The Night Mail

[AndyID]

4 hours ago, J. S. Bach said:

That alone would almost make it worth my trip; if I lived over there!

Unfortunately it's not exactly Kosher. It's a reenactment of the original which is long gone.

[iL Dottore]

After reading @PupCam's lovely post, I must again repeat myself:

You lucky, jammy b*****! (credit card or no credit card).

 

I would agree at £200 a head is rather stiff for the "dining experience", but I would imagine as this is a bespoke experience the costs of all the services provided are higher because these expenses are not a daily expense for the train operating company (which they can manage through bulk buying et cetera).

 

A "one off" to a high standard is always going to cost more than that same high standard item produced on a regular basis.

 

I think that the Blue Pullman is a perfect example of what BR could have achieved on a regular basis had it not been for interfering politicians, stroppy unions and the great unwashed being unwilling to pay for quality.

 

In another post I made elsewhere on RMWeb, I pointed out how the very expensive seats in business class and the very very expensive seats in first class subsidise the economy class airline passenger and I wonder whether or not this model should've been adopted by the railways. With a super luxurious (and expensive) fast train service being aimed at the business traveller and the well heeled, and with the profits used to improve the services for everyone else.

 

The Japanese have grasped that concept well (the Train Suite Shika Shima can cost as much as £7600 a head) - they have at least 4 trains similar to the Shika Shima and many other "joyful trains" (special tourist trains) besides. A simple thing, but well outside the typical British TOC mindset.

 

Anyway, if @PupCam can PM the appropriate links and details I would be most appreciative.

[jamie92208]

Alan, @PupCam, you seem to have had a great day out through countryside that I have great attachment to, having grown up in the Settle area. Like @jjb1970I was born in Carlisle and have also spent holidays along the Newcastle to Carlisle.  I'm glad that you had such a great day out.  Just one question, did you go through Leeds Station or avoid it via the Wellington curve that bypasses it to the West.

 

Jamie

[polybear]

8 hours ago, Happy Hippo said:

Crap design, no workshop!

 

Or Garage....

(did I mention.......)

[jamie92208]

16 minutes ago, polybear said:

 

Or Garage....

(did I mention.......)

And where's the shed. 

 

Jamie 

[AndyID]

Can't beat a shed, until you have filled it with so much crepe you are not quite sure to do with all of it 🤣

[Hroth]

32 minutes ago, AndyID said:

Can't beat a shed, until you have filled it with so much crepe you are not quite sure to do with all of it 🤣

 

Rather like my SHED at the moment, but once the GARAGE is sorted, I'll be able to make more room in the SHED!

 

That's life, eh? 🤪

 

[PupCam]

4 hours ago, iL Dottore said:

After reading @PupCam's lovely post, I must again repeat myself:

You lucky, jammy b*****! (credit card or no credit card).

 

Yes, perhaps you are correct.   Although not overflowing with spare cash (never did understand that concept!)  the Puppers are free to indulge on occasion 😀    And it really was a great trip.

 

4 hours ago, iL Dottore said:

Anyway, if @PupCam can PM the appropriate links and details I would be most appreciative.

 

As in ..   https://midlandpullman.com/?     I've just had a quick squint and many of next years trips are already sold out although the S & C one still has places.  This time it appears to be going up the WCML.  So get planning iD!

 

 

4 hours ago, jamie92208 said:

Alan, @PupCam, you seem to have had a great day out through countryside that I have great attachment to, having grown up in the Settle area. Like @jjb1970I was born in Carlisle and have also spent holidays along the Newcastle to Carlisle.  I'm glad that you had such a great day out.  Just one question, did you go through Leeds Station or avoid it via the Wellington curve that bypasses it to the West.

 

Jamie

 

To the south & west  Jamie.    Here's the timing sheet and I think I've plotted the route correctly.  I certainly don't remember going through Leeds station.

 

 

 

Carlisle looked like a very nice place to explore  and, because it was very nice, a few photographs of Carlisle Cathedral. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

TTFN

 

 

 

 

[DenysW]

13 hours ago, Dave Hunt said:

reversing the car into the corner of a stone wall

My offspring used to refer to these as "Dad Walls" due to similar incidents. Fixed in recent years (but fingers crossed) by the annoying beeping that is a reversing sensor.

 

Deepest sympathy.

[jjb1970]

The centre of Carlisle is lovely. The cathedral is splendid, the castle is a proper military fortress rather than a stately home with a few crenelations and the citadel is surely one of the nicer gateways into a city centre. And because the flood plain of the River Eden cuts the city in two there is a huge green belt through the city. However it does have its less salubrious bits. 

[Compound2632]

13 hours ago, Dave Hunt said:

but despite looking in all the nooks and crannies didn't see Bill.

 

If you mean @bbishop, I'm now much better informed on the management politics of the South Western, which is rather useful for understanding the context of some Somerset & Dorset Joint Committee and Officers' Committee minutes.

