RMweb Gold Harlequin Posted August 2 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 2 (edited) I've just been asked to agree to new site terms and I guess this is the same for everyone. The highlighted section says: Do not post any content or links that serve to promote or offer for sale any goods, services, transaction or commercial entity that you have any involvement with unless agreement is reached which applies from the above date. All previous arrangements are now superseded. What does this mean in practice? Do any of us who are selling items in the "For sale (gold member use only)" area now need to seek agreement, post 1 Aug 2024? What about the big players? Do they need agreement to be able to talk about their products? Thanks, Edited August 2 by AY Mod Title edited for better exposure 1 1 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Steadfast Posted August 2 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 2 Yes I've just had this same pop up. 16 minutes ago, Harlequin said: What about the big players? Do they need agreement to be able to talk about their products? Same for us smaller suppliers - previously had it ok'd by Andy to mention my wares amongst the community. Jo 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators AY Mod Posted August 2 Administrators Share Posted August 2 17 minutes ago, Harlequin said: Do any of us who are selling items in the "For sale (gold member use only)" area now need to seek agreement, post 1 Aug 2024? No; that's a benefit of paid membership. 1 minute ago, Steadfast said: Yes I've just had this same pop up. Same for us smaller suppliers - previously had it ok'd by Andy to mention my wares amongst the community. Jo Any commercial activities need to be agreed with our advertising folk. Please contact sarah.jarman@warnersgroup.co.uk from Monday onwards. 1 1 4 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators AY Mod Posted August 2 Administrators Share Posted August 2 20 minutes ago, Harlequin said: What about the big players? Do they need agreement to be able to talk about their products? If they want to publicise their products or activity themselves, yes. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Steadfast Posted August 2 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 2 2 minutes ago, AY Mod said: No; that's a benefit of paid membership. Any commercial activities need to be agreed with our advertising folk. Please contact sarah.jarman@warnersgroup.co.uk from Monday onwards. Thanks Andy. Jo 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold zr2498 Posted August 2 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 2 11 minutes ago, AY Mod said: If they want to publicise their products or activity themselves, yes. Andy Would that be for every potential post by a manufacturer or can one covering agreement be set up front. I have a concern that those suppliers who contribute well to RMWeb might decide to keep stum in future. This would be a loss to the forum. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators AY Mod Posted August 2 Administrators Share Posted August 2 24 minutes ago, zr2498 said: Would that be for every potential post by a manufacturer or can one covering agreement be set up front. Of course they wouldn't have to ask permission for every post; there will be an agreement that they can post and promote their business and products for the duration of any agreement. 26 minutes ago, zr2498 said: I have a concern that those suppliers who contribute well to RMWeb might decide to keep stum in future. This would be a loss to the forum. If commercial entities wish to use the site to promote their business or products it is reasonable to expect that they support the site if they are deriving a benefit. Several already do. You support the site with your Gold membership for whatever benefit you determined it was for you and I thank you for that. It's appropriate that the same principle is extended more widely. 10 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Harlequin Posted August 2 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 2 (edited) 21 minutes ago, AY Mod said: Of course they wouldn't have to ask permission for every post; there will be an agreement that they can post and promote their business and products for the duration of any agreement. If commercial entities wish to use the site to promote their business or products it is reasonable to expect that they support the site if they are deriving a benefit. Several already do. You support the site with your Gold membership for whatever benefit you determined it was for you and I thank you for that. It's appropriate that the same principle is extended more widely. Are you saying that commercial entities will have to come to a financial agreement with RMweb/Warners to be able to promote their products here? Edited August 2 by Harlequin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators AY Mod Posted August 2 Administrators Share Posted August 2 7 minutes ago, Harlequin said: Are you saying that commercial entities will have to come to a financial agreement with RMweb/Warners to be able to promote their products here? Broadly, yes; that may be as a separate agreement regarding RMweb or as part of a package tied in with their other activities with our business. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northerngirl Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 7 minutes ago, AY Mod said: Broadly, yes; that may be as a separate agreement regarding RMweb or as part of a package tied in with their other activities with our business. This seems an incredibly poor and misguided approach, what incentive is there to pay to say you are making a model, when someone will create a thread within minutes of it being announced 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Parker Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 2 minutes ago, Northerngirl said: This seems an incredibly poor and misguided approach, what incentive is there to pay to say you are making a model, when someone will create a thread within minutes of it being announced It's a big picture thing - ask yourself this, who should pay to keep RMweb working? If someone is making money out of advertising here, should they not contribute a little? 3 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators AY Mod Posted August 2 Administrators Share Posted August 2 3 minutes ago, Northerngirl said: This seems an incredibly poor and misguided approach, Why? If a business is going to derive a benefit then they should contribute. I'm not going to ban users from talking about a company's products or services but if they are creating topics on their behalf (as opposed to discussing content), especially if there's a link then I will get annoyed. 