Doolish Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 I am building a OO gauge layout based on Battledown Flyover. Have now got all the trackwork down and am looking to building the flyover and the adjoining area. I have found a photograph that shows a brick building built into the embankment. Other photos I have show that this was demolished some time ago but it looks as though the 'cutout' area of the embankment is still there. It would appear, from other photographs, that it was a two story building. I cannot find anything that indicates what the purpose of this building was. A suggestion that it was a Plate Layers store seems to fit but I would be interested to hear exactly what it was. Even better would be a photograph showing the front of it! Any help would be appreciated. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium keefer Posted June 9, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 9, 2022 Is shown on 1909 OS 25-inch map Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 5 hours ago, Doolish said: .... A suggestion that it was a Plate Layers store seems to fit .... But - whatever it is - why go to the expense and complication of building it into the embankment when there's no shortage of flat land available ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 To me it says “pump house” or “wellhead”, but I can’t see anything on the pre-flyover OS map that would suggest that there might have been such a thing before the flyover was built. Maybe a spring that had to be dealt with to avoid it washing away the bank? All surmise. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bécasse Posted June 10, 2022 Share Posted June 10, 2022 It didn't exist before Worting Flyover was built, so it is probably a compressor house for the electro-pneumatic signalling installed in the early 1900s. I have (very) vague recollections of a similar building being located near Salisbury East signal box when I visited it in the early 1960s. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted June 10, 2022 Share Posted June 10, 2022 On 09/06/2022 at 09:59, Doolish said: I am building a OO gauge layout based on Battledown Flyover. Have now got all the trackwork down and am looking to building the flyover and the adjoining area. I have found a photograph that shows a brick building built into the embankment. Other photos I have show that this was demolished some time ago but it looks as though the 'cutout' area of the embankment is still there. It would appear, from other photographs, that it was a two story building. I cannot find anything that indicates what the purpose of this building was. A suggestion that it was a Plate Layers store seems to fit but I would be interested to hear exactly what it was. Even better would be a photograph showing the front of it! Any help would be appreciated. That bloke in the foreground by the wing wall seems to have his hand by his fly ... is he relieving himself?🤨 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted June 10, 2022 Share Posted June 10, 2022 13 hours ago, Nearholmer said: ... Maybe a spring that had to be dealt with to avoid it washing away the bank?... Probably unlikely on chalk ! ................ though the proximity to Well's Copse might suggest otherwise ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doolish Posted June 10, 2022 Author Share Posted June 10, 2022 OK have a new theory given to me by someone whos knowledge I highly respect. He believes that it is part of the original signal box that controlled the junction when it was flat ie no flyover. I have seen a photograph of a signal box that was installed directly next to the flyover when the flyover was built. It would seem logical that they would have to build round the original box so it could maintain the junction until the flyover was finished. To prove this I suppose I need an OS map at the time it was a flat junction ie pre 1897 but don't know if these are available or how you view them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted June 10, 2022 Share Posted June 10, 2022 They are available, and I looked yesterday, Nuffink! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted June 11, 2022 Share Posted June 11, 2022 The 40' plan should explain what this was ........ but does it still exist ? ( I don't think it's in the S.R.G Library ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bécasse Posted June 11, 2022 Share Posted June 11, 2022 15 hours ago, Doolish said: To prove this I suppose I need an OS map at the time it was a flat junction ie pre 1897 but don't know if these are available or how you view them. I have already looked at the appropriate 25" OS map and posted above that the building did not exist prior to the building of the flyover. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doolish Posted June 11, 2022 Author Share Posted June 11, 2022 3 hours ago, Wickham Green too said: The 40' plan should explain what this was ........ but does it still exist ? ( I don't think it's in the S.R.G Library ) Thanks but exactly what is the 40' plan? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted June 11, 2022 Share Posted June 11, 2022 Ground plans of most - if not all - stations and other features were drawn by B.R. ( and presumably all predecessors ) at a scale of 40 foot to an inch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium keefer Posted June 12, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 12, 2022 (edited) On 10/06/2022 at 21:08, Doolish said: To prove this I suppose I need an OS map at the time it was a flat junction ie pre 1897 but don't know if these are available or how you view them Click for 1894 OS 25-inch map Edited June 12, 2022 by keefer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted June 12, 2022 Share Posted June 12, 2022 There is a symbol on there that I overlooked when I checked it the other day. Anyone know what it means? A trig point? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam88 Posted June 12, 2022 Share Posted June 12, 2022 11 minutes ago, Nearholmer said: A trig point? Yes. IIRC there were primary, secondary and tertiary with slightly different symbology for each. The OS resurveyed the country in the mid-20C partly because the locations of quite a few of the originals had been lost. This seems an unusual place for a trig point but perhaps the location pre-dates the railway. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium keefer Posted June 12, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 12, 2022 (edited) The key on the old OS map sheet only says 'Trigonometrical Station'. Nothing nearby on the current OS 1:25000 (or even 1:50000) Map: Current OS map at Streetmap Edited June 12, 2022 by keefer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RFS Posted June 12, 2022 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 12, 2022 Here's a clearer picture of it from Flickr photographer Colin Garratt- 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted June 12, 2022 Share Posted June 12, 2022 Looks even more like a pump house or well head to me than it did before. im probably just biased! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Nick C Posted June 14, 2022 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 14, 2022 Looks like the base of an LSWR Type 4 box to me - this diagram: https://www.s-r-s.org.uk/html/srm/T1023.htm suggests one in that position, so maybe it was later moved into the 'v' of the junction? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium keefer Posted June 14, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 14, 2022 So it was originally a signalbox but the 'below floor' part of the structure was retained (with added roof) for re-use as Bécasse suggested previously, once the new signalbox was built 'inside' the junction. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doolish Posted June 14, 2022 Author Share Posted June 14, 2022 On 12/06/2022 at 21:49, RFS said: Here's a clearer picture of it from Flickr photographer Colin Garratt- Fantastic photo - many thanks. Still don't know what it is! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doolish Posted June 14, 2022 Author Share Posted June 14, 2022 Thanks everyone for all the information. Will try and find drawings for the signal box. Again many thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doolish Posted June 15, 2022 Author Share Posted June 15, 2022 (edited) OK have now found the final evidence in a photo. Comes from the Irwell book Mainline to the West. In the first few pages it shows a 'new' box situated alongside the junction itself. One interesting point here is the additional down track. Much later in the book is a chapter on the building of the flyover and in one of the photo's you can just make out a signal box. Interestingly the Southampton Up was still in place. Only question left I suppose is why did they move the box - blind spot perhaps) but more importantly why was the old box not totally knocked down. Did the pneumatic signalling come down this far - if so perhaps it was easier to leave the pumping apparatus where it was but controlled from the new box. Nor being familiar with old signal boxes is it possible to tell what type this is or where I may find drawings of one. Again many thanks for all the suggestions and am glad we got there in the end. Edited June 15, 2022 by Doolish 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted June 15, 2022 Share Posted June 15, 2022 They probably left the base because it was integral with a retaining wall, although it must also have contained something important, otherwise there would have no point putting a roof on it, it could have simply been taken down to slope level and the walls capped. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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