Peterborough North

[great northern]

A Grantham A3 heads south, and shortly afterwards a Doncaster A3 heads north with the 1020 KX-Leeds.

 

[great northern]

32 minutes ago, Clive Mortimore said:

I better get on and make the street lamps.

When you have the time Clive. I know you have more than enough to do already.

[Mallard60022]

Super stuff Gilbert. Another total transformation of that area. 

Phi

[60027Merlin]

1 hour ago, great northern said:

The thing is that the garden should carry on for a bit further Eric, but you have now caused me to consider whether I could adopt what you are saying, but leave a gap in the middle suggesting a continuation on the other side.

 

Gilbert,

 

A gap in the middle or off centre may be the way. In the gap, a painted impression  of a curved path leading further down the garden could be effective as I have noticed in gardens I have visited that curved paths give a different look to the setting and also suggest a bit of distance.

Perhaps a vague outline of a small tree painted on the back as well will give added depth

.

Eric

 

 

Edited April 17, 2023 by 60027Merlin

[davidw]

Hi Gilbert, I was wondering if any of the maroon Thompsons were to appear. 

 

I've looked through umpteen prototype pictures and it seems that not many Thompsons were utilised. Most crack expresses seemed to be mk1s with a Thompson or Gresley catering core. Certainly no whole takes of Thompsons - pressure ventilated Elizabethan excepted. Would that be a fair assessment?

 

Thanks 

[Grafarman]

Hi Gilbert, just wanted to say I'm really appreciating viewing developments from the sidelines; a daily post from your layout is of great value to one's wellbeing.  I haven't commented as there hasn't been anything I could say which others haven't observed; however I would just like to say that the weeds in the overgrown front garden look a little samey to my eyes.  From my own observation of similar gardens (including my own!) a wide variety of growth in all colours, lengths, thickness etc make themselves known, which then spread to nearby walls, fences, gates etc, whilst yours looks more like a crop of something growing wild.  Adding some darker, more bushy clumps might do the trick, along with some trailing brambles around the edges/over the front. 

Not a criticism, just a suggestion.

 

David

[great northern]

Only one prepared image this morning. I have more to do, but I'm having the outside of the house decorated, and it threw all my routines yesterday. So here is Tagalie again.

[great northern]

10 hours ago, davidw said:

Hi Gilbert, I was wondering if any of the maroon Thompsons were to appear. 

 

I've looked through umpteen prototype pictures and it seems that not many Thompsons were utilised. Most crack expresses seemed to be mk1s with a Thompson or Gresley catering core. Certainly no whole takes of Thompsons - pressure ventilated Elizabethan excepted. Would that be a fair assessment?

 

Thanks 

The CWN shows very few specified Thompsons on weekdays, but more on Saturdays.  however, if the requirement was merely for a seven compartment corridor second I suppose either Gresleys or Thompsons could have been used. I agree that you don't see many in prototype pictures, but I can't believe that the most modern coaches they had, prior to MK1s that is, sat in sidings all week and only got used on Saturdays. I certainly haven't seen any whole rakes, save as you say for the Elizabethan.

 

Practical considerations dictate that they shall appear on PN. Lovely as they are, I couldn't afford a lot more of Ian Willets Gresleys, and I think Steve 31A is getting a bit tired of doing Hornby conversions. Well, I would be if I was him. So, I've ordered four maroon ones just so I have a few more for loose stock.

[great northern]

1 hour ago, Grafarman said:

Hi Gilbert, just wanted to say I'm really appreciating viewing developments from the sidelines; a daily post from your layout is of great value to one's wellbeing.  I haven't commented as there hasn't been anything I could say which others haven't observed; however I would just like to say that the weeds in the overgrown front garden look a little samey to my eyes.  From my own observation of similar gardens (including my own!) a wide variety of growth in all colours, lengths, thickness etc make themselves known, which then spread to nearby walls, fences, gates etc, whilst yours looks more like a crop of something growing wild.  Adding some darker, more bushy clumps might do the trick, along with some trailing brambles around the edges/over the front. 

Not a criticism, just a suggestion.

 

David

I agree David. The problem is though that I'm having difficulty finding convincing models of other types of weeds. These are supposed to be thistles and passed my quality test on looks, but I'm still trying to find others which don't look crude and unconvincing.

[davidw]

5 hours ago, great northern said:

The CWN shows very few specified Thompsons on weekdays, but more on Saturdays.  however, if the requirement was merely for a seven compartment corridor second I suppose either Gresleys or Thompsons could have been used. I agree that you don't see many in prototype pictures, but I can't believe that the most modern coaches they had, prior to MK1s that is, sat in sidings all week and only got used on Saturdays. I certainly haven't seen any whole rakes, save as you say for the Elizabethan.

 

Practical considerations dictate that they shall appear on PN. Lovely as they are, I couldn't afford a lot more of Ian Willets Gresleys, and I think Steve 31A is getting a bit tired of doing Hornby conversions. Well, I would be if I was him. So, I've ordered four maroon ones just so I have a few more for loose stock.

