Things that make you :-(

[The Johnster]

Exactly.  The only infomation needed on a cover (envelope) is the addressee’s name, house number or name, and the correct postcode. 

[kevinlms]

On 06/08/2024 at 03:10, eastglosmog said:

Gripe today: Websites saying that your telephone number is incorrect because you have left a gap between the STD code and the rest of the number (and not telling you what they are objecting to).

When I were a young lad I was taught that the correct way to write a telephone number was with a gap between the STD code and the rest of it.

A correctly written code should only allow the right number of digits, and so it's obvious if you put spaces in, because the last digit can't fit.

 

I have seen (I think it was actually MS), create in the format of (for Australia) as +61 0312345678.

 

Our standard numbers are all 10 digits including the area code (except for some special services), but if the country code (+61) is used, then the zero should be dropped, as per international convention.

 

But of course Microsoft are special!

[Dunsignalling]

3 hours ago, Nick C said:

Especially when it comes to internationalisation, or even just dealing with slightly unusual cases - the number of websites I've seen that have a three line address field for example [number/road, town, county] and so can't cope with a four or five line address [house name, road, village, post town, county]...

It normally works on 3-lines if you enter:

 

Line 1: House name, Road

Line 2: Village, POST TOWN

Line 3: County

 

County became superfluous when postcodes were introduced. but it's a useful extra if you live in one of the Newports or Wellingtons! 🙂

[Reorte]

3 hours ago, John Isherwood said:

 

Within the UK, all you need - at most - is house name or number (not both), road, town and postcode.

 

In extremis, the house number and postcode will, in most cases, suffice.

Just as well you don't need a road, since plenty of addresses don't have one. I suppose the name of the row I live in suffices (it's some distance off the road), and there are numerous houses on their own on unnamed roads.

[Reorte]

49 minutes ago, kevinlms said:

A correctly written code should only allow the right number of digits, and so it's obvious if you put spaces in, because the last digit can't fit.

 

I have seen (I think it was actually MS), create in the format of (for Australia) as +61 0312345678.

 

Our standard numbers are all 10 digits including the area code (except for some special services), but if the country code (+61) is used, then the zero should be dropped, as per international convention.

 

But of course Microsoft are special!

Not here. Most phone numbers are the same length but a few are a bit shorter (Buxton numbers always look wrong to me because of that).

[eastglosmog]

4 hours ago, John Isherwood said:

 

You miss the point entirely.

 

It doesn't matter if every town in Kent is called Lydden - they would all have unique postcodes. If the correct postcode is clearly written on the item, the sorting procedure will send it to the correct Lydden.

 

The same applies to counties - write the correct postcode clearly and the county is irrelevant; no matter how many towns of the same name there are in how many counties.

 

The postal address is linked to the unique postcode - the 'actual' address is irrelevant.

 

I repeat - UK postcodes are unique, and convey EVERYTHING in the postal address except the individual property within that unique postcode.

 

CJI.

My postcode has two number 3s, two number 2s and two number 1s.  Until fairly recently, it had 3 of each, but that terrace got given its own Postcode because of the general confusion.  Fortunately the local posties know where everyone lives!

[TheQ]

I live in xxxxxxxxx with yyyyyy, there are two xxxxxxxxx and two yyyyyy in Norfolk.

Doesn't stop some idiot at the couriers changing the post code on the parcel , because they don't know of the other village. A major courier company has its local base near one of the 4 villages. Then you get the phone call... " I'm in xxxxxxxxx where are you." .. after enquiring whether they are near A or B major town, I say 40 miles away...

 

 

Now we've gone digital, to phone next door or anyone else in the area,  you need to type all 10 digits instead of just 6.

 

 

[Nick C]

16 hours ago, eastglosmog said:

My postcode has two number 3s, two number 2s and two number 1s.  Until fairly recently, it had 3 of each, but that terrace got given its own Postcode because of the general confusion.  Fortunately the local posties know where everyone lives!

