For those interested in "Modern Classic" Cars

[russ p]

12 hours ago, big jim said:

Another for @russ p seen in shrewsbury abbey Forgate car park this afternoon

 

 

Cheers Jim, I do like the R8 tourer very rare now. That one looks quite cherished 

[big jim]

Yeah I’ve not seen an estate one for years, thought of you twice yesterday, saw a montego estate heading for the scrappy in sandbach on the back of a transit flatbed yesterday as well, it was absolutely rotten though didn’t look to be anything salvageable on it 

[russ p]

27 minutes ago, big jim said:

Yeah I’ve not seen an estate one for years, thought of you twice yesterday, saw a montego estate heading for the scrappy in sandbach on the back of a transit flatbed yesterday as well, it was absolutely rotten though didn’t look to be anything salvageable on it 

 

Cheers Jim

Not many montego estates left at all. Getting panels for them and maestros is quite difficult nowadays 

[big jim]

Every panel looked to be rusted through on it the brief glimpse I had of it 

[russ p]

Just now, big jim said:

Every panel looked to be rusted through on it the brief glimpse I had of it 

 

That sounds about right 

[monkeysarefun]

 

 

I saw my first one of these on the road in ages the other day. ITs been so long since I even thought about them.

 

I thought they'd all run into trees on wet days back in the late  '80's and early '90's..

 

The Isuzu Piazza, sold here as a Holden with a 110Kw 2 litre turbo as the only engine  option,  back  when they wanted to expand their sporting range beyond a  Commodore with a V8 in it.

 

 

Designed by Guigiaro, I do remember how unique it looked at the time, now  it looks so conventional - how we get used to shapes.

 

The press here at the time savaged its awful handling, and called it  a "death statistic Waiting to happen". So bad were the reviews that Holden had to refund $5000 of the $34000 that owners had spent on it as a kind of goodwill gesture, but more like an apology for selling it to them in the first place.

 

Heres a typical review:

 

Italian styling by Giugiaro? Yep. German-engineered rear-drive platform? Yep. Japanese-designed turbo-fed engine? Yep. Suspension tuning by the work-experience chick? Sadly, yes. Spare undies and a defibrillator? Not included.

 

With sales down the toilet they  tried getting rid of them by offering them as game show prizes, but contestants saw through it and complained about getting them instead of a decent car so even that was abandoned.

 

I reckon the one I saw is probably the last one still out there.

 

I guess they should have stuck with selling Commodores with a V8 in it.

 

 

 

 

 

Edit: I just read that several other markets (including I guess the UK) got a Lotus modified version, so we probably lucked out in the handling department.

 

 

Edited September 14, 2021 by monkeysarefun

[Nick C]

A bit of sad news for this thread I'm afraid - our 1998 K11 Micra departed this morning - the dreaded tinworm had got into it, and it would have needed quite a lot of welding to get through another MOT, plus four new tyres.

 

On a more positive note, it's replacement still fits the theme of this thread - a 2004 Suzuki Ignis.

[russ p]

On 14/09/2021 at 21:30, monkeysarefun said:

 

 

I saw my first one of these on the road in ages the other day. ITs been so long since I even thought about them.

 

I thought they'd all run into trees on wet days back in the late  '80's and early '90's..

 

The Isuzu Piazza, sold here as a Holden with a 110Kw 2 litre turbo as the only engine  option,  back  when they wanted to expand their sporting range beyond a  Commodore with a V8 in it.

 

 

Designed by Guigiaro, I do remember how unique it looked at the time, now  it looks so conventional - how we get used to shapes.

 

The press here at the time savaged its awful handling, and called it  a "death statistic Waiting to happen". So bad were the reviews that Holden had to refund $5000 of the $34000 that owners had spent on it as a kind of goodwill gesture, but more like an apology for selling it to them in the first place.

 

Heres a typical review:

 

Italian styling by Giugiaro? Yep. German-engineered rear-drive platform? Yep. Japanese-designed turbo-fed engine? Yep. Suspension tuning by the work-experience chick? Sadly, yes. Spare undies and a defibrillator? Not included.

