Early Risers.

[Tony_S]

I have been injected with radioactive compounds. Now I have to have a gentle walk and eat my sandwiches and sausage roll. 

[southern42]

1 hour ago, TheQ said:

Mooring Awl, Inner Temple Hare,  1006/629,

snip

 

We were supposed to have a visit of the New American managers, today, but this was cancelled yesterday, and todays campany spam informs us that all our company international travel is banned until further notice..

 

snip

 

Spam:  Dear Staff...no more overseas travel...

Staff:  Let's meet on-line...

Software update:  Sorry...system overload....Please try later...

 

Serious stuff.  I remember 9/11 when a Staff Notice came up on screen: BBC News crashed...Try CNN.

Hopefully technology will cope these days.

 

[AndrewC]

10 hours ago, Joseph_Pestell said:

 

I'm sure Ian has done a few micropubs. I still can't really see the point of them. Isn't it better to keep traditional pubs?

There have been many many arguments along the same vein. Basically it boils down to this...

Once upon a time there was the great British Pub. Then the greed of the brewers took over and filled their bars with nothing but their own tasteless yak urine while squeezing out other breweries and making it harder for free houses to buy beer. (see also Watney's)  They also destroyed the interiors of so many pubs. Where there used to be smaller comfortable rooms, we now have larger, noisier open space bars. 

 

The government decided that pubs and breweries should be separated. Voila the birth of the pubco. These companies leveraged the property value of the pubs they bought from the breweries and racked up massive levels of debt. To claw this back they've been ripping off their tenants with the beer tie and other charges. When practical they allow a pub to be run down to the point where it is no longer viable. These get sold for redevelopment. When a pub is viable but the land is more valuable, the pubco will force out the good landlord, and replace him/her with a company employed manager that is dedicated to making the place a failure. Even if the community band together to try and save the pub, the pubco will leave it closed with rental terms that make it impossible to reopen. (see the China Hall in Rotherhithe as a perfect example) After the pub falls into disrepair the pubco points to it and says to the council there is no demand to reopen. Voila, another block of souless people cubes and a fast £ made. 

 

As lifestyles and demographics change, the big breweries and big pubcos are in self cannibalism mode. Slowly selling off their assets to survive and to look good to shareholders.  Along comes the small craft brewer and the concept of a micro-pub. These smaller brewers are still having a difficult time getting their beers into the chain pubs. So, they've started opening up their own tap rooms. The Bermondsey beer mile is a perfect example of this. There are around 16 brewery taps there. Most are small places with seating for around 20-50 at most. These are all pretty much rammed during their rather limited opening hours. They aren't a replacement for pubs but they are an alternative to them. In contrast there are only 2 traditional pubs left in the area and at least 15 that are closed, flattened, converted. 

 

Now half way in between the traditional pub and the brewery tap we have the micro-pub. The first ones started in Kent after so many towns were left without a traditional pub. The pubs were gone and it wasn't really possible to rebuild or new build a pub. They make perfect economic sense. They are a fraction of the cost to start up than even taking over a lease on an existing pub. On average you need £30k in your pocket before a pubco or brewery will even look at you as a potential landlord. £15k for a micro will pay for the conversion and get you open & running. They make use of existing empty shop fronts with their footfall. Hours can be set to be more sociable. Most are closed Mondays, and only open 3-10 most of the rest of the time. Smaller business, smaller costs and much lower rates than a traditional pub. In many ways a micro is more like the cozy bar of yore. No fruit machines, no TV, no pool tables, no music, no lager tw@s, and no mobile phones. Just like the old days. They also support the smaller local brewers. 

 

The boring borough currently has 10 micros with at least 3 more planned or under construction. We are getting another on our high st in the next few months. Greenwich has 3 1/2 with more planned. The half is a temporary popup micro @ Lakedale coffee in Plumstead. They are hoping for an extension from the council to operate 2-4 evenings a week when the coffee shop would normally be closed. It is a great idea to maximise the utilisation of the space. Craft beers in a coffee shop setting. Sounds strange but it is quite enjoyable. Very family and dog friendly. 

