Which route would you choose?

[Matt37268]

On 14/08/2024 at 20:59, 55020 said:

 

What, you mean I can leave?  Damn, how come it's taken this long for someone to tell me.  😂

 

 

Steve

I believe it’s Royston Vasey that you can never leave… 😜

Otherwise known as Glossop and I’m not sure about that one either 😀

[Matt37268]

As a serious reply to this topic, I believe that when my Dad was growing up in West Bromwich, a journey on his holidays to Highley could involve something like 3 to 5 changes of train depending on the route, depending on directions. And this is all on one region not that far apart regarding distance. 

The easiest would be West Bromwich to Snow Hill, change there for train to Stourbridge Junction, Kidderminster or Hartlebury change at either one of those for train to Bewdley, and finally Change there for train to Highley.

Or alternatively going north change at somewhere like Dudley Port, Dudley, Old Hill then the route as above. 

I could also mention going via Shrewsbury and Wooferton Juction but I don’t think my tiny mind can cope this late and having 2 bottles of Bishops Farewell. 

Although as one last Aside a few years ago several times I went to Cardiff to chase Class 37’s when your ticket shows no restrictions on route, from Sandwell and Dudley, I was never questioned for going or returning via Wolves and Shrewsbury, Hereford and Kiddy, Chepstow and Gloucester or Via Bristol Parkway and Cheltenham. 🤔 

[kevinlms]

13 hours ago, BoD said:

I wasn’t being totally serious. 😉

 

I mean, we’d have to rebuild Kinnaber Junction for a start.

I didn't think you were serious either. It's still a valid point that there was no southbound racing. 

[Oldddudders]

Early childhood in Betchworth, but a mile from the station, meant it seldom figured in family trips, although when my father worked at Horselydown (spelling optional, I believe) near London Bridge, that was his route. But by the late '50s he had been moved to Park Street, for which Waterloo was more convenient, so if I went to London with him we would catch the 414 bus into Dorking, and a brisk walk down Deepdene Avenue to Dorking North. The 4-Sub service called at almost all halts and lamp-posts. OTOH, if I went to London with mum, we would go to Victoria on sumptuous 4-Cors, pausing only at Sutton. The sound of the MG set, conspicuously missing on the Subs, somehow added to a child's idea of travel sophistication!

 

London to Exeter is a conundrum. Unquestionably the GWR route is much faster, and I find the 8xx comfortable enough, with free coffee in first class. But I love the 159s on the LSWR route, and the more leisurely trip is preferable if time is not of the essence - which it usually is if I'm fresh off the Eurostar, having already been travelling for more than 7 hours via Paris!

 

Beeching preached the end of duplication. Hence Paddington to Birmingham was only to be promoted until WCML electrification fructified that far. Similarly the MML services to Scotland were doomed once ECML and WCML were modernised, even before electrification throughout. The GC - "Main Line in the Shadows" as ISTR Trains Illustrated called it in the early '60s, even before Beeching - had less and less chance. 

[Wickham Green too]

6 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

... Paddington to Birmingham ...

Hmmm ..... HS2 ...... hmmm 😎

[Reorte]

20 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

On the other hand, the Midland, with the slower route to Scotland, played the scenery card in its advertising - appealing to enthusiasts of sorts. Also of course comfort - in other words, better both inside and out!

Have to say that's what would likely be the thing to sway me (assuming the difference in cost and time isn't colossal). I often drive slower routes these days after all, because (obviously up to a point) I put a lot more value on a pleasant journey than a fast or cheap one. Past a certain point I actually dislike fast.

Edited August 16 by Reorte

[Pete the Elaner]

2 minutes ago, Reorte said:

Have to say that's what would likely be the thing to sway me (assuming the difference in cost and time isn't colossal). I often drive slower routes these days after all, because (obviously up to a point) I put a lot more value on a pleasant journey than a fast or cheap one. Past a certain point I actually dislike fast.

 

Not just scenery, but also railways.

I took the slow route home from Birmingham to London a few times to get different haulage to usual. Given the choice, I preferred 86/87 haulage, but it was nice for a change to get something different & 47s were on most of the cross country routes via Oxford & Reading at the time.

 

I sometimes do the same when travelling by car. I prefer the M6 to the M6(Toll) not because of the toll itself, but partly because you cannot see Bescot from the Toll. This is more important if I have a passenger who has a railway interest, so I can get a commentary of what is there.

I also drove to ModelRail Scotland last year & stopped for something to eat somewhere around Stoke-on-Trent. That would be a slight detour to Crewe then. Any excuse to see the APT is a good one.

[Compound2632]

In Women in Love, D.H. Lawrence has a couple of his characters discussing choice of train from Nottinham to London. The choice between Midland and Central was, as I recall, entirely down to convenience of the train times. 

[Michael Hodgson]

On 14/08/2024 at 19:55, BlackFivesMatter said:

Many towns and cities had services to other principal cities and towns offered by one or more pre grouping and pre nationalisation companies. I understand that ticket prices were controlled to an extent.

