Bachmann 4BEP

[andyman7]

40 minutes ago, Gwiwer said:

Similar reductions at some other retailers.  Posted in the interests of full and fair play.  They are rumoured to be selling rather slowly at almost £500 apiece.  I'm not surprised if that is correct which is unfortunate and doesn't bode well for future units.  

It's interesting that the RRP of the refurbished CEPs was tweaked downwards before release. However, I suspect that the future impact is likely to be reduced production quantities rather than big price cuts.
The model bus market is an indicator, whilst the frenzy of the 1990s has collapsed, the supply of new models (especially of modern buses) is tiny but they sell out, and prices are £50-£80 a model. It's case of matching the market to the demand.

In the meantime, now is as good a time as it will ever be to fill your boots with BEPS and HAPS, but whilst under £250 is a great price for the BEP I can't help recalling that a little over a decade back, prices got as low as £52 for green SYP CEPs (that's how cheap they got at Modelzone at one point). So the fact that the market now treats a green SYP 4 car EMU as a bargain at over £200 shoes that the accepted price points have been somewhat dramatically repositioned..

[Southernman46]

Indeed the 4 original B&G CEP's I've got cost less than a single re-furbished one. Was holding off on one of these but might just pull the trigger anyway - at least that'll mean an industry-wide sale of re-furbished ones quickly after 🙄

[rembrow]

11 hours ago, andyman7 said:

It's interesting that the RRP of the refurbished CEPs was tweaked downwards before release. However, I suspect that the future impact is likely to be reduced production quantities rather than big price cuts.
The model bus market is an indicator, whilst the frenzy of the 1990s has collapsed, the supply of new models (especially of modern buses) is tiny but they sell out, and prices are £50-£80 a model. It's case of matching the market to the demand.

In the meantime, now is as good a time as it will ever be to fill your boots with BEPS and HAPS, but whilst under £250 is a great price for the BEP I can't help recalling that a little over a decade back, prices got as low as £52 for green SYP CEPs (that's how cheap they got at Modelzone at one point). So the fact that the market now treats a green SYP 4 car EMU as a bargain at over £200 shoes that the accepted price points have been somewhat dramatically repositioned..

I'm not sure Bachmann made a wise decision to issue the current versions of unrefurbished 4 ceps, mlvs and even beps. The earlier releases were very sluggish sellers and I bought my two cep sets at a much reduced price. The mlvs were also slow sellers. I recall that Bachmann sent some stock of the second cep releases, back to China, to be reworked as weathered, retaining the same running numbers. So to produce more at plus £400 price seemed madness to me. I've been regularly checking to the price for the beps, was nearly tempted when some retails went sub £300 at around £299, but held off. I no longer pre order Bachmann or Hornby as have found that virtually everything I want is available 6 months later at reduced prices, so have had to cure my fomo anxiety. Recently purchased Bachmann green class 37s and 20s at £50 less than most retailer discounted prices.

I do feel for retailers who have stock on hand when prices fall significantly. With the example of the bep, I don't know for certain but would suspect that Bachmann have made stock available at a heavy discount.

[S&DWatty]

Hi all,I picked up one of the TMC bargain 4 BEPs and have chipped it with a 21 pin Lais 6 fn decoder.  I'm struggling to get the head and tail lights to work properly.  I can get one end only and that is on for both directions of travel.  I was wondering if I could adjust the CVs to sort it out?  

 

As bought F0 is head/tail and F1 is interior lights.  Interior lights work fine and connectivity between vehicles is fine, albeit awkward to rail as others have mentioned.

 

Happy New Year to all.

[RFS]

Head/tail lights are always on for both directions of travel. Later 4-CEPs, for example, have white headcode at the front with a route number, and red blinds on the rear so it's correct that they are always both on.

 

The couplings have two connectors - one contact for F0 and the other for F1. Is the end where the headcode does come on the powered coach? This one is not dependent on the connectors. If it's the unpowered coach then it's possible that one of the connectors somewhere in the set is not making contact. I've had one where the connector got bent when inserting it, so I would check all the connectors are OK.

