Lisbon trams

[Chris116]

I am on a cruise which stopped in Lisbon on Tuesday. While having a short look around the area near to the ship I saw some of the trams that serve Lisbon. More photos to follow later.

 

 

 

 

[Chris116]

More photos.

 

 

 

[Gordonwis]

Nice to see them using semi convertibles on the 15 in amongst the modern artics. However the 15 used to use the handsome bogie cars rather than the 4 -wheelers.

[brushman47544]

Lisbon trams have been disrupted for some time, with works causing shortened routes and substitutions. The 15E has been cut back to Cais do Sodre until this month (January) due to drainage works and works to reinstate the track to Sta Apolonia, with buses covering the route to Praca Figueira. At the same time (and still today) the 25E has been replaced by buses due to road works.
 

The new CAF trams entered service on the 15E in September alongside the existing Siemens (501+]. You were lucky to see a 4 wheeler on the 15E, no longer common with the new trams in service but do still appear from time to time. The 15E has now been reinstated to Praca Figueira but will eventually be diverted to Sta Apolonia (and supposedly beyond).

 

The photo shows one of the new trams terminating at Cais do Sodre, using the loop installed to allow the 24 to be extended, which has still to happen.

[Gordonwis]

Despite my late father (the founding father of Crich National Tramway Museum) having passed away in late 2020 and my uncle in 2022 we are still going through the vast legacy of transport photos left by both of them. Included in this are 000s of European tramway photos. Guided by my uncle who was an expert on Iberia, we visited Portugal in 1971 (in a J reg Austin 1100...) . We visited Lisboa from our base ( a camp site in Sintra).

 

Here are two shots taken at Sete Rios on 13 August 1971

 

 

 

Edited January 16 by Gordonwis

[brushman47544]

The 4 wheelers still have hand wound destination displays, with drivers using a mirror and leaning out of the front window to check the information is displayed correctly. However tram 557 has been fitted with an electronic display. Seen in 2022 and I’m not aware of any others being so fitted since.

[Gordonwis]

14 hours ago, brushman47544 said:

The 4 wheelers still have hand wound destination displays, with drivers using a mirror and leaning out of the front window to check the information is displayed correctly. However tram 557 has been fitted with an electronic display. Seen in 2022 and I’m not aware of any others being so fitted since.

 

 

And with a geopolitically sensitive advertising livery...

 

 

.

[Johann Marsbar]

5 hours ago, Gordonwis said:

Some more 1971 shots - photos Richard Wiseman

 

Those links don't seem to be working.....

[Gordonwis]

Can anyone explain why these photos - exactly the same as all my other digital photos on my PC - loaded themselves onto here upside down? I can't seem to edit then]m within this forum to get them upright.

[brushman47544]

9 hours ago, Gordonwis said:

Can anyone explain why these photos - exactly the same as all my other digital photos on my PC - loaded themselves onto here upside down? I can't seem to edit then]m within this forum to get them upright.

 

This has happened to other people and ISTR that a solution was to resave the photos in the correct aspect with a new file name on your PC, so any unwanted formatting is lost, and try uploading again. I know this works for photos taken on an iPhone as it's happened to me but I think it also works for scanned images too.

[Neil]

While Gordon gets his beautiful, historic images re-orientated I'll put up a few of my more recent ones from ten years ago.

 

 

 

 

[Gordonwis]

14 hours ago, brushman47544 said:

 

This has happened to other people and ISTR that a solution was to resave the photos in the correct aspect with a new file name on your PC, so any unwanted formatting is lost, and try uploading again. I know this works for photos taken on an iPhone as it's happened to me but I think it also works for scanned images too.

 

 

No - renamed - saved in a different folder on my laptop - no joy

[Gordonwis]

Trying again

 

Some more 1971 shots - photos by my late father Richard Wiseman

 

Edited January 25 by Gordonwis

[Gordonwis]

Workaround for the annoying mis orientated pictures - converted them to .png

 

By the way who can spot the Austin 1100?

[Gordonwis]

Some more now I sorted the orientation issue

 

Some more 1971 shots - photos by my late father Richard Wiseman

 

 

 

Edited January 25 by Gordonwis

[ianmianmianm]

Just for those who are interested in modelling I thought I would post a list of resources. I will put this in the Overseas Modelling - Portugal secion as well.

