RMweb Premium njee20 Posted August 4, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 4, 2020 Yes, I thought the same when they mentioned it. It used to be very obvious that there would be a marked darkening of the track from all the marbles, and it's definitely not as prolific anymore. They still seem to pick some up on their tyres after the race. The reason given (IIRC) was that there's a lot more plastic in the compound now, which is interesting in itself. I'd buy Pirelli tyres just as happily on Monday morning as I would have done previously. Even if they were 'to blame' for the failures, the technology and use case is so far removed from the average road car use as to be totally irrelevant. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted August 4, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 4, 2020 Oo-er https://www.gpfans.com/en/articles/55211/ferrari-suffer-very-sizeable-financial-hit-in-high-tens-of-millions/ Not exactly surprising news. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted August 4, 2020 Share Posted August 4, 2020 Aiming for an "extra" extra payment perhaps... 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 57xx Posted August 4, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 4, 2020 3 hours ago, njee20 said: I'd buy Pirelli tyres just as happily on Monday morning as I would have done previously. Even if they were 'to blame' for the failures, the technology and use case is so far removed from the average road car use as to be totally irrelevant. So would I - which is never. Never really rated them. Regarding the technology, the excuse to go to 18" rims was supposedly more relevance to road tyres.... Expect to be visiting Kwik Fit every 200 miles in future, 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Vecchio Posted August 4, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 4, 2020 Well working several years for Pirelli at their headquarters (cables, not tires, but it is the same company and had at this time the same headquarters) I got a significant reduction on 8 tires per year - so of course I used them. My comment as a non race driver: They were rather loud, the wear was not the best, and when Pirelli sold their cables part I moved to Michelin tires.... 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium njee20 Posted August 4, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 4, 2020 Yes, FWIW I use Michelin through preference too, although my latest car has Contis which seem to make me go, stop, and go around corners. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddieB Posted August 4, 2020 Share Posted August 4, 2020 On 02/08/2020 at 21:09, Classsix T said: I noticed Pirelli sent a lackey down to the winners enclosure to deliberately get in the way of the camera as Lewis pulled in, red bin bag in-hand to cover the front left wheel. After the fact the entire viewing audience had seen three blow-outs in quick succession mind you... C6T. I don't know if it was also to "reserve" the tyre for investigation. First came the delamination after Giovinazzi's spin in practice, then the three apparent sidewall collapses during the race itself, none appearing to fall within the usual parameters of tyre failure. There was a graphic about a lap before Hamilton's tyre went (but after Bottas's failure, IIRC) showing that the front left on Hamilton's car was critical - tread worn down to 10% - suggesting that failure could be imminent. However the subsequent deformation of the inner sidewall (as it appeared from the on-board camera - which seems to be the only perspective shown), which looked to be similar to Bottas's and Sainz's misfortunes, seemed to be in contrast to a blow-out that might be more typical of running tyres beyond their predicted lifespan. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold StuAllen Posted August 4, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 4, 2020 Think his tyre lasted quite well on the last lap, considering he still did over 140mph on the hanger straight - https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/12041856/lewis-hamilton-still-hit-over-140mph-with-punctured-tyre-at-british-gp 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Vecchio Posted August 4, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 4, 2020 1 hour ago, njee20 said: Yes, FWIW I use Michelin through preference too, although my latest car has Contis which seem to make me go, stop, and go around corners. Had a few Mercs in a row (the days of the nice company cars, now changed to an A class), they all came with Conti tires and I have to say not bad at all. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 57xx Posted August 4, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 4, 2020 7 hours ago, EddieB said: However the subsequent deformation of the inner sidewall (as it appeared from the on-board camera - which seems to be the only perspective shown), which looked to be similar to Bottas's and Sainz's misfortunes, seemed to be in contrast to a blow-out that might be more typical of running tyres beyond their predicted lifespan. I think the sidewall deformation was down to the lack of pressure in the tyre to support it. There were reports that the tyres had lots of cuts from track debris so were probably just slow punctures. