The Night Mail

[iL Dottore]

Interesting bit of trivia about the “two finger salute“.

 

It is said, and I have no idea how true this is, that the “two finger salute“ comes from when the English were fighting the French and the Welsh and English longbow men were decimating the French forces. The story goes that if the French captured a Welsh or English archer then they would cut off the first two fingers of the right hand – the fingers used to draw the bow string – to basically permanently take them out of action.

 

As word of this French practice got around, before battles the English and the Welsh archers would raise the first two fingers of their right hand in the direction of the French to show the French that as archers they were (For want of a better term)  “combat ready“.

 

And that, M’Lud, is the origin of the British two finger salute….

 

(or so it is claimed by some)

[Dave Hunt]

I believe that Flávio is right; in particular the salute was used en masse at the battle of Crecy.

 

Of course, the two fingered salute was from the long range archers; the short range troops, such as some of the Welsh contingent, gave the one and a bit fingered salute.

 

Dave

[Winslow Boy]

6 minutes ago, Dave Hunt said:

I believe that Flávio is right; in particular the salute was used en masse at the battle of Crecy.

 

Of course, the two fingered salute was from the long range archers; the short range troops, such as some of the Welsh contingent, gave the one and a bit fingered salute.

 

Dave

 

Nice to know that nothings changed and that Big H will be able to carry on this long standing tradition.

[AndyID]

37 minutes ago, iL Dottore said:

Interesting bit of trivia about the “two finger salute“.

 

It is said, and I have no idea how true this is, that the “two finger salute“ comes from when the English were fighting the French and the Welsh and English longbow men were decimating the French forces. The story goes that if the French captured a Welsh or English archer then they would cut off the first two fingers of the right hand – the fingers used to draw the bow string – to basically permanently take them out of action.

 

As word of this French practice got around, before battles the English and the Welsh archers would raise the first two fingers of their right hand in the direction of the French to show the French that as archers they were (For want of a better term)  “combat ready“.

 

And that, M’Lud, is the origin of the British two finger salute….

 

(or so it is claimed by some)

 

I had to explain that was the reason for the difference between the US single digit gesture and the UK double digit gesture to our friends in the wrong Idaho time zone this weekend. Next time we meet I will explain why a haggis has three legs. (Naturally the longer leg is on the down-side of the hill although that does tend limit a haggis either to a clockwise or anticlockwise trajectory.)

[Happy Hippo]

28 minutes ago, AndyID said:

 

I had to explain that was the reason for the difference between the US single digit gesture and the UK double digit gesture to our friends in the wrong Idaho time zone this weekend. Next time we meet I will explain why a haggis has three legs. (Naturally the longer leg is on the down-side of the hill although that does tend limit a haggis either to a clockwise or anticlockwise trajectory.)

I Was trying to explain to some London folk, who were in Tenby yesterday, about the Welsh Araf.

 

A small secretive creature that hides in hedges, especially near sharp bends in the road. Since they are a protected species, the Senedd has insisted on warnings being painted on the road, or even signage, to  alert drivers to their presence.

 

 

[Welchester]

22 minutes ago, Happy Hippo said:

I Was trying to explain to some London folk, who were in Tenby yesterday, about the Welsh Araf.

 

A small secretive creature that hides in hedges, especially near sharp bends in the road. Since they are a protected species, the Senedd has insisted on warnings being painted on the road, or even signage, to  alert drivers to their presence.

 

I knew an elderly Welsh clergyman (from Mummersher, where they only spoke English) who went out for a drive one day to find this place called Gwasanaethau that he'd seen the signs for.

[New Haven Neil]

3 hours ago, J. S. Bach said:

Coal Board? And it is clean??

 

New, mate, new.  It's replacing this that is rather more used, that is going to be rested for a month.

 

 

 

[polybear]

58 minutes ago, Welchester said:

 

I knew an elderly Welsh clergyman (from Mummersher, where they only spoke English) who went out for a drive one day to find this place called Gwasanaethau that he'd seen the signs for.

 

I just happen to know a "certain Bear" that used to see road signs saying "Gwasanaethau 5 miles".  Bear did think for many years that there did seem to be an awful lot of towns named "Gwasanaethau" in Wales....

[Happy Hippo]

The minister going was most apt!

 

 There are also a lot of signs specifically for a bloke called Allan.

 

However, one of my favourites is mynwent, because it really describes what happened to the residents

Edited July 20, 2022 by Happy Hippo
LLepigns

[jamie92208]

1 hour ago, Welchester said:

 

I knew an elderly Welsh clergyman (from Mummersher, where they only spoke English) who went out for a drive one day to find this place called Gwasanaethau that he'd seen the signs for.

I once took some Indian police officers to Snowdonia.  We walked up from the road to Llyn Idwal and I pointedvout Cwm Idwal.  They looked puzzled and eventually asked what cwm meant.  I explained and theblight dawned.  One of them then said, " at last I know why there is a part of Everest known as the Western Cwm"  i then explained how Edmu d Hilary and his team had spent time training in the area.  I also told them some snippets of English/Welsh history.  I was also entertained by the jokes they were telling about Sikhs.  All of them could have had the word Irish substituted for Sikh.  To be fair the two Sikhs in the group gave as good as they got.