Similar where my parents live - there's three houses with number 1 and two with number 2 - and the other properties in the postcode only have names...

 

At least it's easier than Mrs C's home village on the continent, where every house is numbered (no street names, just "number, village") - but in the order they were built, so there's no geographical logic to it at all!

[GrumpyPenguin]

22 hours ago, John Isherwood said:

 

You miss the point entirely.

 

It doesn't matter if every town in Kent is called Lydden - they would all have unique postcodes. If the correct postcode is clearly written on the item, the sorting procedure will send it to the correct Lydden.

 

The same applies to counties - write the correct postcode clearly and the county is irrelevant; no matter how many towns of the same name there are in how many counties.

 

The postal address is linked to the unique postcode - the 'actual' address is irrelevant.

 

I repeat - UK postcodes are unique, and convey EVERYTHING in the postal address except the individual property within that unique postcode.

 

CJI.

Actually I don't miss the point at all.

 

The postcode is basically for the the convieniance of Royal Mail who, I believe devised it for their own use. When I spent some time HGV driving on multidrop (mostly to retail) the postcodes were more of a hinderence - they would give the location of the shop front when the delivery bay would be at the rear or even on another street - RM do not issue postcodes to loading bays & why should they ? - they are for post, not pallets ! Some delivery notes would have another space for delivery details but the IT systems often would not allow a loading bay address without a postcode. The only saving grace would be if a "freehand" box was provided for more details/instructions & that depended on someone bothering to fill them in.

 

Postcodes are not on most maps/road atlas' - remember them ? Not everyone has a SatNag.(in fact I still carry an up to date road atlas in my car - came in very useful last month when my SatNag went into "walking" mode & refused to change).

 

As for the "actual address" not being relevant I'm sorry, that's piffle - all the important legal documents relating to my property do not have postcodes - why do you think they are call Postcodes ?

 

UK Postcodes may be unique but the current version of the RM Postcode database does not even list my property, so it's a good job we use our actual address on all of our documentation.

 

[franciswilliamwebb]

Facebook seems to be full of more spam than ever at the moment, possibly AI driven but who knows.  One that particularly got my goat was a post by an account called British Patriot or something similar, using a photo of some kneb-ond draped in the Stars and Stripes🙄

[J. S. Bach]

It might have been worse, could have been the Stars and Bars.

[John Isherwood]

1 hour ago, GrumpyPenguin said:

Actually I don't miss the point at all.

 

The postcode is basically for the the convieniance of Royal Mail who, I believe devised it for their own use. When I spent some time HGV driving on multidrop (mostly to retail) the postcodes were more of a hinderence - they would give the location of the shop front when the delivery bay would be at the rear or even on another street - RM do not issue postcodes to loading bays & why should they ? - they are for post, not pallets ! Some delivery notes would have another space for delivery details but the IT systems often would not allow a loading bay address without a postcode. The only saving grace would be if a "freehand" box was provided for more details/instructions & that depended on someone bothering to fill them in.

 

Postcodes are not on most maps/road atlas' - remember them ? Not everyone has a SatNag.(in fact I still carry an up to date road atlas in my car - came in very useful last month when my SatNag went into "walking" mode & refused to change).

 

As for the "actual address" not being relevant I'm sorry, that's piffle - all the important legal documents relating to my property do not have postcodes - why do you think they are call Postcodes ?

 

UK Postcodes may be unique but the current version of the RM Postcode database does not even list my property, so it's a good job we use our actual address on all of our documentation.

 

 

...... and at no point did I say anything to the contrary!

 

This debate commenced when someone (you?) complained that online MAIL address forms did not provide sufficient space for a full address.

 

I pointed out that district names and counties are NOT required for MAIL deliveries, provided  that the correct postcode is provided.

 

Where loading bays and lorry deliveries became relevant, only you know.

 

My last comment on the subject - all that is needed for MAIL deliveries are property number / name, street, town and post code; (and you can usually omit the middle two, if you wish).

