What method do you use to record the wiring of your layout?

[Damo666]

Question to those who like to document their work.  What method do you use to record the wiring of your layout? And if you use software as opposed to written notes and sketches, what software please?

 

Do you note each wire in a realistic fashion, or as a schematic (Think of an accurate geographic depiction of the London Underground verses Harry Beck’s map).

 

As I started to wire up my layout last year I realised I could have problems in the future if I need to trace back an issue and don’t remember what I did (or why). So I started to draw lines using photoshop over a picture I took of the baseboard. Very laborious and I’m not convinced it’s the right solution.

 

I’d be interested to learn from your collective thoughts.

[MikeB]

Rather then a diagram I use lists in an Excel spreadsheet, where each row has three entries, from, wire color, to. for example:

Box A connection 2 down   red   Box C connection 4 up

Box C connection 4 down   red   track 21 feed

 

with separate pages, for track, points, signals etc.

 

It works for me, but each to his/her own.

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

I don't need to, my layout is DCC, ergo, only 2 wires to worry about!!

 

Mike.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

On much the same theme as 'MikeB' above, a systematic labelling scheme, a list of everything installed with date of installation, and schematics of the principles of the layouts: track power, detection, point motors, uncouplers etc.. 

[Damo666]

46 minutes ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

I don't need to, my layout is DCC, ergo, only 2 wires to worry about!!

 

Mike.

Well, my layout is also DCC, but I've a lot more than just two wires. 😁

 

Track and Accessory bus (there's 4) is straightforward, but I've separated these into 2 zones.

The points, with frog switching, is a few more wires.

 

At some stage I'll probably add some signals, whether these are stand-alone for visual effect, or connected to the point motors I haven't yet decided. Depends how much of a muddle it's all going to get.

 

I've looked at, with interest, some form of block detection, but I don't want to jump into the deep end before I know what I'm doing. This is a certain recipe for disaster and if I get lots of wiring problems, it'll be demotivational. I want to get clarity on what I’m already doing before I venture much further.

[Damo666]

1 hour ago, MikeB said:

Rather then a diagram I use lists in an Excel spreadsheet, where each row has three entries, from, wire color, to. for example:

Box A connection 2 down   red   Box C connection 4 up

Box C connection 4 down   red   track 21 feed

 

with separate pages, for track, points, signals etc.

 

It works for me, but each to his/her own.

Thanks Mike, I think I get the ideal of what you are describing.

 

Any chance of a screenshot please of a typical example, just so I'm clear?

[Sitham Yard]

1 hour ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

On much the same theme as 'MikeB' above, a systematic labelling scheme, a list of everything installed with date of installation, and schematics of the principles of the layouts: track power, detection, point motors, uncouplers etc.. 

Again much the same. I like to terminate everything in either chocolate block connectors or solder tag strips (prefer the latter for moveable layouts) and then label all the terminations. If you use Excel for this you should be able to adjust the number of pixels to get a reasonable match to the spacing of each wire and can therefore provide laminated labels for the terminations.  Also label all point motors and anything else under the baseboard.

 

Have a system, that suits you, for identifying all wires to the track e.g. if two isolations in platform 1 then the feeds could be labelled Platform 1 and Platform 1A and the returns Platform 1R and label all the holes in the baseboard where a wire comes through, a marker pen will do.  

 

Colour coding can help e.g. black for return, white for all point crossing v's (frogs) etc. 

 

By doing all this I find that often an issue can be resolved without having to look at the written notes and diagram.

 

Others have suggested in the past that the underneath of a baseboard should be painted a light colour to help see all the wiring and labels. I just paint both sides of a baseboard with a light grey primer.    

Andrew

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

As close as I get to 2 wires, underneath the platform board, straight track only!

 

Mike.

 

[DCB]

Recording is much more important if you build the layout in a logical way, turning it upside own to secure the wiring etc.   That way there is that awful moment when you connect the power for the first time and absolutely nothing works.
Me I plan the section breaks, on my plan drawn at 1 :12th scale in an A3 Artists Sketch book. I lay the track, check clearances, test  it with push along and battery mules, controller and crocodile clips and only then think about wiring.    My traction and lighting wiring is telephone wire, good for 1 amp, (DC) red/green/white/black with similar pink and brown .The individual wiring modules are scrawled in  an A 5 reporters notebook.  The 5 amp points wires are colour coded and from a Transit Van .    The clever bit is photographing the  sketches and  transferring them to the cloud on your favourite photo sharing site so you can download them to eyeball when it goes pear shape .      It's my live frog diamonds with their 4 pole relays which gave me some grief,  (2 wire DCC users should sit down here)    The terminals on the diode matrix's are clearly marked as to which point they feed or which stud feeds them. in Biro  and a photo doesn't come amiss, if the matrix misbehaves or a relay fails  (Hasn't happened yet after 35 years).    I did acquire some colour coded and lettered collars for wires but could never be bothered to use them.        Mix and match, nick a good idea here and there that's my way.

