Defford Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 (edited) Hi all, I've just purchased the print below, probably taken in the early 1960s. It's evidently a type 2 at Kyle of Lochalsh with a mixed parcel/passenger train but does anyone know what type of vehicle is coupled directly behind the loco? Adrian. Edited August 5, 2020 by Defford Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisf Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 It is a BG of LNER parentage, clearly designed under Gresley. Chris 7 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defford Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share Posted August 5, 2020 10 minutes ago, chrisf said: It is a BG of LNER parentage, clearly designed under Gresley. Chris Aha, thanks Chris. I'm not familiar with LNER designs. Kyle line photos from this era tend to feature ex-LMS or BR stock. Seems like it might be the luggage brake van described on this page: https://www.steve-banks.org/prototype-and-traffic/279-lner-npcs-61-6-thompson-deal-bg Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted August 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 5, 2020 Definitely Gresley, the one on Steve's site is planked rather than panelled and the Thompsons have a different profile. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Defford said: Aha, thanks Chris. I'm not familiar with LNER designs. Kyle line photos from this era tend to feature ex-LMS or BR stock. Seems like it might be the luggage brake van described on this page: https://www.steve-banks.org/prototype-and-traffic/279-lner-npcs-61-6-thompson-deal-bg Definitely Gresley (the way the end of the roof curves down is a giveaway.) It seems to be on Fox, rather than the heavier Gresley bogie. which might make it an early LNER, or even GN, van. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted August 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 5, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, chrisf said: It is a BG of LNER parentage, clearly designed under Gresley. Chris Perhaps even GNR Gresley parentage given the Fox bogies? Edit: Sorry, there is an echo in here. Edited August 5, 2020 by Joseph_Pestell Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 Gresley D113 61'6" Full Brake introduced in 1929. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted August 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 5, 2020 Not enough doors for a D113? Looks more like one of the 52'6" shorties. As it has a guard's ducket I would guess D154 or D282. Many of these LNER vans look to have been on bogies recovered from upgraded stock or from the condemned vehicles which they replaced. 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 Yes. I think you're right. Too busy thinking of the bogies and I bought a MJT one recently just for something to put Fox bogies I already had under. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted August 5, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Fat Controller said: Definitely Gresley (the way the end of the roof curves down is a giveaway.) It seems to be on Fox, rather than the heavier Gresley bogie. which might make it an early LNER, or even GN, van. Later LNER (c. mid 1930s) I would say given that it is on an underframe with angle iron trussing rather than adjustable truss rods. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted August 5, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 5, 2020 D284? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted August 6, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2020 8 hours ago, melmerby said: D284? D284 had straight roof ends, not curved down. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 GWR and SR designs at Kyle in this image. 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted August 6, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2020 22 minutes ago, robertcwp said: GWR and SR designs at Kyle in this image. Thanks Robert. I was looking for that picture last week in relation to another discussion and couldn't find it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted August 6, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 6, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, TheSignalEngineer said: D284 had straight roof ends, not curved down. Thanks I was looking at info in Harris's book and it just said D284 (no picture) as D129 of which there was a picture, so assumed it was just a later version maybe with angle iron trusses. EDIT Looking through the list of vans in various books I have, If it has the typical Gresley curves at the end it doesn't exist! All the ones that meet the general look of the one in the photo are either too long, or have flat ends. It looks like D129 but that doesn't have the curves, the D284 is the later version (maybe with angle iron trusswork). Edited August 6, 2020 by melmerby Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darryl Tooley Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 11 hours ago, TheSignalEngineer said: As it has a guard's ducket I would guess D154 or D282. It is a D282. The ten vehicles to D154 were built in 1932, before the change to angle-iron trussing took place. D 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted August 6, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 6, 2020 1 hour ago, Darryl Tooley said: It is a D282. The ten vehicles to D154 were built in 1932, before the change to angle-iron trussing took place. D Which bogies should it have? I found a mention of D282 built York 1937 and using GNR bogies. Is that correct? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darryl Tooley Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 Just now, melmerby said: I found a mention of D282 built York 1937 and using GNR bogies. Is that correct? Yes. All the 52'6 gangwayed brake vans were built with the GN pressed steel design of 8' wheelbase bogie, and by and large seem to have kept them, including, by the look of it, the one in the OP's image. D 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defford Posted August 6, 2020 Author Share Posted August 6, 2020 Thanks all for helping me out. Sounds like it's most probably D282 and certainly one of the shorter Gresley brake vans. 10 hours ago, robertcwp said: GWR and SR designs at Kyle in this image. Great picture, thanks. There's more variety on the Kyle line than I had thought. I suppose the general pool of BR vehicles spread over the country as time went on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted August 6, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2020 (edited) 11 hours ago, melmerby said: Thanks I was looking at info in Harris's book and it just said D284 (no picture) as D129 of which there was a picture, so assumed it was just a later version maybe with angle iron trusses. EDIT Looking through the list of vans in various books I have, If it has the typical Gresley curves at the end it doesn't exist! All the ones that meet the general look of the one in the photo are either too long, or have flat ends. It looks like D129 but that doesn't have the curves, the D284 is the later version (maybe with angle iron trusswork). Harris's book LNER Standard Gresley Carriages has a drawing of D282 in the section on passenger brake vans, page 179. The roof, sides ends and underframe match the picture in the OP. Text in that section refers to the 52'6" vans having 8' bogies. Edited August 6, 2020 by TheSignalEngineer 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted September 4, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 4, 2020 diagram 282. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Bucoops Posted September 4, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 4, 2020 And here's a naked one (well it will be a d154). 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted September 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 5, 2020 On 06/08/2020 at 18:28, Defford said: Thanks all for helping me out. Sounds like it's most probably D282 and certainly one of the shorter Gresley brake vans. Great picture, thanks. There's more variety on the Kyle line than I had thought. I suppose the general pool of BR vehicles spread over the country as time went on. I have the impression that the pool arrangement was instituted on 1/1/48 and by midnight the entire network was flooded with Southern PMVs. This is an exaggeration but everything got everywhere very quickly and the process probably took no more than a very few months for pool NPCCS and goods stock. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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