[S&DWatty]

2 hours ago, RFS said:

Head/tail lights are always on for both directions of travel. Later 4-CEPs, for example, have white headcode at the front with a route number, and red blinds on the rear so it's correct that they are always both on.

 

The couplings have two connectors - one contact for F0 and the other for F1. Is the end where the headcode does come on the powered coach? This one is not dependent on the connectors. If it's the unpowered coach then it's possible that one of the connectors somewhere in the set is not making contact. I've had one where the connector got bent when inserting it, so I would check all the connectors are OK.

Cheers Robert,  yes its the uncovered end that's unlit.   I'll go back and check that the unlit end is correctly connected as its entirely possible that one of the connecting drawbars has a bent pin.  

 

Thanks for the help!

 

 

[S&DWatty]

15 minutes ago, S&DWatty said:

Cheers Robert yes its the uncovered end that's unlit.   I'll go back and check that the unlit end is correctly connected as its entirely possible that one of the connecting drawbars has a bent pin.  

 

Thanks for the help!

 

 

Hi Robert that was exactly as you suspected and an easy 5 min fix!  Thank you and Happy New Year!

 

Regards

 

Dave

Edited December 31, 2023 by S&DWatty

[RFS]

I too picked up the TMC bargain, with the 4-BEP to replace one of my existing 4-CEPs. Very pleased with it until it started intermittently derailing. For better close-coupling I use the class 101 conductive couplings as they're shorter and result in corridors touching on straight track. So I thought at first it was that, but it was always the the same bogie on the CK that was the problem. Removing the bogie to check it out revealed a problem with the pickups as per picture. Once straightened out, all OK!

 

Edited January 3 by RFS
Spelling

[Blobrick]

Could l ask the more knowledgeable amongst the RM membership a question relating to the Green version of Bachmanns BEP (Bachmann 31-490 Class 410  No. 7005 ) 

 

After reading through the comments in this thread l gather that this version of the model represents  unit 7005 as built and entered service.  It does not have the UIC yellow strip or the Red Stripe over the Buffet car. Reading through the Blood and Custard website, it seems that these markings were added to a lot of the fleet between late 1959 and 1960, so my question is how long could 7005 have run in traffic before having these markings added at the outside maximum ?  Plus l understand that the Indicator type used initially was of the long number type, when would that have changed?  What date would be the cut off for this model?

 

Many thanks in advance

 

Bob C

 

[robertcwp]

5 hours ago, Blobrick said:

Could l ask the more knowledgeable amongst the RM membership a question relating to the Green version of Bachmanns BEP (Bachmann 31-490 Class 410  No. 7005 ) 

 

After reading through the comments in this thread l gather that this version of the model represents  unit 7005 as built and entered service.  It does not have the UIC yellow strip or the Red Stripe over the Buffet car. Reading through the Blood and Custard website, it seems that these markings were added to a lot of the fleet between late 1959 and 1960, so my question is how long could 7005 have run in traffic before having these markings added at the outside maximum ?  Plus l understand that the Indicator type used initially was of the long number type, when would that have changed?  What date would be the cut off for this model?

 

Many thanks in advance

 

Bob C

 

Hard to say exactly but probably not beyond its first overhaul in the early 1960s. The buffet cars also gained Commonwealth bogies whilst the units were still green.

 

I moved mine forward to a more mid-1960s condition:

P1090135am by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

P1090136am by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

 

7005 retained a whistle in this condition, as confirmed by a 1965 photo in an Ian Allan abc of the era.

[Blobrick]

6 hours ago, robertcwp said:

Hard to say exactly but probably not beyond its first overhaul in the early 1960s. The buffet cars also gained Commonwealth bogies whilst the units were still green.