 

With sales down the toilet they  tried getting rid of them by offering them as game show prizes, but contestants saw through it and complained about getting them instead of a decent car so even that was abandoned.

 

I reckon the one I saw is probably the last one still out there.

 

I guess they should have stuck with selling Commodores with a V8 in it.

 

 

 

 

 

Edit: I just read that several other markets (including I guess the UK) got a Lotus modified version, so we probably lucked out in the handling department.

 

 

 

Wasn't this built on the same platform as they now call it as the chevette? 

[RANGERS]

On 23/09/2021 at 12:22, russ p said:

 

Wasn't this built on the same platform as they now call it as the chevette? 

It used GM’s “T” platform and was based on the US version of the Chevette, models were delivered to Giugiaro for the stylists to use as a basis for the design, the principle dimensions are said to have resulted directly from those US cars. 

“T” car development was a collaboration between GM’s worldwide engineering resource, though Vauxhall didn’t have much input until the Opel Kadett arrived on their desks for “anglicizing” into the UK Chevette.

 

The Lotus suspension came with the face lifted cars from 1987, by which time the original UK importer had gone  bust and Lotus were under GM ownership as well. To minimise costs, the same live rear axle was used but Lotus came up with a complex suspension set up that transformed the cars, though they still had a fearsome reputation.

[big jim]

I think my front wheel bearing might have slightly gone on the diesel mini!

 

 

 

Unfortunately the Touareg is also off the road, failed it’s MOT with a broken spring, track rod ems and has a slow puncture so it’s down to the red mini for a bit which my wife may have to use to go to the caravan on Friday if the Touareg doesn’t come back in time!

 

and to top that off my electric bike is knackered too with at least a 2 week wait for parts 

[Nick C]

Yep, that's knackered! 

 

It's a pig of a job to do on most FWD cars too, you generally need a hydraulic press to get the old one out...

[Quarryscapes]

1 hour ago, Nick C said:

Yep, that's knackered! 

 

It's a pig of a job to do on most FWD cars too, you generally need a hydraulic press to get the old one out...

Usually quicker, cheaper and easier to get a second hand knuckle from a breakers.

[Chris M]

On 14/09/2021 at 10:16, big jim said:

Yeah I’ve not seen an estate one for years, thought of you twice yesterday, saw a montego estate heading for the scrappy in sandbach on the back of a transit flatbed yesterday as well, it was absolutely rotten though didn’t look to be anything salvageable on it 

I had a Montego estate back in the day, took her camping in France. This photo was taken back in the summer of 1991. A nice motor with the 2.0 efi petrol engine, she could do 40 mpg if I was gentle with her but that was very rare. Very practical - I could do with one now to move my layout around. From the DVLA site this one ceased to exist in 2003.

 

[doilum]

On 18/10/2021 at 07:19, Chris M said:

I had a Montego estate back in the day, took her camping in France. This photo was taken back in the summer of 1991. A nice motor with the 2.0 efi petrol engine, she could do 40 mpg if I was gentle with her but that was very rare. Very practical - I could do with one now to move my layout around. From the DVLA site this one ceased to exist in 2003.

 

A proper estate car with a vertical rear hatch. Perfect for layouts.

We. Have been seriel Astra estate owners but each new model is slightly less useful than it's predecessor.

[Hobby]

We had an M reg astra estate (series 2?) and was the most roomy car we had for a long time, took it to Czech Republic in the late 90s! It was replaced by a vectra estate which was smaller. That was replaced by a very early Fabia estate which also went to the Czech Republic, in fact back to the factory that built it, they had a good museum back then. 

[big jim]

7 minutes ago, doilum said:

Have been seriel Astra estate owners but each new model is slightly less useful than it's predecessor.

