Bachmann O4

[Wacol]

Hi Peter, Try fitting them under the cylinders.

 

Wacol

[45568]

Soon as I had posted I realised what they were!!!! Senior moment brought on by excitement!!

Cheers, Peter C.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

Picked up my first example this morning, and am altogether very pleased with it. A sweet runner, and after the regulation hour of running, good for 30 grams force, which means about 60 wagons on level track. So it proved, a nice little wheelslip as it got them away smoothly, I expect that as usual a few more hours running will see about a 10% improvement in traction as the tyres polish up. Bachmann's screw together construction means that the supplied ballast weight can come out, and be substituted by a chunk of lead, which will signficantly improve traction. That it will crawl 'dead slow' on a basic DC resistance controller augurs well for performance once decoder fitted. Adjusting the loco to tender distance so that the pretty much correctly dimensioned fall plate covered the gap really helped the appearance.

 

What I wanted to see for myself was the wheelbase and cylinder dimensions. Would Bachmann go to the trouble of representing the 'interesting' Gorton coupled wheelbase dimensions? (They have.) How would they deal with the front end to get it round 2nd radius curves? The answer is that the cylinders are a millimetre underlength (don't extend far enough forward) and the pony truck wheels are somewhat over a millimetre forward of the scale position. It is all very tight at the front of a Robinson 2-8-0, but by means of these expedients the pony truck can swing out far enough for train set curves. So that's a little more modification required when tinkering with the cylinder and slide bar position and angle. Not sure yet how far I can go for the 30" minimum radius I would like this loco to negotiate, probably moving the pony truck wheel rearward to the correct position (8'4" ahead of leading coupled wheel) will be the simplest option.

 

For the rest, it's pretty well done. The only cosmetic manufacturing expedient that jars a little are the tender brake shoes moulded as part of the frame; but these can be cut away. Character items like the whopping great dome and the austere crew shelter are pleasing; just wondering if it will be possible to add a handrail stanchion off the rear of the cab side cut out. Small detail like the rods to operate the sanders are delicately done and the chequer plate on the front platform is excellent. One thing I am curious about is the dimension of the increased width of the footplating above the cylinders and slidebars: the old Ian Beattie drawing I have shows this to be shorter than Bachmann represent it, and appears to correspond to photographs. Was there some variation within the class for this feature?

[AMJ]

Smokey Robinson

Had an interesting day. My loco runs a treat on DC put a chip in it and hey presto the chip becomes a DCC smoke generator. Tried it with more than one chip and et la voila the chips fried!

 

Put the blanking plate back on and runs a treat on DC.

 

Guess who is taking it back to the shop in the morning.. Let's see if they believe me and they also fry a chip!

 

Now to email the supplier of a sound chip to say it gone to a crisp in the same day that I got it!

[31A]

I found the pony truck spring was a bit strong on mine, causing the front drivers to be lifted slightly on some pointwork and hence loss of pick up on dead frogs (OK, I know there shouldn't be dead frogs, but when I built my layout Peco didn't make live frog slips in Code 75!).

 

Very easy to remove the pony truck and leaf spring, flatten the spring slightly and reassemble, and problem solved.

 

Otherwise, as others have said, a very impressive model, which I'm very happy with!

[big jim]

Smokey Robinson

Had an interesting day. My loco runs a treat on DC put a chip in it and hey presto the chip becomes a DCC smoke generator. Tried it with more than one chip and et la voila the chips fried!

 

Put the blanking plate back on and runs a treat on DC.

 

 

didn't some super D's have a similar problem?

 

assuming the robinson also has the chip in the tender, the solder on the wires between the tender and loco were touching on some super d's, its fine on dc as the power only needs to go between the motor and pick-ups whereas on dcc it obviously needs to go to the decoder but the short was sending power to the wrong side of the chip and blowing it?

 

i may be mistaken though

[DougN]

Have to say my LNER liveried O4 runs beautifully I would recommend it to any one. Mine will haul about 15 waggons around my layout which has 24" radius ends and a 1:30 grade. It is severe and the only loco's that run perfectly are Bachmann's all the Hornby rollingstock seems to play up on it! So I may not be getting a L1

 

A very happy 04 owner.

[AMJ]

The supplier of my loco spoke to the service department at Bachmann and they will have a look at the problem of the short. So loco off for a service.

 

Thanks Jim, sounds like excessive solder on the micro joints - very easy to do.

[Guest TomTank]

Just ordered mine in LNER livery and looking forward to giving her a touch of weathering when she arrives!

 

Hornby Mag give a nice review of her, she looks like a mighty fine detailed old lady

[coachmann]

The model with its fine detailing looks fabulous. Shame I now have to await the early BR version....