 

I moved mine forward to a more mid-1960s condition:

P1090135am by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

P1090136am by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

 

7005 retained a whistle in this condition, as confirmed by a 1965 photo in an Ian Allan abc of the era.

 

 

Hi Robert

 

Many thanks for your reply. Your model of 7005 falls right within the period l m interested in. (1962-1965).

So a couple of questions if l may, am i right in suspecting that you ve used a spare vestibule door from a CEP set for the SYWP and you ve swopped out the Buffet bogies for Commonwealth ones ?  (I think Bachmann do theses as spares?)

Who supplied the UIC markings you ve added?

 

Thanks once again

 

Bob C

 

Edited July 11 by Blobrick

[robertcwp]

3 hours ago, Blobrick said:

 

 

Hi Robert

 

Many thanks for your reply. Your model of 7005 falls right within the period l m interested in. (1962-1965).

So a couple of questions if l may, am i right in suspecting that you ve used a spare vestibule door from a CEP set for the SYWP and you ve swopped out the Buffet bogies for Commonwealth ones ?  (I think Bachmann do theses as spares?)

Who supplied the UIC markings you ve added?

 

Thanks once again

 

Bob C

 

Yes I used spare doors from my two green Ceps but changed the headcode.  Bogies were from Bachmann spares I think. Bands are HMRS transfers. 

[Blobrick]

11 minutes ago, robertcwp said:

Yes I used spare doors from my two green Ceps but changed the headcode.  Bogies were from Bachmann spares I think. Bands are HMRS transfers. 

Thanks Robert, l ll begetting on to Bachmann spares this morning!. Much appreciated!

 

Cheers

 

Bob C

[SRman]

1 hour ago, Blobrick said:

Thanks Robert, l ll begetting on to Bachmann spares this morning!. Much appreciated!

 

Cheers

 

Bob C

If it's any help, I used the coloured bands on a standard Hornby RB Restaurant Car, but used the wide ones intended for HSTs from Fox Transfers, cut down to half their height. Alternative supplier, same result. I do have the HMRS ones too, but couldn't find them at the time. 😂

I can say that the colour density of the Fox ones is very good.

 

 

[Blobrick]

17 minutes ago, SRman said:

If it's any help, I used the coloured bands on a standard Hornby RB Restaurant Car, but used the wide ones intended for HSTs from Fox Transfers, cut down to half their height. Alternative supplier, same result. I do have the HMRS ones too, but couldn't find them at the time. 😂

I can say that the colour density of the Fox ones is very good.

 

 

 

 

Thanks for that, l appreciate your input. However currently my plans may have hit a small bump in the road as Bachmann appear not to have any Commonwealth bogies available on there site. I ve emailed them just in case but l m not hopeful. I know there are other manufacturers who could possibly supply suitable bogies, but the fitting of these will not be as straight forward compared to the Bachmann ones.

There's always the chance someone has a pair squirreled away somewhere and might be prepared to part with them, otherwise l could be struggling

 

Just my luck!

 

Bob C 

[Geep7]

Just now, Blobrick said:

 

 

Thanks for that, l appreciate your input. However currently my plans may have hit a small bump in the road as Bachmann appear not to have any Commonwealth bogies available on there site. I ve emailed them just in case but l m not hopeful. I know there are other manufacturers who could possibly supply suitable bogies, but the fitting of these will not be as straight forward compared to the Bachmann ones.

There's always the chance someone has a pair squirreled away somewhere and might be prepared to part with them, otherwise l could be struggling

 

Just my luck!

 

Bob C 

I'm in the same position as you. I have the TRB bodyshell, seating unit and underframe, but no bogies..... I may go down the route of grafting some MJT or Replica commonwealth bogie sides onto some Bachmann Cep bogies, or see if I can pick up some Bachmann Mk1 commonwealth bogies as i'm not too worried about the lighting pickups.

