RNAD railways - locos, rolling stock, loads and buildings in 009.

[coline33]

On 02/06/2023 at 02:03, Scottish Modeller said:

Relevant to the topic, but not exclusive to it!

 

Royal Navy munitions Post Falklands era.

 

I'm trying to collect info and photos of some of the later munitions used by the RN and stored at Dean Hill prior to being moveer to other locations after the closure of the site.

 

Does anyone any suggestions of how to find out more info and photos to help with this?

 

Phil H

Phil, thank you for the request.   It is very timely as a producer is looking to know of further Dean Hill munitions to add to the present range.   We hope the links can be found and the types advised.   Colin.

[eastworld]

On 16/05/2023 at 09:52, coline33 said:

Well, it is all happening!!!   The new range of munitions shown in my photos are now available at CWrailways website.   Under Product Names, click on to Bombs and Munitions for a new revised page.   Then under Product No's go to Diesel & Electric Locos page.   Under the photos of gthe Hunslet diesel it states "current version has half open cab door" and "now available with or without air cylinders".   In fact the cab door is fully open and the Hunslet bonnet nameplate is of the straight version.   If you need to have the diagonal version then please ask to see if available.

 

Please note that CW stands for "Chris Ward" NOT myself as my only interest in these developments is in purchasing!

You need to be careful ordering bombs over the internet!

 

[coline33]

38 minutes ago, eastworld said:

You need to be careful ordering bombs over the internet!

 

Well said!!!   Good job in 4mm they cannot be made hollow!

[Scottish Modeller]

Hi all,

 

OK - a bit more on more modern munitions....

 

Apparently most of the navy munitions stopped being carried loose or on cradles and went into palleted cases. 

 

This followed the introduction of standard pallet sizes as part of the NATO standardisation.

 

So far I've been told standard ISO pallet sizes with cases to that size. 

 

Standard NATO pallet

1200mm x 1000mm

See https://thinkdefence.wordpress.com/2014/11/15/military-boxes-pallets-containers-part-2-pallets/

 

ISP2 cases

See https://www.peli.com/eu/en/product/isp-cases/isp2-case/eu080040-2020

 

Designed for use with the NATO Pallet, the ISP2 case system can be cross-stacked to form a stable load. The columnar ribs in the case walls can support a much taller pallet stack than corrugated boxes.

 

Other things RNAD....

 

Forklift transportation wagons.

 

Were these simply converted by the variuos sites or were some built new by Hudson? Drawings and photos not published  would be a great help!

 

Thanks

Phil H

Edited June 20, 2023 by Scottish Modeller

[coline33]

On 20/06/2023 at 17:00, Scottish Modeller said:

Hi all,

 

OK - a bit more on more modern munitions....

 

Apparently most of the navy munitions stopped being carried loose or on cradles and went into palleted cases. 

 

This followed the introduction of standard pallet sizes as part of the NATO standardisation.

 

So far I've been told standard ISO pallet sizes with cases to that size. 

 

Standard NATO pallet

1200mm x 1000mm

See https://thinkdefence.wordpress.com/2014/11/15/military-boxes-pallets-containers-part-2-pallets/

 

ISP2 cases

See https://www.peli.com/eu/en/product/isp-cases/isp2-case/eu080040-2020

 

Designed for use with the NATO Pallet, the ISP2 case system can be cross-stacked to form a stable load. The columnar ribs in the case walls can support a much taller pallet stack than corrugated boxes.

 

Other things RNAD....

 

Forklift transportation wagons.

 

Were these simply converted by the variuos sites or were some built new by Hudson? Drawings and photos not published  would be a great help!

 

Thanks

Phil H

Thanks, Phil.   I have passed this info on.   I noticed some of the modern pallets stacked in the background of some of the published photos.   Colin.

[coline33]

This where I have got to with West Dean, today!   Hunslet 7495, Breakdown Van DH474 (less strips) and Brake Van DH552.   Enjoy.

[ELTEL]

On 15/07/2023 at 11:35, coline33 said:

This where I have got to with West Dean, today!   Hunslet 7495, Breakdown Van DH474 (less strips) and Brake Van DH552.   Enjoy.

What make, and what supplier provides the above kits and running chassis ?
 