[Compound2632]

30 minutes ago, PupCam said:

Here's the timing sheet and I think I've plotted the route correctly.  I certainly don't remember going through Leeds station.

 

According to that timing sheet, you didn't, you took the south-to-west chord from Engine Shed Junction to Whitehall Junction. You would certainly have noticed had you gone into Leeds station, as the direction of travel would reverse there - but I have no doubt that from an operational point of view, accommodating a railtour would have but a strain on the station's capacity.

[PupCam]

50 minutes ago, jjb1970 said:

The centre of Carlisle is lovely. The cathedral is splendid, the castle is a proper military fortress rather than a stately home with a few crenelations and the citadel is surely one of the nicer gateways into a city centre. And because the flood plain of the River Eden cuts the city in two there is a huge green belt through the city. However it does have its less salubrious bits. 

 

Doesn't everywhere! 

 

27 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

According to that timing sheet, you didn't, you took the south-to-west chord from Engine Shed Junction to Whitehall Junction.

 

Precisely as I stated; to the south and west of Leeds.

 

 

27 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 You would certainly have noticed had you gone into Leeds station, as the direction of travel would reverse there - but I have no doubt that from an operational point of view, accommodating a railtour would have but a strain on the station's capacity.

 

That I hadn't appreciated.

 

 

Edited September 9 by PupCam
Added note to jjb's post

[polybear]

3 hours ago, Hroth said:

 

Rather like my SHED at the moment, but once the GARAGE is sorted, I'll be able to make more room in the SHED!

 

That's life, eh? 🤪

 

 

You've mentioned the S-word (twice) AND the G-word - and all in one post.  Not only that, but you've shouted them.....😱

 

[PhilJ W]

12 hours ago, PupCam said:

Evening!

 

The ERs amongst us will be aware that I went for a little train ride yesterday which involved being an Early Riser.    Being on Hitchin station platform at 7:25am on a Saturday when you are retired is just plain cruel.  

However it was worth it as this was the train we caught.

 

 

Some were interested in photographs to show details but as they would mostly be of railway related objects there would have been risk to life and limb from low flying awls so I thought I'd post a few here instead.

 

 

 

Not really it's what credit cards were invented for.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Fantastic!  We loved it, I hope you do too!

 

 

Sorry Grizz, I didn't see your post until I was reading ERs this morning otherwise I would have done so but sorry I can't help.   

 

Having said that I was talking to one of the stewards who said they've actually got four sets so it maybe that there's a mix? 🤔   You might need to hedge your bets and consider both cases.

 

Well, what can I say?   It was a fantastic experience and a great, if long and tiring, day out.     You can go either as just a first class passenger (with complementary refreshments; coffee/tea/biscuits and other things to nibble)  and free to bring as much or as little food and alcohol with you as you wish or for the full-scale dining experience where you are plied with what seemed likely to be an almost continuous round of posh nosh whilst seated in the train (~5 hours there, 5 hours back).   As we don't eat a huge amount of food normally we thought we'd not be able to do the posh nosh, dining experience anything like justice.   As the full-dining was an extra £200 EACH that would have made for an expensive day out (the fare was £198 +£25 each facing single seat supplement) which we cash-strapped pensioners baulked at 😉.  Sorry @iL Dottore!  Actually what would have been really good would be to say just have a really good, Pullman style dinner on the return journey for a slightly more modest supplement and we could then enjoy the Pullman dinning experience but wouldn't end up feeling completely pigged out by huge quantities of unnecessary food.    In the end we didn't eat any of the stuff we'd brought from home, had a couple of bacon rolls from the buffet as breakfast and ate perhaps a 1/3 of the nibbles provided and went out for a light lunch in Carlisle.   We didn't stave and didn't feel bloated.   This is the top layer of the Morning Nibbles box.   There was another one in the afternoon.

 

 

And as for the trip?    A marvellous run up the ECML picking up at various points up to Retford.   Up to Doncastor then made our way across country south of Leeds to Hellifield and hence to Settle.   At the start of this section the dull grey conditions had changed to really dull fog with very poor visibility and we were thinking "Well this going to be great, we're going to miss the spectacular scenery" but we needn't have worried.   As we went west the fog lifted, the dull grey turned to grey and then even a hint of brightness and by Hellifield although not wall-to-wall blue sky and sunshine more than good enough to admire the view.  And of course, what a view!  

 

 

 

Funny enough whenever I pass through Dent going north I'm reminded of a 1960s(?) Railway Modeller article by David Jenkinson featuring his model of the "station on the curve".   It might not have been up to modern  finescale standards back then but it sure captured the essence of the place which I didn't see for real but recognised instantly until some 50 years later.   

