The Night Mail

[Chris Snowdon]

14 hours ago, TheQ said:

Except when one vessel is limited by size or draft,

Except when one vessel is following a shipping channel and the other crossing.

Except when one vessel or both are sailing craft.

Except when one vessel is aground.

 

I can't find my copy of the COLREGs...  I'm also having strange flashbacks to discussions in another place about "the ever-evolving Traffic Separation Scheme "Off Texel"..."

 

We started with poetry.  We've done music.  We've done fluid dynamics.  Now we're on etiquette and regimental traditions (I have been told that there was one in which, thanks to a passing moment of confusion by a Portuguese-born subaltern, they still pass to the right).

 

I had imagined from the title that this thread was about the intricacies of running postal, newpaper and similar services, or the simple joy of operating mail coach sets, but it's more like an after-dinner discussion.  I love it.

 

regards

cs

[Northmoor]

12 hours ago, Happy Hippo said:

the decanter goes around faster than passing the parcel on a Belfast bus.

You've just reminded me of something I saw years ago, probably on one of Clive James' programmes looking at strange TV from around the world.

 

I think it was the Lebanese(?) version of Candid Camera and someone thought it would be hilarious for an actor carrying a suitcase to walk up to a group of people - say at a bus stop, put down the case, pause, then run away very fast..........

[New Haven Neil]

5 minutes ago, Chris Snowdon said:

I had imagined from the title that this thread was about the intricacies of running postal, newpaper and similar services,

 

Errrrrrrrrr, well it's about anything really, but the ER's thread is a 'no trains' area, so this is similar drivel but with trains allowed.

 

And yes, we're all in need of help.........

 

So welcome aboard (ex-Bibby Line engineer myself) and have fun!

[DenysW]

24 minutes ago, AndyID said:

Nope

It is my non-expert opinion that we are at cross-purposes, are in fundamental agreement but are using different criteria/definitions/assumptions.

[Winslow Boy]

Just now, DenysW said:

It is my non-expert opinion that we are at cross-purposes, are in fundamental agreement but are using different criteria/definitions/assumptions.

That sums up TNM in a nutshell that statement.

[Winslow Boy]

10 minutes ago, Chris Snowdon said:

 

I can't find my copy of the COLREGs...  I'm also having strange flashbacks to discussions in another place about "the ever-evolving Traffic Separation Scheme "Off Texel"..."

 

We started with poetry.  We've done music.  We've done fluid dynamics.  Now we're on etiquette and regimental traditions (I have been told that there was one in which, thanks to a passing moment of confusion by a Portuguese-born subaltern, they still pass to the right).

 

I had imagined from the title that this thread was about the intricacies of running postal, newpaper and similar services, or the simple joy of operating mail coach sets, but it's more like an after-dinner discussion.  I love it.

 

regards

cs

Don't forget naval designs and things nautical.

[New Haven Neil]

Navel gazing?

[AndyID]

6 minutes ago, Chris Snowdon said:

 

I can't find my copy of the COLREGs...  I'm also having strange flashbacks to discussions in another place about "the ever-evolving Traffic Separation Scheme "Off Texel"..."

 

We started with poetry.  We've done music.  We've done fluid dynamics.  Now we're on etiquette and regimental traditions (I have been told that there was one in which, thanks to a passing moment of confusion by a Portuguese-born subaltern, they still pass to the right).

 

I had imagined from the title that this thread was about the intricacies of running postal, newpaper and similar services, or the simple joy of operating mail coach sets, but it's more like an after-dinner discussion.  I love it.

 

regards

cs

 

Ah well you see this is an extremely catholic (small c) thread. The common denominator seems to be an interest in trains of one sort or another. Some (not me you understand) seem to use it as an opportunity to wind-up other posters, which, although I highly disapprove of such actions, is most entertaining.

[Winslow Boy]

5 minutes ago, New Haven Neil said:

Navel gazing?

Is that some sort of new bow for one of those floaty things we discussed?

 

Interested of land locked Manutopea.

[AndyID]

7 minutes ago, DenysW said:

It is my non-expert opinion that we are at cross-purposes, are in fundamental agreement but are using different criteria/definitions/assumptions.

 

Not really. All I'm saying is you can't mess with the laws of friction which have nothing to do with contact area. The locomotive engineers knew that full-well.

[Northmoor]

53 minutes ago, DenysW said:

Not fully convinced.

 

If the Civil Engineer only believes in tons/axle (which seems to have been most of them), then extra drivers within the same rigid wheelbase, say 0-6-0 to 0-8-0 allows for 33% more weight, thus 33% more traction before slippage. If the Civil Engineer also believes in ton/ft (the Midland, and the ex-Midland LMS and possibly BR) then extra drivers achieve nothing, not even a greater area for the weight. 

 

If you absolutely must increase the numbers on tractive effort without going articulated (e.g. the Standard 9Fs) then you have to increase the rigid wheelbase and then play silly whatsits with the flanges because otherwise the locomotive gets stuck or derails on the sorts of curves seen in sidings and/or on points. Even dead slow.