 

Each micro is unique, each offers the locals something different. No chains, no identikit bar spaces. I know, I'd rather spend a few hours in the Kentish Belle (train themed no less) or the Bird & Barrel (Bexley Brewing's tap room/micro hybrid) than in some soulless 'spoons filled with louts, or the nearest Greene Thinge pub with it's montezuma's revenge inducing beers and reheated meals. We've lost 5 pubs in the area in the past decade to redevelopment. One more is under threat. One is grade 2 listed but just bought by the same company that illegally demolished the Old Leather Bottle in Belvedere. Micro-pubs are keeping the old traditional pub alive. 

 

On that note, I'm off work today so I'm thinking it is almost beer o clock. Time for a bottle of Belgian tripel, Dulle Teve aka raging bitch perhaps, which I picked up from the Kentish Belle's bottle selection. Try and find that in your local 'spoons. 

[Two_sugars]

1 hour ago, jamie92208 said:

GDB, I hope that the relevant Elf and safety precautions have been taken before you start assembling  the desk.

 

Jamie

He'll be arreet, man . . . . . he knaas where EnR is . .

 

Morning world. it's sunny on the Costa and i have A diabatetic eye appointment. Am I worried?

 

Serpently knot.

 

have a good day all

 

 

John

[Kingzance]

Good morning from here too!

 

Some may feel that AndrewC’s explanation of the differences between outlets for ales and beers might be somewhat jaundiced, I certainly do not think so. We have two village pubs - one is run as a first time enterprise by a couple in their late forties, the other is an older building that is desperately in need of refurbishment. Both are linked through their pubcos to Greene King. The first mentioned is doing ok as a result of hard work by the landlords and staff, the second not so. The second is now up for a new tenant, offers in the region of £400 per week and a requirement that the tenant refurbishes to a certain standard (no doubt using pubco approved contractors- much like The Church of England does). Within a twelve month, I suspect the latter will be sold on for redevelopment even though the community is having over 100 new homes built within their catchment areas!

 

So what else is new in KZland? Very little really, it is Tuesday therefore fish and cribbage. The new provider of golf lessons seemed to keep the grandsons’ attention for a whole 45 minutes so we will persist - obviously at some cost to KZ’s stash of muddling tokens. I may expose the coupe de grasser to the elements later just to even things up a little.

 

Be good and (particularly GDB) be careful. I hope all investigations proceed to a satisfactory outcome.

Edited March 3, 2020 by Kingzance
Correcting auto-corrections

[leopardml2341]

Morning Folks,

 

On a boring conference call at work - have to find something to do; so hopefully reviewed, rated and responded correctly

 

CUL8R

[grandadbob]

Many thanks for your concerns regarding my elf n safety and I'm glad to report that no injuries or mishaps have befallen me. Unlike the desk.  This is primarily because when I started to unpack the bloody thing I found 3 pieces to be damaged.  

It has been returned from whence it came and a replacement has been ordered. If this one is damaged they will be told where to shove it.

 

F.L. Atpackbuilder

[PhilJ W]

Morning all from Estuary-Land. Not a lot to report, things to do so be back later.

6 minutes ago, grandadbob said:

Many thanks for your concerns regarding my elf n safety and I'm glad to report that no injuries or mishaps have befallen me. Unlike the desk.  This is primarily because when I started to unpack the bloody thing I found 3 pieces to be damaged.  

It has been returned from whence it came and a replacement has been ordered. If this one is damaged they will be told where to shove it.

 

F.L. Atpackbuilder

What are the dimensions of the pack? (in case you need some help.)

[grandadbob]

5 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

What are the dimensions of the pack? (in case you need some help.)

 

80cmx44cmx10cm and weighs about 15kg  If it does need shoving where I suggest I suspect it might  smart a bit!  

[PhilJ W]

8 minutes ago, grandadbob said:

 

80cmx44cmx10cm and weighs about 15kg  If it does need shoving where I suggest I suspect it might  smart a bit!  

It will certainly make their eyes water.

[southern42]

We had three pubs, so I have been told, in our once small quarryman's village (which has expanded with council houses and more recent new builds) and before my time - one near us.

 

The BBC's Wales History archived page, The death of the British pub explains:

 

The public house, a place just to drink and talk, arrived in Wales in the early 1700s. To begin with they were beer houses, the name summing up their origins.

Quite simply people opened up their houses and sold beer in their front rooms or parlours. In rural areas these beer houses might be located in farm houses - in towns they were just as likely to be terraced properties,* surrounded on both sides by the dwellings of ordinary men and women.

