Early Risers.

[4630]

4 minutes ago, Grizz said:

WHAT……or should I say WTF?……….you mean that they can’t actually do that?  ……..well now, there’s a novel concept. 
 

Accountability, consequences to actions or inactions…..surely not. 
 

Anyone remember the Post Office? 

 I believe that @iL Dottore was referring to the Swiss government, not the clown show that invariably inhabits the Palace of Westminster. 
 

 

Edited May 26 by 4630
To add a word

[Grizz]

2 minutes ago, 4630 said:

 I believe that @iL Dottore was referring to the Swiss government, not the clown show that invariably inhabits the Palace of Westminster. 
 

 

Ah…..’The House of Liars and Criminality”……

 

As the old saying goes….There has only ever been one man to enter the place who held true intentions…….🎼Remember, remember the 5th of November….etc etc….

[skipepsi]

26 minutes ago, jjb1970 said:

 

I can't help thinking that in the case of the current crop (and not just ours) the God's would make them sane so they could see what a bunch of clowns they are. Not that I'm a judgemental type, that's not my way.

People are not only incompetent; their incompetence robs them of the mental ability to realize just how inept they are. The Dunning-Kruger effect https://www.verywellmind.com/an-overview-of-the-dunning-kruger-effect-4160740

[iL Dottore]

2 hours ago, polybear said:

ION......

 

Bear has discovered that Thiefyjet want £408 for a return to Lisbon.  Bluddy hell.......

Other airlines want more.

Yes, you can consider that a Rant.

Blimey!

 

That's what I pay for a business class return ZRH-LCY with Swiss if I book far enough in advance!

 

I checked the prices on SWISS for a ZRH-LIS return flight in early June with a 1 week stay. At such short notice economy light (no checked baggage, 1 carry on) is SFr 373.45 [£321] (it would be as low as SFr 224.45 [£192.59] if you took the 05:55 departure from Lisbon). Economy with hold luggage (economy classic) Is SFr 264.45 [£ 226.41] for the early flight and SFr 453.45 [£389) for the later flight.

 

Incidentally, flying out on the last flight ZRH - LIS and returning on the first flight LIS - ZRH the cheapest business class fare I can find is SFR654.45 [£562] - so just £154 more that squeezy jet AND you get all the business class priority perks! I guess squeezy jet and O'leary Air view the holiday period as a license to print money!

 

The errors you are making is (a) booking so close to departure and (b) choosing a popular destination (flying to the Canary Islands at the same time will set you back SFr 587.35 [£505], the Canary Islands are a popular holiday destination for the Swiss) and c) going when everyone else is going on holiday

 

In comparison, if I now book ZRH - LCY in Business class on SWISS for the November Brains Trust meeting, it will cost me - today - SFr385.85 [£332] - so cheaper than squeezy jet to Lisbon!

 

Of course, I have the advantage of (a) traveling to a non-holiday destination and (b) doing it out of season.

 

[PhilJ W]

2 hours ago, skipepsi said:

People are not only incompetent; their incompetence robs them of the mental ability to realize just how inept they are. The Dunning-Kruger effect https://www.verywellmind.com/an-overview-of-the-dunning-kruger-effect-4160740

The link here.

https://www.verywellmind.com/an-overview-of-the-dunning-kruger-effect-4160740

[iL Dottore]

2 hours ago, Grizz said:

@iL Dottore, am I right in thinking that in Switzerland in the late 1980s, National service was compulsory, and that you could opt for a civilian element (service in a hospital / medical unit ) if you fundamentally objected to the ‘Military training to Kill’ ethos. 
Also that if you just flatly refused or just wouldn’t do it, then you got a jail term for the duration? 
 

I seem to recall that this might have been the case, as I was going out with a trainee Swiss Air stewardess at the time, and we had a friend named Peter whose friend didn’t want to serve in a military unit that taught him to fight and potentially kill. 
 

At this point I acknowledge that I may well be way off the mark as it was a long time ago. 

Pretty much the case!

[PhilJ W]

2 hours ago, polybear said:

One for Puppers @PupCam:

 

I use the self checkout because I can take my time and pack my bags as I want them packed. The normal checkouts they push everything through at breakneck speed and the cashier sits there waiting for you to finish packing because you just can't keep up with them. By using the self service checkouts I can put everything through at my own pace and pack my bags the way I want.

[iL Dottore]

2 hours ago, 4630 said:

It might just be me as I’ve had a couple of glasses of a decent white with my Sunday lunch, so I apologise if I’ve got the wrong end of the stick here - but don’t you mean to say that ‘ …the government can’t make decisions without the people’s approval.’