 

John Isherwood.

[Nick C]

1 hour ago, John Isherwood said:

 

...... and at no point did I say anything to the contrary!

 

This debate commenced when someone (you?) complained that online MAIL address forms did not provide sufficient space for a full address.

 

I pointed out that district names and counties are NOT required for MAIL deliveries, provided  that the correct postcode is provided.

 

Where loading bays and lorry deliveries became relevant, only you know.

 

My last comment on the subject - all that is needed for MAIL deliveries are property number / name, street, town and post code; (and you can usually omit the middle two, if you wish).

 

John Isherwood.

You're assuming the addresses are being used for deliveries by the Royal Mail - many companies these days use other couriers, which can vary from excellent to utterly dire, usually depending on the person doing the last-mile drop. It can often be very important to have the full address to have any hope of the delivery actually reaching the right place...

[John Isherwood]

14 minutes ago, Nick C said:

You're assuming the addresses are being used for deliveries by the Royal Mail - many companies these days use other couriers, which can vary from excellent to utterly dire, usually depending on the person doing the last-mile drop. It can often be very important to have the full address to have any hope of the delivery actually reaching the right place...

 

I only ever input name, house number, road, town and postcode in ANY online address form.

 

I get mail and deliveries from, literally, all over the world, via RM and all the other couriers / carriers.

 

In thirteen years at this address, there have been zero mis-deliveries.

 

I also send letters and packages worldwide via the same means, and the written addresses are similarly name, house number, town and poscode - plus country where not UK. Again, no mis-deliveries.

 

What else can I tell you?

 

John Isherwood.

[Nick C]

9 minutes ago, John Isherwood said:

 

I only ever input name, house number, road, town and postcode in ANY online address form.

 

I get mail and deliveries from, literally, all over the world, via RM and all the other couriers / carriers.

 

In thirteen years at this address, there have been zero mis-deliveries.

 

I also send letters and packages worldwide via the same means, and the written addresses are similarly name, house number, town and poscode - plus country where not UK. Again, no mis-deliveries.

 

What else can I tell you?

 

John Isherwood.

Then you've been lucky!

 

Like I said in an earlier post, "house number, road, town, postcode" would not uniquely identify the house in which I grew up*, nor indeed the flat in which I used to live**. @eastglosmog demonstrates the same. The RM official guidelines specifically say to include "locality (where relevant)". Not all addresses fit neatly into "number, street, town, postcode"

 

With RM it'd be fine as the postie knows who lives where, with a courier it might not.

 

I will agree that County is no longer needed though. 

 

* 1 Something Cottages,

Road Name

Village

TOWN

POSTCODE

 

** Flat 1, 

1 Something Road,

TOWN

POSTCODE

[GrumpyPenguin]

On 08/08/2024 at 15:35, Nick C said:

Then you've been lucky!

 

Like I said in an earlier post, "house number, road, town, postcode" would not uniquely identify the house in which I grew up*, nor indeed the flat in which I used to live**. @eastglosmog demonstrates the same. The RM official guidelines specifically say to include "locality (where relevant)". Not all addresses fit neatly into "number, street, town, postcode"

 

With RM it'd be fine as the postie knows who lives where, with a courier it might not.

 

I will agree that County is no longer needed though. 

 

* 1 Something Cottages,

Road Name

Village

TOWN

POSTCODE

 

** Flat 1, 

1 Something Road,

TOWN

POSTCODE

John has been very lucky indeed.

 

OK, maybe I'll try & put it another way - postcodes are fine (if they are correct) for post and small packages, mostly domestic.

 

Many times I've pitched up at the postcode only to be told "oh no, it's down the road, 2nd left and through the gates" (or something similar).

 

As for "postcodes with the building number contain everything you need" - that gave me a chuckle.

 

Just imagine, you have made a delivery at Westwood Cross & you only have a postcode of CT9 14JX for your next delivery - it wont appear on your SatNag because of a typo so you are stuffed. However, ask almost any local & ask where Hornby is then you will almost certainly get directions to the front of the building.