 

For Lisbon Trams:

 

- Atlas Editions 4 wheeler - can be motorised more easily. Has trolley and panto on roof and Carris logos. More modern trucks.

- Amarellis - we all know these! Sold branded with the Carris logo by the tram museum, and unbranded by souvenir shops. There is a seller on Ebay who sells reliveried ones with adverts, and also motorised ones as well.

- Halling - produced several older models including with open platforms, semi-enclosed platforms, and full enclosed.

- Modelismo Artesanale - produced a limited run of the single-direction box-shape Caixote trams - they have doors on one side only. These were also available as kits, but are long sold out.

- Resin model of the bidirectional Caixotes, doors on both sides - https://scontent.ffab1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/325758493_840659440345311_8013902041169067125_n.jpg?_nc_cat=105&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=5f2048&_nc_ohc=p662fyvopc8Q7kNvgEhMs03&_nc_ht=scontent.ffab1-2.fna&oh=00_AfBmAf35LD_dWJiLrjNCwh9MD3U-ErswBN3sjQHCLtJZXg&oe=663D7A9F this seller on Facebook sells these, but you have to phone him!!!

- 3D print files Cults 3D has downloadable files to do your own resin print. Search "1947 Lisbon" on their site. I've done a test print in plastic rather than resin, which is in my photo.

- Buses: https://www.facebook.com/easytransportesminiaturas/?locale=pt_PT sells Carris liveried buses as Code 3 models (along with Porto ones too).

- Tramads in the UK does four waterslide decals for the advert liveries for the 4 wheel trams.

- Some years ago Halling produced some engineering test models for the Alicante version of the Lisbon Siemens Articulado tram. They were unmotored and liveried in the Spanish FGC livery. Only a handful were produced (I Have one set of bodyshells) but they may show up on sale someday.

 

Buildings:

 

- Modelismo Artesanale: A small number of village and railway buildings, but not really suitable for a city model.

- Parvus.info : Spanish buildings which work well for Portuguese city buildings.

- Sofgreen: A few building kits but mostly Porto types. 

- Maketforyou https://www.instagram.com/maketforyou1/?hl=en-gb a very boutique producer of high end buildings, a few of which work for a cityscape.

- There is another supplier which I can now not find, who does a few building and scenic kits very specific to Portugal.EDIT - these guys https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100063968326366&sk=photos

- A few of the shops, Espacio Papel e Livraria in Lisbon, La Ferrovie De Paris, and Nettoys in Matosinhos near Porto, all do ocasional limited edition scenic models of things like kiosks and bus stops. Noch also do card scenic sheets of the Lisbon style Calcadas paving.

- JG Modelismo is a niche supplier in Lisbon who occasionally stocks scenic items.

 

 

Trains:

 

- Norbrass and Sudexpress have produced Brass and Plastic, respectively, high quality RTR models of locos and passenger stock and freight stock in 16.5mm gauge. 

 

- Arlo Micromodel produce RTR locos, coaches, and kits and conversion items. 

 

- JG Modelismo has produced the Nohab 100 and 50 Iberian Gauge railcars and the refurbished Allan railcars as RTR

 

- Mabar, Mehano, Electrotren, Roco and LS Models have at various times produced Portuguese liveried versions of their French or Spanish Models.

 

- PT Trains and a few others have produced wagons

 

- Modelismo Artesanal produce Napoli metre gauge coach kits, will be producing the 9020 series metre gauge locos as RTR. They have previosuly produced the ME-07 railcars, and the series 9500 metre gauge modern railcars. They previously produced a kit for a Drasine (Wickham trolley equivalent) in Iberian gauge and the Iberian gauge Allan railcar.

 

- On Shapeways Marketplace, there are kits for the 9020 locos, the 9000 locos (I think - listed under the Spanish FEVE) and the 9500 railcars, produced by tttrams as a seller these include bodie sides for the locos. I think he or she does them in HO, TT or N scales. Recreation 21 has the Nohab metre gauge railcars, and the 9630 2 car metre gauge DMUs as bodyshells, again in a range of scales. 

 

- Trenmilitaria produces the FEVE loco 1500 which became the CP 9020 - you would have to order plain bodies and paint them!

 

For decals, Colorado Decals has traditionally produced the CP railway ones. There is nothing available for Carris.

