The best currently available dcc controller

[peterm1]

11 hours ago, Crosland said:

And even higher.

Yes my Lenz can go to 64, but I don't see any need for that in my lifetime.

 

[peterm1]

If, as you say, price is not a problem, have a look at Zimo, but make sure you're sitting down first.

[Gilbert]

16 hours ago, johnd said:

 

Also a visit to an exhibition is a good idea, speak to the the DCC layout operators and observe the systems in use and speak to any dealers selling DCC, they are usually most help full.

I agree completely - I use an NCE Powercab and get asked so often I take a second throttle (the spare set anyway TBH) and a 600mm test track with a panel installed so I can demo without messing with the layout ops.

Some dealers suchas Digitrains have systems set upin their shops

16 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

Another consideration is what your friends have. You may get a better system to theirs but they won't be able to help you with any issue which may arise.

Anothe practical consideration

 

and finally - at exhibitions I frequently hand my throttle over to fellow operators on my layout and something relatively simple and intuitative  i.e. the NCE throttle - is easy for them to pick up.

Chris H

[Hobb0]

Many thnx guys again the last reply made me thinking - which software is considered the best as above- itrsin or train controller - I will of course check em my self via YouTube etc and post what I see as a possibility 

 

[WIMorrison]

Those of us who use iTrain consider it to be the best and most affordable, those who use TrainController consider it to be the best.

 

In the same way you have asked what is the 'best controller' there is no 'best' software, in the same way that there is no best operating system, word processor, or spreadsheet. 

 

 

[melmerby]

11 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said:

The two main software packages widely used are iTrain and TrainController and it would be wise to consider which you would go for before committing to hardware, though it probably won't have a massive impact on your choice of command station

 

9 minutes ago, WIMorrison said:

Those of us who use iTrain consider it to be the best and most affordable, those who use TrainController consider it to be the best.

 

If you Buy TrainController, you will have less money left to buy other kit 😆

(Speaking as a TrainController Gold 9 user)

[WIMorrison]

Just now, melmerby said:

you will have less money left to buy other kit

 

A lot less 🤣

[njee20]

14 hours ago, daryll said:

why would you want to control a model railway with a computer  , unless you like to watch trains go by

The OP literally said “computer control with Railcom”, so rather than your own prejudices why not make recommendations that fit with his specification? FWIW (as a member of MERG) I would neither recommend, nor use their system. 
 

The Z21 springs to mind from the specification (the full fat black Z21, not the white z21, ridiculous naming convention). Or possibly the Digikeijs DR5000 or the new offshoot from one of their designers, the name of which eludes me. They’re a bit more esoteric and less user friendly than the Z21 I’d say, at half the price.  

 

I have an ECoS and that like that very much, but if you want iPad connection the Z21 does a better job of it (although there are apps for the ECoS too). 

Edited December 29, 2022 by njee20

[melmerby]

9 minutes ago, njee20 said:

(the full fat white Z21, not the black z21, ridiculous naming convention)

Confused you. It's the other way around.

Z21 (Black) is the top model, z21 (white) is the beginner's version.

 

 

Edited December 29, 2022 by melmerby

[AndrueC]

14 hours ago, daryll said:

why would you want to control a model railway with a computer  , unless you like to watch trains go by

That's exactly what I like to do - so do a lot of people which is why roundy-roundy layouts are created. My end goal (many years to go) is to have my layout fully controlled by computer. At the very least following a timetable but as I'm a computer programmer I'm also hoping to support ad-hoc train running with the computer working out how to park trains to clear the tracks for a different rakes and maybe even stop trains at junctions to let trains share tracks while running.

 

@WIMorrison since you're describing exactly what I want to achieve over the next couple of decades what controller/sensors/software are you using?

Edited December 29, 2022 by AndrueC

[melmerby]

9 minutes ago, njee20 said:

Or possibly the Digikeijs DR5000

The problem with the DR5000 is it always strikes me as very much a "work in progess" as the firmware was far from ready when it launched with features either not implemented or only partially so.

I had one from very early on and it started with firmware 1.1.2 (IIRC) and it had a lot of updates until 1.6.2 (?)

It is well featured but IMHO too cheap to have been properly developed, I had automation problems with my original one and later with much more recent one (bought because I thought the first one had developed a fault).

I eventually changed to a Z21 and it has worked flawlessly from day 1.

[njee20]

16 minutes ago, melmerby said:

Confused you. It's the other way around.