So if you say loved in London and wanted to travel to Exeter you had the choice of GWR or LSWR routes.  How would the traveller choose which route. Likewise if you lived in Aberdeen and wanted to go to London (fool) would you choose the ecml or west coast? 

 

It is my understanding that if One was in Buck House and wanted to go to Cambridge or Sandringham, One would normally go from KIngs Cross rather than Liverpool Street because the latter is in the City of London whereas the former isn't, and that means there are certain archaic formalities that would have to be observed when crossing the border between Westminster and the square mile on One's journey to the station

[Michael Hodgson]

8 hours ago, Matt37268 said:

The easiest would be West Bromwich to Snow Hill, change there for train to Stourbridge Junction, Kidderminster or Hartlebury change at either one of those for train to Bewdley, and finally Change there for train to Highley.

Or alternatively going north change at somewhere like Dudley Port, Dudley, Old Hill then the route as above. 

 

 

I knew a chap (an LMS man) in Bimingham who always said he preferred the GWR route to Wolverhampton Low Level, because the scenery was so much better - the GW line being mostly in cutting vs the elevated LMS route to High Level station.

[Siberian Snooper]

As a kid ( during the 60s) up to Vic from Horsham, was always the fast, Dorking North and Sutton, whereas coming home, it was always the first available.  The other route was all shacks to Gatwick and then East Croydon. Sometimes Faygate was missed out.

 

 

[BlackFivesMatter]

2 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said:

 

I knew a chap (an LMS man) in Bimingham who always said he preferred the GWR route to Wolverhampton Low Level, because the scenery was so much better - the GW line being mostly in cutting vs the elevated LMS route to High Level station.

 The scenery between Birmingham and Wolverhampton? Scenery? Just as well I didn't have a cup of coffee at my lips when I read that! 

[Hal Nail]

11 hours ago, Matt37268 said:

The easiest would be West Bromwich to Snow Hill, change there for train to Stourbridge Junction, Kidderminster or Hartlebury change at either one of those for train to Bewdley, and finally Change there for train to Highley.

I could easily be getting various WBA, SVR and Telford trips mushed together but doesn't the Kidderminster train go through Smethwick Galton Bridge which is walking distance from the Hawthorns, so could do that to avoid going into Birmingham? Plus you get to see the shrine!

[Red Devil]

12 hours ago, Matt37268 said:

I believe it’s Royston Vasey that you can never leave… 😜

Otherwise known as Glossop and I’m not sure about that one either 😀

Hadfield.....

Glossop looks like Las Vegas in comparison to Hadfield....

 

[Artless Bodger]

When Head Gardener worked in Newcastle (I remained living in Reading), when I visited for weekend I'd usually take the Friday off, and use Cross Country. I actually found 5+ hours in a Voyager seat more comfortable than 3 hours in a mk4, and the scenery and railway interest preferable. If I went from work on a Friday night (Overton to W'loo, KX 20.00 terminating Newcastle) it was just 3 hours to Newcastle, first stop York, unless of course there was a trespass, broken down freight or wires down. But after York my back was so uncomfortable that I almost had to stand the rest of the way. 

 

 

[Compound2632]

3 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said:

It is my understanding that if One was in Buck House and wanted to go to Cambridge or Sandringham, One would normally go from KIngs Cross rather than Liverpool Street because the latter is in the City of London whereas the former isn't, and that means there are certain archaic formalities that would have to be observed when crossing the border between Westminster and the square mile on One's journey to the station

 

The Great Eastern ran Cambridge expresses from St Pancras; I would have expected that to be the favoured route at least pre-grouping or pre-Great War, St Pancras being more favourably laid out for corralling royalty.

[Matt37268]

38 minutes ago, Hal Nail said:

I could easily be getting various WBA, SVR and Telford trips mushed together but doesn't the Kidderminster train go through Smethwick Galton Bridge which is walking distance from the Hawthorns, so could do that to avoid going into Birmingham? Plus you get to see the shrine!

That’s Correct, but Galton Bridge didn’t open until 1995!
When Dad had his holibobs in Highley we’re talking about between about 1958-62ish, Although they could have gone to Oldbury (now Sandwell and Dudley) or Spon Lane to Rolfe Street then walked over to Smethwick West and caught the train there! 
When you think of the choice’s and all these stations are all within a mile and a half radius it does make the mind boggle slightly. 😵‍💫

[Compound2632]

1 hour ago, Matt37268 said:

 Although they could have gone to Oldbury (now Sandwell and Dudley) or Spon Lane to Rolfe Street then walked over to Smethwick West and caught the train there! 

 

Smethwick Rolfe Street was where, aged eight, I lost my confidence in parental infallibility. Mum had got us on the wrong train at New Street; we should have been heading back home to Four Oaks. What made it worse to a serious-minded infant was that she thought the mistake hilarious.

[Hal Nail]

1 hour ago, Artless Bodger said:

When Head Gardener worked in Newcastle (I remained living in Reading), when I visited for weekend I'd usually take the Friday off, and use Cross Country.