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

While you are waiting Larry, you can contemplate a few improvements.

 

Having had the body off*, it is the simplest thing in the world to alter the cylinder position, there is space above the mounting bar that is screwed to the chassis block. A little packing under the mounting bar does the job, and I don't believe it will be necessary to make any accomodation under the footplate either. It's the slide bar bracket that is the villain of the piece, this needs to rise slightly to get the piston axis aimed at the third coupled wheel axle centre. While its' mounting bar can similarly be easily unscrewed to permit adjustment, it is captive between the chassis block groove it locates in, and the underside of the footplate casting. About a 0.75 mm deep channel needs to be cut in the underside of the footplate casting to allow it to sit higher on the chassis block, for correct appearance. The cutting job can wait for daylight tomorrow.

 

Fortuitous discovery, while getting the chassis out: the wire that forms the rear handrails to the cab is a single U shaped piece of wire, located in holes in the footplate, lightly tacked with adhesive. So a couple of small handrail knobs can be slipped on, and secured under the cabside cut outs each side, if this detail is to be added.

 

That's as far as I have gone on taking the loco body to pieces. Removing the three screws on the underside released the smokebox from the footplate, but everything is still tight at the cab end. Going to wait for good daylight to look for the gaps and cracks that indicate if the cab end is clipped onto the footplate in any way. Not doing this idly BTW, I want the cast weight out to be substituted with a lump of lead.

 

*Getting the loco body off. It is not necessary to take the brake actuator off to get at the rear securing screw. The screwhead is concealed under the wires, just to the rear of the chassis bracket for the brake actuator. Use a small crosshead screwdriver (OOO) and part the wires gently to find the screwhead. With the securing screws undone the chassis lifted out of the body very easily. Big benefit of the new packaging is that the loco can sit inverted in the top half of the pack, and is thus well protected while the chassis is removed. (After a lifetime of flinging away the boxes, I shall from now on be keeping some of the packaging.)

[coachmann]

Useful info there 34theletterbetweenB&D, especially pertaining to the slidebar/cylinder angle. I rarely take mine apart, with my tendency to lose bits, but your suggestion will be followed.

 

I'm taken with the LNER livery loco because of its wheel and handle smokebox door fastener but am still studying photos at the moment.

[micklner]

It didnt take long for O1 and O4/8 conversions to start

 

http://www.lner.info/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2141&sid=0beb0936db9ac5b385535df4dab46e43&start

 

 

looks very nice B)

[t-b-g]

While you are waiting Larry, you can contemplate a few improvements.

 

Having had the body off*, it is the simplest thing in the world to alter the cylinder position, there is space above the mounting bar that is screwed to the chassis block. A little packing under the mounting bar does the job, and I don't believe it will be necessary to make any accomodation under the footplate either. It's the slide bar bracket that is the villain of the piece, this needs to rise slightly to get the piston axis aimed at the third coupled wheel axle centre. While its' mounting bar can similarly be easily unscrewed to permit adjustment, it is captive between the chassis block groove it locates in, and the underside of the footplate casting. About a 0.75 mm deep channel needs to be cut in the underside of the footplate casting to allow it to sit higher on the chassis block, for correct appearance. The cutting job can wait for daylight tomorrow.

 

Fortuitous discovery, while getting the chassis out: the wire that forms the rear handrails to the cab is a single U shaped piece of wire, located in holes in the footplate, lightly tacked with adhesive. So a couple of small handrail knobs can be slipped on, and secured under the cabside cut outs each side, if this detail is to be added.

 

That's as far as I have gone on taking the loco body to pieces. Removing the three screws on the underside released the smokebox from the footplate, but everything is still tight at the cab end. Going to wait for good daylight to look for the gaps and cracks that indicate if the cab end is clipped onto the footplate in any way. Not doing this idly BTW, I want the cast weight out to be substituted with a lump of lead.

 

*Getting the loco body off. It is not necessary to take the brake actuator off to get at the rear securing screw. The screwhead is concealed under the wires, just to the rear of the chassis bracket for the brake actuator. Use a small crosshead screwdriver (OOO) and part the wires gently to find the screwhead. With the securing screws undone the chassis lifted out of the body very easily. Big benefit of the new packaging is that the loco can sit inverted in the top half of the pack, and is thus well protected while the chassis is removed. (After a lifetime of flinging away the boxes, I shall from now on be keeping some of the packaging.)