To begin with these places had no bar counter - such refinements did not come into being until the middle of the 19th century.

The beer (and it was, normally, just beer that was sold) was stored in the pantry and was fetched to your seat or, if you were lucky, to your table by the landlady or landlord, being poured from a jug directly into your glass. Most of these early pubs or beer dens had only one room, with chairs typically set around an inglenook fire or lined along the walls.

These early pubs were well used and provided valuable income for the owners. In many cases they were run by women, the men continuing to work on the farm or foundry during the day and either lending a hand at night or simply sitting and partaking in the entertainment.

It was very much a working class clientèle as the upper echelons of society would either use well-established inns or drink in the comfort of their own homes. But for men coming home from the pit, quarry* or steel works these public houses provided much-needed refreshment after a working day that would probably kill or maim most people in this day and age. 

Beer was also safe to drink. It was, for the most part, relatively clean and unlikely to carry disease. 

 

* Applicable to our village

 

 

Do I foresee a return to such pub?

 

Edited March 3, 2020 by southern42

[AndrewC]

33 minutes ago, grandadbob said:

Many thanks for your concerns regarding my elf n safety and I'm glad to report that no injuries or mishaps have befallen me. Unlike the desk.  This is primarily because when I started to unpack the bloody thing I found 3 pieces to be damaged.  

It has been returned from whence it came and a replacement has been ordered. If this one is damaged they will be told where to shove it.

 

F.L. Atpackbuilder

Inserted width wise rather then lengthwise I would hope. Top tip: Stop at an Asian shop enroute as and pick up a bottle of ghost reaper chilli hot sauce to use as a lubricant. 

[AndrewC]

3 minutes ago, southern42 said:

We had three pubs, so I have been told, in our once small quarryman's village (which has expanded with council houses and more recent new builds) and before my time - one near us.

 

The BBC's Wales History archived page, The death of the British pub explains:

 

The public house, a place just to drink and talk, arrived in Wales in the early 1700s. To begin with they were beer houses, the name summing up their origins.

Quite simply people opened up their houses and sold beer in their front rooms or parlours. In rural areas these beer houses might be located in farm houses - in towns they were just as likely to be terraced properties,* surrounded on both sides by the dwellings of ordinary men and women.

To begin with these places had no bar counter - such refinements did not come into being until the middle of the 19th century.

 

With that, Brains, Wales' largest brewer yesterday announced they were selling off 40 of their pubs. In many ways the current micro is more like the 18th century beer houses. One brewery tap room in Gipsy Hill SE London had no bar. The taps were against one wall and the "bartender walked over, poured, and handed you the glass". 

 

 

[Tony_S]

I can remember pubs having “off sales “ of beer in a jug the customer brought. I didn’t partake but does this still happen anywhere?

[PhilJ W]

2 minutes ago, southern42 said:

We had three pubs, so I have been told, in our once small quarryman's village (which has expanded with council houses and more recent new builds) and before my time - one near us.

 

The BBC's Wales History archived page, The death of the British pub explains:

 

The public house, a place just to drink and talk, arrived in Wales in the early 1700s. To begin with they were beer houses, the name summing up their origins.

Quite simply people opened up their houses and sold beer in their front rooms or parlours. In rural areas these beer houses might be located in farm houses - in towns they were just as likely to be terraced properties,* surrounded on both sides by the dwellings of ordinary men and women.

To begin with these places had no bar counter - such refinements did not come into being until the middle of the 19th century.

The beer (and it was, normally, just beer that was sold) was stored in the pantry and was fetched to your seat or, if you were lucky, to your table by the landlady or landlord, being poured from a jug directly into your glass. Most of these early pubs or beer dens had only one room, with chairs typically set around an inglenook fire or lined along the walls.

These early pubs were well used and provided valuable income for the owners. In many cases they were run by women, the men continuing to work on the farm or foundry during the day and either lending a hand at night or simply sitting and partaking in the entertainment.

It was very much a working class clientèle as the upper echelons of society would either use well-established inns or drink in the comfort of their own homes. But for men coming home from the pit, quarry* or steel works these public houses provided much-needed refreshment after a working day that would probably kill or maim most people in this day and age. 

Beer was also safe to drink. It was, for the most part, relatively clean and unlikely to carry disease. 

