia-s-traffic-controllers-20190507-p51kq0.html