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share Posted August 5, 2020 (edited) 7 hours ago, 57xx said: I think the sidewall deformation was down to the lack of pressure in the tyre to support it. There were reports that the tyres had lots of cuts from track debris so were probably just slow punctures. Slow punctures show on the Pit Wall data immediately, so any signs and the radio message would have gone out to that driver to stop that lap. I think a lot may have been caused by the left rumble strips, as that was the tyre they were leaning on most in the fast right handers. Edited August 5, 2020 by Andrew P 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sidecar Racer Posted August 5, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 5, 2020 All explained here . https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/53654385 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share Posted August 5, 2020 Jonathan Palmer's analysis of this coming weekend, I think two stops will be the norm, or a very long first stint providing there are no Safety Car incidents. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/53657231 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete the Elaner Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 20 hours ago, njee20 said: Yes, FWIW I use Michelin through preference too, although my latest car has Contis which seem to make me go, stop, and go around corners. I'm not sure what you mean by go, stop, go? I assume you mean they grip well enough to give you confidence, which is good & not mean that you have to almost stop to be able to drive around corners at all...which is not so good! I try not to stop at corners in my Elan; I prefer to drive around them as fast as possible because that is what a Lotus is designed to do. Contis do have a good reputation though, among cyclists too. Their Gatorskins are a popular choice for road cycles. We seem to be drifting from F1 to tyres...or are we actually drifting at all? Tyres are a vital part of the setup. F1 tyres have very specific requirements: 1, 2 or even 3 sets should provide as much grip as possible for 200 miles & if they still work well after this time, this is not a good thing: they should instead be lighter, grippier & therefore softer. For road cars, Michelin seem to be popular, but they were at the heart of the 2005 US Grand Prix disaster because their tyres failed to cope with the re-surfaced high speed corner. Should we judge Michelin by this incident? I don't think we should & nor should we judge Pirelli from their F1 performance. Michelin road tyres have a (deserved) reputation of providing a good balance of grip & long life, but you pay a premium for this. If you just want good grip & don't do many miles, then there are alternatives which may be more suitable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share Posted August 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Pete the Elaner said: I'm not sure what you mean by go, stop, go? I assume you mean they grip well enough to give you confidence, which is good & not mean that you have to almost stop to be able to drive around corners at all...which is not so good! I try not to stop at corners in my Elan; I prefer to drive around them as fast as possible because that is what a Lotus is designed to do. Contis do have a good reputation though, among cyclists too. Their Gatorskins are a popular choice for road cycles. We seem to be drifting from F1 to tyres...or are we actually drifting at all? Tyres are a vital part of the setup. F1 tyres have very specific requirements: 1, 2 or even 3 sets should provide as much grip as possible for 200 miles & if they still work well after this time, this is not a good thing: they should instead be lighter, grippier & therefore softer. For road cars, Michelin seem to be popular, but they were at the heart of the 2005 US Grand Prix disaster because their tyres failed to cope with the re-surfaced high speed corner. Should we judge Michelin by this incident? I don't think we should & nor should we judge Pirelli from their F1 performance. Michelin road tyres have a (deserved) reputation of providing a good balance of grip & long life, but you pay a premium for this. If you just want good grip & don't do many miles, then there are alternatives which may be more suitable. I always preferred second hand worn out Dunlop Cross Pys for sliding around in my Ford Anglia. MOVING SWIFTLY ON, and BACK on Topic. This should prove interesting, will they get a Ban, Points deducted for the whole Season, or win the case? https://www.espn.co.uk/f1/story/_/id/29600201/renault-racing-point-set-hearing-pink-mercedes-protest 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted August 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 5, 2020 (edited) 23 hours ago, njee20 said: Yes, FWIW I use Michelin through preference too, although my latest car has Contis which seem to make me go, stop, and go around corners. My (admittedly fairly ancient) experience with Pirelli Cinturatos, on a 1973 Vauxhall Firenza 2300 Sport, also involved rapid wear and high noise levels. They gripped like