Chester Northgate reimagined

[woodenhead]

Whilst toying with a rebuild of the track I am also considering how I implement an overall roof.

 

This is a mock up of the length of roof I would add.  What I need to prove to myself is that I will be able to see to know where to stop the locos to uncouple.

 

The jury is still out, I’ve added some arches that are not really adding any visibility, the big hole is where the station building would join to the roof and would not be a real gap.  The actual roof was mainly glass, but it’s going to be difficult I think.

 

Hmmmm…

 

Edited May 26 by woodenhead

[lezz01]

Personally I would model the roof as one that has been removed. Lot's of them were removed by BR days so it would be in keeping with your era.

Regards Lez.

[AndyB]

Looking good, @woodenhead

Not sure where I saw it but I believe you can put a cut in the track and bridge it with a diode. Stops the train after the gap. But allows it to reverse back out?

Alternatively could you use one of the off-the-shelf IR solutions?

[woodenhead]

1 minute ago, lezz01 said:

Personally I would model the roof as one that has been removed. Lot's of them were removed by BR days so it would be in keeping with your era.

Regards Lez.

I would but most of the roof remained intact at Chester Northgate.  Perhaps I need a mirror angled down from the other side so I can see in without having to look down.

 

I am not making it any easier in my reimagined version as I will be adding another section of overall roof in front of this for two additional platforms.  But I guess this is where doing a mock up works best, I can work out what works best before committing to anything.

[woodenhead]

1 minute ago, AndyB said:

Looking good, @woodenhead

Not sure where I saw it but I believe you can put a cut in the track and bridge it with a diode. Stops the train after the gap. But allows it to reverse back out?

Alternatively could you use one of the off-the-shelf IR solutions?

I'm using Dapol uncouplers so I need to do a little shuffle, and it's getting that right between a class 40 and a class 25 - the differences in engine length are quite marked.

[woodenhead]

This is how the platform ends might look and how I would position the roof - the black box is the station building, the thin lines are the roof bars (as a guide).  The middle lines in front of the station building remain sidings as per prototype, it would be four platform faces in total, two of which are shorter to let me still use the true station building position and imagine the old cattle dock area was rebuilt later as more platform space.

 

I think the angled mirror might work best - I shouldn't be needing to bend or stretch to see a loco.

 

Edited May 26 by woodenhead

[scottystitch]

For uncoupling, potentially the diode idea has merit, although my limited electronics knowledge would suggest it would only work for a DC control system.  The engine would stop when passing the gap in the rail. If you positioned the magnet correctly, when you saw the train stop, you reverse the locomotive slightly to allow the Dapol couplers to part , et voila, the train is uncoupled.

 

That said, you've been adding sound to your motive power so maybe you  are DCC.

 

However, if DCC, you could bridge the gap with a switch. Switch off, and the engine stops when crossing the gap; switch subsequently on allows the engine to perform the slight reverse/uncouple movement.  The only issue is the sound would cease and you'd have to go through the start up rigmarole again...so maybe a non-starter.

 

At least that's what I think off the top of my head.

 

Regardless, it's good to see you posting on this thread again.

 

Best

 

Scott.

Edited May 26 by scottystitch

[woodenhead]

@scottystitchif I was DC a diode would be great.

 

But the great swing to DCC has rather affected that option.

 

Mrs W has a small folding mirror I can try out to test that idea.

 

Ever since I decided in the prototype I’ve had this on my mind and I do like an overall roof.  I’ll find a way to make this work.

[TT100 Diesels]

4 hours ago, woodenhead said:

Whilst toying with a rebuild of the track I am also considering how I implement an overall roof.

 

This is a mock up of the length of roof I would add.  What I need to prove to myself is that I will be able to see to know where to stop the locos to uncouple.

 

The jury is still out, I’ve added some arches that are not really adding any visibility, the big hole is where the station building would join to the roof and would not be a real gap.  The actual roof was mainly glass, but it’s going to be difficult I think.

 

Hmmmm…

 

 

This mock up absolutely "pop's" to me. Even as a quick and dirty cardboard cut out, it somehow has the elegance of times past......