Thanks Gilbert, I've some  resided old tooling Thompsons  and a couple of complete comet kits. I've a few in new tooling in c/c and I've now a few in maroon. Bachmann have certainly done a good job on them. Hope i can persuade my treasurer that I need more for my birthday!

Edited April 18, 2023 by davidw

[Mallard60022]

27 minutes ago, great northern said:

I agree David. The problem is though that I'm having difficulty finding convincing models of other types of weeds. These are supposed to be thistles and passed my quality test on looks, but I'm still trying to find others which don't look crude and unconvincing.

The magic Static Grass machine needs to make a visit dear heart. You need Weeds, we can create weeds.

P

[Mallard60022]

Plenty of inspiration AND I have a good UTube chappie that does excellent Static Grass Vids.

P

[great northern]

Northwards goes Tagalie.

Coming south is the 9.18 Up Leeds, with Persimmon at the head. Behind it are eight all door seconds, with a three compartment brake at each end, and another in the middle.

[great northern]

11 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

The magic Static Grass machine needs to make a visit dear heart. You need Weeds, we can create weeds.

P

Weeds from static grass?

[Tony Wright]

12 hours ago, great northern said:

The CWN shows very few specified Thompsons on weekdays, but more on Saturdays.  however, if the requirement was merely for a seven compartment corridor second I suppose either Gresleys or Thompsons could have been used. I agree that you don't see many in prototype pictures, but I can't believe that the most modern coaches they had, prior to MK1s that is, sat in sidings all week and only got used on Saturdays. I certainly haven't seen any whole rakes, save as you say for the Elizabethan.

 

Practical considerations dictate that they shall appear on PN. Lovely as they are, I couldn't afford a lot more of Ian Willets Gresleys, and I think Steve 31A is getting a bit tired of doing Hornby conversions. Well, I would be if I was him. So, I've ordered four maroon ones just so I have a few more for loose stock.

Good evening Gilbert,

 

Regarding Thompson cars in ECML trains in 1958, I've pored through many prototype pictures, and the following might be of use. (please, all, observe copyright restrictions on the following images). With one or two exceptions, all these shots were taken in 1958.............

 

 

Fancy modelling this train? It's a Down Leeds. 

 

 

Or this one?

 

 

 

Interesting one this. When Hornby brought out its SR bogie van, I reviewed it, fiddled with it, weathered it and put it into a train on Little Bytham; only to be assured soon after by one visitor that such SR types NEVER left the Southern Region. Hmmmm.......

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I cannot find a picture showing mainly Thompson cars in ECML sets in the late-'50s (other than the Lizzies).

 

Mixed trains such as this below seemed much more common.................

 

 

Perhaps the Thompsons were.........

 

 

more in cross-country trains. 

 

What is noticeable is how many examples of Thompson front line stock were still in carmine/cream in 1958. 

 

And that many of the above trains cannot be found in the relevant BR CWNs - summer Saturdays, perhaps? 

 

Anyway, the Thompson cars certainly lasted long..........

 

 

 

As late as 1965. 

 

I wished I'd taken more pictures at this time, but art school student poverty rather restricted the taking of too many pictures...........

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

[jwealleans]

10 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

 

Fancy modelling this train? It's a Down Leeds. 

 

That's the ex-GN 12 wheel Restaurant Car leading, isn't it?   I know Andy Sparkes has done that one in BR condition.   IIRC there's a good picture on Steve Banks' website.   That must be an ex-Elizabethan car behind it - labelled 'Buffet'?   Is that the one which still exists?

[great northern]

60050 passes the B1 waiting to go to Grimsby.

Then I moved the camera to somewhere I don't usually visit, but the result wasn't very inspiring.

[Mallard60022]

11 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good evening Gilbert,

 

Regarding Thompson cars in ECML trains in 1958, I've pored through many prototype pictures, and the following might be of use. (please, all, observe copyright restrictions on the following images). With one or two exceptions, all these shots were taken in 1958.............

 

 

Fancy modelling this train? It's a Down Leeds. 

 

 

Or this one?

 

 

 

Interesting one this. When Hornby brought out its SR bogie van, I reviewed it, fiddled with it, weathered it and put it into a train on Little Bytham; only to be assured soon after by one visitor that such SR types NEVER left the Southern Region. Hmmmm.......

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I cannot find a picture showing mainly Thompson cars in ECML sets in the late-'50s (other than the Lizzies).

 

Mixed trains such as this below seemed much more common.................

 

 

Perhaps the Thompsons were.........

 

 

more in cross-country trains. 

 

What is noticeable is how many examples of Thompson front line stock were still in carmine/cream in 1958. 

 

And that many of the above trains cannot be found in the relevant BR CWNs - summer Saturdays, perhaps? 

 

Anyway, the Thompson cars certainly lasted long..........

 

 

 

As late as 1965. 

