Hornby 2022 Black 5 new tooling

[JohnR]

17 hours ago, Corbs said:

Painted the sides and lower bit and top of the lamp iron black and dabbed a bit of panel wash on the lamp to tone down the white.

 

 

 

 

I was going to ask if anyone had tried weathering the lamps to just tone down that bright white, and if that would help take the eye away from them. This demonstrates exactly that, and it really works. 

[JSpencer]

6 hours ago, Peter Kazmierczak said:

Anyone still got their gramaphone record of train sounds, which Tri-ang released in the 1960s?

I've still got Hornby's cassette tape from the 80s.

[Ian Hargrave]

TBH it’s not only the paint job on the lights that presents a problem.

The lamps are just far too glaringly bright and need toning down .

I think we now perhaps are too used to our rtr models being illuminated. As I have already posted,now having run the Caprotti for a day,this simply will not do.But now it appears we’re stuck with it. IMHO,what could have been a great model spoiled by those lamps and of course the tender gap. Although thankfully ATM no evidence of a failure with the contact 

[zr2498]

18 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

TBH it’s not only the paint job on the lights that presents a problem.

The lamps are just far too glaringly bright and need toning down .

I think we now perhaps are too used to our rtr models being illuminated. As I have already posted,now having run the Caprotti for a day,this simply will not do.But now it appears we’re stuck with it. IMHO,what could have been a great model spoiled by those lamps and of course the tender gap. Although thankfully ATM no evidence of a failure with the contact 

To reduce the brightness of the lamps extra resistors could be added. If the intention is to add DCC decoder, then it might be possible to adjust a CV to reduce brightness. Alternatively painting with a heavy tint over the lens might also help.

I wonder if Hornby would send me a CAD drawing of the coupling so I could modify or replace it 😟 Don't think so!

[MikeParkin65]

3 hours ago, Ian Hargrave said:

TBH it’s not only the paint job on the lights that presents a problem.

The lamps are just far too glaringly bright and need toning down .

I think we now perhaps are too used to our rtr models being illuminated. As I have already posted,now having run the Caprotti for a day,this simply will not do.But now it appears we’re stuck with it. IMHO,what could have been a great model spoiled by those lamps and of course the tender gap. Although thankfully ATM no evidence of a failure with the contact 

I wonder how much market research Hornby will do. Do they know how many have bought this model because of the lamps?. I can definitely tell them I have not bought 2 because of the lights (and the tender coupling) . 

[Phil Parker]

18 minutes ago, MikeParkin65 said:

I wonder how much market research Hornby will do. Do they know how many have bought this model because of the lamps?. I can definitely tell them I have not bought 2 because of the lights (and the tender coupling) . 

 

You only have to look in any diesel loco thread to know how popular, arguably essential, a full set of working lights are. There are demands for perfectly good models to be retooled to include them. Why shouldn't this also apply to steam engine fans? After all, Hornby have to persuade people to upgrade from a Black 5 that was lauded by MRJ when it came out.

[IOW O2]

12 minutes ago, MikeParkin65 said:

I wonder how much market research Hornby will do. .................

 I can definitely tell them I have not bought 2 because of the lights (and the tender coupling) . 

If Fleischmann could put working lights on my N gauge German 2-10-0, 45 years ago, seems odd Hornby have gone for O gauge size.  Ooh, perhaps they were aiming at the toy market, so kids could ogle at them lit up.

[IOW O2]

4 minutes ago, Phil Parker said:

 Why shouldn't this also apply to steam engine fans? 

Not an issue for me if they were scale size, I like lights for my dusk mode room lights running.  As in my post above, it was managed in N years ago.

Edited June 2 by IOW O2
more info.

[John Isherwood]

1 hour ago, IOW O2 said:

If Fleischmann could put working lights on my N gauge German 2-10-0, 45 years ago, seems odd Hornby have gone for O gauge size.  Ooh, perhaps they were aiming at the toy market, so kids could ogle at them lit up.

 

You totally miss the point.

 

German loco lights are fixed; UK loco lights need to be detachable as they convey a message, depending upon positioning.

 

Have you read any of this thread?

 

CJI.

[John Isherwood]

1 hour ago, Phil Parker said:

 

You only have to look in any diesel loco thread to know how popular, arguably essential, a full set of working lights are. There are demands for perfectly good models to be retooled to include them. Why shouldn't this also apply to steam engine fans? After all, Hornby have to persuade people to upgrade from a Black 5 that was lauded by MRJ when it came out.

 

Maybe that's the difference between steam era and diesel era modellers?

 

I'd be VERY surprised if more than a small percentage of steam era modellers felt that working / detachable lamps were desireable, let alone essential.

 

In fact, working lights in their Hornby incarnation seem to be a major disincentive to many otherwise potential purchasers - including me!

 

CJI.

[sjp23480]

I am waiting to see if anyone will replace the lamps with electric lights, as originally fitted to 44755 - according to Essery and Jenkinson.   

