The Night Mail

[rockershovel]

30 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Or the loss of youth and innocence:

 

"Oh, when I was one-and-twenty, I kissed the girls a-plenty,

  but now I'm twenty-two, I'm stuck with only you."

Hence the Army and the sea;

 

Brighton Camp (The Girls I Left Behind Me)

At least one version of Over The Hills And Far Away

Spanish Ladies 

Bobby Shaftoe

 

 

[polybear]

 

1 hour ago, rockershovel said:

Just gone from Last Night Of The Proms to reading about the latest nonsense at Harland and Wolff. What's WRONG with this country? 

 

 

(With some exceptions):

(a) We're cr@p at making things

(b) We're too expensive at making things, and:

(c) Those leaving school & uni are afraid of getting their paws dirty anymore

[Sabato]

In 1969 an album titled "Green All The Way" was released. Sung by Brett Stevens, the content was a number of songs written by Dave Goulder, a former fireman based (I think) in the East Midlands. They reflected his experiences on the footplate and other railway stories (eg Pinwherry Dip). I think I still have mine somewhere, tho' nothing to play it on. A decade or so I managed to pick up a book with the lyrics in a charity shop. The book is also now buried!!

[Tony_S]

1 hour ago, iL Dottore said:

Get Your Kicks On The B34 Cirencester Bypass, just doesn't 

A13, Trunk Road to the Sea by Billy Bragg is an amusing variation. 

[DenysW]

1 hour ago, iL Dottore said:

On the the subject above, one famous song from Dr. Feelgood: Get Your Kicks On Route 66, just works.

 

Get Your Kicks On The B34 Cirencester Bypass, just doesn't 

'Casey Jones' and 'The Wreck of the Old '97' both have heroic drivers. "We'll Blame the Quintinshill Signalman" doesn't have the same poetic opportunity. Nor does "I told Huskisson do to get out of the train!"

Edited Monday at 13:10 by DenysW

[jjb1970]

1 hour ago, polybear said:

 

 

(With some exceptions):

(a) We're cr@p at making things

(b) We're too expensive at making things, and:

(c) Those leaving school & uni are afraid of getting their paws dirty anymore

 

A big problem in shipbuilding is financing construction. Because of how the payment system works the shipyards need either cash or finance to build the ship. The Meyer Werft yard in Germany has just been rescued by the German government as although their order book is bulging for very expensive cruise ships they're struggling to get finance and they're locked into contracts which are way too low now for various reasons. The old Wartsila then STX yard had a similar issue, they could get orders but couldn't afford to build the ships which were being ordered.

Edited Monday at 14:14 by jjb1970

[Dave Hunt]

2 hours ago, Sabato said:

In 1969 an album titled "Green All The Way" was released. Sung by Brett Stevens, the content was a number of songs written by Dave Goulder, a former fireman based (I think) in the East Midlands. They reflected his experiences on the footplate and other railway stories (eg Pinwherry Dip). I think I still have mine somewhere, tho' nothing to play it on. A decade or so I managed to pick up a book with the lyrics in a charity shop. The book is also now buried!!

 

Dave Goulder was a fireman at Mansfield who was taken off the footplate because of eyesight problems. I corresponded with him briefly in the '90s when he was living in Scotland. I have a copy of his songs on a 25 track CD called The Golden Age of Steam produced in 2008 by Fellside Recordings Ltd. PO Box 40, Workington CA14 3GJ - www.fellside.com - It is a remastered compilation sung by Dave Goulder himself. I frequently play it in my workshop.

 

Dave

 

[Winslow Boy]

5 hours ago, zarniwhoop said:

You used a multi-select - there were two items quoted in your Wright Writes post, the first was a one-liner from WB commenting on Jamie and Cakes and obviously nothing to do with Wright Writes, the second  was the pic of the coal on the tender on which you commented.

 

Only saying this since you don't seem to understand why WB commented.

Thank you for explaining that to the poor thing. I didn't know if I could get down to his 'level of understanding' but you saved me the effort.

 

My old mum used to say - write it as if for Martians, but nothing about Bears.

[Dave Hunt]

1 hour ago, DenysW said:

'Casey Jones' and 'The Wreck of the Old '97' both have heroic drivers. "We'll Blame the Quintinshill Signalman" doesn't have the same poetic opportunity. Nor does "I told Huskisson do to get out of the train!"

