BBC NightSleeper

[KeithMacdonald]

On 16/09/2024 at 16:31, PhilJ W said:

They seem to have all of the disaster movie stock characters. The hero out of favour with his superiors, the PITA politician, the 'lost' child, the lady in a wheelchair and a few others on the train. And off the train the computer internet expert that the head of the department doesn't want but the only person who can sort it out..

 

How about the pilot driver falls ill with food poisoning, and the flight attendants ask if anyone knows how to fly a plane drive a train. Fortunately there is a doctor on board to treat all the sick passengers, and the automatic pilot rises to the occasion remote control is magically restored with about 0.1 metres of track remaining before a 1000 metres vertical drop.

 

Surely you cannot be serious?

[KeithMacdonald]

On 03/09/2024 at 11:13, Damo666 said:

I do wonder about the set’s health and safety coordinators having actors running on the top of carriages

 

It's been done before, even with horses!

Although, perhaps, a little CGI was involved?

FWIW, I'm think of the climax of The Lone Ranger.

Perhaps it's easier on Steam Heritage trains?

 

 

[Damo666]

3 hours ago, KeithMacdonald said:

 

It's been done before, even with horses!

Although, perhaps, a little CGI was involved?

FWIW, I'm think of the climax of The Lone Ranger.

Perhaps it's easier on Steam Heritage trains?

 

 

Now that made me laugh.

 

There are soooooo many improbabilities in that Lone Ranger chase scene I know it’s all tongue-in-cheek, and I can totally live with that. It’s comedy on a different level, it’s fun, it’s enjoyable and it’s not to be taken seriously.

 

As I alluded to in my opening post, if it’s supposed to be serious, then make it have some semblance of reality.

 

Thanks for sharing the clip.

[MarkC]

On 03/09/2024 at 12:13, Damo666 said:

I do wonder about the set’s health and safety coordinators having actors running on the top of carriages with OHLE.

 

 

Indeed so. Potentially quite shocking...

[adb968008]

So we binge watched this last week to the end of the series.

 

its entertaining entertainment.

its reminded me of the Silver Streak which I just happened to watch last month.

i am impressed the UK can produce a Hollywood style film on a UK budget, it makes a difference to the cheap jack hows yer father budget films of 20 years ago, which focused on storyline and irony rather than graphics and thrills.

I can imagine this selling well overseas, and not a bad advert for the sleeper, for those seeking adventure.

 

overall I was impressed at the set detail, I understood no actual rail vehicles used on the sleeper.. those interiors are pretty good, even if the guards compartment is probably the most technically advanced and spacious than there ever has been.

 

ive seen much worse than this on TV, and thats what matters.. tbh I felt train truckers was much more OTT and thats meant to be a documentary. I did note the very politically correct cast and roles they played, obvious for the BBC. Everytime I saw that minister it reminded me of Liz Truss.

 

This was typical exaggerated entertainment for those who want fear, but dont care the reality being impossible.. Put Tom Cruise in the lead role it’d be a box office smash.

 

 

 

 

Edited September 28 by adb968008

[Ducking Giraffe]

But where was the lady with the guitar singing to the sick child who needed a drip? And why didn't they all come down with food poisoning? (It was the fish. Causes uncontrollable flatulence and dribbling.)

[Pacific231G]

On 28/09/2024 at 14:05, MarkC said:

  On 03/09/2024 at 11:13, Damo666 said:

I do wonder about the set’s health and safety coordinators having actors running on the top of carriages with OHLE.

Indeed so. Potentially quite shocking...

don't worry Mark, they didn't!  I have though seen how the BBC did once do that for real (not with OHLE) back when CGI was still in the futiure , and it was pretty foolproof. Along with other measures, there were catch nets attached to the train and between the carriages, out of shot everywhere an actor might have fallen.  

I watched it tonight and it has entered the Cassandra Crossing level of incredibilty with the uncoupling scenario. The idea that the train, if it derailed or crashed, would cause more casualties on the ground than on the train was frankly risible. I can't think of a single example (American trains full of inflammables apart) where that's happened. 

Edited September 30 by Pacific231G

[MarkC]

14 hours ago, Pacific231G said:

don't worry Mark, they didn't!  I have though seen how the BBC did once do that for real (not with OHLE) back when CGI was still in the futiure , and it was pretty foolproof. Along with other measures, there were catch nets attached to the train and between the carriages, out of shot everywhere an actor might have fallen.  

I watched it tonight and it has entered the Cassandra Crossing level of incredibilty with the uncoupling scenario. The idea that the train, if it derailed or crashed, would cause more casualties on the ground than on the train was frankly risible. I can't think of a single example (American trains full of inflammables apart) where that's happened. 

