Imaginary Locomotives

[Gibbo675]

BR Std Kitson-Meyer

 

Hi Folks,

 

Here is my latest relapse into crazy locomotive design, it is an amalgamation of two BR Std class 4MT kits and a class 9F.

 

The kits had been purchased to build a Franco Crosti Garrett but I decided that the 9F boiler was of the wrong proportion and so the project was converted to the Kitson Meyer type. I particularly like the chimney of the bunker end of the locomotive as it such a great tall thing, I think that the top lamp iron will have to be fitted to it somewhere. As far the bunker capacity goes it is a nominal 7 tons but the water capacity may be a little shy for such a large boiler.

 

Unlike the mallet of the previous post this particular design has a boiler frame to both support the boiler and to locate the power units. The allocated design office is Swindon for the locomotive will be used on the Ebbw Vale coal traffic so it will be very a heavy lump much like a Harley Davidson motorcycle.

 

I haven't worked out the leading dimensions or a weight diagram yet but I shall get around to it eventually.

 

 

Gibbo.

[melmerby]

If the water capacity is a bit low you can always add a tender:

 

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/12/SAR_Klasse_KM.jpg

 

Keith

[brack]

Very interesting. My first instinct is that the firebox/ashpan looks too small/constricted - either pull the bogies further apart or use 3 or 4 closely coupled axles for a shorter coupled wheelbase. In terms of the rear chimney, no modern (post WW1) kitson Meyers had them, the exhaust just being routed through the smokebox like normal. Presumably it helped with draughting.

 

If you're concerned about the water capacity perhaps look at the beyer peacock built kitson Meyers for FCAB with their oil firing and tenders.

 

The boiler and general lines of the tanks/bunker do look good though.

[AlfaZagato]

Stretching the water tanks to the firebox would net a useful increase in water capacity.

[rockershovel]

Harley Davidsons are sometimes described as devices designed to convert fuel into heat and noise, without actually producing any power in the process, supported by chassis designed to combine the maximum of weight with the minimum of rigidity..

[rockershovel]

Very interesting. My first instinct is that the firebox/ashpan looks too small/constricted - either pull the bogies further apart or use 3 or 4 closely coupled axles for a shorter coupled wheelbase. In terms of the rear chimney, no modern (post WW1) kitson Meyers had them, the exhaust just being routed through the smokebox like normal. Presumably it helped with draughting.

If you're concerned about the water capacity perhaps look at the beyer peacock built kitson Meyers for FCAB with their oil firing and tenders.

The boiler and general lines of the tanks/bunker do look good though.

Agree about the wheelbase. Articulated locomotives generally have close-coupled wheelbases for design reasons, except Beyer Garratts - which are the only articulated type with any reputation for high speed running.

[melmerby]

It's a pity someone can't rescue one of the K-Ms in the loco "graveyard"

See Street View:

https://goo.gl/maps/9E4vdmHiBy32

Photo:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/KitsonMeyer-Uyuni-01.jpg/1920px-KitsonMeyer-Uyuni-01.jpg?1544519554572

 

 

Here is another type in steam:

 

Keith

 

EDIT the same boiler principles as the Beyer Garratt, seem to apply.

Short fat barrel, big firebox.

Edited December 11, 2018 by melmerby

[Northroader]

Top half’s going forwards, bottom half’s going backwards.

[sir douglas]

the links are to Antofagasta & Bolivia railway meyers at Uyuni and the photo is of what was the last running TalTal meyer

[Michael Edge]

It's a pity someone can't rescue one of the K-Ms in the loco "graveyard"

See Street View:

https://goo.gl/maps/9E4vdmHiBy32

Photo:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/KitsonMeyer-Uyuni-01.jpg/1920px-KitsonMeyer-Uyuni-01.jpg?1544519554572

 

 

Here is another type in steam:

kitson.jpg

 

Keith

 

EDIT the same boiler principles as the Beyer Garratt, seem to apply.

Short fat barrel, big firebox.

 

Unobstructed ashpan as well, like the Garratt. Interestingly both engines have the valve gear in what is normally forward gear (radius rod at the bottom of the link) but they are going backwards.

[Gibbo675]

Unobstructed ashpan as well, like the Garratt. Interestingly both engines have the valve gear in what is normally forward gear (radius rod at the bottom of the link) but they are going backwards.

Hi Mike,

 

That usually denotes either external admission piston valves or slide valves, the return cranks are very often in back quarter when the rods are down if that is the case but all the bits may be swapped around and placed in opposing quarter to make the locomotive go in what ever direction accordingly.

 

Easier to look at picture than describe somehow !

 

Gibbo.

[Gibbo675]

Harley Davidsons are sometimes described as devices designed to convert fuel into heat and noise, without actually producing any power in the process, supported by chassis designed to combine the maximum of weight with the minimum of rigidity..