 

Jamie

[pH]

43 minutes ago, jamie92208 said:

I was also entertained by the jokes they were telling about Sikhs.  All of them could have had the word Irish substituted for Sikh. 

Quote from a site discussing jokes like those:

 

“Apparently, there is something deep in the human psyche about telling such jokes.  Every culture tells similar stories, they just change the names.”

 

- Irish tell them about people from Kerry. (And people from other parts of Kerry allegedly tell them about people from West Kerry.)

- Other Canadians tell them about Newfoundlanders.

- Germans tell them about East Frisians. 
- Dutch tell them about Belgians (or possibly it’s the other way round).

 

Etc., etc …

[iL Dottore]

3 hours ago, AndyID said:

 

I had to explain that was the reason for the difference between the US single digit gesture and the UK double digit gesture to our friends in the wrong Idaho time zone this weekend. Next time we meet I will explain why a haggis has three legs. (Naturally the longer leg is on the down-side of the hill although that does tend limit a haggis either to a clockwise or anticlockwise trajectory.)

Aw, C’mon Andy. You don’t expect me to believe that a haggis only has three legs, do you?

 

Any serious student of cerrituluszoology knows they have 4 legs and three breathing tubes (which is why they are prized by the Scots as bagpipe material).

 

The next thing you’ll be telling me, is that drop bears are only to be found in eucalyptus forests! 

[iL Dottore]

I had mentioned before that a good restaurant critic would appreciate a restaurant or caff or even a burger bar on its merits. I discovered the following article by Jay Rayner that proves that a good restaurant critic’s life is not all three Michelin star eateries.

https://www.theguardian.com/food/2022/may/22/the-greasy-spoon-chronicles-a-day-in-the-life-of-the-hope-workers-cafe

It really is a very positive article (and I like the idea that they have put into practice of putting money into a pot so that someone, in the future, can get a meal that he or she needs)

[PhilJ W]

1 hour ago, jamie92208 said:

I once took some Indian police officers to Snowdonia.  We walked up from the road to Llyn Idwal and I pointedvout Cwm Idwal.  They looked puzzled and eventually asked what cwm meant.  I explained and theblight dawned.  One of them then said, " at last I know why there is a part of Everest known as the Western Cwm"  i then explained how Edmu d Hilary and his team had spent time training in the area.  I also told them some snippets of English/Welsh history.  I was also entertained by the jokes they were telling about Sikhs.  All of them could have had the word Irish substituted for Sikh.  To be fair the two Sikhs in the group gave as good as they got.

 

Jamie

 

1 hour ago, pH said:

Quote from a site discussing jokes like those:

 

“Apparently, there is something deep in the human psyche about telling such jokes.  Every culture tells similar stories, they just change the names.”

 

- Irish tell them about people from Kerry. (And people from other parts of Kerry allegedly tell them about people from West Kerry.)

- Other Canadians tell them about Newfoundlanders.

- Germans tell them about East Frisians. 
- Dutch tell them about Belgians (or possibly it’s the other way round).

 

Etc., etc …

And us East Saxons say the same about Suffolk folk (Moonrakers) and they say the same about those from Norfolk (Bobs not only your uncle). 

[Happy Hippo]

3 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

 

And us East Saxons say the same about Suffolk folk (Moonrakers) and they say the same about those from Norfolk (Bobs not only your uncle). 

I have Telfs, and they have  them that comes from Broseley.

 

Apparently, the last marriage from outside the village took place in 1893.

 

 

Them does 'Deliverance' in Severn coracles.

[PhilJ W]

19 minutes ago, iL Dottore said:

I had mentioned before that a good restaurant critic would appreciate a restaurant or caff or even a burger bar on its merits. I discovered the following article by Jay Rayner that proves that a good restaurant critic’s life is not all three Michelin star eateries.

https://www.theguardian.com/food/2022/may/22/the-greasy-spoon-chronicles-a-day-in-the-life-of-the-hope-workers-cafe

It really is a very positive article (and I like the idea that they have put into practice of putting money into a pot so that someone, in the future, can get a meal that he or she needs)

Sounds like a good place for a meet, ER's or NM's. I looked it up and its a short walk from from Holloway Road Station, first stop south of Finsbury Park.

[Tony_S]

3 hours ago, Happy Hippo said:

a bloke called Allan.

Allan o'r Swyddfa. That’s the station-manager on my narrow gauge line. He is really Mr Allan but his colleagues can never find him. 

[br2975]

7 hours ago, iL Dottore said:

Interesting bit of trivia about the “two finger salute“.

 

It is said, and I have no idea how true this is, that the “two finger salute“ comes from when the English were fighting the French and the Welsh and English longbow men were decimating the French forces. The story goes that if the French captured a Welsh or English archer then they would cut off the first two fingers of the right hand – the fingers used to draw the bow string – to basically permanently take them out of action.

