Brandon - ideas for a N Gauge retirement layout

[stivesnick]

All

 

A similar view to the one in the previous post but now with added model railway stuff and the first of the new baseboards.

 

My previous layouts, designed for exhibition use, used baseboard kits, but these are now getting rather expensive. So it is back to a standard softwood frame. As the layout is not intended for exhibition use, boards can be larger. The first board is 2400 x 600mm. Progress photo enclosed. I will use solid boards in the station area which is generally flat, but individual track beds elsewhere to allow scenery to drop below track level. Some of the timbers will need to be cut out to create a riverbed.

 

Regards 

 

Nick  

[stivesnick]

The second baseboard has now been constructed and the track plan for the first stage of the layout marked out. Nothing is fixed yet and the layout is resting on temporary supports whilst I decide the correct height for the legs so that they clear the radiator, window cill and various book cases. As drawn the passing siding will take 2 locos, 15 trucks and a caboose. 

 

At the height shown in the photos, I will struggle to reach into the corner of the layout so the track to the large factory will need to be relocated to make it easier to reach.

 

Progress photos enclosed. Note hi-tech strip of cardboard with holes used for drawing the curves.

 

Regards 

 

Nick  

[stivesnick]

All

 

Tracklaying has started and the first half of the GN station track has been laid. To give an idea of what the future layout might look like, I have dug out some buildings from previous layouts and add some stock boxes to give an idea of what buildings might be required. 

 

The exercise was worth doing as I realised I had to move the track by the grain elevator over by 10mm to allow the building to fit.

 

Mock up photos below:

 

Nick 

 

 

[stivesnick]

The trackwork in the GN depot area has been completed, wired and some temporary fiddle yards added at each end of the depot to allow for some test running. One of the advantages of having a fixed layout with manually operated points means that there are no wires across board joints or point frog wiring to get mixed up, so it all worked first time!

 

Some progress photos enclosed showing some of the test trains. 

 

I must think about inproving the lighting in the room. The photo of the passenger train has some extra lighting from a fish tank light. This light has some blue LEDs included  giving a strange effect. 

 

I did shoot some video but not able to load onto youtube but having not used for some time and fogotten password and not able to satisfy the youtube police, I am not able to load it up.

 

 

Nick 

[stivesnick]

Test running continues - found a small issue. I did not realise that the new Peco unifrog points do not self isolate. The layout has a mix of old Peco points and the new unifrog points, so some combinations of point settings mean that the isolation doesn't work. Will need to add a few section switches. 

 

Meanwhile work has started on some of the unbuilt kits I have. First up is a factory building from the Dutch firm Artitec. Its a resin kit so the walls are quite thick, but does make it easier to glue together. 

 

Adding to the coillection are some modular building sections from DPM for the large factory building in the corner plus some 3D printed tanks.

 

Photos enclosed. 

 

Nick 

[stivesnick]

Some progress with the buildings 

 

I have painted the Artitic factory building. As can be seen from the photo, the roof is not a great fit so some remedial work is needed to fill in the gap between the roof and end walls. I also need to tounch up the piantwork and add signage etc. 

 

I have started on one of the large factory complex buildings. The length of the building just fits onto a A3 cutting mat, which is essential in keeping the modular wall sections flat when joining them togther. There will be a loading platform in front of the building which can take 4 box cars. The photo shows the building in it's intended location with the yellow paper shapes to represent the other buildings in the complex. Once the weather improves and there is no wind/rain, I can use a rattle can to spray paint the walls a basic colour and the window/doors before working out how to support the roof. 

 

Progress photos enclosed.

 

Nick 

 

 

[Michael Hodgson]

Every time I see the title of this thread, I can't help thinking of this place (which sadly I never got into)

 

https://www.suffolknews.co.uk/bury-st-edmunds/news/more-of-our-history-gone-residents-share-sadness-after-si-9241573

 

[stivesnick]

Michael 

 

There are many towns/cities in the US with english names. 

 

Nick

[Johann Marsbar]

9 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said:

Every time I see the title of this thread, I can't help thinking of this place (which sadly I never got into)

 

https://www.suffolknews.co.uk/bury-st-edmunds/news/more-of-our-history-gone-residents-share-sadness-after-si-9241573

 

 

The main station building almost suffered the same fate as Greater Anglia wanted to demolish it, but it was "saved" after an extensive campaign, though it currently looks like this......