I had a Vauxhall mokka as a hire car the other week, a mid sized SUV type car, I had to collect a full length intergrated fridge freezer in it, great I thought, plenty of room as it certainly wouldn’t have gone in the mini, first I pushed the front seat right forward and it wouldn’t fit at the back by about 3 inches, not a problem, tip the seat back to its fully reclined position, slide the fridge over the seat and done, the seat then didn’t recline fully vertically by design so it caught in the headrest as I tried to push it over, simple, take the headrest off to slide it over the front seat without, at that point I discovered the headrest is a permanent feature, not removable in any way shape or form so I ended up having to drive back home with the fridge sticking out if the back and the tailgate bungee strapped down!

 

a big(ish) car but useless for transporting anything of any significant size 

 

 

[Hobby]

Most SUVs are the same, large on the outside, small inside. For load carrying you are still better off with a medium or large estate car, though even they tend to be compromised with non folding rear seat bases. 

[Dunsignalling]

34 minutes ago, Hobby said:

Most SUVs are the same, large on the outside, small inside. For load carrying you are still better off with a medium or large estate car, though even they tend to be compromised with non folding rear seat bases. 

Though, in some cases, you can take the back seats out altogether. Probably not in a crossover like the Mokka, though.

 

Good point about rear seats in estates, I had a Peugeot 206 3-door hatch and, by reclining the front seat and folding down half the back one with the squab removed, I could carry 3m lengths of batten etc. Replaced it with a significantly longer 207 estate and no chance! The squab was fixed, much thicker, and got in the way of reclining the front seat by enough. Had to buy some ladder bars!

 

Haven't yet worked out what's possible in the Yeti without a load of hassle. Those seats look heavy!

 

John

Edited October 20, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[boxbrownie]

1 hour ago, big jim said:

I had a Vauxhall mokka as a hire car the other week, a mid sized SUV type car, I had to collect a full length intergrated fridge freezer in it, great I thought, plenty of room as it certainly wouldn’t have gone in the mini, first I pushed the front seat right forward and it wouldn’t fit at the back by about 3 inches, not a problem, tip the seat back to its fully reclined position, slide the fridge over the seat and done, the seat then didn’t recline fully vertically by design so it caught in the headrest as I tried to push it over, simple, take the headrest off to slide it over the front seat without, at that point I discovered the headrest is a permanent feature, not removable in any way shape or form so I ended up having to drive back home with the fridge sticking out if the back and the tailgate bungee strapped down!

 

a big(ish) car but useless for transporting anything of any significant size 

 

 

But the Mokka is basically a mid size hatchback given a styling boost to fill a customer segment, it is definitely not a load lugger for sure.

 

BTW did the head restraint rod collets (on the seat) not turn to release the H/R?

 

Next time you want to move a fridge hire a Nissan Patrol 

[big jim]

Nope the rods were solid in the seat, the headrest bit moved up and down but that was it 

 

 

Edited October 20, 2021 by big jim

[boxbrownie]

6 minutes ago, big jim said:

Nope the rods were solid in the seat, the headrest bit moved up and down but that was it 

 

 

Very odd that……but then again it is a Vauxhall* 

 

*I would say that, wouldn’t I? 

[Hobby]

46 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

 

Haven't yet worked out what's possible in the Yeti without a load of hassle. Those seats look heavy!

 

I thought that they had the same set up as the Roomster and you could take them out and slide them across? I did like the Roomster for its versatility. 

[boxbrownie]

Relevant page from the Mokka manual

Edited October 20, 2021 by boxbrownie

[big jim]

It’s the front headrests that won’t come out, the backs were fine as per the diagram 

[Dunsignalling]

27 minutes ago, Hobby said:

 

I thought that they had the same set up as the Roomster and you could take them out and slide them across? I did like the Roomster for its versatility. 

You can, but they look quite a bit bigger than the ones in the Roomster!

 

I have a trailer for carrying anything  really awkward, which saves a lot of faffing about, so I haven't yet needed to experiment with the configuration. Might need to transport a layout in the new year and I reckon they'll just be taken out for that.

 

The trick to getting long stuff in smallish cars lies in creating a path to have it on the diagonal with one end in the passenger-side footwell. Hence the importance of how the front and rear seats interact.

 

John