Peco Parkside kits for a novice

[57xx]

3 hours ago, Philou said:

I do have a question for you Richard, you mentioned that you replace your buffers with metal ones. From where do you source them?

 

I'm currently using Lanarkshire Models cast buffers, they have a vast range and cover pretty much anything you can think of. I have in the past also used MJT (Dart Castings) ones. Not as big a range but the do some with steel buffers cast into the white metal collars which are a bit stouter.

[Philou]

@gary_lner You asked regarding the rooves (that's the way I was taught but it's now roofs - or so I believe). I just checked - the meat van is no problem. It's just as well I looked, as the CCT is not the same - it fits better one way than the other - so I've marked it for later when I glue it. I shall use The Johnster's elastic band method BEFORE I do the brake gear gubbins - less risk of damage. Also take care with the roof as there is no overhang on the model (don't know about the 1:1 version) and so no margin for error.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

 

Thanks to all those that suggested various buffers - it'll give me something to do this evening .

 

[Philou]

I don't want to divert this thread too much, unless the OP @gary_lner says OK, but having completed up to a point my set of Parkside wagons, I'm going to go back to my really, really old unmade Airfix mineral wagons to compare the ease, or not, of their construction by way of comparison - I'll post here, if I may?

 

Cheers and take care out there,

 

Philip

 

Ratio signals to follow - but they might be more problematic - moving parts by the zillion in them AND I want to put LEDs as backlights and I'll need some ideas for that!

 

Toodle pip!

[gary_lner]

12 minutes ago, Philou said:

I don't want to divert this thread too much, unless the OP @gary_lner says OK, but having completed up to a point my set of Parkside wagons, I'm going to go back to my really, really old unmade Airfix mineral wagons to compare the ease, or not, of their construction by way of comparison - I'll post here, if I may?

 

Cheers and take care out there,

 

Philip

 

Ratio signals to follow - but they might be more problematic - moving parts by the zillion in them AND I want to put LEDs as backlights and I'll need some ideas for that!

 

Toodle pip!

Morning Philip that's absolutely fine feel free to post anything you make. I'd be interested to see what the airfix kits look like aswell.

 

Regards Gary 

[Philou]

@gary_lner Thanks for that. I'll start later this afternoon, grand box-opening ceremony, ooohing and aaaahing over the contents etc., etc. . Off for quick walk as the sun is shining with a rather cold wind, but at least it's dry.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

 

 

[Philou]

I'm back - the wagon is done. It took about hour an half to do and it needs buffers and couplings to be attached. It's at about the same stage as the Parkside ones.

 

What differences in construction? The methodology is basically the same, but the plastic mouldings of the Parkside ones are finer giving the plastic slightly less rigidity and less weight. It may well be that the plastics are different. The Airfix ones are moulded in one colour only, whereas Parkside pre-colour the solebars, and the roofs where applicable.

 

I found the Airfix slightly quicker to assemble and no need for the instructions either. I expect it's a wagon of which I have built a great number (26 and 3 unbuilt) and so it was pretty well memorised. However, the biggest difference was that there were no wheels or bearings provided in the kit. I don't know if this has changed under the Dapol label or not. These I already had in stock.

 

Here we go, a few pictures:

 

Basic kit - plastic wheels - bin those as you shan't need them.

 

All body parts and solebars removed from sprues and tidied up. Working doors fitted prior to assembling the sides to the floor. Can you see what I can see that isn't on the Parkside wagons?

 

Solebars ready to have the axleboxes opened up to take some Peco brass cup bearings. The masking tape was wound around the twist drill (40 years ago - can't believe it!) as the plastic is quite soft - no need for a drill.

 

There you go - easy peasy.

 

On to the next post .....................

 

 

[John Isherwood]

8 minutes ago, Philou said:

.... there were no wheels .... provided in the kit.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ermm - those Peco brass bearings are the ancient type - intended for wheels on non-pinpoint axles.

 

If you fit pinpoint axles the running will be rough - you need the more modern 'tophat' bearings.

 

https://www.wizardmodels.ltd/shop/wagons/bpp001/

 

John Isherwood.