 

So scenically, you must go with it ! But I understand your conundrum with uncoupling 🤔. 

 

I am not an electronics person, but have seen and am aware of sensor units that detect track occupation, from the model railway electronics type retailers at shows. Might that be the answer to balance practicality with elegance?

 

Best of luck with it though,

 

Cheers

 

TT100.

 

[woodenhead]

So another option and probably the one I had in my back pocket.

 

The roof sits over 4 roads in this part of the station, the two middle rows being sidings.  So here I would have to have uprights to support the structure which just so happened to be round.  Given I am in N gauge I am sure I can find a suitable large diameter nail to perform this task and once sprayed white will be supportive and prototypical in looks, a second row of these could easily replace the big wall I currently see and that would offer good site.  Then I extend the other two lines to full length and move the station to the more traditional, but less prototypical for Northgate, end of the platforms.  The station building will lose depth as it will only be a face, but I can mimic how it looked in the real station just at a different configuration to the platforms and it will form a good scenic break at that end of the layout.

 

I did want the proper station configuration, but I am going to regret it most likely if I cannot see.

 

I will try out the mirror idea tomorrow to see how it appears but I have a back up plan as well that will open up the interior.

[37Oban]

Hi,

 

since this is Northgate reimagined, just glaze the relevant portion of the roof so you can see what's happening inside without using a mirror.

 

Roja

[scottystitch]

Just thinking out loud.  Could a small camera (s) be an option.  I know some people use vehicle parking cameras for line of sight in fiddle yards.  Would it be possible to build the overall roof you'd really like, and incorporate a camera somewhere out of sight to allow you to see the uncoupling area?

 

It's maybe a bit elaborate for what you want, but as I say, just thinking out loud...

 

Best

 

Scott.

[AndyB]

I was just typing the same as @scottystitch replied. 

I picked up a snall cctv camera and monitor for about £15 on Amazon for my hidden fiddle yard.

[t-b-g]

I hope this encourages you to go with the station roof. Buckingham was based on Chester Northgate.

 

This has gaps in the roof to allow a coupling hook to be used as it has three link couplings. The whole roof is hinged at the back and lifts up for access for track cleaning etc.

 

I have a similar dilemma on a OO gauge layout I am working on. Our solution is to use extra long uncoupling magnets so accurate positioning is not required. They are long enough that any loco, stopped the right sort of distance from the buffer stops, has its back end over the magnet. 

[woodenhead]

@t-b-g It's that Buckingham scene that is keeping me going on this - I do want to achieve something with this railway and I am annoyed at myself that I didn't address it early on by adopting a temporary Metcalfe station - though some elements I may reuse in some manner so my passengers have some extra cover beyond the roof.

 

Also a little annoyed that at York I bought the components I needed for the roof, apart from the clear plastic for the glass which is most of the roof!  So now I am looking for a local model shop with some (and I was in Waltons only two weeks back and didn't look).

 

In my head I am breaking it down into projects - having done the cardboard test roof trusses (shaped from the actual ones I am to use) for the prototype, I am confident that I can build the actual roof as one part and it will hold together, then side walls and iron posts inner supports can be built on the layout and the roof plonked on top.

[gismorail]

The real Chester Northgate had the platform 2 canopy removed in the latter years that’s the one further away from the station building 

have a look at the disused station site 

[woodenhead]

Am I a finescale modeller - not at the moment

Am I completely confident in what I am doing - no

Is this a perfect first attempt - hell no

 

 

Am I on a journey - yes

Can I improve - definitely

 

Ok, so it's been a bit, but I've been putting things off and the first attempt using slightly different materials did not turn out well so I needed time to think.

 

New material, some clamps and a bit of patience and 2/3 of one side of one canopy glazing has kind of, sort of been cut.

 

 

A lot more to do with it yet, there is another line of glazing to add at the top and the edges need a layer of plasticard let alone the walkways and yes a couple of the lines are not straight.  But I can stick this piece at the back and it won't be visible.  At least now I feel confident I can do the rest of the glazing - a bit at a time.  Until I complete this roof and associated walls I cannot move forward with rebuilding the layout as it all rests upon the position of the roof and associated platforms.  But I do like that I can actually see through it despite my hamfisted attempt to paint the grooves.