 

 

...which is totally enclosed in a wood an scaffolding "fortress" that you can't even see the original building hiding behind!

Whether the place ever gets restored is another question........

 

My Great Uncle was Stationmaster there at one time during his lengthy Railway career - I think in the late 1950's.

[Michael Hodgson]

3 hours ago, Johann Marsbar said:

 

The main station building almost suffered the same fate as Greater Anglia wanted to demolish it, but it was "saved" after an extensive campaign, though it currently looks like this......

 

 

That actually looks in better condition than the station building last time I saw it.

[Michael Hodgson]

12 hours ago, stivesnick said:

Michael 

 

There are many towns/cities in the US with english names. 

 

Nick

Yes, when I was working on a contract  in Virginia, they told me Richmond was so called because the bend in the river looked to the early settlers just like the one in England.  I couldn't see it myself, but of course I was thinking of Richmond Yorks rather than Richmond Surrey,  I went to Pennsylvania one weekend and found it very confusing that Manchester was West of Lancaster and South of York, while Reading was quite a bit further to the North 😕 

 

But at least the Strasburg Railroad looked to me like a foreign line 😀.   The German I was working with thought the Amish spoke a dialect of Deustch rather than Dutch, and he had only come with me because the Amish dress reminded him of his Jewish ancestors.

[stivesnick]

Some more progress with the large factory. It has now been painted and a roof added. I have also started to build the loading dock using plastic sections. I feel there ought to be a canopy over the loading dock, however this would hinder attempts at uncoupling in the sidings which are at the limit of reach. 

 

The company name has come from looking at company names in a local directory linked to what letters I have spare. 

 

The yellow card on the photos is where the company energy plant will go. It will receive coal in gondolas. 

 

In ongoing trail running, I have drawn up a simple switch list for 5 days operation. Some facilities will get switched each day, others once or twice during the 5 sessions. The schedule ensures that no operating session is the same as the last. 

 

Finally a question for all the experts on operation. The line represents a through route rather than a branch line, with the local freight running from yards at each end of the route where cars would be switched to and from through freights on the "main line(s)".  If the local freight serves a number of town en-route, would the yard put the cars in town order or would they simply block switch a group of cars from other services? Any thoughts on this welcome.

 

Seasons greetings to you all.

 

Nick 

[Keith Addenbrooke]

Hi Nick, in response to your question on classification of cars in yards, if I may offer a non-expert view (some contributors to this Forum have worked on US Railroads, so will know more):

 

If you like model railroading books, one that might be worth reading is Lance Mindheim’s 2021 Kalmbach publication: “How to Design a Model Railroad.”  It certainly updated my thinking.  His description of classification yards is that they do block cars by destination.  That’s one simple answer.  However, if you want to get more involved in yard switching there are some other factors that can come into play, some of which may be era-dependent:

 

1.  Are there any hazardous products being transported in your train that require barrier cars and cannot be placed immediately next to a locomotive?

2.  How are your spurs arranged at each town - it’s easier for a local to switch all the spurs in the trailing direction on each leg of the journey - more efficient than switching every spur at each town, as this may involve run-rounds.

3.  Do any of your industries - the one in the picture above could be one - have load specific car spots: the customer wants car 1 next to loading door A (etc), for example?

4.  Do any of your customers receive or ship fresh or time bound product, or pay a priority rate?

5.  Can your assigned power haul the number of cars needing delivery / pick-up, or are there grades or other issues en route that place a restriction on the length of a train?  Combine this with item 4. and it can get more complicated?

 

You might also factor in: is the same crew running the yard switching as well as the local - in which case how they classify the cars for each destination may be up to them, as they’ll be delivering them?  Or is there restricted yard capacity at one or both ends of your line - making it more difficult to classify cars into the optimum consist before departing?  Perhaps there is a time limit before the next through train is scheduled to arrive, so they need to set off - I don’t know if this is prototypical, it’s just a thought.  How long is a crew shift - that is a real life safety issue?  Is there somewhere en route to spot cars to be switched into facing spurs on the return journey (when those same spurs will be trailing)?  What is the railroad policy here?