 

When I had a look at the slidebar bracket, I decided that raising it up would solve one problem and create another. If you look at a photo of the real thing and compare it to the model, check the position of the rear ends of the slidebars in relation to the steps. If you move the bracket (which includes the steps) up, you will also end up with the steps in the wrong place. I reckon that the options may be to either make new holes in the back of the bracket or perhaps move the bracket up as suggested and replace the steps, which would probably mean making new ones. It may be possible to make a part out of thin black plasticard or metal (with holes for the slidebars at the right spacings) then attach this to the front of the existing slidebar braket at the correct hight. Not tried it but just thinking out loud!

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

That's right, the steps do land up overheight. As far as I am concerned the obvious mechanical defect of misalignment of the cylinder axis with the driven wheel axle is the glaring fault that has to be corrected. Slightly mispositioned steps barely register in my eyes, but if they ever begin to annoy, chopping them off and fitting a replacement will hardly be difficult. You never know, an aftermarket etched parts maker may even offer a little kit some day.

 

Still debating whether or not to correct the bend in the connecting rods. Not too visible in my accustomed eye level viewing position, and I am a little leery of bending what is probably mazak...

[coachmann]

I mostly saw the 04s on the line between Newton and Godley Junction as well as on the Apethorne line (it passed the bottom of my uncles garden) in the 1950s. For a modern-looking loco, it was the 04/8 with its sleek boiler and window cab. But for visual sheer brute power I always liked the 04/7 with its large boiler and 'fat face' smokebox.

 

It is the latter I'll probably have a look at building from the Bachmann model. Anyone know of any scale drawings?

[45609]

It is the latter I'll probably have a look at building from the Bachmann model. Anyone know of any scale drawings?

 

Larry,

 

The Isinglass drawing (ref 489) covers the O4/7. Also the NRM holds a decent copy of the pipe and rod arranagement for the 15D boilered Gresley version of the O4. Reference number is 4/GW/12461/E.

 

Cheers....Morgan

[coachmann]

The Isinglass drawing (ref 489) covers the O4/7. Also the NRM holds a decent copy of the pipe and rod arranagement for the 15D boilered Gresley version of the O4. Reference number is 4/GW/12461/E.

 

Thanks for this Morgan. I wondered if you have an address or contact for the Isinglas drawings please?

 

Cheers,

Larry

[jwealleans]

2562 on the LNER forum or here

[45609]

2562 on the LNER forum or here

 

What he said. Thanks JW

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

Having a rethink on relocating the slide bar bracket. Not much thickness in the footplating to allow cutting the necessary trough to allow the mounting bar to be repositioned. Don't really want to muck up the footplate; and the alternative of thinning down the mounting bar will leave it rather 'weeny weedy weaky' as Julius Caesar didn't say.

 

So. What. To. Do. ? Because that misalignment of cylinder axis/piston rod to driving axle centre has to be corrected. I think it may be necessary to take the slide bar bracket apart, fill the slide bar locating holes and drill new ones, to obtain the correct orientation. More thought required.

[7013]

I wonder if there has been any communication with Bachmann to ascertain their view on the slidebar/cylinder issue. It does seem rather counterproductive to me to pay £125 for a RTR loco then have to start taking it to bits and packing, cutting etc. to make it look acceptable, surely someone should be puting some pressure on Bachmann. I know upsetting the manufacturers is frowned upon but this loco has been a long time coming and it is still not right, I'm glad I am in the market for a GWR version perhaps the tooling will be sorted by then!

[Gavvy2]

I am slightly puzzled by the discussion on the slide bar issue. As a young man I used to watch O4s passing Heaton Mersey shed on the old cheshire lines and for me the model perfectly captures the imposing lines of the prototype. As I look at he model I am transported back 50 years to long trains of slowly moving unfitted mineral wagons clanking,and squeaking past.

 

I have studied photos and cannot see what the fuss is about. The prototypes seem to vary slightly and lighting conditions can also create different images.I attach a photo of 63685 ( an O4/3 but I think the same in this area)and it does appear that the slide bar 'hangs down' a little.

 

Anyway I shall be very happy to buy one as it is,even though I will also need more minerals!

 

cheers

 

Gavin

[craigwelsh]

You should be able to draw an imaginary line between the piston in the cyinder and the boss of the driven axle, on the Bachmann model it tends to angle sharper downwards more towards the middle driver.

 

This sort of misalignment was the big giveaway on the problems with the original Ixion Manor in 'N' where the cylinders ended up massively below the correct place for this line..

 

Its not really important on the model but on the prototype it ensures the amount of movement of the connecting rod is even either side of centre. Once you realise where it should be its one of those annoying things..

 

Btw I had noted the bend in the connecting rods in the Hattons photo but put it down to the lens on the camera used..

[coachmann]

Thanks to the gent that gave the Isinglas drawing number for an 04/7. Order placed this afternoon.

 

Larry