 

Depends what you mean by heroic. The Wreck of the Old 97 happened on September 27, 1903 when the American Southern Railway fast mail train - train reporting number 97 - from Washington DC to New Orleans, whilst en route from Monroe, Virginia, to Spencer, North Carolina, derailed due to excessive speed entering the trestle bridge at at Stillhouse near Danville, Virginia, and crashed into the ravine killing eleven people including the driver Steve Brodie. The train was an hour late leaving Monroe and Brodie was ordered to be back on schedule by the time he got to Spencer some 166 miles away since the Railroad would be fined by the US Mail for every minute it was late. The line was notorious for sharp curves and steep grades and not suited to fast running but Brodie 'went for it' and at Stillhouse paid the price. The song maintains that he was doing 90mph when his air brakes failed but in fact he was probably doing no more than about 60mph and probably just left it too late to brake on the falling grade.

 

Dave

[Happy Hippo]

4 hours ago, iL Dottore said:

The "Great American Song Book" (a collection of what are considered to be the best songs  written in America over the last century or so) is absolutely chockablock full of great songs about railroads (railways) prisons and life on the open road.

 

Try as I might, very little comes to mind in terms of great British songs about the railway, about prisons or about life on the open road. I am certain that our late great friend ChrisF would've been able to name  a number of obscure and semi obscure folk ditties that fit the bill, but apart from one or two songs from Jethro Tull I really can't think of any British tailway songs along those lines.

 

Over to you guys. Ideas?

I do vaguely remember a song, the chorus of which went something like this:

 

Pacifics, Atlantics they're steaming no more.

Their memories fading away.

So just spare a thought for a rusting A4

As it goes on it's permanent way.

[AndyID]

Well there is this 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tay_Bridge_Disaster

but I don't think anyone managed to set it to music.

[rockershovel]

1 hour ago, jjb1970 said:

 

A big problem in shipbuilding is financing construction. Because of how the payment system works the shipyards need either cash or finance to build the ship. The Meyer Werft yard in Germany has just been rescued by the German government as although their order book is bulging for very expensive cruise ships they're struggling to get finance and they're locked into contracts which are way too low now for various reasons. The old Wartsila then STX yard had a similar issue, they could get orders but couldn't afford to build the ships which were being ordered.

The point being that the German government feels it worth their while to support the industry. When I was in Poland in 2018 the government had just re-nationalised the shipyards to preserve the capacity. Our government don't care, it seems. 

Edited Monday at 16:10 by rockershovel

[pH]

2 hours ago, DenysW said:

'Casey Jones' and 'The Wreck of the Old '97' both have heroic drivers. "We'll Blame the Quintinshill Signalman" doesn't have the same poetic opportunity. Nor does "I told Huskisson do to get out of the train!"

There is a whole album about a heroic BR driver who was awarded the George Cross for his heroism:

 

https://open.spotify.com/album/1Bov7llGAT7x5cj69gpc56

‘The Ballad of John Axon’ by Ewan MacCall, Charles Parker and Peggy Seeger.

 

It’s from a “radio ballad”, one of a series produced for the BBC.

Axon stayed on the footplate of a runaway freight and was killed when it crashed at Chapel-en-le-Frith:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Axon

 

[Happy Hippo]

5 minutes ago, pH said:

There is a whole album about a heroic BR driver who was awarded the George Cross for his heroism:

 

https://open.spotify.com/album/1Bov7llGAT7x5cj69gpc56

‘The Ballad of John Axon’ by Ewan MacCall, Charles Parker and Peggy Seeger.

 

It’s from a “radio ballad”, one of a series produced for the BBC.

Axon stayed on the footplate of a runaway freight and was killed when it crashed at Chapel-en-le-Frith:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Axon

 

It's funny how things come around.

 

Only a week or so ago, Brian Rolley was posting one of his regular informative 'on this day' reports on the RiSW Facebook group.

 

One of the locos listed was 48188, which was the loco that John Axon had been driving.

 

 

[AndyID]

28 minutes ago, rockershovel said:

The point being that the German government feels it worth their while to support the industry. When I was in Poland in 2018 the government had just re-nationalised the shipyards to preserve the capacity. Our government don't care, it seems. 

I don't think it's a case of not caring. It's more a case of not wanting to subsidize a non-competitive business.

 

What I do know is that shipbuilding on the Clyde became hopelessly non-competitive because of demarcation disputes.

[polybear]

3 minutes ago, AndyID said:

I don't think it's a case of not caring. It's more a case of not wanting to subsidize a non-competitive business.

 

What I do know is that shipbuilding on the Clyde became hopelessly non-competitive because of demarcation disputes.

 

I worked in a Glasgow Shipyard (YSL) in the mid-90's; the guy I worked with had also worked at H&W in Belfast - he said you could always spot where an RN Ship was built (H&W or YSL) as the build-standard of the former was noticeably better.

[Tony_S]

We could have all sorts of nice things but for some reason raising taxes for governments to pay for them isn’t popular. 