glue up to the point where they finally did let go, which tended to be memorably sudden. I haven't bought any since. I used branded Contis on my last three cars (all Peugeots). Excellent, but the prices got a bit steep. My garage recommended their mid-price equivalents. TBH, I didn't notice any real difference - maybe I'm slowing down! My current chariot is a Skoda Yeti CR170, and came with a set of Falkens which I like. They hang on well and are decently free from "roar" except on the concrete of the dualled A30 down to Exeter. OK, they are massive for a relatively small/light car (225/50 x 17), but they almost seem not to be wearing at all..... John Edited August 5, 2020 by Dunsignalling 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejstubbs Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, Sidecar Racer said: All explained here Photo caption: "Race winner Lewis Hamilton examines his punctured front left tyre after the British Grand Prix." "Punctured"? It's fallen apart! I realise that it was a puncture that led to the structural collapse but seeing that gaping hole I can only conclude that he was extremely lucky to have made it to the finish line in P1. Here's someone who didn't quite make to the end of their race on three wheels: He got it back to the pits, though! Edited August 5, 2020 by ejstubbs 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share Posted August 5, 2020 11 hours ago, Andrew P said: Slow punctures show on the Pit Wall data immediately, so any signs and the radio message would have gone out to that driver to stop that lap. I think a lot may have been caused by the left rumble strips, as that was the tyre they were leaning on most in the fast right handers. https://www.racefans.net/2020/08/04/silverstone-restoring-becketts-kerb-to-previous-specification-following-tyre-cuts/ 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share Posted August 5, 2020 Wow, Just ONE Practice Session, that will cause some upsets for Quallie. https://www.racefans.net/2020/08/04/single-90-minute-practice-session-confirmed-for-f1s-return-to-imola/ 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share Posted August 5, 2020 No reserve Driver for Merc's? https://www.racefans.net/2020/08/04/mercedes-seek-another-solution-for-reserve-driver-after-discovering-gutierrez-lacks-superlicence/ 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share Posted August 5, 2020 Ferrari question Racing Point legality? https://www.racefans.net/2020/08/03/ferrari-wade-into-racing-point-legality-row-with-letter-to-f1-and-fia/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Hroth Posted August 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 5, 2020 47 minutes ago, Andrew P said: Ferrari question Racing Point legality? https://www.racefans.net/2020/08/03/ferrari-wade-into-racing-point-legality-row-with-letter-to-f1-and-fia/ Quote Ferrari has intervened in the dispute over Racing Point’s car by asking Formula 1 and the FIA to clarify a key aspect of the regulations. Pot, meet Kettle. After all, Ferrari know all about trying to bend the rules and regs..... I suppose their view is that if they get Racing Point out of the way, then Vettle will be able to finish at least a place higher. 1 2 1 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium njee20 Posted August 5, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 5, 2020 8 hours ago, Dunsignalling said: My current chariot is a Skoda Yeti CR170, and came with a set of Falkens which I like. They hang on well and are decently free from "roar" except on the concrete of the dualled A30 down to Exeter. OK, they are massive for a relatively small/light car (225/50 x 17), but they almost seem not to be wearing at all..... Downright sensible size compared to the 235/35/19s on my Golf! It can be a little ‘crashy’ on our roads it must be said! Still... confirms that Contis have reasonable puncture resistance! Back on topic. 90 minutes practice at Imola seems ludicrous. One thing to have that at a long established circuit, but when did Imola last hold a GP?! None of the current drivers have raced there have they? 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Radford Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 16 hours ago, Andrew P said: https://www.racefans.net/2020/08/04/silverstone-restoring-becketts-kerb-to-previous-specification-following-tyre-cuts/ Vettel rallycrossed there every single lap! (Well maybe not every...) 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
didcot Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 15 hours ago, Andrew P said: Ferrari question Racing Point legality? https://www.racefans.net/2020/08/03/ferrari-wade-into-racing-point-legality-row-with-letter-to-f1-and-fia/ I think it was Adrian Newey who said that if Ferrari saw something and couldn't copy it successfully, then they would complain to the FIA to have it banned. Smacks of glass houses and stones, given Ferrari's so called deal with the Ferrari International Aid over legalities towards the end of last season. If I were Racing Point I would be applying pressure to have that deal publicised! 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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