[Damo666]

Thanks to all who replied, especially those who sent me PMs.

 

This is what I've got (Layout board #1):

 

And what I wanted to do was produce a schematic drawing so that I can easily fault-find later and understand how I've wired each board (it's been a learning curve, and I've had to go back and re-do stuff when I discovered a mistake or realised there was a better way of doing something). And this is where I often find myself, trying to remember how (and why) I did something many months / years ago.

 

I started with this, using Photoshop, but I feel I'm usings a bulldozer to shift a bucket of sand. I'm not happy with this as it's too cumbersome and slow. I won't be doing this for the remaining boards.

 

This is an inverted view, as if I'm looking down on the layout from above and seeing the wiring underneath.

 

I think the image below is the type of info I need to capture, so I know how everything is individually wired (image taken from a DCC Concepts manual - I wouldn't need all the notes):

 

 

I could of course use this for a typical point, but I'd also like to record the wiring for the Circuit Breakers, Signal controls, power supplies, USB interface, which point is connected to which signal on which control board etc

 

The new (to me) piece of software I've started to look at is Microsoft VISIO, looks promising.

 

Edited August 26, 2023 by Damo666
typo

[IWCR]

Record?,  as  in  write  it  down  or  draw  it?  Strange  Concept.

 

Pete

[Vecchio]

All my points and signals are numbered, I use a standard colour combination for DCC and for the DC bus. I have excel lists for every interface from board to board. I have also excel lists for every Megapoints controller showing the relation between Megapoints controller, Point number and Mimic board channel. 

 

Without such documentation you get crazy in case of a fault. 

 

IMG20230816202428 

 

 

 

You may think 37 pin connectors are an overkill, especially when using DCC and a bus system for points and signals, but I prefer to have some spare pins in case necessary

 

 

[brossard]

DCC does help to simplify things.  I don't need a control panel, just momentary push buttons on the fascia to change turnouts.  That is a huge advantage I think.

 

However, two wires?  I think not:

 

 

Before anyone says anything:

 

1) It actually does all work.  Tortoises and Wabbits are prominent.  Choc blocks keep everything modular and provide test points.

2) I am unhappy with the messiness and in the coming days I will be reviewing and revising the wiring. 

 

The problem with choc blocks is that solid core wires tend to fatigue and break, they're all going.  Even stranded wires can come out over time, and they frequently do.  I have some various sized ferrules  that the wire is inserted into and crimped.  This gives better adhesion inside the choc block.

 

I will also go round and use screw down plastic clamps to keep the wires under control.

 

That said the layout has done four shows to date.  We had one or two electrical scares at the last show but these were fixed.  It does underscore that the wiring needs looking at.

 

John

[Enterprisingwestern]

1 hour ago, IWCR said:

Record?,  as  in  write  it  down  or  draw  it?  Strange  Concept.

 

Pete

 

 

I agree.

Some people are overthinking this!!

 

Mike.

[Dagworth]

For the first time ever I have recorded the wiring on a layout while building Ipswich. It’s all written in an Excel sheet that lists what each pin of the 37 pin D connectors of each board carries. There are three connectors on each board, an input from/to the computer connection and power distribution, and a connector to the board each end. 
All the excel sheet lists is what the designation of each pin is, be it a voltage, a signal or point output, a track circuit or switch input to the computer, or a DCC jump carrying a track circuit across a baseboard joint. Everything is marked under the baseboards of what connections are which ties up with the excel notes. 

 

No wires themselves are marked in any way, the colour and the connector pin number is enough to identify its purpose. 
 

Andi 
 

[Damo666]

56 minutes ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

 

I agree.

Some people are overthinking this!!

 

Mike.

Perhaps Mike.

 

I think it all depends on the size of your layout, mine has 22 points and I'm starting to consider how best to add signals. Recording what I’ve done before for reference will, I hope, help me reduce the possibly of making a short circuit or creating some other fault.

 

It also depends what degree of OCD you have in wanting to record things.

[5BarVT]

There is one thing worse than not recording what you’ve done . . .

Recording it to start with and not updating when you change things.

 

I know!

 

Paul.

[Davexoc]

I used Excel, with the signalling looking like this,

 

Connectors are 9-pin and the various bits are colour coded. The signals are off 3-pole 4-position rotary affairs, some using 2 of the poles to accomodate feathers. Ground signals are toggle switches as are point motors, which are done in a similar format.