 

Some people have led sheltered lives.

[John Isherwood]

7 hours ago, GrumpyPenguin said:

John has been very lucky indeed.

 

OK, maybe I'll try & put it another way - postcodes are fine (if they are correct) for post and small packages, mostly domestic.

 

Many times I've pitched up at the postcode only to be told "oh no, it's down the road, 2nd left and through the gates" (or something similar).

 

As for "postcodes with the building number contain everything you need" - that gave me a chuckle.

 

Just imagine, you have made a delivery at Westwood Cross & you only have a postcode of CT9 14JX for your next delivery - it wont appear on your SatNag because of a typo so you are stuffed. However, ask almost any local & ask where Hornby is then you will almost certainly get directions to the front of the building.

 

Some people have led sheltered lives.

 

I can only believe that you are deliberately not reading what I have posted; EVERYTHING that I have posted relates to postal deliveries via RM.

 

NOTHING about courier or carrier deliveries; NOTHING about typos - indeed, I have deliberately emphasised the need for CORRECT postcodes.

 

The fact remains that I have twenty-five years experience of trouble-free posting and receiving via RM, using only the most basic address plus CORRECT postcode.

 

Other experiences are, no doubt, available.

 

John Isherwood.

Edited August 10 by John Isherwood

[GrumpyPenguin]

3 hours ago, John Isherwood said:

 

I can only believe that you are deliberately not reading what I have posted; EVERYTHING that I have posted relates to postal deliveries via RM.

 

NOTHING about courier or carrier deliveries; NOTHING about

 typos - indeed, I have deliberately emphasised the need for CORRECT postcodes.

 

The fact remains that I have twenty-five years experience of trouble-free posting and receiving via RM, using only the most basic address plus CORRECT postcode.

 

Other experiences are, no doubt, available.

 

John Isherwood.

I'm simply trying to point out that there is (or can be) a vast difference between a postcode & an actual address - also I have given you examples of why 100% usage of postcodes is not such a good idea.

Next time you see a 44tonner looking lost you may get the point.

I give up.

Enjoy the rest of your weekend.

[Reorte]

A house name or number plus postcode should, as far as I know, be unique., Sometimes you'll get some named and some numbered houses in the same postcode, but I don't think you should ever end up with two different streets, both with the same number. "Number" may have to be expanded to separate block and flat numbers for all I know, and it's always possible that someone will end up in a new house without the postcode yet sorted out.

 

That identifies addresses uniquely, it doesn't necessarily give you much of a clue where to actually find them, but that's the delivery company's problem (some don't seem to make sufficient effort, but that's the area where I trust the RM over others, my house isn't the easiest to find).

[DIW]

1 hour ago, GrumpyPenguin said:

 

I give up.

 

What, 3 words?

 

Hat, coat, gone!

[John Isherwood]

1 hour ago, GrumpyPenguin said:

I'm simply trying to point out that there is (or can be) a vast difference between a postcode & an actual address - also I have given you examples of why 100% usage of postcodes is not such a good idea.

Next time you see a 44tonner looking lost you may get the point.

I give up.

Enjoy the rest of your weekend.

 

Clearly, we are talking about two entirely different problems.

 

I am not clear where deliveries via a 44 tonner entered the debate - but evidently they have significance for you.

 

John Isherwood.

[Erichill16]

15 minutes ago, DIW said:

What, 3 words?

 

Hat, coat, gone!

Just checked, no such address!

[33C]

If I give my entire address, no end of problems but, if I leave out a number, no confusion.  No more schlepping across the road and banging on two different addresses for me!

[MJI]

Covid 19

[woodenhead]

Changing the fill valve on the toilet only to discover it was working perfectly and the issue was that the flush valve seal has deteriorated and was constantly leaking.

 

Oh well it's all new now, but it's an ar$e taking the thing apart several times.