As an impoverished student in the 80s, I travelled once a term from Southampton to Newcastle. The London route was far too expensive so I'd get the Sunday direct train which took 11 hours. I think it managed to kill 45 mins just between Durham and Newcastle!

 

To ring the changes, purely for the railway interest, coming back, I'd sometimes get the early train to Bristol and then down through Salisbury.

Edited August 16 by Hal Nail

[turbos]

One of the factors not mentioned so far is that humans in general are creatures of habit and once they know a route they’ll stick to it even when a better alternative becomes available. There are still a lot of people in Scotland that when travelling to Glasgow airport, Greenock or the M77 and approaching Glasgow on the M80 then battle through the centre of Glasgow on the M8, when the marginally further but much more pleasant and less stressful M80-M73-M74-M8 gets you to the airport at the same time and often earlier (and gives some nice views of Polmadie depot). When challenged on using this route they always answer ‘but that’s the route I know!

For local journeys when people know the price and choices available they’ll use the service that best matches their needs and circumstances. Whereas for longer distance journeys they’d do more research similar to what we do these days when flying long haul. It’s those occasional medium distance journeys that people often don’t make the best choices for.

 

Brian.

 

 

 

[The Johnster]

I have on several occasions had to drive Cardiff-Holyhead for Irish ferries, and most folk I know go M4/A449/A40/M50/M5/M6/A55/A5, something like 130 miles out of the way.  Takes about 5hours so long are there are no tailbacks M5/M6.  A470 is slower but more direct (at least by Welsh standards), takes about 5hrs 30, not much traffic beyond Merthyr, scenery as good as it gets anywhere, and generally more pleasant and relaxing.  Came back that way on a winter Sunday evening once, passed all of four other vehicles between Bettws-y-Coed and Merthyr, clear night full moon, drove on sidelights a good bit of the way; magnificent!

 

I love this sort of motoring.  M/ways are boring.

Edited August 16 by The Johnster

[Compound2632]

18 minutes ago, The Johnster said:

I have on several occasions had to drive Cardiff-Holyhead for Irish ferries, and most folk I know go M4/A449/A40/M50/M5/M6/A55/A5, something like 130 miles out of the way.  Takes about 5hours so long are there are no tailbacks M5/M6.  A470 is slower but more direct (at least by Welsh standards), takes about 5hrs 30, not much traffic beyond Merthyr, scenery as good as it gets anywhere, and generally more pleasant and relaxing.  Came back that way on a winter Sunday evening once, passed all of four other vehicles between Bettws-y-Coed and Merthyr, clear night full moon, drove on sidelights a good bit of the way; magnificent

 

The Midland had a Swansea - Aberystwyth through carriage in the high old days - I wonder how often anyone travelled through.

[RichardT]

5 hours ago, BlackFivesMatter said:

 The scenery between Birmingham and Wolverhampton? Scenery? Just as well I didn't have a cup of coffee at my lips when I read that! 

I think you might have missed the irony in @Michael Hodgson’s post

😀

Look again at why the LMS chap preferred the GWR route…

[Matt37268]

7 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Smethwick Rolfe Street was where, aged eight, I lost my confidence in parental infallibility. Mum had got us on the wrong train at New Street; we should have been heading back home to Four Oaks. What made it worse to a serious-minded infant was that she thought the mistake hilarious.

At the tender age of 12 at the SVR’s 1940’s weekend in the summer of 1996  I remember telling my mother that ‘we’ve really got to get on this train’ whilst at Kidderminster on the Sunday afternoon and being told to ‘be quiet, we’re going to enjoy the band performance’ 

Whilst the band is playing 80079 gets away with the last train of the day to Bridgnorth… (I’m guessing there’s a few of you ahead of me now 😀) 

 

Mum then asks what time the next train is to Bewdley where the car’s parked…

 

In 1998 2 years later when I still can’t smoke, vote, purchase alcohol or have sex, a friend of mine asks me if I fancy a day out with Deltic 22 to Ramsgate? 
£19 something Supersaver return, My Nan says she’ll treat me, my mates got all the times worked out for me from Sandwell and Dudley etc.

 

My Mother is slightly unsure about me travelling all that distance, train times etc until as my Father points out ‘He knew what one was the last bloody train out of Kidderminster the other year didn’t he?’ 

I’ve done a Deltic to Ramsgate 😀 and every now and then we like to remind my mother about getting the last train from Kiddy (my parents have been settled in Bewdley now for the past 8 years or so 😀) 

[Michael Hodgson]

18 hours ago, Hal Nail said:

As an impoverished student in the 80s, I travelled once a term from Southampton to Newcastle. The London route was far too expensive so I'd get the Sunday direct train which took 11 hours. I think it managed to kill 45 mins just between Durham and Newcastle!

 

 

As a student I caught the train from New Street to Newcastle a couple of times a term.  It always ran about 20 late.  So at about the time it was due in Newcastle it would just be slowing for its stop at Durham with the view from the viaduct.  I would look u to see my fellow passengers getting their cases off the racks and say it would only be another 20 minutes to Newcastle.  "Isn't this Newcastle then?"  "No, that's just Durham Gaol."