Completely new to 009 and looking at a small project based say on RAF stores 

 

Eltel 

[Rammstein2609]

Hi All

 

I hope you don't mind me posting this here but since we're on the topic of RNAD items, I've just started work on a small L shaped OO9 layout inspired by Dean Hill.  I really wanted to incorporate a portion of the light traverse laboratories but due to the size of my baseboards, I can only fit 3 of the 6 bays.  I've used 9.5mm plywood for the main structure of the blast walls and developed my own laser cut buildings.  The ply blast walls will receive a suitable texture coat to disguise the fact they're a timber product before everything gets painted.  I want to detail the building interiors so plan on modelling removable painted roof sections along with transparent removable sections.

 

Here is the progress I made over the weekend at the St Andrews Model Railway show:

 

 

I would love to post a photo of the real thing for comparison but can't for copyright reasons, instead some images can be viewed at this website: https://www.subbrit.org.uk/sites/dean-hill-royal-naval-armaments-depot/

 

Thanks

Martin

[coline33]

On 06/08/2023 at 18:29, ELTEL said:

What make, and what supplier provides the above kits and running chassis ?
 

Completely new to 009 and looking at a small project based say on RAF stores 

 

Eltel 

Sorry for delay in replying.   The Hunslet loco is CWrailways on Kato mech and the vans are Bachmann 009 (have a good look at their range).   The covered van is the SR version as found on Lynton & Barnstaple and the brake van is a rebuild and repainted of the open brake van on Statford Barn railway.   Bachmann also have a Dean Hill Baguley-Drewry loco due for release.   For RAF railways suggest the kit for 'Douglas' on the Talyllyn as that was ex-RAF Calshot.   Trust this helps, Colin.

[coline33]

On 15/08/2023 at 20:09, Rammstein2609 said:

Hi All

 

I hope you don't mind me posting this here but since we're on the topic of RNAD items, I've just started work on a small L shaped OO9 layout inspired by Dean Hill.  I really wanted to incorporate a portion of the light traverse laboratories but due to the size of my baseboards, I can only fit 3 of the 6 bays.  I've used 9.5mm plywood for the main structure of the blast walls and developed my own laser cut buildings.  The ply blast walls will receive a suitable texture coat to disguise the fact they're a timber product before everything gets painted.  I want to detail the building interiors so plan on modelling removable painted roof sections along with transparent removable sections.

 

Here is the progress I made over the weekend at the St Andrews Model Railway show:

 

 

I would love to post a photo of the real thing for comparison but can't for copyright reasons, instead some images can be viewed at this website: https://www.subbrit.org.uk/sites/dean-hill-royal-naval-armaments-depot/

 

Thanks

Martin

Martin, sorry for the delay in saying this is just the site for your project so thank you for sharing.   It looks great and inspirational, well done.   Please keep us all up-to-date on your progress.   I found plenty of images from Googling Dean Hill and other RNAD sites.   Colin.

[ELTEL]

On 01/09/2023 at 11:43, coline33 said:

Sorry for delay in replying.   The Hunslet loco is CWrailways on Kato mech and the vans are Bachmann 009 (have a good look at their range).   The covered van is the SR version as found on Lynton & Barnstaple and the brake van is a rebuild and repainted of the open brake van on Statford Barn railway.   Bachmann also have a Dean Hill Baguley-Drewry loco due for release.   For RAF railways suggest the kit for 'Douglas' on the Talyllyn as that was ex-RAF Calshot.   Trust this helps, Colin.

Thanks for the information 

 

I will going along to the 009 50th Anniversary Exhibition in a couple of weeks time to have a good look at 009 and what it could offer.

 

I have previously built both 0.16.5 NG and Gn15 (still have all the Gn15 rolling stock) but never modelled in 009

 

Would need to sell the Gn15 stock to fund any new project.

 

Did manage to go to the 0 Gauge Guild Exhibition at Stafford today (was tempted by 7mm but no purchases) 

 

Terry 

 

 

[Scottish Modeller]

Hi all,

 

OK, things have been quiet with me - having an eye condition has really slowed my modelling down.

However, I've now had my first cateract op and can report that I can see almost normally from that eye, just need the other one done!

I've not been wasting time though, lots of  research has been done.....

 

As a result I have additional quests to resolve areas where I am lacking information or/and photos.

 

Priority one?

 

RNAD Dean Hill - Fork Lift carrrying wagons.

 

So far I've identified 2 different versions but don't have enough photos to come to a conclusion about them. They appear to be conversions from standard RNAD Flat or Single Plank wagons. But, one of the chassis appears to be different from the RNAD standard ones.