 

And so on, and so on…until time us up.  Just some ideas from my own reading and watching over the years.  Hope that’s OK, Keith.

 

Edited December 21, 2023 by Keith Addenbrooke

[stivesnick]

Hi Keith 

 

Many thanks for your detailed response. I will have a look out for Lance's book.

 

My current thinking is as follows:

 

As noted in the first post, the layout will be (very) loosely based on the Great Northern's Willmar to Sioux City secondary route. The route was 220 miles long and trains took around 7 hours to cover the full length. 

 

My understnding is that the 1 or 2 through freight trains each day would have made limited stops en-route as they had to connect with other freight trains at each end of the line. I assume any switching would be trailing connections only - perhaps at key inerchanges with other railroads. 

 

The local freight would have taken much longer and would not be able to make a round trip in a day, so the eastbound and westbound local freights would have crossed somewhere. 

 

My run-around loop is not too long, around 18 cars, however on the real railway it would have been much longer say 100+ cars so a run-around move would have taken some time. Some loops did have a cross-over in the middle to speed things up. 

 

I am going to work on the basis that run-around moves were allowed for, although there will be other spurs on the layout, such as the quarry, which will be trailing switching only. Loaded cars will be dropped off at Brandon by westbound trains ready to be picked up by the next eastbound train. 

 

Thanks again for your comments.

 

Nick 

Edited December 22, 2023 by stivesnick
technical error corrected

[stivesnick]

Here is the "as-built" track schematic. 

 

Cars that need to change direction, can be stored at the Willmar end of the industry spur. 

 

The baggage car that gets dropped off from the Sioux City mail/passenger train gets stored on the team track. The return working that picks it up, will use the double ended siding to pick up the baggage car and temporary move any freight cars on that track out of the way if required. Not sure if switching a oil tank car with the baggage car is a great idea so may swop the oil distributer and the feed mill locations so the oil distributer is at the end of a spur and could be gated if needed.

 

Hope that makes sense.

 

Nick 

[F-UnitMad]

10 hours ago, Keith Addenbrooke said:

How long is a crew shift - that is a real life safety issue?  

I recall Lance covered that in one of his blog posts - in model layout terms he translated it into not rushing things and operating unprototypically fast just to cram all the planned moves into your operating session. If you run out of time (dinner is on the table, the lawn needs mowing, etc!) then so what? Leave your switch list as it is for the next time, just as in real life if a crew ran out of hours the next crew would pick up any unfinished work (I'm sure they'd be less than thrilled, but Lance didn't say!!)

6 hours ago, stivesnick said:

My run-around loop is not too long, around 18 cars, however on the real railway it would have been much longer say 100+ cars so a run-around move would have taken some time.

Again, exactly the reason Lance gives in his book about why real life crews try & avoid run-round moves - the loop ("siding" in US terms - our 'sidings' are their 'spurs') could be a mile or more long, far too time consuming.

I have DVDs which show Short Lines doing fly-switching (or 'Dutch drops') to quickly swap ends, but only with one or two cars. I think such moves are now illegal on the Class 1 roads. And they're all but impossible to model, as well..!!

[CameronL]

14 hours ago, F-UnitMad said:

fly-switching (or 'Dutch drops'

Video here. It gets scary at about 6.00 when the driver's mate is bleeding the airbrakes and just goes on getting scarier. Accounts mention one person uncoupling the cars and another one braking them, but in this video one man does everything and has to climb off and on moving rolling stock.

 

I suppose it could be done with free-rolling stock and some method of auto-uncoupling it while moving (a DCC gizmo?) ISTR a GWR exhibition layout in Railway Modeller a long time ago which had a slip coach uncoupling from an express and coming to a halt in a station. I think that was triggered by a laser beam.

Edited December 22, 2023 by CameronL
Typo

[stivesnick]

All

 

Thanks for the responses to my question on switching the local train. I have had a go at applying the no run-around rule and it works well. I just have to remember what the cars that are kept for the next train to complete switching are meant to go. 

 

Its been 6 weeks since consgtruction started and I am pleased with the progress made so far. Some latest photos enclosed starting with a general view and some of the other trains including the daytime passenger train plus a MOW extra. The next tasks are to finsih the various building kits I have so I can finalise the location of the buildings.