Hi Mr rockershovel,

 

Ducati is the name of the game at my house although I'm currently building this;

 

 

I was one told that you can make two Harley Davidsons by cutting a John Dere in half down the middle.

 

Gibbo.

[Gibbo675]

Very interesting. My first instinct is that the firebox/ashpan looks too small/constricted - either pull the bogies further apart or use 3 or 4 closely coupled axles for a shorter coupled wheelbase. In terms of the rear chimney, no modern (post WW1) kitson Meyers had them, the exhaust just being routed through the smokebox like normal. Presumably it helped with draughting.

 

If you're concerned about the water capacity perhaps look at the beyer peacock built kitson Meyers for FCAB with their oil firing and tenders.

 

The boiler and general lines of the tanks/bunker do look good though.

Hi Brack,

 

The grate area of the fire box is the same as a normal 9F which is 40 square feet give or take although the water legs have been lengthened to allow for a deeper fire by 12" (4mm). There is a good chance that the ash pan will grow in width although I might find some pipes that need routing and a relieved ash pan is a good way of doing it.

 

As for the chimney, that bit was the most fun. How mad does it look to have a chimney sticking out of the back of the bunker ?

 

Gibbo.

Edited December 11, 2018 by Gibbo675

[Gibbo675]

Stretching the water tanks to the firebox would net a useful increase in water capacity.

Hi Alfa,

 

The cut outs near the firebox are for maintenance and washouts, very important on plastic locomotives ! The length of the side tanks are as a result of using the parts of the kit that are available, the 9F tender sides are too deep and so I used the ones from the class 4.

 

Gibbo.

[Gibbo675]

If the water capacity is a bit low you can always add a tender:

 

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/12/SAR_Klasse_KM.jpg

 

Keith

Hi Kieth,

 

I had thought of that sort of arrangement but as the loco is for South Wales coal traffic small capacity water tanks might just do the job. I don't think dipping the troughs wold be an option over those lines though.

 

Gibbo.

[Ohmisterporter]

It's a pity someone can't rescue one of the K-Ms in the loco "graveyard"

See Street View:

https://goo.gl/maps/9E4vdmHiBy32

Photo:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/KitsonMeyer-Uyuni-01.jpg/1920px-KitsonMeyer-Uyuni-01.jpg?1544519554572

 

 

Here is another type in steam:

kitson.jpg

 

Keith

 

EDIT the same boiler principles as the Beyer Garratt, seem to apply.

Short fat barrel, big firebox.

 

A 5" gauge model of the Chilean Nitrate Railway Kitson-Meyer was built and run by John Hartup of the Lancaster and Morecambe Model Engineering Society. It was bought by the NRM and was displayed there for some years. Last time l saw the loco it was on a shelf in the warehouse. Unfortunately I have lost my pictures of it.

[sir douglas]

this one?

NRM 6-7-2013 (12) by Sam, on Flickr

 

im following a build of a transandine meyer https://www.youtube.com/user/Garrattmaker/videos

[AlfaZagato]

Hi Alfa,

 

The cut outs near the firebox are for maintenance and washouts, very important on plastic locomotives ! The length of the side tanks are as a result of using the parts of the kit that are available, the 9F tender sides are too deep and so I used the ones from the class 4.

 

Gibbo.

 

I think I actually meant smokebox, but who needs maintenance access anyways!

[Ohmisterporter]

That's the one, Sam. 

[Gibbo675]

I think I actually meant smokebox, but who needs maintenance access anyways!

Currently undergoing modification using an off cut of the left over 9F tender. Photos in due course.

[Budgie]

I wonder what a Beyer-Garratt Kitson-Meyer would be like.

[RedGemAlchemist]

I wonder what a Beyer-Garratt Kitson-Meyer would be like.

Organised chaos probably.

[Northmoor]

Ducati is the name of the game at my house although I'm currently building this;

 

Er, are you replicating THE Britten?  Quite possibly one of the greatest motorcycles ever made.

[Gibbo675]

Er, are you replicating THE Britten?  Quite possibly one of the greatest motorcycles ever made.

Hi Northmoor,

 

I certainly am !

 

After Guy Martin saw the photos he said, "The man's a FUBARRING legend", which is pleasing.

 

No craftsmanship clever for the bike yet, only my plastic toy train which is disappointing.

 

Gibbo.

[Michael Edge]

Hi Mike,

 

That usually denotes either external admission piston valves or slide valves, the return cranks are very often in back quarter when the rods are down if that is the case but all the bits may be swapped around and placed in opposing quarter to make the locomotive go in what ever direction accordingly.

 

Easier to look at picture than describe somehow !

 

Gibbo.

 

The return cranks are in back quarter, this configuration would normally result in the loco going cylinders first. It was normal practice for radius rods to be down in the usual direction of travel but most locos have the cylinders at the front end.