 

Anyone know if drawings exist of both the carrying and ramp wagons?

 

More photos would be a big help!

 

Thanks

Phil H

Edited September 30, 2023 by Scottish Modeller

[Scottish Modeller]

Hi all,

 

Some time doing internet searches whilst I was waiting for my hospital appointment....

What did I find out?
 

Flat Wagons - different locations made different versions.

 

DH889 - Hudson - Dean Hill modification

Unidentified - Hudson - Dean Hill modification

Unidentified - unknown (ex Trecwyn)

Unidentified - unknown (ex Trecwyn)

 

Ramp Wagons - 

DH247 - Hudson - Dean Hill modification

DH135 - Hudson - Dean Hill modification

Unidentified - unknown (ex Trecwyn)

Unidentified - unknown (ex Trecwyn)

 

Nearly all the photos I have found are of the Dean Hill modified ones but a couple of photos show the ex Trecwyn ones which are very diffferent to the Dean Hill ones.

 

Any other input would be appreciated!

 

Phil H

 

ps - first attempt at modelling a Dean Hill set is on my workbench now - photos to follow once I start sticking things together.

 

[Scottish Modeller]

Hi all,

 

OK - still looking at the Fork Lift carrying wagons - MHE

 

Looking at the various photos - I need to find some different suspension units for one of the wagons.

 

Using the 009 society chassis works for 2 of the wagons - need to make body to sit on them, but they have the right suspension/bearing type.

 

The other wagon needs some 'Hudson Raletrux' suspension/bearings.

 

They are available in other scales, just not found them in 4mm scale yet! See attached snip from a 1/32 scale wagon kit.

 

So, are they available in 4mm scale and I've not found them or are they something I'm going to have to make from scratch?

 

Thanks

Phil H

 

Edited October 6, 2023 by Scottish Modeller

[PaulRhB]

On 15/08/2023 at 20:09, Rammstein2609 said:

 

 

 

 

 

Those really look the part Martin, are you likely to offer these for sale?

[SteveyDee68]

Just to say that Colin Swithey’s “like” posted on 7 October 2023 on Martin’s post of 15 Aug appears to have been Colin’s final contribution to RMWeb, before he unexpectedly passed away later that day.

 

I hope that everyone interested in modelling the RNAD narrow gauge railway systems in 009 will continue to use his thread as the central depository of knowledge, despite it’s original author no longer being with us.

 

I think Colin would have appreciated that.

 

Steve S

Edited October 26, 2023 by SteveyDee68
Clarity

[Dunalastair]

Picking up on Colin's useful thread, I have been looking at one of the lesser known sites, RNAD Crombie, originally RNOD Crombie in WW1, still functioning as DM Crombie in Fife. Built to serve the Rosyth Dockyard, it had the usual 2' 6" gauge, but less usually had four (later five) fireless NG steam locos designed for working in tunnels and bunkers. 'Early Railways of West Fife' (Brotchie and Jack) has a short section on the line, including a few images and a very useful plan. The book cost me rather more than I would normally pay, even second hand, so I had better get my value out of it! Good thing my Shapeways shop came in with a payment just at the right time.

 

I have now 3D printed a static model at 1:76 of one of the fireless NG locos based on a photograph and limited additional information. This is how it looked after initial paint but before cleaning up and without couplers, which have yet to be designed and printed. 

 

 

Such a loco would make a change working the Bachmann model RNAD rolling stock - the Crombie machines apparently  lasted until the end of WW2.

 

One of the images in the Brotchie book shows vans without roofs labelled as Royal Naval Ordnance Dept (in full) by contrast to later RNAD branding. The change in name came in 1920. 

 

Most of what we hear about RNAD NG relates to later lines like Trecwn and Dean Hill, built in the late thirties, with the later generation of rolling stock, some represented now in preservation. What do we know about the earlier WW1 generation of NG rolling stock?

[Dunalastair]

Looking closely, those WW1 RNOD vans seem to be wider than the later WW2 RNAD vans - or are they just lower? The ends seem to be about square, rather than tall and thin. Any thoughts on dimensions for the two designs? 

[Dunalastair]

My interpretation of the RNOD (later RNAD) rolling stock based on the photograph in the 'Early Railways of West Fife' book. Roofless van and flat wagon with stacked crates.

 

 

These are static models so gauge is 10mm to represent 2' 6" rather than strictly OO9. But OO9 is a better match to navy gauge than it is to Welsh slate / WDLR gauge.