 

* Applicable to our village

That reminds me of when I visited the Sittingbourne & Kemsley railway back in the long hot summer of 1976. The car park was some distance from the railway as there was redevelopement going on, in fact the car park was a very dusty recently cleared site. The heat and dust had made me thirsty but en route to the railway I spotted a pub sign in the middle  of a terrace of small houses. I decided to have a pint so I proceded down the street but got to the end of the terrace with no sign of a pub. I looked round and the pub sign was behind me so I retraced my steps and found it was one of the houses. There was only one room, the front room of the house with a diminutive bar in the corner with an equally diminutive old lady serving drinks. The only beer on tap was Shepherd & Neames mild so I settled for that. Alas the pub was part of the redevelopement.

[PhilJ W]

2 minutes ago, Tony_S said:

I can remember pubs having “off sales “ of beer in a jug the customer brought. I didn’t partake but does this still happen anywhere?

I too remember that, the Woolpack in Romford still sold beer like that until the early 70's. Weights and measures legislation killed the practice off. They continued by offering measurable containers of plastic with screw lids but party cans killed it off altogether. The Woolpack is still there (its a listed building) but has now been converted into flats. 

[Tony_S]

There were loads of small one room pubs and similar shops in the Potteries towns when I lived near there at Keele for a year (74-75). My friend seemed to know (and be known in) all of them. 

[TheQ]

Oddly on another forum (yes they do exist) at this moment is a discussion of missing pubs on the Norfolk Broads.

My house is partly on the foundations of one, closed in the 1880s.

 

Another is the Chequers house..  http://www.ludhamarchive.org.uk/Chequers.htm?LMCL=OD9QFr in Horning

Though more recently also in Horning the Black Horse pub closed about 20 years also the Half Moon closed in 1960, the Petersfield Hotel closed about 10 years ago. This leaves Three pubs all tenanted, one of which  is closed at the moment but supposed to reopen by Easter..

[Tony_S]

There used to be a pub in Benfleet called “The Crown”. It was partially demolished by a runaway lorry, which is why it is now called “The Half Crown”.

[The Lurker]

Greetings all from LBG where the wind has grown colder and stronger.

 

Sidcup has two of the Boring Boroughs micro-pubs. One had tea rooms next door also run by the couple but recently closed. They were WW2 themed, which struck me as odd, given that a time of rationing was not time to go out and have cucumber sandwiches and Victoria sponge.

 I prefer the one which is further away from me, the Hackney Carriage, which occupies the premises of a former purveyor of school uniforms known as Twinset.

 

Like Tony I remember off-sales, certainly from the Abington in Northampton in the early 90s. I've not seen that since, but to be fair I have not looked. Since then, a far greater variety of bottled ale has become available in supermarkets so I suspect demand has fallen.

 

I also remember a terraced house pub in Tonbridge, that was called Uncle Tom's Cabin. It was IIRC a free house, a rarity in that area where every other pub was a Whitbread's tied pub  serving Fremlins and Flowers. I have no idea if it is still there.

 

The flow of words to and from india and also food has some interesting patterns; Mumbai from Bombay from Portuguese Bom Bahia is not one you'd immediately think of. Likewise the similarity linguistically between paella and pilau, the latter possibly being a borrowing from the former, and then some of the ingredients in the former going back to Spain. And of course good old "curry" is derived from "cury", a middle  English word derived from medieval French - "cuire"  means to cook in modern French - and was used to describe the meals that were heavy with imported spices. Was that then taken by the British East India company and applied to the cooking of the sub-continent? No-one knows but it's a good tale.

 

 I hope that Tony's radioactive moments are going well, and belated birthday wishes to Ian A.

[Gwiwer]

Greetings one and all.  

 

As Yellow-beer Fever continues to spread we have been given no instructions and had no communication whatsoever regarding the matter.  considering we are up-close and fairly personal with around 1.5bn passengers a year at the House of Fun, and a goodly number of those have recently arrived in the country via Gatwick Airport, there is either no need for the knee-jerking going on in some quarters or a complete and utter abrogation of duty somewhere in the system.  I suspect the former is closer to the mark.  

 

Risk management would be the name of the game.  Setting unknown parameters of viral infection and spreading rates against the potential disruption to the daily lives of the nation if gatherings and close contact were restricted.  Put simply "What are the chances?" and the answer seems to be very very small indeed in general terms.  The common cold and the annual rounds of influenza are spread as easily - if not more so - infect more people and can be lethal.  One death is one too many but we are not able to eliminate the risk altogether.  