 

PS. Contrary to your post, Airfix did provide wheels (of a sort) in black plastic - as per your photos.

Edited March 31, 2020 by cctransuk

[Philou]

Same as the Parkside kits - a little spot of glue and gentle push the bearings into place. These do not go flush with the plastic for if you try, you'll drill through the axlebox. I remembered that from years ago!

 

Job jobbed - hour and a half. To complete it with buffers and couplings (but not painted) I estimate two hours tops. Not too bad for a model that cost 35p (plus wheels, couplings and bearings) all those years ago. It probably isn't as 'fine' as the Parkside ones, they come from another age after all.

 

Some modellers of these wagons don't like the opening doors as the hinges are overscale - I've kept them as the other 26 are the same. One thing that is apparently incorrect is that these wagons did not have brake shoes on both sides - so I only put them this side. I now need to get the 26 others and remove the shoes on the one side too.

 

To finish - and the same to be done on the Parkside ones, will be some fine brass wire (that I haven't got otherwise I would have so done) to form the link between the V-hangers. On this wagon as they were unfitted I have been spared from doing the lever arm to the vacuum cylinder - there are some to be done on the Parside ones too.

 

The answer to the question I asked in the previous post - Airfix very kindly stamped the part number on each of the body pieces. Every. One. I never noticed on all the 26 others I built before!! I did ask my self if I was going to have all my minerals loaded or unloaded. I think we all know the answer to that now chums, don't we?

 

Luckily, I have all the false coal loads as provided by Airfix (never chuck anything out, me), so I can now put some sheet lead at the bottom and then put the false load over the top and finish off with some real bits of coal.

 

Cheers everyone and take care out there,

 

Philip

 

Tomorrow, I'll try and do the last 2 minerals and then onto the signals.

 

[Philou]

@cctransuk The cup bearings were what was available all those years ago and I've still got a large number stashed away, so it seemed a waste not to use them. Granted the wheels don't spin forever in the cups unlike in the top-hat ones, but they are nonetheless quite free-running.

 

When I said 'no wheels', I really meant no metal ones as I did mention in the caption that the plastic ones wouldn't be required .

 

For an old kit - it scrubs up fine.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

 

[brossard]

Just a minute, I would argue that assembly is the easy part.  Painting, lettering and weathering really makes a model pop.

 

Here are some Slaters exMR/LMS wagons I did ages ago:

 

 

 

 

Slaters 4mm wagons are very good IMO.  They have done the rounds being variously under C&L and Coopercraft.  They are now back home at Slaters, where they should have stayed.

 

In my 4mm days I didn't take as many pictures of my work as I do now.  I also did a lot of upgrades to RTR stock.

 

John

[John Isherwood]

6 minutes ago, Philou said:

 

 Airfix very kindly stamped the part number on each of the body pieces. Every. One. I never noticed on all the 26 others I built before!!

 

 

It's funny - I don't recall the Airfix mineral wagon having raised numbers moulded on, as shown in your photos.

 

John Isherwood.

[Philou]

@brossard I don't disagree that the painting and lettering will make or break the model - and I wasn't out to set any records in building the wagon - I was just setting my skills between an old kit and the new ones. I found that slightly more care was required in constructing the Parkside ones due to the relative fineness of the parts.

 

I have a huge amount of learning to do when it comes to the 'painting and decorating' - I have nil skills, but I will have 29 minerals on which to practice!!! Painting will have to wait as most of our local hardware stores are shut and I don't think rattle can paint counts as an 'essential item' - unfortunately .

 

By the way, just love the finish on your wagons - really look the part. I've never done any Slaters but I have done some Ratio ones, though one or two have warped in storage whereas the Airfix ones haven't moved.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

[Philou]

@cctransuk Regarding the numbers on the parts, I've just had a quick count on the photo I posted up earlier, there are about 10 wagons without part numbers, the rest with. I assume the mould was revamped at some time, as the last three I'm building were the last batch I bought. I wasn't into modelling after 1970-1, cars, women, beer .... children, mortgage ...... Oi, you can stop the world's smallest violin at the back ......