 

Question, how does one paint the glazing frames?  I have scored the surface, painted over and then wiped down using thinners - it looks like hardly anything was left although it looks better in the image.

 

My dad was quite an accomplished modeller when he wanted to be, hopefully it's in me somewhere but until I start trying to do it how will I find out eh.

 

At least I have a process now - cut, saw, file, score, paint repeat eight times.

[scottystitch]

Looks great.  The hardest step is the first step, and you've taken it.  Good job!

 

Keep at it, in small chunks, and it will all come together.

 

Best

Scott.

[woodenhead]

So the first attempt was scrapped, luckily no glue involved but it wasn't working with cutting out for the vents, nothing lined up and the cuts were not all the same size.

 

Simplified second attempt and this is now two thirds of the final roof width, much quicker to build, I can do one in an afternoon.  The vents will be added again in due course.

 

 

I am using the glazing for structural strength and will add plasticard on top for the covered elements and probably something else to represent felt.

 

Plus something for the end, station building will be at the other.

 

The good thing is I can see inside for uncoupling, though there is way more glass now than will be visible when I am done.

 

Once I have the roof done I can then redesign the layout around it - track, walls, supports and platforms.

Edited July 28 by woodenhead

[scottystitch]

That looks cracking, great job!  Seriously impressive.

 

Best

Scott.

[TT100 Diesels]

Roof looks fantastic, loving it.

 

You asked about painting the glazing a few posts up thread, I would mask off with a good quality tape, albeit looks quite a job for a big roof. Also paint inside the masking tape as a semi dry brush, so its not flooded with "runny" paint, thus minimising paint / tape interface bleed under. With a lot of roof to do, I personally would also consider using micro strip, can be pre painted, but even better if you just want white. Would need careful gluing, but just another method.

 

Hope this helps,

 

Keep up the fantastic work,

 

Cheers

 

TT100 Diesels

Edited July 29 by TT100 Diesels
Spelling

[woodenhead]

So the roof development continues, bit more painting and fettling left but my mind is now turning to the support walls and station building.  I was going to go with an end station building, but having found another image of Northgate station from the outside I now have a bit of an idea what it looked like from outside and I actually want to keep the station on the side of the roof.  So next step is to decide the dimensions of the station building as that determines the size of the supporting walls.

 

This roof is not perfect, but I think it looks good enough.

 

 

 

Plonked over the existing railway, once the side walls are built the new station layout will be put down.

 

 

Edit: remember my new Northgate will have 4 platforms hence the extra roof span....

Edited August 25 by woodenhead

[woodenhead]

@gismorail You don't happen to know where I can find or have any drawings of the station buildings?

 

Currently attacking Inkscape with a view to creating a shell from which I can build the station, images online are not the most clear for counting bricks, and it seems the person who built the station liked to use half brick / full brick / half brick - a bit of quick math required.

 

Whilst I am not going to be capable at this stage of a true scale model of the station I would very much like to get the feel of the station.

[scottystitch]

I think that roof looks terrific!  
 

well done

 

Best

 

Scott. 

[woodenhead]

So this is different.

 

I already had a couple of books on the CLC and I purchased four more secondhand books from the 1980s in the hope of some better images of the station.

 

But alas no, more of the same that I already had of the interior and nothing of the exterior.  So that means I am going to have to do this the hard way - counting estimating bricks on blurry images.

Here is the first extraction of information, I do intend to use Inkscape at some point, but I need a starting point from which to extrapolate everything.  I think one standard window and a door should get me started on the platform side though there are some wider ones but I can estimate them once into Inkscape I think.

 

Didn't think I would be using the actual loose leaf pad my dad used when he was drawing models for building on his N gauge railway, but there you go.  I have the imperial size of a brick and it looks like the elevation excluding platform is 13.25 feet or 2.7cm scaled to 2mm.  This is the standard small window, the standard door looks to be the same width and general shape.