Z21 (Black) is the top model, z21 (white) is the beginner's version.

 

 

Balls, I’ll fix that!

 

9 minutes ago, melmerby said:

The problem with the DR5000 is it always strikes me as very much a "work in progess" as the firmware was far from ready when it launched with features either not implemented or only partially so.

I had one from very early on and it started with firmware 1.1.2 (IIRC) and it had a lot of updates until 1.6.2 (?)

It is well featured but IMHO too cheap to have been properly developed, I had automation problems with my original one and later with much more recent one (bought because I thought the first one had developed a fault).

I eventually changed to a Z21 and it has worked flawlessly from day 1.

Yes, I agree. Hence saying it’s the more esoteric version of the z/Z21. I’ve got one I’ve dabbled with, but it’s not enough to make me change from the ECoS.  

[melmerby]

19 minutes ago, AndrueC said:

@WIMorrison since you're describing exactly what I want to achieve over the next couple of decades what controller/sensors/software are you using?

I can give input to that.

I have a Z21 and are using Digikeijs DR4088LN block detectors. I have around a 100 blocks, I also have 70ish points, they are controlled mainly by NCE Switch 8s driving tortoise motors, more recently I have installed some MPB MP1 point motors, they are driven be an Arduino based DCC accessory decoder (my own design). I also have a Fleischmann Turntable driven by A Littfinski (LDT) TT-DEC DCC turntable decoder (kit built) and two reverse loops with LDT KSM-SG modules.

I have some Dapol servo driven signals (later type) and use an Arduino to operate them from DCC.

 

I use TrainController Gold 9 (and will not be upgrading to version 10!) on a Windows 11 PC with 4 screens.

Edited December 29, 2022 by melmerby

[JST]

Something else that may be worth thinking about is how good are you with IT systems. If you are not totally confident you will need a decent support facility. I cannot speak for or about Traincontroller as I have iTrain. All I know is that iTrain support  for a numpty like me is superb both from the provider and a certain member of this forum.

[ITG]

To add a view from a beginner in computer control… after much research, I opted for the previously mentioned Z21 and iTrain. Although still very much on a learning curve, I liked the fact that I could start by using the Z21 as a stand alone (well, with a laptop), and then convert/transfer to iTrain. Whilst I’ve not extensively researched Traincontroller, just reading of the trading and charging policy was easily enough to lead me to iTrain. I’ve found the latter to be well-supported via videos and user forum.

I have to say, as my learning progresses, I am constantly amazed by both iTrain’s flexibility in options (eg what factors should a train take into account when routing or stopping) and it’s practical understanding of (real and model) railway operational needs.

No connection other than a satisfied trainee.

[WIMorrison]

1 hour ago, njee20 said:

Or possibly the Digikeijs DR5000 or the new offshoot from one of their designers,

 

 

 

The owner of Yamorc was not one of the Digikeijs designers, he was the designer of their products, the new company is also not an offshoot.  He finished with Digikeijs in 2019 and it was not a mutual separation. Digikeijs lost the case that they brought in court and had to pay handsomely for their actions. You can read about some of it here FAQs – Yet Another MOdel Railroad Company (yamorc.de)

 

It is fair to say that all the products he is designing, manufacturing and selling under his own brand are what Digikeijs products could have been had they allowed him to take the products to the next generation - they did not and would not allow the development. A key aspect is that Karst is a keen railway modeller and has been for many years, hence he knows what is needed to achieve the objectives.

 

 

55 minutes ago, AndrueC said:

 since you're describing exactly what I want to achieve over the next couple of decades what controller/sensors/software are you using?

 

I use a Z21 with a Z21 10806 single booster, I also have a wired and wireless MultiMaus (you cannot trust Wireless devices at exhibitions, hence the need for a wired version also). For detection I use YD7088RC which will be available as the YD6016LN-RC next year. I need to use the Railcom versions because I operate using Railcom to get the benefits that come from operating with it. I also use DR4018 to control turnouts with MTB MP1 motors.

 

Software wise I use iTrain which I chose after comparing it with JMRI, RocRail, WinDigipet and TrainController. In my opinion, it was then the most fully featured for the price, with excellent support from an author who is also a railway modeller. iTrain has had several upgrades during the time I have used it, getting even better with each update - it should be noted that it is only version upgrades that cost you money, a recent update to v5.1.x was free and introduced many new features. V6 may be available next year and there is already discussion on what may be included.