As a former tribologist, I think the desire for more powered axles is less about coefficients of friction or axle loadings and more about not putting all your eggs in one basket. 

 

Low friction might exist on a very short stretch of rail (such as a dribble out of a Bullied Pacific's famously oil-tight valve gear bath); if you have only one powered axle and it's on the slippery spot on the rail, you're going nowhere.  However, if you have two or three other axles on "good" rail, you'll get traction and away you go.

 

EMUs can accelerate and decelerate so fast because there are often so many powered axles; they don't need to put too much tractive or braking force through any one contact, so can still perform well even in poor rail conditions.  The fact that they weigh bu99er all compared to a steam loco helps.

[Northmoor]

20 minutes ago, DenysW said:

It is my non-expert opinion that we are at cross-purposes, are in fundamental agreement but are using different criteria/definitions/assumptions.

When I worked in management consultancy* it was amazing how some colleagues could have the most time-consuming heated agreements without realising.

 

* I am very, very sorry.

[Winslow Boy]

8 minutes ago, Northmoor said:

When I worked in management consultancy* it was amazing how some colleagues could have the most time-consuming heated agreements without realising.

 

* I am very, very sorry.

I thought that was how they managed to charge there exorbitant fees.

[AndyID]

7 minutes ago, Northmoor said:

As a former tribologist, I think the desire for more powered axles is less about coefficients of friction or axle loadings and more about not putting all your eggs in one basket.

 

 

'scuse me but, it was all about gravitational force between the wheels and the rails. The engineers knew that. They had no option but to spread the weight of a more powerful locomotive over a greater number of drivers without losing tractive effort.

 

It's really not terribly complicated.

[Chris Snowdon]

9 hours ago, J. S. Bach said:

Or GREEN panniers! Like this one 😇:

 

 

I only have two green panniers but still I apologise.  Please don't hate me.  In mitigation, I also have an LT red one.

[Chris Snowdon]

41 minutes ago, New Haven Neil said:

 

Errrrrrrrrr, well it's about anything really, but the ER's thread is a 'no trains' area, so this is similar drivel but with trains allowed.

 

And yes, we're all in need of help.........

 

So welcome aboard (ex-Bibby Line engineer myself) and have fun!

Many thanks for this - Got it, I think...  "And yes, we're in need of help..." Agreed.  Where's the port?

[AndyID]

12 minutes ago, Chris Snowdon said:

Where's the port?

 

Pass it PDQ.

[Tony_S]

6 minutes ago, Chris Snowdon said:

I only have two green panniers but still I apologise.  Please don't hate me.  In mitigation, I also have an LT red one.

Considering I mainly have ex LMS trains in Early BR I seem to have a few pannier tanks. I think I just like them. I will be putting a decoder in one tomorrow. It isn’t green or even ex Great Western. Black and British Railways. It should be straightforward. I found a small prairie tank I had bought that needed a decoder. I sorted that out today. According to the information when I bought it on eBay and the box it was in it needed an eight pin decoder. It was actually a much older model that must have been put in a new box! At least it wasn’t the split chassis but I didn’t have any wired decoders, I did have some six pin wired sockets so I soldered one in and used a six pin decoder. Goes really well now all the wheels are clean! 

[Winslow Boy]

30 minutes ago, Chris Snowdon said:

I only have two green panniers but still I apologise.  Please don't hate me.  In mitigation, I also have an LT red one.

Just don't mention crimson lake that's all we ask.

[Winslow Boy]

11 minutes ago, AndyID said:

 

Pass it PDQ.

Left or right. In all the confusion I've lost track of it.

[Winslow Boy]

36 minutes ago, AndyID said:

 

'scuse me but, it was all about gravitational force between the wheels and the rails. The engineers knew that. They had no option but to spread the weight of a more powerful locomotive over a greater number of drivers without losing tractive effort.

 

It's really not terribly complicated.

Didn't Sir Isaac Newton invent gravity? Something to do with apples sinking to the bottom of the pie when his mother baked them wasn't it?

[AndyID]

1 minute ago, Winslow Boy said:

Didn't Sir Isaac Newton invent gravity? Something to do with apples sinking to the bottom of the pie when his mother baked them wasn't it?

I wouldn't worry about it. Assuming he was right when we get out of bed tomorrow we won't find ourselves sticking to the ceiling.

[Winslow Boy]

2 minutes ago, AndyID said:

I wouldn't worry about it. Assuming he was right when we get out of bed tomorrow we won't find ourselves sticking to the ceiling.

It's not the sticking to the ceiling you've got to worry about, it's making sure you get the piece of pie with the apple in it.

[Chris Snowdon]

11 minutes ago, Winslow Boy said:

Left or right. In all the confusion I've lost track of it.

"Port to port" - Back to the COLREGs

"Pass the Duchy 'pon the left-hand side" - Back to music, even if in this case, back in the day, some producer thought it better to have teenagers singing about a stoneware demijohn of proof-strength rum rather than a huge spliff...

[AndyID]

30 minutes ago, Winslow Boy said:

Left or right. In all the confusion I've lost track of it.

 

Gordon Bennett!