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

[brossard]

38 minutes ago, Philou said:

@brossard I don't disagree that the painting and lettering will make or break the model - and I wasn't out to set any records in building the wagon - I was just setting my skills between an old kit and the new ones. I found that slightly more care was required in constructing the Parkside ones due to the relative fineness of the parts.

 

I have a huge amount of learning to do when it comes to the 'painting and decorating' - I have nil skills, but I will have 29 minerals on which to practice!!! Painting will have to wait as most of our local hardware stores are shut and I don't think rattle can paint counts as an 'essential item' - unfortunately .

 

By the way, just love the finish on your wagons - really look the part. I've never done any Slaters but I have done some Ratio ones, though one or two have warped in storage whereas the Airfix ones haven't moved.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

 

I would caution against having too many wagons waiting for paint etc.  You could end up with an overwhelming situation with just too much to do and no idea where to start.  I usually have 3 kits on the go at various stages of assembly and paint.  This way, I can work on a kit while glue and paint are drying on another.  Transfer application is a job I dislike but I try to get it right.

 

One thing I ALWAYS do is prime, either grey or red oxide depending on top colour.  I use the stuff for cars that is plastic safe.

 

Another trick of the trade is varnish.  When the paint is done I put on a coat of gloss varnish (Testors Glosscote).  Transfers don't like matte surfaces.  (I also use Microscale Microset and Microsol).  When the transfers have dried, I add a coat of matte varnish (Testors Dullcote).  The varnish magically blends everything to a nice uniform finish.

 

John

Edited March 31, 2020 by brossard

[brossard]

At risk of making people run before they can walk, I just edited this old thread on the build of a pair of Parkside Fish vans:

 

BTW that pic is NOT my van, I don't know how the system picks these.

 

Rather advanced underframe construction using etched brass.  Parkside brake detail can be sparse and uses plastic rod.

 

John

[JohnR]

32 minutes ago, brossard said:

Rather advanced underframe construction using etched brass.  Parkside brake detail can be sparse and uses plastic rod.

 

John

 

Whats the best source for the brass rod to improve the underframe? I always find the plastic provided just seems to be a smidgen too short.

 

[Philou]

@brossard Thanks for the added information. It was going to be my question regarding prepping of the plastic kits as I'm stuck with acrylics primarily - no model shops with a 100miles from here, and the UK won't deliver other than by courrier. Someone, I think The Johnster, said that he gives a blast of matt varnish as a base coat - what do you think?

 

Regarding the number of wagons on the go, I shan't mind if it's 6 or 26 - I shall just work my way through albeit slowly. I have around 60 kit-built wagons plus all RTR ones that need at least a blow-over to tone them down and give that 'used-look' look. It is one thing that bugs me over here, the continentals seem to keep their stock pristine - it's just too clean!!

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

[brossard]

John I get most of mine from my local hobby shop although that is more than 20K away.  A more convenient way is to order from Hatton's or Eileen's Emporium.  Most common wire I used on 4mm wagons is 0.020" (0.5mm).

 

John

[brossard]

2 minutes ago, Philou said:

@brossard Thanks for the added information. It was going to be my question regarding prepping of the plastic kits as I'm stuck with acrylics primarily - no model shops with a 100miles from here, and the UK won't deliver other than by courrier. Someone, I think The Johnster, said that he gives a blast of matt varnish as a base coat - what do you think?

 

Regarding the number of wagons on the go, I shan't mind if it's 6 or 26 - I shall just work my way through albeit slowly. I have around 60 kit-built wagons plus all RTR ones that need at least a blow-over to tone them down and give that 'used-look' look. It is one thing that bugs me over here, the continentals seem to keep their stock pristine - it's just too clean!!

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

 

Yes, frustrating that we can't get paint.  I can get basic colours from the likes of Tamiya, but BR railway colours are much harder to get.  I do have a stock of Humbrol acrylics (BR grey, crimson and cream).  I cobbled up a batch of BR bauxite from brown and red.  It looks OK after weathering.

 

I haven't tried using varnish as a base coat so really can't say yay or nay.  Matte varnish will provide a key for the paint I expect.  However, primer also provides a base colour to enhance the final colour.  The primer finish looks so good I sometimes want to leave it like that (but never do of course).