Ah well - my attempt at humour was an epic fail!

 

But yes, <before CGI> was a different world, but even with safeguards, ocasionally it went 'orribly wrong. Wasn't someone badly hurt during the filming of "Octopussy"?

 

As for uncoupling trains on the move - there are quite a few examples...

 

Mark

[melmerby]

2 hours ago, MarkC said:

But yes, <before CGI> was a different world, but even with safeguards, ocasionally it went 'orribly wrong. Wasn't someone badly hurt during the filming of "Octopussy"?

A technician was run over and killed during the Ben Hur chariot race.

 

In the relatively early days of US railroads two steam trains were deliberately run into each other head-on, in front a large audience.

The resulting boiler explosions and scattered debris killed quite a few spectators.

Edited September 30 by melmerby

[Dava]

On 27/09/2024 at 11:23, KeithMacdonald said:

 

How about the pilot driver falls ill with food poisoning, and the flight attendants ask if anyone knows how to fly a plane drive a train. Fortunately there is a doctor on board to treat all the sick passengers, and the automatic pilot rises to the occasion remote control is magically restored with about 0.1 metres of track remaining before a 1000 metres vertical drop.

 

Surely you cannot be serious?

How could they make this without Lesley Nielsen? 
Airplane on rails!

 

[Legend]

I switched over to Mortimer and Whitehouse gone fishing on BBC2 Sunday and Call my Bluff on BBC4 Monday , but caught the last half hours on both nights , which was enough I think ! Didn’t miss much and I know how it ended 

[Pacific231G]

WARNING SPOILERS

We were supposed to believe that a train (actually just the locomotive and one or two coaches by the time it got to London) crashing into the buffers at Victoria at 100MPH would take out the whole district. In reality (though I wouldn't recommend it) you'd likely be fairly safe at the back of the concourse. Also, did anyone notice that though the train was gallivanting around a large part of Britain's main line rail network, when it stopped, and often when it was in close up, it was on a single track line with bullhead rail- funny that.  Oh well, it was entertaining enough for about three episodes then it got silly

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ANufwUPFm8&ab_channel=McNickler 

Edited October 1 by Pacific231G

[45156]

Having read some of these comments, I reversed my decision not to watch this, but binge watched it over two days.

 

Well produced, certainly. well(ish) cast too.  But both James Cosmo and Sharon Small are pretty good actors.  But also too many stereotypes - the self preserving politician, lost boy, and wheelchair using civil rights lawyer and the "let's all get p*sssed" accountant.

 

Plausible - not at all.  As soon as we got to the level crossing between the Caley main line and the GSW main line, and the sluggish 37, I knew that as this went on the credibility was going to drop and drop - and the revalation of protagonist was the most improbable of all.

[Damo666]

On 02/10/2024 at 00:07, Pacific231G said:

Oh well, it was entertaining enough for about three episodes then it got silly

 

9 minutes ago, 45156 said:

Plausible - not at all.

As the OP, I would like to thank all the contributors who watched this on my behalf and offered their opinion, they have saved me from wasting numerous hours. 😁

 

Now, back to my latest discovery, Slow Horses (not railway related).

[Michael Hodgson]

On 27/09/2024 at 11:23, KeithMacdonald said:

 

How about the pilot driver falls ill with food poisoning, and the flight attendants ask if anyone knows how to fly a plane drive a train. Fortunately there is a doctor on board to treat all the sick passengers, and the automatic pilot rises to the occasion remote control is magically restored with about 0.1 metres of track remaining before a 1000 metres vertical drop.

 

Surely you cannot be serious?

Haven't you got to have a nun in the full penguin suit ?  I thought they were obligatory.

[RJS1977]

22 minutes ago, 45156 said:

Plausible - not at all.  As soon as we got to the level crossing between the Caley main line and the GSW main line, and the sluggish 37, I knew that as this went on the credibility was going to drop and drop - and the revalation of protagonist was the most improbable of all.

 

The trouble is that we, the knowledgeable ones, know that the scenarios - at least those relating to train operation and safety - are completely ludicrous and wouldn't happen in real life, but the majority of people watching it don't. Programming like this - whether intentionally or otherwise - send out a message that "railways are dangerous", and with the UK rail network still struggling to return to pre-pandemic passenger numbers, the last thing it needs is unnecessary negativity.

[RJS1977]

On 30/09/2024 at 18:29, Dava said:

How could they make this without Lesley Nielsen? 
Airplane on rails!

 

 

That's a different kind of disaster movie altogether!