[SRman]

1 hour ago, Blobrick said:

 

 

Thanks for that, l appreciate your input. However currently my plans may have hit a small bump in the road as Bachmann appear not to have any Commonwealth bogies available on there site. I ve emailed them just in case but l m not hopeful. I know there are other manufacturers who could possibly supply suitable bogies, but the fitting of these will not be as straight forward compared to the Bachmann ones.

There's always the chance someone has a pair squirreled away somewhere and might be prepared to part with them, otherwise l could be struggling

 

Just my luck!

 

Bob C 

 

 

I would suggest still doing the conversion/update and just waiting to pounce when the bogies do become available, as they are a very simple swap with just one screw for each bogie, so a matter of a minute or so to swap both.

I have been watching and waiting for a pair of Commonwealth bogies myself for a BEP conversion I have (half) done, which at present has the restaurant/buffet body on a TS chassis. When in motion it is barely noticeable that it's not the genuine article.

[John Tomlinson]

1 hour ago, Blobrick said:

 

 

Thanks for that, l appreciate your input. However currently my plans may have hit a small bump in the road as Bachmann appear not to have any Commonwealth bogies available on there site. I ve emailed them just in case but l m not hopeful. I know there are other manufacturers who could possibly supply suitable bogies, but the fitting of these will not be as straight forward compared to the Bachmann ones.

There's always the chance someone has a pair squirreled away somewhere and might be prepared to part with them, otherwise l could be struggling

 

Just my luck!

 

Bob C 

 

Looks like there's a few of us thinking about these bogies!

 

I have a BEP buffet car made of Bachmann spares, and the bogies were the only things not available. This was a few months back. I keep looking back at the website, as I'm sure they'll appear one day. Having missed the first spares run of the coach bodies, I did get lucky a while later, when one appeared out of the blue, so hoping for the same with the bogies.

 

John.

[Blobrick]

1 hour ago, John Tomlinson said:

 

Looks like there's a few of us thinking about these bogies!

 

I have a BEP buffet car made of Bachmann spares, and the bogies were the only things not available. This was a few months back. I keep looking back at the website, as I'm sure they'll appear one day. Having missed the first spares run of the coach bodies, I did get lucky a while later, when one appeared out of the blue, so hoping for the same with the bogies.

 

John.

 

 

 

 

As l mentioned earlier. l sent Bachmann an email  this morning, in the off chance that they would be getting some more bogies in stock, this was their reply........

 

 

Thank you for your enquiry.

We can supply replacement bogies for the TRB coach for £12 each plus £5 UK P&P although they are not yet listed on the spares website.  To order you would need to contact the service department on 01455 245 575 and you can quote the part number E3149-223-02

 

Needless to say l ve been on to them and ordered a pair!

 

Cheers

 

Bob C

Edited July 11 by Blobrick

[Gwiwer]

All of this skilled and effective modelling might not have been necessary had Bachmann actually released the first-illustrated version of the 4-Bep. In syp green with yellow / red bands and small headcode numerals. 
 

I don’t think we know why this was mysteriously changed to the early plain green version but it resulted in me cancelling my order. 
 

To be fair I might well have cancelled anyway once the release price was announced. Having (somewhat earlier of course) purchased a pair of green syp 4-Cep units at under £100 apiece paying four times that or more was not within my budget. 
 

Also of course had the syp / lined version been produced we might well have an equal number of us reverse-engineering it into early plain green. 

[brushman47544]

9 hours ago, Gwiwer said:

I don’t think we know why this was mysteriously changed to the early plain green version but it resulted in me cancelling my order. 

Having travelled on the 4-BEPs frequently from Dorking on the way to visit family in Littlehampton I was ready to stump up the asking price, but for me too the change to plain green meant I didn’t buy one. And I won’t now even if Bachmann produces one in SYP. Supposedly the earlier plain green sells better, at least on DMUs, but I have my doubts - Kernow MRC’s class 205 DEMU, another SR unit, was originally to be produced with two different numbers in green SYP because of the higher number of pre-orders for that livery.