 

No record as to when these were removed, sometime in the early 1950s I imagine - reaching out to see if anyone knows?  😉

 

[John Isherwood]

3 minutes ago, sjp23480 said:

.... reaching out to see if anyone knows?  😉

 

 

...... and another one 'reaching out'!

 

Are we suffering a spate of drownings amongst the membership? 🤨

 

CJI.

[AY Mod]

4 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

Are we suffering a spate of drownings amongst the membership?

 

Do I get two more wishes? 😁

 

Although I would be unlikely to use it I'm afraid you'll just have to accept it as widespread contemporary phraseology.

[zr2498]

26 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

You totally miss the point.

 

German loco lights are fixed; UK loco lights need to be detachable as they convey a message, depending upon positioning.

 

Have you read any of this thread?

 

CJI.

Oppotunity missed by Hornby. They could offer a set of 10 Black 5s with the lamps fixed in different positions to cover all occasions 😄

[sjp23480]

56 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

...... and another one 'reaching out'!

 

Are we suffering a spate of drownings amongst the membership? 🤨

 

CJI.

 

🎣 🤭

 

Sorry John, I couldn't resist! 

Edited June 2 by sjp23480

[IOW O2]

1 hour ago, cctransuk said:

You totally miss the point.

 

German loco lights are fixed; UK loco lights need to be detachable as they convey a message, depending upon positioning.

 

Have you read any of this thread?

Don't be so patronising.  

 

Have read entire thread.  The point was what was obtainable for lighting in N gauge years ago by another manufacturer.

[JaymzHatstand]

I'm glad to see that those who have received their Caprotti versions don't seem to be reporting any issues thus far with the drawbar arrangement. And @Corbs has certainly done a good job of improving the lamps, though they are still oversized, that has been countered somewhat.

 

The matt finish on the smokebox is something that has been a long time coming in RTR, and one which I'm surprised it's taken this long for manufacturers to take up (I'm aware of course, that Hornby aren't the first to do this) It really adds to the appearance of a loco, especially an all black one.

 

I've put my name down for the Locomotion 5428, and had become a little apprehensive after seeing several issuses with the electrics, but am starting to feel (maybe prematurely, but hopefully not) more confident about them. The lamps aren't a problem really, as I'm happy to replace them with something more suitable, but may well leave the central one as Eric often has a modern high intensity one for his Whitby trips. The tender lamp and coupling will maybe require a bit more work to improve, but as long as they work as intended out of the box, then I'll be a happy camper!

 

Looking forward to seeing other people's efforts and solutions for tweaking various aspects of this (mostly) excellent model!

 

Cheers

 

J

[neilkirby]

I have been following this thread with interest as I have the 'real steam' one on order.  These lamps have drawn a lot of fire, and I do think that they look awful personally.  However I have also been looking at the thread for the Kernow SRM, which appears to have an equally hugh lamp. and although I may not have read all 60 odd pages, but of those I have read I do not recall seeing any of the discussion we have here:

Regards,

Neil

[Wheatley]

3 hours ago, IOW O2 said:

Don't be so patronising.  

 

Have read entire thread.  The point was what was obtainable for lighting in N gauge years ago by another manufacturer.

Were they removeable and re-positionable ?

[rogerzilla]

Looking at real locos at the GWSR steam gala, smokeboxes start glossy and then scorch to matt.  So it's arguable whether a pristine model should have a matt smokebox.  It depends on whether it's representing a freshly outshopped engine, or just a well-cleaned one.

[Ian Hargrave]

9 hours ago, sjp23480 said:

I am waiting to see if anyone will replace the lamps with electric lights, as originally fitted to 44755 - according to Essery and Jenkinson.   

 

No record as to when these were removed, sometime in the early 1950s I imagine - reaching out to see if anyone knows?  😉

 

Eric Treacy’s photo of her on a Leeds-Glasgow express in the late 1940’s confirms this.

[Erichill16]

10 hours ago, AY Mod said:

 

Do I get two more wishes? 😁

 

Although I would be unlikely to use it I'm afraid you'll just have to accept it as widespread contemporary phraseology.

Even the Beeb are using it!

‘The BBC has reached out to the UK authorities for a response’

 Article this morning regarding MI6 recruiting Chinese spies.

Must admit it makes me cringe.

[franciswilliamwebb]

23 minutes ago, Erichill16 said:

Even the Beeb are using it!

 

Well that's me jumping down from the fence!  If it's OK with the home of "arriving into the train station" then I'm getting my pitchfork and torch out of the walk-in wardrobe😉

[No Decorum]

It’s the way of the world. I hate the use of new words when a perfectly good word already exists; “advancement” instead of “advance” is merely one example. It’s particularly bad when we adopt Americanisms. However, there is nothing I can do about it except to console myself with the thought that so much cringing keeps my back flexible. 🤣

[AY Mod]

7 hours ago, neilkirby said:

of those I have read I do not recall seeing any of the discussion we have here:

 

Certainly noted in the review in BRM and discussed with Kernow. Apparently it was the smallest that the factory could do with red/white LEDs so it's probably what has governed the output of the Black 5. I know it could be done smaller but that may not be practical for mass assembly.