 

You are quite right. The government can't make decisions WITHOUT the people's approval. Of course, it's a lot more complicated than just asking "you don't mind, do you?". Because it is a direct democracy, the Swiss can hold their government to account by the use of referenda (amongst other things).

 

My knowledge of how Swiss politics works is not terribly extensive, but there is a lot more accountability in Switzerland than you see in many other countries.

 

It also helps that Swiss politicians have all held real jobs in the real world (often ta political candidate will refer to what they've achieved in a real world job and how it will make them the right person for the political post) .

[The White Rabbit]

5 minutes ago, iL Dottore said:

.... accountability ... real jobs in the real world ... what they've achieved in a real world job ....

 

There's much I could say, though perhaps better not. Suffice to say - I'm very envious! 

[PhilJ W]

Afternoon all from Estuary-Land. I was feeling a bit peckish so I've just demolished a couple of fried egg baps, delicious. I've still got a few hours till dinner anyway.

[4630]

6 minutes ago, iL Dottore said:

Because it is a direct democracy, the Swiss can hold their government to account by the use of referenda (amongst other things).

 

It also helps that Swiss politicians have all held real jobs in the real world (often ta political candidate will refer to what they've achieved in a real world job and how it will make them the right person for the political post) .

It’s always interesting to learn how different countries apply democracy and democratic principles to suit their own jurisdiction. 
 

My sense is that the use of regular referenda would not be a comfortable fit with the UK electorate’s psyche.

 

Once elected my impression is that a UK Government is expected to get on with it; try to implement the manifesto that was used to bribe encourage the voters; avoid any major economic calamity and generally not bother the electorate again until the next election. 

 

16 minutes ago, iL Dottore said:

It also helps that Swiss politicians have all held real jobs in the real world (often ta political candidate will refer to what they've achieved in a real world job and how it will make them the right person for the political post) .

A particularly enlightened approach IMHO.

 

 

 

[DaveF]

It's rained on and off but not heavily so far but it is very cool, 12°C at the moment.  Church was fine this morning with an interesting sermon.  Those who are churchgoers may be able to work out why I have written that knowing which day it is in the church calendar.

 

I was home for coffee, finished the usual Sunday e mails and phone calls and cooked a nice lunch.  Quite simple, just a turkey joint, stuffing, sausages, parsnips, carrots, sprouts, roast and boiled potatoes.  There is enough left for a cold lunch tomorrow and two lots of tea time sandwiches so really a very cheap meal.

 

I spent a little while searching a hard drive to see if I had scans for one album of photos some of which are ink jet prints from negatives I scanned in the early days of scanning.  They were in the folder where I expected them to be.  I also checked that they exist on all 4 external hard drives I am currently using.  From time to time I buy a new one and copy everything on to it and then stop using the oldest one.  It means that there are 300 fewer photos to scan than I had thought.  I also have another hard drive which I am using as I sort out the family photos.  My PC and laptop both have SSDs which are not huge.

 

I watched the Grand Prix, only falling asleep once in the middle of it.

 

Next will be tea then a mix of book and TV to end another quiet relaxing day.

 

David

 

 

[Erichill16]

4 hours ago, iL Dottore said:

Going the Sunday "Easy Listening" route again, I see.

 

Whatever happened to iconoclastic punk slayer of shibboleths???

Dose of melancholia.🤒 

[Tony_S]

32 minutes ago, 4630 said:

My sense is that the use of regular referenda would not be a comfortable fit with the UK electorate’s psyche.

I wonder if countries that have frequent referendums get used to actually answering the question being asked whereas in countries that have them infrequently they become an opinion poll on the current government, i.e.get used as a protest vote. I think the one that did for de Gaulle was actually about motorway tolls in Brittany. 
Tony
 

[Hroth]

We had a referendum a few years back, it didn't turn out too well...

 

[Grizz]

1 minute ago, Hroth said:

We had a referendum a few years back, it didn't turn out too well...

 

Yeah it would seem that you can’t tell if the people asking you the referendum question are truthful about the intent behind the question. 
 

Difficult to believe of .GOV.UK and other assorted GITS I know. 

[Grizz]

Question…..has it occurred to anyone else on ER that we might very well be on various .GOV.Blar.Blar. watch lists for our blatant disrepk and lack of due deference towards “Authority”????
 

To quote someone very close to my heart……

 

[Tony_S]

As I drove over here to Enfield, Aditi said it would be fine if I watched the GP on my tablet, as she and her Mum would be chatting away.So after lunch, I streamed the audio to my hearing aids.  It was very odd, sometimes the stereo made the cars seem to  drive through my head.I have never listened with headphones to sports programmes previously. Aditi didn’t mind not seeing but the Monaco race is the only one she watches as she likes the scenery! She always thinks of it as being the start of the (or at least her) summer. 