 

FInally, here's my printed rough test model of the Caixote with a Lisbon buddy. My layout is Spanish but assumes a Spanish tourist town has bought some Lisbon trams, as in La Coruna.

 

 

 

- 

Edited May 9 by ianmianmianm
added another supplier

[PaulRhB]

5 hours ago, ianmianmianm said:

Buildings:

 

- Modelismo Artesanale: A small number of village and railway buildings, but not really suitable for a city model.

- Parvus.info : Spanish buildings which work well for Portuguese city buildings.

- Sofgreen: A few building kits but mostly Porto types. 

- Maketforyou https://www.instagram.com/maketforyou1/?hl=en-gb a very boutique producer of high end buildings, a few of which work for a cityscape.

- There is another supplier which I can now not find, who does a few building and scenic kits very specific to Portugal. A few of the shops, Espacio Papel e Livraria in Lisbon, La Ferrovie De Paris, and Nettoys in Matosinhos near Porto, all do ocasional limited edition scenic models of things like kiosks and bus stops. Noch also do card scenic sheets of the Lisbon style Calcadas paving.

- JG Modelismo is a niche supplier in Lisbon who occasionally stocks scenic items.

Thanks for the list, very useful 😀

[GrumpyPenguin]

Very useful thanks.

 

Piry I cannot find some HO tram setrack (I know Tillig do some but not tight enough radius & the supply is a bit erratic (even direct from Germany).

 

 

[ianmianmianm]

On 06/05/2024 at 12:40, GrumpyPenguin said:

Very useful thanks.

 

Piry I cannot find some HO tram setrack (I know Tillig do some but not tight enough radius & the supply is a bit erratic (even direct from Germany).

 

If you're modelling these specifically then you are most accurate doing them in narrow gauge. They are 900mm in real life which meand 10.34 mm at HO scale. The closest you can get to this is allegedly HOn3 for which there is very little available. However if you go down to HOe at 9mm then you have the very cheap and varied Tomix track with 3 o 4 radii. They can be quite nicely painted and weathered up, although I learned the hard way that you need to mask off the joints between sections if spraying.

Edited May 7 by ianmianmianm

[Gordonwis]

1 hour ago, ianmianmianm said:

. However if you go down to HOe at 9mm then you have the very cheap and varied Tomix track with 3 o 4 radii. 

 

 

Also Kato Unitram N gauge track

 

.

[GrumpyPenguin]

Thanks again guys, I'm aware that they should be barrow gauge but would prefer to stick with standard for robustness - it will only be a loop on a "Crossroads of Europe" layout so I can live with the scale inaccuracy as long as the track/roadway looks acceptable to me.

[Edwin_m]

Porto trams are pretty similar to Lisbon ones, but standard gauge and bi-directional.  

[ianmianmianm]

I've just added this one into the list. Some nice Portuguese vuildings.

 

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100063968326366&sk=photos 

 

[ianmianmianm]

On 08/05/2024 at 09:26, GrumpyPenguin said:

Thanks again guys, I'm aware that they should be barrow gauge but would prefer to stick with standard for robustness - it will only be a loop on a "Crossroads of Europe" layout so I can live with the scale inaccuracy as long as the track/roadway looks acceptable to me.

It baffles me why this has never happened in 16.5mm. I had a layout about 10 years ago with the Hartel track on it which was very easy to use and with a bit of filling and painting actually looked good. There were also some fellas at Eurospoor in Utrecht one year that were selling some set-track pieces which were made with resin and using Peco rail and these were lovely. But I never saw them again.

 

Rue D' Etropal (Recreation 21) designed a track system using 3 printed pieces into which you slide regular Code 100 rail (I think). The pieces are designed for the corresponding rail lengths in existing set track so are fully interchangeable with Peco. They are still on Shapeways Marketplce but the price is now silyl high because of Shapeways' pricing structure. If you message him he might be able to let you buy the files and then print your own through a 3rd party like SGD3D or similar. I know he was considering selling files only at one point as he was so frustrated at the Shapeways prices. Track is a classic reason where this sort of arrangement might be justified.

 

Ian

[Tom Burnham]

We had a few days in Lisbon in April.  Photos of the Bica and Gloria funiculars (very tram like), one of the newer articulated cars on the loop at Cais do Sodre, and a chance photo of a 15E tram crossing the single-track, non-electrified connection from the Estoril railway at Alcantara Mar to Alcantara Terra (on the main suburban network).