 

In other news I have received and installed a three-way pint* to good effect.  Things are moving much better now.  My experience of micro-pubs is rather limited but BiL has taken me to a couple.  The atmosphere was - at first - relaxed and convivial but as they became more popular it became overcrowded and sometimes entry was restricted owing to the numbers.  And the single toilet originally provided which proved to be insufficient relief.  One venue has now spilled out onto the pavement and the other is seeking to expand into larger premises - a marcro-pub maybe?  The ales have always been excellent however.  

 

* That might have been a Freudian slip - neither single nor double but three-way - to avoid a painful awling.  I have yet to encounter a beer glass with three individual outlets  

[Kingzance]

Ah Rick, is a marcro pub one for explorers who make an r's of themselves or could it be related to the provision of illicit substances - as in narco? Pray tell all 

[AndrewC]

1 hour ago, Tony_S said:

I can remember pubs having “off sales “ of beer in a jug the customer brought. I didn’t partake but does this still happen anywhere?

Yes yes, a thousand times yes. The vast majority of micro-pubs sell takeaway. Most are in plastic 2 or 4 pint jugs. Other places have “growler fills” which allows one to have what ever they want filled as long as they can accurately measure what is being sold. Unlike the US growlers haven’t taken off as much but micros rule for draught off sales. 

 

Lurker, technically you have 4 micros. Hopper’s Hut by Waitrose, Hackney Carriage closer to the station (and Invicta models), The Hanger at the oval, and Half Way which is really closer to Eltham but still in a Sidcup post code. The Hanger, it’s carbon copy the Bolthole, and the soon to open in Welling, the Hanger II, are less traditional micro-pubs and more like micro-spoons bars. 

[TheQ]

55 minutes ago, Gwiwer said:

Greetings one and all.  

 

 

 

* That might have been a Freudian slip - neither single nor double but three-way - to avoid a painful awling.  I have yet to encounter a beer glass with three individual outlets  

 

[Ian Abel]

First and foremost, thanks to all for the birthday greetings

 

Delayed posting due to a busy weekend, even if there seems to be little actually accomplished!

Another package DID arrive providing more G-gauge track for the garden

 

Saturday:

We (well the Mrs!!) decided it was such nice day we would walk to a local book store.

3 miles later  mission accomplished! Had I not been working out since Feb 1st., I'd have never managed the distance, especially at the Mrs pace. Definitely seeing the effects of deciding to get in shape.

Following that we went to dinner at a friends house, she always has a celebration as March 1st is HER birthday and with mine March 2nd. she arranges a get together.

 

The following must be preceded with a warning - those (myself especially) of British inclination may/will find this sort of dinner very un-British. It involved eating pretty much EVERYTHING with your hands!

Not sure exactly how this should have played out given the current virus issues, but here goes.

The dinner was what's referred to as a "dump dinner". The easy/normal part is to dump a bunch of ingredients - shrimp, corn halves, snow peas, kielbasa sausage pieces, spices and more - in a large pot and cook, then part two (not in all locations apparently) drain and DUMP the entire meal contents on a table, suitable covered. Add bread and butter for the bread/corn, and you go at the pile by hand - seems more medieval than anything!

It was all excellent, but takes some for me to not have a knife and fork to use!

 

Sunday - choir sung at two services, so up early and not ready to relax until early afternoon. Dog walk and done.

 

Monday - birthday, but simply work and heading to NY in mid-afternoon, uneventful trip to JFK, not sure I'm exactly excited by the need to be in a busy international terminal at present, but avoid touching ANYTHING and it's probably not that bad... uh huh...

 

So here we are, on Long Island again, apparently MAJOR changes (quelle surprise!!) to some reports as the new CFO has finally got his teeth into the job and wants his own mark (unlike dogs, pi$$ing on a tree isn't sufficient) on the format, so were playing musical accounts this week.

 

Self selected "birthday present/ride";

New convertible Mustang and looks like the weather will cooperate this week and I'll be able to put the top down for a few trips

 

7 and partly sunny with rain just stopped driving in, headed for 12 and maybe some showers later.

Sunny supposedly most of the rest of the week.

 

Carry on...