Edited May 26 by Tony_S

[Ozexpatriate]

I'll add tuppence to the discussion on service.

 

In the US, young men are required to register for selective service. There is however no 'draft' in place and has not been since 1973 in the wake of the tragic and convulsive period of the Vietnam war. The US armed forces are all volunteer - and enlistments are dropping.

 

The idea of having some sort of universal compulsory service was regularly mooted - though it hasn't been in a while. Usually proponents suggest that inductees have some choice of service - including non-military options like the Peace Corps, or (depending on who is doing the suggesting) efforts like the New Deal-era, Civilian Conservation Corps.

 

Locally we are beneficiaries of the CCC. Many of the local wilderness trails and park lodge facilities (like the Timberline Ski Lodge on Mt. Hood, which you can see in "The Shining") were built by the CCC.

 

I can imagine something like the CCC working on pollution mitigation projects - like a marine version tasked with plastics removal from the ocean. Similarly a concept like inductees going into a (less than RN) basic nursing program and being assigned to rural hospitals where staffing shortages are crippling. (But this will sound like "Government health care" to many.)

 

It's compelling, but the 'devil is in the details', and many people who would support compulsory service would simultaneously oppose large government programs. 

 

The law of unintended consequences also suggests that a vast, renewable supply of cannon fodder would tempt old men "in charge" to make rash deployment decisions. It's a non-starter.

 

I would suggest that this is exactly what has happened in a Mediterranean country with a long history of compulsory military service - presumed necessary for their defence, but currently being used as something not quite that.

 

Edited May 26 by Ozexpatriate

[Ozexpatriate]

3 minutes ago, Ozexpatriate said:

The law of unintended consequences also suggests that a vast, renewably supply of cannon fodder would tempt old men "in charge" to make rash deployment decisions.

Rather incongruously for the time, former President Herbert Hoover said in 1944:

Quote

Older men declare war. But it is youth that must fight and die. And it is youth who must inherit the tribulation, the sorrow and the triumphs that are the aftermath of war.

 

[Coombe Barton]

... more from the same instigator of the eat out to help out chaos ...

https://johncolby.wordpress.com/2024/05/26/gp-visits-covid-enquiry-half-baked-schemes-domestics/

[Ozexpatriate]

1 hour ago, Tony_S said:

I wonder if countries that have frequent referendums get used to actually answering the question being asked whereas in countries that have them infrequently they become an opinion poll on the current government, i.e.get used as a protest vote. I think the one that did for de Gaulle was actually about motorway tolls in Brittany. 

The law of unintended consequences suggests that such behaviour will happen - but less so where people care about the issue.

 

Local referenda are frequent in the US - often at the state level, but they also regularly exist (in the form of bond levies or consumption taxes) at the county or municipal level. Election day was last week. There were ballot measures (referenda) to renew a tax on gasoline, fund firefighters and a bond levy to  fund the zoo. 

 

A statewide ballot measure on some firearm-related restrictions passed (barely) a couple of years ago. It is still held up in court. A separate measure on decriminalizing drug possession (mostly to address perceived inequities in policing) passed but coupled with a massive influx of fentanyl (and street drugs adulterated with fentanyl) the legislature has stepped in to address problematic parts of the enacted ballot measure.

 

The biggest problem with the ballot measure system is a some sort of referenda corollary to Newton's third law: "For every substantial ballot measure proposed there shall be an equal and opposite ballot measure".

 

The coincident appearance of measure / counter-measure (and accompanying advertising) is confusing to voters about which is which.

[4630]

8 minutes ago, Ozexpatriate said:

The law of unintended consequences suggests that such behaviour will happen - but less so where people care about the issue.

 

Local referenda are frequent in the US - often at the state level, but they also regularly exist (in the form of bond levies or consumption taxes) at the county or municipal level. Election day was last week. There were ballot measures (referenda) to renew a tax on gasoline, fund firefighters and a bond levy to  fund the zoo. 

 

I can imagine a similar scenario in the UK would generate a few “Not another one!” type responses from the majority of the electorate.

 

BBC - Brenda, “Not another one!”

[PhilJ W]

[TheQ]

Afternoon Awl,

Knackered I am, aft paws are somewhat sore.

 

We had just under 200 visitors, a bit over a 1/3 of whom is required to break even..

The electrickery cash machine worked perfectly if a little slow at times. 

One part  of one of our units of unmentionables spent a short time on its side, but thereafter everything went well.

 

It rained for several hours this morning, then about 15:00 we had a thunderstorm, it was still raining when I took the signs down, and when we loaded at the hall and unloaded at the MRC.

 

I'm off for an early lie down.