[RJS1977]

On 30/09/2024 at 01:10, Pacific231G said:

 

The idea that the train, if it derailed or crashed, would cause more casualties on the ground than on the train was frankly risible. 

 

I don't think it's inconceivable and it's possibly only down to location of where accidents have taken place.

 

It is a testament to the crashworthiness of modern rolling stock that only one passenger was killed when a Pendolino rolled down the embankment at Grayrigg.  Had there been pedestrians in the field, or had the Pendolino rolled on to a road, there could have been more casualties outside the train than on it. Remember too that at Potter's Bar a pedestrian was killed by masonry dislodges from a bridge by a derailed train.

 

Indeed, in the 1895 Montparnasse derailment, there were no casualties on the train but a pedestrian outside the station was killed by falling masonry - had the street been busier, maybe many more would have been killed.

[Philou]

3 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

pedestrian outside the station was killed

 

IIRC 'twas a poor lady seller of newspapers that caught the train ................

[PhilJ W]

4 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

Indeed, in the 1895 Montparnasse derailment, there were no casualties on the train but a pedestrian outside the station was killed by falling masonry - had the street been busier, maybe many more would have been killed.

There was a similar accident at Ramsgate Harbour station, also resulting in the death of a passer by.

[Pacific231G]

1 hour ago, PhilJ W said:

There was a similar accident at Ramsgate Harbour station, also resulting in the death of a passer by.

Ramsgate Harbour station is a particular interest but I'd not heard of this. Do tell more. 

 

6 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

 

I don't think it's inconceivable and it's possibly only down to location of where accidents have taken place.

 

It is a testament to the crashworthiness of modern rolling stock that only one passenger was killed when a Pendolino rolled down the embankment at Grayrigg.  Had there been pedestrians in the field, or had the Pendolino rolled on to a road, there could have been more casualties outside the train than on it. Remember too that at Potter's Bar a pedestrian was killed by masonry dislodges from a bridge by a derailed train.

 

Indeed, in the 1895 Montparnasse derailment, there were no casualties on the train but a pedestrian outside the station was killed by falling masonry - had the street been busier, maybe many more would have been killed.

The plotline in Night Sleeper was that if the train did crash at full speed into the buffers at Victoria, it would take out nearby buildings - including the cyber security headquarters where they were trying to stop it. 

I don't know why Wiki refers to Montparnasse as a derailment. It was an overrun accident caused by a late brake application by a driver who'd been trying to make up time (he got two months in jail) . The carriages were undamaged and even the locomotive was very soon back in service. The train did cross a 30 m concourse but, being France, there were no high platforms so only the buffers and the end wall of the station to stop it.  The first vehicle behind the tender was a fourgon  (guards van more or less) so the carriages were somewhat separated from the crash itself ( that was the regulation in France until steel bodied carriages replaced wooden ones) 

 

There was  a not disimilar accident at Union Station in Washingron DC in 1953 when a brake failure (due to a cock being closed by contact with a coupler) in all but the first three carriages of a heavy sixteen coach train caused it to  run into the bumper of a terminal track at about 35 MPH. Nobody was killed even though part of the train fell through the concourse into rooms beneath. Apparently , that incident was the inspiration for the Silver Streak movie.   

Results of a similar accident at Gare de Lyon in Paris in Paris were more deadly when a train whose brakes had failed due to an error by a driver ran at speed into a crowded commuter train ready to depart from a low level platform. 59 people died in that accident but AFAIK they were almost all in the first coach of the stationary train from which there  were only two survivors , Nobody in the runaway train was killed as theyd all moved back down the train. However, looking at images from the accident there is very little sign of damage to the station itself. About nine months later  I saw, from a steam special,  the coach that had been collided with (a driving trailer) sitting on a siding and it was a pretty horrific sight. 

 It was kept there in its post crash condition because it was evidential for the subsequent court cases. 

The driver of the stationary train remained at his post as the runaway approached in order to repeat the order to his passengers to get off the train. He was killed but his courage undoubtedly saved dozens of other lives. 

 

Edited October 11 by Pacific231G

[Welchester]

14 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

There was a similar accident at Ramsgate Harbour station, also resulting in the death of a passer by.

 

12 hours ago, Pacific231G said:

Ramsgate Harbour station is a particular interest but I'd not heard of this. Do tell more.

 

I think it must be this one:

 

https://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/eventsummary.php?eventID=5721

[PhilJ W]

54 minutes ago, Welchester said:

 

 

I think it must be this one:

 

https://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/eventsummary.php?eventID=5721

More detailed report here.

https://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/docsummary.php?docID=7124