 

As word of this French practice got around, before battles the English and the Welsh archers would raise the first two fingers of their right hand in the direction of the French to show the French that as archers they were (For want of a better term)  “combat ready“.

 

And that, M’Lud, is the origin of the British two finger salute….

 

(or so it is claimed by some)

.

When first married in the late 70s, with the mortgage rate at 15%......... as with many Cardiffians unable to buy in the city, we bought in Beddau (pronounce locally as 'bather').

.

The local BrAIns hostelry, was called 'The Bowman' in recognition of the Llantrisant bowmen (archers) who served the crown, and the pub contained many, illustrated references to the locals historic exploits on the other side of Le Manche..

Llantrisant being a mile or so from Beddau.

Sadly, 'The Bowman' has gone the way of many BrAIns pubs.

.

Whilst the explanation of the   'two fingered' gesture carried some weight, there was no reference locally, to any former archers returning home minus two digits.

.

It was however, common local knowledge, that noblemen captured in such battles as Crecy, Agincourt, Harfleur etc would be held for ransom by the French, whereas the worthless peasant archers were of no value, and would be quickly despatched by their captors.

.

That aside, I know which version I prefer................ says the man who when taking our then two young children on foreign holidays by air, would not allow them to use the aircraft toilet until we were in French airspace.

.

.

.

Edited July 20, 2022 by br2975

[br2975]

5 hours ago, Welchester said:

 

I knew an elderly Welsh clergyman (from Mummersher, where they only spoke English) who went out for a drive one day to find this place called Gwasanaethau that he'd seen the signs for.

.

As a PC working the Ely area of Cardiff.................an area well known to Hippo, our shift was blessed with a new, recently promoted Inspector.

We'll call him.....Geoff.

One afternoon, the Inspector says to the senior man, who we'll call 'Russ' - "Come on Russ, let's go for a walk up the front to Culverhouse Cross"

Culverhouse Cross being a large road junction on the western outskirts of the city, where the A4232, A4055 and A48 all converge, amidst a retail park, or two.

They reach CHX (as we called it) and Geoff stares up at the huge roadsign and starts reading

"A4055 Barry"

"A48 Cowbridge"

"A4232 (M4) - Bridgend, Port Talbot, Swansea, Gorllewin"

.

"Oi. Russ, where's Gorllewin ?"

"West boss" replies Russ.

"Yes, I know it's west - the sign says so, but where down west ?"

"Gorllewin, it's west." says Russ

"Russ, I'm not thick, I can read a road sign, but I've never seen Gorllewin on the map, how far past Swansea is it ?"

.

I'll let the non-Welsh speaking  'saes' amongst the members use Google Translate to work this one out.

[New Haven Neil]

Well our archery club certainly subscribes to the legend!

 

This ball was described as a Frenchie's head.....moving target too.  They all hit.

 

[TheQ]

4 minutes ago, br2975 said:

.

As a PC working the Ely area of Cardiff.................an area well known to Hippo, our shift was blessed with a new, recently promoted Inspector.

We'll call him.....Geoff.

One afternoon, the Inspector says to the senior man, who we'll call 'Russ' - "Come on Russ, let's go for a walk up the front to Culverhouse Cross"

Culverhouse Cross being a large road junction on the western outskirts of the city, where the A4232, A4055 and A48 all converge, amidst a retail park, or two.

They reach CHX (as we called it) and Geoff stares up at the huge roadsign and starts reading

"A4055 Barry"

"A48 Cowbridge"

"A4232 (M4) - Bridgend, Port Talbot, Swansea, Gorllewin"

.

"Oi. Russ, where's Gorllewin ?"

"West boss" replies Russ.

"Yes, I know it's west - the sign says so, but where down west ?"

"Gorllewin, it's west." says Russ

"Russ, I'm not thick, I can read a road sign, but I've never seen Gorllewin on the map, how far past Swansea is it ?"

.

I'll let the non-Welsh speaking  'saes' amongst the members use Google Translate to work this one out.

everywhere is west of Gorleston

[Winslow Boy]

5 minutes ago, TheQ said:

everywhere is west of Gorleston

 

Not if you were in the artic then it would be south.

[TheQ]

14 minutes ago, Winslow Boy said:

 

Not if you were in the artic then it would be south.

That would depend where the lorry was parked... may be in the Gwasanaethau

[simontaylor484]

5 hours ago, Happy Hippo said:

The minister going was most apt!

 

 There are also a lot of signs specifically for a bloke called Allan.

 

However, one of my favourites is mynwent, because it really describes what happened to the residents

Surely that sign will take you to a dead end

 

Ironic that the Clergy man was following signs for services 

Edited July 20, 2022 by simontaylor484
Spell checker

[Dave Hunt]

6 hours ago, New Haven Neil said:

 

New, mate, new.  It's replacing this that is rather more used, that is going to be rested for a month.

 

 

 

 

Aaaaaarrrrgggghhhhhh pannier warning!!

 

Dave