[J. S. Bach]

9 hours ago, DenysW said:

Many thanks for the Steve Goodman earworm.  From the same song (but the verse that's usually omitted) "This train's got Th' Vanishin' Railroad Blues".

The version that I like uses"Disapearin'" and has great train photos:

 

I rode the "City" when I was stationed at NAS Memphis. On a Saturday, I rode from Memphis to someplace deep in Mississippi where I could wait (about an hour) for a northbound train to get me back to Memphis on Sunday.

 

The actual train in the video is privately owned and the video appear to be taken on different trips as the consist changes in several shots.

[J. S. Bach]

5 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Or the loss of youth and innocence:

 

"Oh, when I was one-and-twenty, I kissed the girls a-plenty,

  but now I'm twenty-two, I'm stuck with only you."

I am glad that I did not have any of the diet Pepsi that I am drinking in my mouth when I read that; I would have needed a new monitor!! 😾

[BSW01]

8 hours ago, BSW01 said:

That is a work in progress, I’ll report back when I’ve hopefully tested my latest idea. 

Here’s my latest version.

It looks a lot better, but hiding the corners is almost impossible. 
 

I’ve now got to see if I can retro fit this modification to the dozen or so I’ve already made. 

[SM42]

2 hours ago, AndyID said:

I don't think it's a case of not caring. It's more a case of not wanting to subsidize a non-competitive business.

 

What I do know is that shipbuilding on the Clyde became hopelessly non-competitive because of demarcation disputes.

 

I thought a lot of it was a refusal to move with the times, continuing pre war production methods as others were investing in new techniques such as rivetting when the rest of the world was welding. 

 

The orders were there. Just couldn't make them at a competitive price. 

 

Andy

[rockershovel]

44 minutes ago, SM42 said:

 

I thought a lot of it was a refusal to move with the times, continuing pre war production methods as others were investing in new techniques such as rivetting when the rest of the world was welding. 

 

The orders were there. Just couldn't make them at a competitive price. 

 

Andy

It's a complex problem. I don't know about ship-building, but I did see the influx of former shipyard workers into the yards building the offshore platforms in the 70s and 80s. Quite a few of them had to be told firmly that their former ways were not required and they were not in "union shops" now. 

 

Any who resisted were simply dismissed, or more correctly not further employed ... and that meant turned out of their accomodation as well. 

 

The British management were generally regarded by the American companies as useless and were rarely employed except in junior roles. Companies like Worley Parsons and McDermott reckoned they could train welders on the site, and did so. I remember a girl who came on the site driving a sandwich van, applied for a job and was taken on the next batch of trainees...

 

But there's no getting away from it. Our governments simply don't care about retaining the capacity. They cling to their "free-market" obsessions in a protectionist world which isn't playing that game.

 

Do you think the Dutch get all the windfarm construction because they are jolly nice chaps? This is a brand-new market in which both our government and the company managements they idolise never even got to the starting blocks. Why is this? 

Edited Monday at 19:40 by rockershovel

[AndyID]

38 minutes ago, SM42 said:

 

I thought a lot of it was a refusal to move with the times, continuing pre war production methods as others were investing in new techniques such as rivetting when the rest of the world was welding. 

 

The orders were there. Just couldn't make them at a competitive price. 

 

Andy

 

I'm sure that was part of the problem but whether it was because of management or the unions I do not know. Of course it wasn't called "Red Clydeside" for nothing. There was a  similar problem at the Rootes car plant at Linwood.

[SM42]

1 minute ago, AndyID said:

 

I'm sure that was part of the problem but whether it was because of management or the unions I do not know. Of course it wasn't called "Red Clydeside" for nothing. There was a  similar problem at the Rootes car plant at Linwood.

 

My understanding it was more a management issue. 

 

I seem to remember  reading or hearing that in the final days of some of the yards, the unions took over running them to fulfill the orders being built or  were on the full order books after the company had gone bust.

 

Andy

[jamie92208]

12 hours ago, DenysW said:

Many thanks for the Steve Goodman earworm.  From the same song (but the verse that's usually omitted) "This train's got Th' Vanishin' Railroad Blues".

 

10 hours ago, Dave Hunt said:

 I’ve also heard versions that omit the line, “Freightyards full of old black men…”

 

Dave

Yes it has been pc'd but wrongly to my ears.  I had a Willie Nelson  version, using the proper words, played at the crem for a good friend who was also an American citizen and rail fan. The last line was the disappearing one and apparently there wasn't a dry eye in the house. I couldn't attend myself. John Denvers version has the updated words. 

 

There is folk music from the 60's about the Settle and Carlisle but I can't reference it. 

 

Jamie

Edited Monday at 19:53 by jamie92208