 

Weathering is very simple, or at least the way I do it is.  I do have an airbrush so that's pretty important.  I use two basic colours when weathering, first a light coat of earth/dirt followed by a light coat of black.  I use powders, umber, black and rust to highlight solebars and underframes.

 

John

[Steamport Southport]

17 minutes ago, JohnR said:

 

Whats the best source for the brass rod to improve the underframe? I always find the plastic provided just seems to be a smidgen too short.

 

 

Many of the model shops that sell kits sell the wire/rod. Usually described as handrail wire or signal wire and normally sold in packs of ten lengths of 10 or 12 inches. Often available in brass or nickel silver.

 

The most common sizes are 0.3, 0.45 and 0.7 mm (sometimes 0.9).

 

Try places like Wizard, Eileen's Emporium, Peters Spares, Alan Gibson, etc.

 

For example this is the Wizard/51L version of the 0.45mm.

 

https://www.petersspares.com/51l-uc039-30cm-x-045mm-diameter-nickel-silver-handrail-wire-pack-of-10-oo-gauge.ir

 

 

 

Jason

 

[brossard]

I would add that 0.3mm wire is about right for 4mm handrails.

 

Nickel silver is harder than brass and less malleable.  It stays straighter than brass though.  For me they are interchangeable.

 

Avoid wire in rolls, there's just no straightening it.

 

John

Edited March 31, 2020 by brossard

[Enterprisingwestern]

2 hours ago, brossard said:

 

Yes, frustrating that we can't get paint.  I can get basic colours from the likes of Tamiya, but BR railway colours are much harder to get.  I do have a stock of Humbrol acrylics (BR grey, crimson and cream).  I cobbled up a batch of BR bauxite from brown and red.  It looks OK after weathering.

 

I haven't tried using varnish as a base coat so really can't say yay or nay.  Matte varnish will provide a key for the paint I expect.  However, primer also provides a base colour to enhance the final colour.  The primer finish looks so good I sometimes want to leave it like that (but never do of course).

 

Weathering is very simple, or at least the way I do it is.  I do have an airbrush so that's pretty important.  I use two basic colours when weathering, first a light coat of earth/dirt followed by a light coat of black.  I use powders, umber, black and rust to highlight solebars and underframes.

 

John

 

Apologies everyone, here I come on my hobbyhorse,, soapbox in hand.

You do not need railway colours specifically, once you allow for the fading and weathering of the prototype, the "correct" railway paint shades are irrelevant. Look at a colour picture of a rake of mineral wagons or fitted bauxite wagons and tell me which is the right one colour wise.

Like yourself I am outwith the UK and use various options for my colours, from Tamiya/Vallejo etc via primers from my local pintura and sprays from the Chino supermercado.

Start looking at colours not labels!

 

Mike.

[brossard]

Absolutely right Mike, certainly for goods stock.  I don't get all twitter and bisted about freight wagon colours.

 

On the other hand passenger coaches should be painted with more care.  The bodies were cleaned, even if ends were not.

 

John

[brossard]

Anyone who is interested in building wagon should try to get hold of some books:

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/4mm-Wagon-Opens-Minerals-Hoppers/dp/1874103038/ref=sr_1_20?keywords=wild+swan+railway+books&qid=1585751015&sr=8-20

 

https://www.branchstow.co.uk/the4mmwagonparttwogeoffkent/

 

or:

 

https://www.abebooks.co.uk/book-search/title/4mm-wagon-general-merchandise-vans/author/kent-geoff/

 

Geoff's is a 3 book series and contains tips for building wagons and for modifying.  There are also a lot of prototype wagon pictures.

 

https://www.abebooks.co.uk/servlet/SearchResults?cm_sp=SearchF-_-topnav-_-Results&kn=4mm coal wagon&sts=t

 

Another good one for those interested in mineral wagons.

 

John

Edited April 1, 2020 by brossard

[cheesysmith]

If you don't have a model shop, look for a music shop. Guitar wire is useful. Also, check your local motor spares shop for paints, halfords over here do a good range of spray paints.