 

I have assisted several people to automate their layouts using iTrain and one (who is 86!!) implemented iTrain (with Railcom) on his extensive layout himself with a bit of remote guidance. After he completed the implementation, and face to face meetings were again permitted, when showing it to me he said "It has taken me 40 years to finally get this layout running the way I want it too, and it was iTrain that let me do that." He uses iTrain to run trains on the main lines of the layout, and shunts trains manually at the same time, knowing that iTrain will ensure accidents cannot happen - even to the manual trains.

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, JST said:

I cannot speak for or about Traincontroller

Support is mainly from expert users on the forum.

Herr Freiwald's input is less than forthcoming much of the time.

He can also be quite terse if you do not immediately understand what he posts.

 

Having been a Traincontroller user from early editions of ver 7, I would not now recommend it for new users.*

The price increases have been way above inflation with each new version (7>8>9>10) being a not insubstantial increase over the previous one.

There is also an extra UK premium because we left the EU.

 

I also take exception to his latest security mechanism which requires a computer connected to  the internet all the time the program is operating.

 

*My recommendation for any new user is to consider iTrain.

[Michael Hodgson]

I use iTrain, Z21, Digikeijs modules (but would now choose yamorc for the reasons given by Iain).

 

If you want to use Railcom (so the computer will know which loco is in which block), in addition to Railcom feedback detectors on the track sections, your loco decoders also need to support Railcom, which many do not.  The key point about Railcom is that the loco trasmits signals to the system, whereas the basic NMRA standards just send data the other way.  If you are using a system like iTrain, you don't need to use railcom detectors everywhere - once the software knows where a loco is, it can keep track of it as it know which section it entered next.  Lenz & Zimo decoders are Railcom compatible; US-market decoders, LAIS and other cheapo brands tend not to be.

[woodenhead]

The problem asking anyone which is the best, is that in most cases people already have the best item, it's the one that suits them as all have different features, designs, touchy feely bits (or none if screen based).

 

It's like going onto a 4x4 site and asking if I should purchase a Land Rover or a Toyota - I am going to get lots of people who own each telling me theirs is the best, then someone will pop up and mention Ssangyong.

[Hamburger]

The best is clearly Massoth. But I wouldn't buy it because of the price.

 

US controllers are mostly based on the NMRA, which differs from the NEM in some points and therefore some features of European decoders cannot be used optimally or it even leads to problems.

 

Hornby is not quite up to date in development and also somewhat limited.

 

Maerklin has too many problems with DCC (this is intentional).

 

All other European controllers can be recommended. Again, you get what you pay for.

[Hobb0]

I understand that choosing depends on individual needs, skills etc.  it it is great to read others point of view however. 
Many thnx for replies so far and plz chip in ( small joke here) if u have experienced positive or negative from using systems mentioned already.

I want a robust and expandable system that will give be bells n whistles ( another !) that functions without bugs.

[WIMorrison]

May I suggest that you look in detail hete?

 

https://www.z21.eu/en

Edited December 29, 2022 by WIMorrison
Finger trouble

[BoD]

If you are looking to purchase in the near future then, sadly, your choice may be limited by stock availability of some of the systems,  or the components of some systems at the moment.  For very much the same reason that there are long waiting times for some new cars.

[two tone green]

18 hours ago, WIMorrison said:

Don't knock it until you have tried it - the computer is extremely good at running  8 to 10 trains simultaneously from a random selection of 17, stopping them in stations, shunting them in and out of sidings, swapping them over whilst operating 70 turnouts and all without any short circuits or crashes. It leaves me free to operate one train myself, shunting wagons, changing locos - basically whatever I want to do, and the rest of the trains continue to run.

 

I know that I wouldn't have a hope in running that number of trains by myself.

 

And the best aspect? When people visit, I can actually talk to them and show them the layout without having to stop talking and change my attention whilst I operate turnouts or move a train.

 

Lots and lots of reasons why computer automation is a useful addition to railway modelling.

And the signalling and interlocking. Try changing a signal in the right sequence that has three DCC addresses on a handset as well as taking care of the interlocking. 
 

PC is best for this with some decent software. 

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, Hamburger said:

Maerklin has too many problems with DCC (this is intentional).

Märklin, of course, has it's own version of DCC; The Mfx system which is incompatible with normal DCC but IIRC many European decoders will work with either.

Edited December 29, 2022 by melmerby