 

I wished I'd taken more pictures at this time, but art school student poverty rather restricted the taking of too many pictures...........

Regards,

Tony. 

Oooooof, thanks Mr W for those, many of which show how uninteresting Retford is these days, compared to way back then.

Last one is Tuxford?

Phil

[Tony Wright]

1 hour ago, jwealleans said:

 

That's the ex-GN 12 wheel Restaurant Car leading, isn't it?   I know Andy Sparkes has done that one in BR condition.   IIRC there's a good picture on Steve Banks' website.   That must be an ex-Elizabethan car behind it - labelled 'Buffet'?   Is that the one which still exists?

Good morning Jonathan,

 

Yes it is.

 

The next car is a Thompson PV RFO.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

49 minutes ago, Mallard60022 said:

Oooooof, thanks Mr W for those, many of which show how uninteresting Retford is these days, compared to way back then.

Last one is Tuxford?

Phil

Muskham, Phil.

 

What the steam views show is the incredible variety in passenger rolling stock on the ECML in 1958.

 

Take this one, at Bawtry during that year.........

 

 

60002 heads an Up Newcastle express, the second and third cars of which are ex-Tourist TO twins, then another Gresley, then a triplet set (still in carmine/cream) and so on. It could be a Saturday-only train, but it appears in none of my CWNs for the period. 

 

That's what I tend to do more of these days in my own modelling; use the CWNs, but also prototype pictures, such as the above. It requires much still to be made, however. I doubt if there's anything RTR which could be used to replicate the train above - Hornby's gangwayed Gresleys aren't much use! 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited April 19, 2023 by Tony Wright
to add something

[great northern]

12 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good evening Gilbert,

 

Regarding Thompson cars in ECML trains in 1958, I've pored through many prototype pictures, and the following might be of use. (please, all, observe copyright restrictions on the following images). With one or two exceptions, all these shots were taken in 1958.............

 

 

Fancy modelling this train? It's a Down Leeds. 

 

 

Or this one?

 

 

 

Interesting one this. When Hornby brought out its SR bogie van, I reviewed it, fiddled with it, weathered it and put it into a train on Little Bytham; only to be assured soon after by one visitor that such SR types NEVER left the Southern Region. Hmmmm.......

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I cannot find a picture showing mainly Thompson cars in ECML sets in the late-'50s (other than the Lizzies).

 

Mixed trains such as this below seemed much more common.................

 

 

Perhaps the Thompsons were.........

 

 

more in cross-country trains. 

 

What is noticeable is how many examples of Thompson front line stock were still in carmine/cream in 1958. 

 

And that many of the above trains cannot be found in the relevant BR CWNs - summer Saturdays, perhaps? 

 

Anyway, the Thompson cars certainly lasted long..........

 

 

 

As late as 1965. 

 

I wished I'd taken more pictures at this time, but art school student poverty rather restricted the taking of too many pictures...........

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

Many thanks Tony. It is going to take me a while to work through these, and of course I've never been as good at you at identifying cars, particularly those towards the end of a long rake.

 

However, by sheer coincidence I have just run a train that had the catering cars right at the front, and I even checked the CWN to see if that was correct, as it seemed most unusual. However, the 1020 Down Leeds in the summer of 58 did indeed have the catering in that position. I can't recall any other such instances though, except for the return working of that train, which was the 5.33 ex Leeds.  The CWN specifies a triplet set , the only one in the GN CWN. I cannot think of any in the ECML CWN which give the catering in that position.

 

As to whether the ones you have shown were Saturday workings, I can't be sure. What I can say though is that having gone back now to the weekday CWN, the make up of trains is very different to what I was doing on the Saturday sequence, and I am using far more MK1s than I did then. For unusual formations mid week though there is always the 9.47 Up Newcastle, with four different formations in five days.

[great northern]

On goes 60050, first a well used angle,

 

then head on from the end of the platform.

[thegreenhowards]

14 hours ago, jwealleans said:

 

That's the ex-GN 12 wheel Restaurant Car leading, isn't it?   I know Andy Sparkes has done that one in BR condition.   IIRC there's a good picture on Steve Banks' website.   That must be an ex-Elizabethan car behind it - labelled 'Buffet'?   Is that the one which still exists?

I did an ex GNR 12 wheeler but I don’t think it’s exactly the same as the one in Tony’s photos. I remember getting excited when Tony first posted that photo and then realising that it was a slightly different diagram. I can’t remember the exact difference now though. Mine is shown below. It was one of three and I think was mainly used for excursion traffic in the 1950s.

Andy

[great northern]

Grimsby fish empties heading back to New Clee this morning.

 

 

[great northern]

One more look at the fish empties.

then we have the arrival of the Up Sunderland, with its Heaton A2/3 Ocean Swell. Lovely name, but not often to be seen in these parts.

Decorator finished and gone. Lovely job, but gloss painting today meant open doors and windows gleefully exploited by a strong and cold north easterly wind. All firmly closed now though, and tomorrow all will be back to normal.