 

 

 

And so on to Carlisle.   ~3 hours to spend so we had lunch, a mooch around the streets and a trip into the Cathedral.   The Cathedral was very nice with some lovely stained glass windows.  Whilst mooching the streets  Puppers eagle eye spied a sign saying "Model Railway shop - Upstairs".   It would have been rude not to go upstairs ....   A small but apparently very well crammed establishment!

 

Then back on the train for the 4:26 departure home, this time heading east as soon as we left Carlisle along the Tyne valley.  That's very nice too.    I did look to see if Bob & Paul were fishing but I didn't spot them.   If they were there maybe Bob's still having trouble with gravity and had fallen over in the long grass 🤣    As an aside, that's a great TV series isn't it?  Can't wait for the next programmes.

 

We aimed for Newcastle but just missed as we took the junction  for the south and then back down the ECML to home to complete a very memorable day.   To round it off beautifully we were greeted on the platform at Hitchin unexpectedly by Junior Puppers and the eldest (6 years old) Junior Junior Puppers which was a lovely surprise.

 

I have to say I think the preservation, modification to Pullman standard and painting in the old Blue Pullman scheme of these 125 sets is inspired.     If you get the chance, do have a go.

 

Alan

 

I'm checking my lottery tickets right now.

[PhilJ W]

6 hours ago, iL Dottore said:

After reading @PupCam's lovely post, I must again repeat myself:

You lucky, jammy b*****! (credit card or no credit card).

 

I would agree at £200 a head is rather stiff for the "dining experience", but I would imagine as this is a bespoke experience the costs of all the services provided are higher because these expenses are not a daily expense for the train operating company (which they can manage through bulk buying et cetera).

 

A "one off" to a high standard is always going to cost more than that same high standard item produced on a regular basis.

 

I think that the Blue Pullman is a perfect example of what BR could have achieved on a regular basis had it not been for interfering politicians, stroppy unions and the great unwashed being unwilling to pay for quality.

 

In another post I made elsewhere on RMWeb, I pointed out how the very expensive seats in business class and the very very expensive seats in first class subsidise the economy class airline passenger and I wonder whether or not this model should've been adopted by the railways. With a super luxurious (and expensive) fast train service being aimed at the business traveller and the well heeled, and with the profits used to improve the services for everyone else.

 

The Japanese have grasped that concept well (the Train Suite Shika Shima can cost as much as £7600 a head) - they have at least 4 trains similar to the Shika Shima and many other "joyful trains" (special tourist trains) besides. A simple thing, but well outside the typical British TOC mindset.

 

Anyway, if @PupCam can PM the appropriate links and details I would be most appreciative.

These trains are not run by the TOC's but by independant train charter companies. When you take into account the fact that they have to maintain their stock to a very high standard (acceptable to Network rail) and some such as Blue Pullman have to maintain their own traction as well the prices are very reasonable. 

[PhilJ W]

Where can I get socks like these.

https://www.facebook.com/reel/1819576465235619

[polybear]

39 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

Where can I get socks like these.

https://www.facebook.com/reel/1819576465235619

 

I really do worry about you sometimes Phil.....

 

[Happy Hippo]

2 hours ago, DenysW said:

My offspring used to refer to these as "Dad Walls" due to similar incidents. Fixed in recent years (but fingers crossed) by the annoying beeping that is a reversing sensor.

 

Deepest sympathy.

The problem is that most fixed wing pilots are not taught to reverse!

[Oldddudders]

25 minutes ago, Happy Hippo said:

The problem is that most fixed wing pilots are not taught to reverse!

I used to think Reverse Thrust was something from the Kama Sutra!

[Oldddudders]

Sherry found this online somewhere.

 

[Hroth]

1 hour ago, PhilJ W said:

Where can I get socks like these.

https://www.facebook.com/reel/1819576465235619

 

Dunno.

Its on facebook.

I don't do facebook.....

 

[Tony_S]

22 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

Sherry found this online somewhere.

Probably on Brian Bilston’s Facebook page? That is where I saw it. 

[iL Dottore]

1 hour ago, PhilJ W said:

These trains are not run by the TOC's but by independant train charter companies. When you take into account the fact that they have to maintain their stock to a very high standard (acceptable to Network rail) and some such as Blue Pullman have to maintain their own traction as well the prices are very reasonable. 

I know that.

 

My point was the the TOCs in Japan, like JR East, JR West etc., put on both "joyful trains" (tourist trains) and luxury trains which feed revenue back into the system. I was just wondering why British TOCs don't also offer tourist trains or even luxury hotel trains (I have my, unPC, ideas on that)..

 

Having said that, given the state of both Britain's railways and its TOCs, I doubt if they could even if they wanted to (and had a large enough customer base for such things)

[jjb1970]

RMWeb is the only open social media I do now, though I use WhatsApp a lot and have various friend and family group chats which do what Facebook was supposed to do without all the nonsense, advertising, and stuff I am not interested in. I really don't miss Facebook. I never got into Twitter/X as it just seems a sewer to bring out the worst in people. And I never saw any value in Linkedin.