1 1 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Harlequin Posted August 2 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 2 (edited) [Cross-posted with Phil] I think I see: A company posting on RMweb is now seen as a form of advertising and so the money men at Warners have decided to charge them "advertising rates", treating the forum as if it was a print magazine to some degree. Before the advertising men got involved RMweb was a much simpler place. Edited August 2 by Harlequin 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium DLT Posted August 2 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 2 Hi Andy, Does this mean that I can't "mention in passing" that I've decided to sell a model? Thanks, Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators AY Mod Posted August 2 Administrators Share Posted August 2 5 minutes ago, Harlequin said: A company posting on RMweb is now seen as a form of advertising It is. It always has been really (otherwise why would anyone do it?) but I've taken a benevolent approach. 7 minutes ago, Harlequin said: RMweb was a much simpler place. Years ago it was also a lower cost service. 1 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators AY Mod Posted August 2 Administrators Share Posted August 2 4 minutes ago, DLT said: Does this mean that I can't "mention in passing" If you are a Gold/Premium member there is the the For Sale subforum but I wouldn't be upset if you mentioned it "in passing" in one of your own topics too. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Harlequin Posted August 2 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 2 (edited) 10 hours ago, Phil Parker said: It's a big picture thing - ask yourself this, who should pay to keep RMweb working? If someone is making money out of advertising here, should they not contribute a little? Money is the bottom line, of course, but every money-making step is a step further away from RMweb's roots. Businesses are enthusiasts too - but now some of them might keep quiet or seek ways to work around the "agreement". Shame there isn't another way. RMweb used to be a much simpler place. [This was an alternative version of my previous post. I tried to Hide them both while I gathered my thoughts.] Edited August 2 by Harlequin 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Parker Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 9 minutes ago, Harlequin said: I think I see: A company posting on RMweb is now seen as a form of advertising Are you telling me this isn't an advert? Of course it is. That's why it's been posted on the most popular model railway forum, they want to put their product in front of the most people possible, to derive a commercial benefit (Yes, I know this is a charity model, but there have been plenty of posts for purely commercial models). Which is why Accurascale have reached an agreement with Warners as part of the larger package. Now, is it fair that they should pay and other shouldn't, but still get the same benefits? 6 5 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Popular Post AY Mod Posted August 2 Administrators Popular Post Share Posted August 2 2 hours ago, Harlequin said: Money is the bottom line, of course, but every step away from a simple forum where enthusiasts simply talked to each other about the hobby is a step further away from RMweb's roots. I would have run out of money at the beginning of 2012, costs were increasing exponentially and all my time was unpaid. Agreement was reached with Warners and it was saved. Next year RMweb will be 20 years old but it could have, quite likely, ended 12 years ago. 5 1 33 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted August 2 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 2 We don't use this as advertising, merely informing interested people what's going on in our businesses. I have never had any sort of agreement before. How does this affect such as Tony Wright who lists items in his thread for sale from deceased modellers and the like? This sounds on the face of it well calculated to drive us and many others away from RMweb completely. Michael and Judith Edge 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Parker Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 2 minutes ago, Harlequin said: Money is the bottom line, of course, but every step away from a simple forum where enthusiasts simply talked to each other about the hobby is a step further away from RMweb's roots. Money is required to run the servers, pay for the bandwidth and cover staff wages (an inevitable cost when the forum is too large for someone to run as a hobby). If we want a forum "where enthusiasts simply talked to each other about the hobby" then someone has to pay for all of this, and the aim is to find the least painful way of doing this. 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Parker Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 1 minute ago, Michael Edge said: We don't use this as advertising, merely informing interested people what's going on in our businesses. What's the difference between this and advertising? This isn't a one size fits all job. @AY Mod and I are well aware that there are lots of different-sized businesses out there, what works for a large company isn't appropriate for a tiny one, and are working with the company to try and refine it. The basic fact remains though, that someone has to pay for RMweb. Any ideas for that are always appreciated, but if you are going to say "Sell more advertising", go look at your local newspapers website, and see where that could lead... 1 2 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwin_m Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 Is RMWeb now obliged to declare that specific threads contain paid content, much as YouTube does with videos? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators AY Mod Posted August 2 Administrators Share Posted August 2 3 minutes ago, Edwin_m said: Is RMWeb now obliged to declare that specific threads contain paid content, much as YouTube does with videos? It will be self evident if a business posts a topic which is about their products or services; a bit like Ford posting a advert video on Youtube - they don't have to say it includes paid content does it? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Harlequin Posted August 2 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 2 @AY Mod @Phil Parker You keep responding to posts that I've tried to Hide while I have second thoughts about them! I don't have solutions to the thorny problems - but I hope you guys know what you're doing and most importantly keep the open community of enthusiasts. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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