 

Regards 

 

Nick 

[stivesnick]

Some more photos. This time of Train 51 - the overnight mail/passenger train that drops off a baggage car at Brandon.

 

Nick 

[stivesnick]

Happy new year to you all.

 

Spent the last few days building the bolier house for the Kingcase factory. Again used DPM parts, the chimney is a Ratio kit. The boiler house will receive coal in gondola cars, so need to build a coal pile next to the building. 

 

Work in progress photos enclosed, shown in approximate location and a photo of the other side. The intention is to build all the buildings for the town before finalising their locations. Next up are some laser cut wood kits for the factories on the spur behind the depot. I also have another couple of apartment buildings shown in the previous post. The challange will be to get the finish looking similar to the kit built many years ago. 

 

Regards 

 

Nick 

Edited January 16 by stivesnick
spelling error

[stivesnick]

The next building for construction is  a Blair Line Fertilizer Plant, a laser wood kit. 

 

The kit comes with parts for a hopper discharge pit and auger for hopper car unloading. This poses a couple of questions.

 

Firstly, when did railroads switch to hopper cars for such traffic? Hopper cars, started to appear in the late 1930s with further deliveries in the 1940s. These were the 2 bay hoppers, originally used for cement tarrfic but eventually used for other products. The larger 3 bay hoppers started to appear in the late 1950s, around the time the layout is set. They appeared to be used for grain traffic.

 

The second question in using the hoppers, is the storage capacity of the plant. To deliver a full car load from a hopper would perhaps require a separate storage bin. Using box cars, could imply a part car load of bagged fertilizer.

 

I am tempted to use the 2 bay hoppers, but could consider using box cars and ignore the hopper dischage parts. 

 

I am also considering using the 3 bay hoppers as part of a demonstration train: Loco, some hoppers and an observation car to run as an extra, calling at the various towns on route to talk to the local farmers about the latest developments.

 

Pogress photo and picture of hopper wagons.

 

Nick 

[F-UnitMad]

On 07/01/2024 at 11:31, stivesnick said:

 

Interesting comparison in coupler sizes there!! 😁👍

[stivesnick]

On 13/01/2024 at 18:55, F-UnitMad said:

Interesting comparison in coupler sizes there!! 😁👍

The coupler/bogie  will  be changed at some point to a microtrains version. I need to check how many couplers I need for this and other rolling stock. 

 

Some more progress with the Fertilizer Plant. It would be fair to say that the elevator unit was quite tricky and highlights an issue when HO laser cut kits are simply scaled down to make an N gauge version, especially if the wood thickness is halved. Anyway it doesn't look too bad, although I will try to tidy up the trim elements on the building corners. The next step is the lorry loading extension which is added to the side of the building. The blue lines on the photo indicate where the access road will go. 

 

I have also started laying track for the interurban line yard. The photo shows work in progress. The back line will  be a freight siding with a loading dock. The second line is a storage track for cars between asignments. The other two tracks will be a car barn for the passenegr stock and freight locomotives. The York modelmaking site has some nice trusses for the car barn roof but are a few mm wider than I had planned so these tracks may have to move over a bit to create the space. 

 

Progress photos enclosed.

 

Nick 

[stivesnick]

I have finished laying the track for the interurban (SRTC) depot. Although not wired yet, pushing cars around the yard, I am happy that the track plan will work when it comes to moving freight to and from the Great Northern Line. A typical SRTC freight will be around 6 cars with say 4 being interchanged with the GN line and the others for local traffic.

 

It is also possible, that during the harvest season, there could be longer freights of refer cars that would exceed the length of the run around loop. I must dig out all the refer cars to see how many I have got. Swopping over an loaded and empty trains of refer cars will be complicated (so will likley be scheduled in for each running session!) but will add to the fun in operating the layout.

 

Some genral overview progress photos enclosed including a mark up shpwing where extra buildings will be required.

 

Happy with the progress but still lots to do.

 

Nick

 

 

[Keith Addenbrooke]

I like the inclusion of an interurban line - nice touch not often included.

 

I’m a bit confused about your comment swapping over loaded and empty reefers - to my mind they’ll look identical?  (I note some of the box cars in the photos have doors open, but I wouldn’t have thought empty reefers would travel like that?  Just wondered, Keith.