Actual cables are a mish-mash of different multi-cores from 4 to 24. The above sheet will be updated soon with power feeds too....

 

[Dave John]

I'd certainly agree with making detailed wiring lists. 

 

Use whatever software is freely available to you and remember to update the lists as you make changes. 

 

Kelvinbank is a simple layout, yet there are 30 + pages of wiring lists and 40 + pages of circuit diagrams. 

 

Many years ago before kelvinbank 0 I had an N gauge layout. I thought I could just remember the wiring. I discovered  that memory, like hair, is temporary ... 

[Wheatley]

My layout currently under construction fills the garage, has 25 electrical sections, about 80 points and signals and no wiring diagram.

 

Each wire has an identification code based on what it does, written next to every connection or termination, so TC is the track common return, T1, T2 etc are track section feeds, E1N is East box lever 1 normal etc etc. 

 

Although there is no wiring diagram there is a list written on the underside of each board (!) stating which connections enter or leave that board. Connections between boards are by 25 way D-sub connectors wired to tag strips, and each strip has the wire ID written on. So I can trace a wire from one end of the layout to the other quite easily. 

 

DC wiring looks complicated but it's essentially the same three basic circuits  repeated multiple times. 

 

The fiddle yard (9 roads) uses Setrack self-isolating points so just 2 wires. And as it's effectively a long single track roundy-roundy with a couple of passing loops designed for solo operation, it all runs off a single controller !

[Philou]

Oo-er - and there was I thinking DCC was the solution - except as my DCC unit is kaput at the moment, I shall need to keep a DC option open. Food for thought in all the above!

[kevinlms]

17 hours ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

 

I agree.

Some people are overthinking this!!

 

Mike.

While I agree in principle, you do need some notes of what you've done, but much of it can be standard.

Something like a solenoid point motor can certainly be modular in approach to the wiring.

3 wires used to drive the points, 1 common, and 2 to operate the point, one each for straight or curve/reverse.

3 more for a switch, 1 for the frog and the other 2 to the outside rails. If you want to add in point detection for say signals, 3 more wires as a standard.

There's 6 (or 9) wires, that should ALWAYS be used for the same function and so the same colour throughout for each identical purpose. So only one diagram for them all.

 

Once you start doing that, the job gets easier and you can remember the basics, since it's just multiplying out.  DC or DCC.

[5BarVT]

11 hours ago, Wheatley said:

My layout currently under construction fills the garage, has 25 electrical sections, about 80 points and signals and no wiring diagram.

 

Each wire has an identification code based on what it does, written next to every connection or termination, so TC is the track common return, T1, T2 etc are track section feeds, E1N is East box lever 1 normal etc etc. 

 

Although there is no wiring diagram there is a list written on the underside of each board (!) stating which connections enter or leave that board. Connections between boards are by 25 way D-sub connectors wired to tag strips, and each strip has the wire ID written on. So I can trace a wire from one end of the layout to the other quite easily. 

 

DC wiring looks complicated but it's essentially the same three basic circuits  repeated multiple times. 

 

The fiddle yard (9 roads) uses Setrack self-isolating points so just 2 wires. And as it's effectively a long single track roundy-roundy with a couple of passing loops designed for solo operation, it all runs off a single controller !

I would argue you do have a wiring diagram - it’s the layout!

The important thing is that you have identifiers to a code that you understand to say what the wires do.

Paul.

[Davexoc]

There are several ways to crack this nut. You can draw a schematic to show visually what has been done, or you can label everything.

I've worked on machinery from different countries and they all have their own style. USA will use tagged on wire numbers, whereas Germany will tell you terminal numbers with wire ident on a multicore by either core number or colour. Italy I found did something between the two...

As long as you follow the same set of your rules, it should all fall into place. All my track feeds are brown, with blue common return. Multi-aspect signal I used a multi-core that gave me red, green, yellow, white, black and blue. First three self explanatory, then feather, shunt and 0 volts. Simples....

[dasatcopthorne]

Over many years of building and running Club exhibition layouts I have taken a slightly differing direction.

This allows a sheet or more for each board, allowing a file to be made up and kept with the layouts paperwork.

 

It records 25 pin D plug connectors where they go to and from. Mid board drop offs or wires ending on a board can be shown however you choose.

 

Each wire is named with its purpose and any other info needed. The date allows updates to be made and recorded.

 

On some occasions, I draw a rough track diagram at the bottom and annotate with point and section numbers/labels.

 

Dave.

 

Edited August 27, 2023 by dasatcopthorne